00:36 <raz> even as a former pythonista i'll never understand how that language became so popular. seems not everyone gets to the point where they realize what a mess it is :<

00:42 <raz> after a couple years i just couldn't deal with the wrecked dep management, the cryptic list comprehensions everywhere, the 2vs3 mess, weird metaclasses, the lack of symmetry and chaining and a slew of other things anymore. then ruby came along and life was good again.

00:45 <FromGitter> <djberg96> What's the proper way of temporarily shutting off stderr?

00:45 <FromGitter> <djberg96> I tried this, but crystal seems unhappy:

00:45 <FromGitter> <djberg96> ```code paste, see link``` [https://gitter.im/crystal-lang/crystal?at=60232cad9d5c644f66601b2a]

00:48 <FromGitter> <djberg96> that runs, but stderr is still making it to the console

00:49 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> why do you need to do that?

00:51 <FromGitter> <djberg96> because i don't want output generated, i just want to know if the command succeeded or not

00:51 <FromGitter> <oprypin:matrix.org> @djberg96 are u sure u don't want the log module? that one can be reconfigured very nicely

00:51 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> also fwiw ⏎ ⏎ > Standard input, output and error are inherited.

00:51 <FromGitter> <oprypin:matrix.org> hold up lol that's an entirely different question

00:52 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> if you use like `Process.run` or something you can set what each IO would be. i.e. `File::NULL`

00:52 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> but yes, deff look into `Log` module for general logging stuff

00:53 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> if you don't write to STDERR, nothing will be printed...

00:53 <raz> or, if you want pain, https://github.com/mosop/stdio

00:53 <FromGitter> <djberg96> I'll look at Process.run, thanks

00:54 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> it is definitely better than ticks

00:54 <raz> it's fun tho, i think it even works as long as you don't fork

00:54 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> https://github.com/crystal-lang/crystal/blob/f0901e1/src/process.cr#L431

00:55 <raz> i think crystal should provide a clean way to close, mute or capture stdout and stderr tho. sometimes you just really want to.

00:56 <raz> but strangely all languages i know make that painfully hard, crystal didn't invent that

00:56 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> I don't know if it is really necessary

00:57 <raz> then you've never fought the righteous fight for clean logging™

00:57 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> It is your program, you're supposed to know which is outputting to STDERR/STDOUT

00:57 <raz> those web frameworks always insist on printing random non-json things at random times

00:57 <raz> it is my program, but it's blacksmoke's shard :P

00:57 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> this should be configurable

00:57 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> it is

00:58 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> well for the most part...

00:58 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> if it use `Log`, it is

00:58 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> it does

00:59 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> raz: no hack should be needed then ;)

00:59 <raz> yup, that's what they all think

01:00 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> got a more specific example? only thing athean logs by default is the `matched route` thing and exceptions, where both can fairly easily disabled/altered

01:01 <raz> yea not in athena to be fair, at least not at the moment

01:01 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> 👍

01:15 <FromGitter> <djberg96> anything wrong with this?

01:15 <FromGitter> <djberg96> ```code paste, see link``` [https://gitter.im/crystal-lang/crystal?at=602333ccae4b9b27c1aea259]

01:18 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> what are you expecting it to print?

01:19 <FromGitter> <oprypin:matrix.org> why do u rescue, an error can happen only if the file doesn't exist

01:22 <FromGitter> <djberg96> i'm not expecting it to print anything. Change command to "ls" and it returns true

01:23 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> right because you set it to true before running the command?

01:23 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> and it prints `false` since thats not an actual command name

01:23 <FromGitter> <Blacksmoke16> to be clear, output is only closed for that process's output, *NOT* the entire program

01:23 <FromGitter> <djberg96> good :)

02:13 <FromGitter> <djberg96> and the port of mkmf-lite is on its way :)

11:41 <FromGitter> <alexherbo2> can a command expect an argument with optionparser?

11:42 <FromGitter> <alexherbo2> I noticed command could not contain dashes `-` in their name

11:42 <FromGitter> <alexherbo2> `evaluate-commands` in not recognized

12:19 <FromGitter> <asterite> Try it in Ruby. If it works in Ruby it should work in Crystal. If it doesn't work it's a bug

13:08 <FromGitter> <roduquen> Hi guys, I found this issue, it is the first time I have this so I share, maybe I can have some info : ⏎ ⏎ ```code paste, see link``` [https://gitter.im/crystal-lang/crystal?at=6023dad9063b6c68d54f4626]

13:33 <FromGitter> <asterite> Do have code to reproduce this?

13:33 <FromGitter> <asterite> You probably should open an issue, as the error says

14:12 <FromGitter> <alexherbo2> the ruby optionparser does not handle named command, while crystal does

14:13 <FromGitter> <alexherbo2> `on("evaluate-command", "eval commands")`

14:18 <FromGitter> <asterite> oh, it's the command name... I guess it's a bug then

14:28 <FromGitter> <roduquen> Unreproductible in my env

14:30 <FromGitter> <roduquen> I already had the same problem because of kemal environment

14:33 <FromGitter> <roduquen> Not the same issue but the same problem of unreproductibility

17:11 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> try to narrow the problem

17:12 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> what commit did introduce this

17:12 <FromGitter> <jrei:matrix.org> copy your whole program, and remove code chunks by chunks