11:35 <inimino> ec: I'm in SF

16:26 <ec> inimino: hm?

16:26 <ec> :P

16:35 <ljharb> ec: aren’t you in like Chicago or something

16:54 <jfhbrook> so uh, do any of you work with ruby? I feel like a few of you have ruby experience

16:55 <jfhbrook> thinking about working for a rails shop, hoping the full-stackedness is pervasive enough to be interesting, but I've never worked with ruby beyond doing the rails getting started tutorial

16:57 <ec> I love Ruby, as a language

16:57 <ec> hate rails … but i’m sure I, too, am gonna end up at a Rails shop

16:58 <ec> I’m also apprehensive about working in ruby *with a group*. It’s a very flexible language, and lends itself well to duck-typing, meta programming, etc; and *doesn’t* lend itself well to … structure, collaboration, fixedness? lol.

16:59 <ec> I assume in an org a lot of those things instead have to be enforced socially or by tools; and afaict none of the tools are all that powerful … (basically just Rubocop, right? no typing tools that I know of, nor stronger static analysis)

17:12 <ljharb> ruby gives much more hanging rope than most languages

20:32 <jfhbrook> I mean I've written javascript before ;)

20:32 <jfhbrook> some dudes made a type annotation library for ruby

20:32 <jfhbrook> cool that you can do that without new syntax (apparently, anyway)

20:33 <ec> ehhhhh, it’s different. JS’s “rope” is bugs, which you’re pretty much encouraged to avoid *both* by the language, the idioms, and the community

20:33 <jfhbrook> and yeah I mean rails itself is whatever, I'd rather be using sqlalchemy but it looks fine for what it is

20:33 <ec> Ruby’s “rope” is language-sanctioned features, designed to be used

20:33 <jfhbrook> I'm gonna write so many DSLs

20:34 <ec> and sanctioned by at least parts of the community — reasonably, for the things *they’re* working on, you know?

20:34 <ec> what’s sqlalchemy

20:36 <jfhbrook> the good (for an orm) python orm and query builder

20:37 <jfhbrook> I did the rails tutorial and it was fine but I have a *lot* of questions

20:38 <jfhbrook> like, why do I have to run bundle exec rails instead of just rails? why does my 2.5 environment install gems in the 2.6.0 gem directory?

20:38 <jfhbrook> why aren't there any require statements inside the controllers or models?

20:38 <jfhbrook> just lots of weird shit like that

20:39 <jfhbrook> some of them are just fundamentally bizarre environment issues that I probably caused myself by fucking with system ruby in arch 🙃 but the lack of requires in the controllers file, that's not just me, something strange is going on there

21:34 <ljharb> jfhbrook: stripe made types for ruby iirc

21:46 <jfhbrook> ljharb: those are the ones yeah

21:47 <jfhbrook> man this would just be super funny if I ended up working on a rails app

22:05 <ec> how so?