<hramrach__>
basically you have a bootloader in rom and nand which are fixed and you can replace the kernel
<hramrach__>
iirc somebody said that u-boot support is planned but getting working kernel is higher priority
<hramrach__>
also the boot sequenc for rk is rather dumb
<hipboi>
:)
<hipboi>
can 3066/3188 boot from external sd card?
<hramrach__>
it can if you erase the flash
<hramrach__>
erase enough of it to make it unbootable
<hramrach__>
and only 3188
<hramrach__>
3066 cannot
<hramrach__>
see the main page of linux-rockchip
<hramrach__>
you can dual-boot with the recovery button. there is also a guide that advises to short pins on the flash to make it possible to write to it
<hramrach__>
so you probably can install flash-disable switch ;-)
<hipboi>
hramrach__, thanks :)
<hramrach__>
np :)
<FergusL>
that's exciting to hear !
<hipboi>
hramrach__, you contribute a lot to the wiki :)
<hramrach__>
;-)
<FergusL>
it's unclear to me how close one is from booting linux when replacing kernels
<hramrach__>
you can install picuntu which is full distro
<hramrach__>
but for experimenting you want to replace on thing at a time
<FergusL>
hramrach__: you mean, if I get a new rk device, I should first try to change the kernel for example ?
<FergusL>
instead of directly going to picuntu
<hramrach__>
if picuntu works for you go for it
<hramrach__>
but it does not support 3188 so far afaik
<FergusL>
yes
<FergusL>
cnxsoft reported boot on 3188 though
<FergusL>
on the Tronsmart T428 iirc
devgiant has joined #linux-rockchip
<FergusL>
can someone recommend european ebay sellers for rk3188 sticks ?
<hipboi>
FergusL, try aliexpress
<FergusL>
aren't all aliexpress sellers based in China ?
<hipboi>
FergusL, yes, China based
<FergusL>
I'm looking for european sellers ! there are some on ebay
<FergusL>
though I know I'd better purchase from China and wait
<hramrach__>
FergusL: Europe is a lost cause
<FergusL>
haha
<hramrach__>
you will get rk3188 in like half a year in EU shops
<FergusL>
okay then that's a recommendation from you ?
<hramrach__>
it's a tradeoff
<hramrach__>
I buy on ebay what I cannot get elsewhere
<FergusL>
geekbuying or dx.com seem to be good places too
<hramrach__>
the price on e-bay varies too
<hramrach__>
and most have similar to amazon
<FergusL>
yes
<hramrach__>
it might be somebody selling one second hand or fakes. from what I heard the latter is somewhat of a problem on e-bay lately
<FergusL>
for android mini-pc ?
<hramrach__>
yes, for electronics. But that was like half a year ago. I don't follow the latest e-bay fads
<hramrach__>
but as a rule of thumb if the price is unbelievable don't believe it :p
<FergusL>
it's funny Rk has been making dual cores again, like 3168
<FergusL>
I really don't know where to get a mini stick :|
<hramrach__>
it's always a difficult decision :p
<FergusL>
yes !
<FergusL>
ever tried geekbuying ?
<FergusL>
they even seem to be supporting a bit the community
<hramrach__>
no, never
<FergusL>
ok
<FergusL>
but sometimes I just think cubieboard or beaglebone might be just the perfect choice actually
<FergusL>
because it basically just works :D
<hramrach__>
depends on the features you want
<hramrach__>
cubieboard has poor audio options. only analog and hdmi
<hramrach__>
or USB, meh
<FergusL>
depending on which card you pick, it might be much better than integrated one
<hramrach__>
and possibly very bulky, too
<FergusL>
yes :-/
<FergusL>
i'd like to create some sort of very versatile sampler/synthesizer linux-based box for live music
<FergusL>
it could be only done inside PureData which I know works fine on ARM
<FergusL>
next up could be adding JACK, but that might turn out to be much trickier
<hramrach__>
jack probably works
<FergusL>
hum
<hramrach__>
you want the visuals also or only sound?
<FergusL>
I've seen people having issues with the internal sound and jack, but with usb soundcard it works better
<FergusL>
only sound
<FergusL>
basically a box at your feet, on which you plug usb instruments and microphone and with an output
<FergusL>
and can control it from a phone, a tablet or another computer
<hramrach__>
if you don't rely on the internal soundcard and do everything with USB it should work
<FergusL>
nice to know
<hramrach__>
the SPDIF on rk would be nice for output but god knows what it actually suports
<FergusL>
I could even forsee a usb baseboard
<FergusL>
yes...
<hramrach__>
to make an internal soundcard noise-free requires good HW and SW engineering
<hramrach__>
which is unlikely to happen on random Chinese board
<FergusL>
sure; yes
<hramrach__>
the USB drivers are common for all architectures so what works on a netbook should work on arm board, basically
<FergusL>
that's what I thought yes
<hramrach__>
the A10 has about half or so the performance of a cheap netbook processor
<hramrach__>
you might be limited in the number of devices you can connect
<FergusL>
I could go woth A10/A20 or imx6 dual/quads, but the extra cpu power from RKs is tempting
<FergusL>
maybe it's just useless
<hramrach__>
the rk brief says something about 16 USB endpoints
<FergusL>
interesting, that is, with hub connected I guess ?
<FergusL>
I dind't know the limitation could be so low, although 16 USB instruments is a LOT
<FergusL>
because I do make the instruments myself, too :)
<hramrach__>
and sound card and mouse
<FergusL>
true
<FergusL>
(well in my design, it's a completely headless box, no mouse, no kb, no screen, no nothing
<FergusL>
but maybe my design idea has a lot of flaws
<hramrach__>
Provides 16 host mode channels
<hramrach__>
whatever that means
<FergusL>
might be it, yes, haha
<hramrach__>
the OTG port has 9 more
<hramrach__>
hmm, the A10 datasheet says that OTG has 5 endpoints and hsot is OHCI/EHCI
devgiant has quit [Quit: Leaving]
JochenKauz has joined #linux-rockchip
<JochenKauz>
One question... why is a section on linux-rockchip.info abot the repos uninteresting?
<hramrach__>
because it has no info
<JochenKauz>
it has much info
<JochenKauz>
it has the info for finding sources
<hramrach__>
it was a shopping list. no info
<JochenKauz>
something xda wants to be published
<JochenKauz>
what?
<JochenKauz>
shopping list?
<hramrach__>
like what is in hte repos, which is current on what - no info
<JochenKauz>
sorry... thats something I can not agree to
<JochenKauz>
if you want to build something that is the basic of everything on RK, you need this
<JochenKauz>
if you don't have that info, nothing is made
<JochenKauz>
you can try to make a linux, without kernel.. no way
<JochenKauz>
so, sorry. thats nothing what is unimportant to know
<hramrach__>
there is the list of repos on hte software page
<JochenKauz>
you want to build an odys kernel... here you go... you want to build an upuntu touch... here you go
<hramrach__>
but for it to be really useful you need to know which repo to use for what
<hramrach__>
and that info is missong
<hramrach__>
where you go?
<hramrach__>
there is no link neither for odys nor ubuntu touch
<JochenKauz>
you think that you are the one who should decide what is usefull or not?
<JochenKauz>
ok... your turn.. no problem
<JochenKauz>
we could work together... but not that way
<FergusL>
hey...
<hramrach__>
feel free to put the list of repos back on the main page. it's not that long yet
<FergusL>
something like the omegamoon github repo directly on the main page ?
<hramrach__>
but if this project is to grow you will get like dozens of repos with temp forks
<JochenKauz>
I would only like to be informed.. if we make another structure... its okay.. but we should talk about it
<hramrach__>
If I wanted to build a kernel which repo do I pick?
<JochenKauz>
the omegamoon blog entry made us oin the top of google search now
<hramrach__>
heh
<JochenKauz>
It's easy
<JochenKauz>
you have a tablet
<JochenKauz>
if you want to build a kernel... look at the repos
<JochenKauz>
there you find the description what kernel are possible
<JochenKauz>
we have 12 or 15 kernels to build, perhaps more... the other ones are for 6 kernels, or perhaps more
<hramrach__>
like there is no repo that you would recommend?
<hramrach__>
or need special kernel for each device?
<JochenKauz>
no.. you need to pick the one that match your tablet
<JochenKauz>
you need special kernel for every device
<hramrach__>
that's rather lame and unusual for LInux
<JochenKauz>
hardware is so much different, you can not try to
<JochenKauz>
yes, but thats RK
<JochenKauz>
its a design, and every distrivutor can order what he whants
<hramrach__>
can't the hardware be detected?
<JochenKauz>
I've made from my sources round about 8 different tablets
<JochenKauz>
no
<JochenKauz>
its an old kernel
<JochenKauz>
some things can be loaded
<hramrach__>
you can build them into kernel and just not use
<JochenKauz>
but LCD, RAM size, Touch... did not work
<JochenKauz>
as an example
<hramrach__>
it's not like the device has 4M ram
<JochenKauz>
something I'm working at these days
<JochenKauz>
you have an toch GT801
<JochenKauz>
touch
<hramrach__>
ok
<JochenKauz>
it has hardware dependig fw that is loaded into the controller at boot time
<JochenKauz>
this is dependig on Screen resolution, or the driver you have
<JochenKauz>
this fw is compiled into the kernel
<hramrach__>
so you cannot change screen resolution?
<hramrach__>
you have to pre-load some firmware that sets it?
<JochenKauz>
and to make it really simple... in the touch you can define an offset... that must match the driver
<JochenKauz>
yes
<JochenKauz>
I'll realy hate this
<JochenKauz>
I've been working on one kernel now for 4 weeks
<JochenKauz>
only the touch is the problem, but no sources are available
<JochenKauz>
I've made a disassamble to get the right FW, but how to find the drivewr for this FW
<JochenKauz>
now, with the help of my crew, we find a driver that could match, but we have to patch the FW
<JochenKauz>
hopefully thats it
<JochenKauz>
it is an really another world like normal Linux
<JochenKauz>
if you want look at our repos, look at arch/arm/amch-rk29/board*
<hramrach__>
the AW kernel works on every device that has the same platform
<JochenKauz>
arch/arm/mach-rk29/board*.c
<JochenKauz>
there you find so many differences in the inits... its horrible
<hramrach__>
like difference in pin assignemnt or completely different code?
<JochenKauz>
its all different... pin's... different screen resolutions, differnt battery... mostly different structs
<JochenKauz>
on one board the sensor is on i2c1, then on i2c2
<hramrach__>
so just config differences
<JochenKauz>
the you must reservate the ram for the gpu, according the screen resulution
<hramrach__>
or jsut reserve a lot
<JochenKauz>
do you have 2 cams, or one, or nothing
<hramrach__>
plus there is kernel arguments
<JochenKauz>
yes, but all rk2918 do have the same
<JochenKauz>
we got it to work with 6.2
<JochenKauz>
not more
<JochenKauz>
for rk3x... notzhing more than 4.4
<hramrach__>
6.2 and 4.4 what?
<JochenKauz>
gcc
<JochenKauz>
4.
<hramrach__>
yeah, gcc versions :/
<JochenKauz>
so thats the point... our repos are the key to get an running version of the kernel... without that.. no Android could be run on an RK based device
<JochenKauz>
its an hard job to find something.. but RK does not publish anything
<hramrach__>
but without the info about picking the repo and gcc you still do not get a kernel built
<hramrach__>
the README in hte repo is still the generic Linus readme
AutoStatic has joined #linux-rockchip
<JochenKauz>
All Infos are in the makefile
<JochenKauz>
there you find the toolchain to be used
<JochenKauz>
if someone want,, the info is there
<JochenKauz>
we talk about kernel building, not compile an easy hello world
<AutoStatic>
Hello
<JochenKauz>
we surely have to gave more infos about compiling kernels, but at this point now, all we publish is for experts or enthusiasts
<JochenKauz>
HI
<AutoStatic>
Hi JochenKauz
<AutoStatic>
FergusL: I'm working on a similar idea. Not a synth but a guitar stompbox.
<FergusL>
ha great !
<FergusL>
Rk powered ?
<AutoStatic>
Yup, rk3066 based
<FergusL>
nice !
<AutoStatic>
ot a MK808 and some UG802 clone
<JochenKauz>
cool
<AutoStatic>
RT kernel runs on it
<FergusL>
my idea could certainly have some stomp buttons and pots
<FergusL>
ohhhh
<FergusL>
that's great news
<AutoStatic>
So I can achieve real low latencies
<AutoStatic>
Well, it's not very stable
<AutoStatic>
:(
<JochenKauz>
what kernel you use?
<AutoStatic>
But when it runs, it runs ok
<AutoStatic>
jeremy@rk3066:~$ uname -a
<AutoStatic>
Linux rk3066 3.0.36-rt58 #1 SMP PREEMPT RT Thu Jul 4 13:18:23 CEST
<FergusL>
what softwares are you using ?
<AutoStatic>
JACK + Guitarix
<JochenKauz>
is the sourse available?
<JochenKauz>
source
<AutoStatic>
Not yet, I made quite a mess out of it
<AutoStatic>
The RT patchet didn't apply cleanly so I had to do quite some by hand
<AutoStatic>
But I'll upload it one of these days
<FergusL>
yes pleade !
<JochenKauz>
but you've got a 36er kernel source?
<FergusL>
do you use a screen with it ?
<JochenKauz>
based on BQ?
<AutoStatic>
Yes, 3.0.36
<AutoStatic>
Form the Galland github
<JochenKauz>
ok
<AutoStatic>
Yes, with a monitor, but I'd like to use it headless
<AutoStatic>
But WiFi is a PITA on the MK808
<JochenKauz>
my colleague is working on 3.10 mainline at this time
<AutoStatic>
Oh great!
<JochenKauz>
yes
<hramrach__>
3.10 has DT
<AutoStatic>
DT?
<hramrach__>
so hopefully at least something becomes configurable then
<JochenKauz>
they are commiting changes for RK to Linus at this time
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: same here the goal is to have it headless
<AutoStatic>
I read about that yes
<FergusL>
first one would have to ssh on it
<AutoStatic>
FergusL: yeah but then the problem is, how do you connect to the device?
<FergusL>
but then maybe a webapp by a server ran by the device itself
<AutoStatic>
Yes, with guitarix that's possible
<FergusL>
well with wifi, but I know it's a hard part on those cheap things...
<AutoStatic>
You can run one instance in a headless way and another with a GUI on a different machine and with some Avahi trickery they can communicate
<FergusL>
first, a warning : I don't own any of these, I only have googled about it for long nights but never bought one
<FergusL>
I was thinking about a js webapp and the server modifies all with OSC or midi signals
<AutoStatic>
You mean a RK based device?
<FergusL>
(or puredata, in my case)
<FergusL>
yes
<AutoStatic>
Ah ok
<AutoStatic>
Well, you have to pick the right model
<FergusL>
so forgive me if I miss crucial points :)
<AutoStatic>
No problem :)
<FergusL>
absolutely, that's what we were talking about with hramrach__ earlier
<AutoStatic>
The MK808 has a Wifi adapter that connects via SDIO
<AutoStatic>
So basically via the SD card controller
<FergusL>
now that the Rk3188 starts to be linuxified, I'm tempter...
<FergusL>
hu ?!
<FergusL>
okay, didn't know that
<JochenKauz>
it should be possible to connect a midi connector.. or not?
<AutoStatic>
Yes, no problem
<FergusL>
you still need the usb adapter !
<AutoStatic>
Or directly on the board you mean?
<JochenKauz>
only one hint... we've got ubuntu touch running on Rk2918
<FergusL>
JochenKauz: tablets, that is ?
<JochenKauz>
on our supported tablets
<JochenKauz>
Odys RK2918
<FergusL>
what is "our" ?
<JochenKauz>
and if someone has another tablet, I could try to make a kernel
<FergusL>
I'm a bit afraid by the Rk based tablets
<JochenKauz>
we support the following tablets
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: how did you know I have this project ? you were'nt there !
<FergusL>
JochenKauz: didn't heazr much about the rk2918, is it single core 1Ghz ?
<JochenKauz>
we made it 1.1GHz
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: mainly percussions because it's what I play, I'm maling pressure sensors with carbon-loaded paper
<JochenKauz>
but yes single core A8
<AutoStatic>
Oh cool!!
<AutoStatic>
ANd you probably connect them via USB?
<hramrach__>
anybody hs the power to change topic?
<FergusL>
but I'm slowly progressing
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: depends, right now it's Arduino so yes, but it could be directly serial
<AutoStatic>
That's possible but then you need a RK board that has serial connectors
<FergusL>
I realy like the idea of a small wooden or metal box with inside, a stick pc + small usb sound card for good inputs + usb hub + microcontroller with some pots and buttons
<FergusL>
yes, I think most have these
<FergusL>
one just needs to find the right pads !
<AutoStatic>
Sound good!
<FergusL>
great to find someone with the same ideas
<JochenKauz>
we are also working on rk30 and rk31 kernels.. so to get an 3.0.36er kernel that work on mk808... nice try... cause the 3.10... is next the door
<JochenKauz>
and it could help us to get mainline to work
<FergusL>
what is "we" ? do you own a society ? or is it the community in general ?
<JochenKauz>
so if anyone want to help us,,, all help is appreciated
<AutoStatic>
FergusL: I'm going to build it inside a Hammond/Eddystone enclosure with an USB soundcard. But then I need to get the PC stick stable first
<JochenKauz>
we are Crew RKTablet
<FergusL>
oh okay JochenKauz
<hramrach__>
JochenKauz: do you have a web other than the github one?
<JochenKauz>
we are 4 Kernel Builders and 2 Android Roms maker
<JochenKauz>
yes
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: software-wise you mean ?
<AutoStatic>
And kernel-wise
<AutoStatic>
Well, software is not relly the issue
<JochenKauz>
we have a forum and a blog
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: I see
<hramrach__>
oh, the one on arctablet
<JochenKauz>
if you want to meet us.. we are on arctablet..
<FergusL>
I'm a linux user, I'm not that new but I must confess that tweaking and compiling kernels is something I've never done !
<AutoStatic>
FergusL: for the RK based devices it's quite simple.
<JochenKauz>
and we are present on xda
<hramrach__>
german?
<JochenKauz>
and it would be a pleasure for us to meet you there
<JochenKauz>
international
<JochenKauz>
its basically german... but in english.. no problem
<FergusL>
I visited this website for the first time today, but didn't understand much on the first page !
<FergusL>
AutoStatic: what music genres are you mostly playing ?
<JochenKauz>
only ask..
<JochenKauz>
We could answer, if we are able to
<JochenKauz>
@FergusL... what was the problem?
<JochenKauz>
what did you not understand?
<FergusL>
JochenKauz: oh it's simply me not knowing much ! got confused by the product names and acronyms
<AutoStatic>
FergusL: Indierock
<FergusL>
I see
<FergusL>
JochenKauz: has anybody tested flashing linux on the rk3188s ?
<FergusL>
tablets, that is
<JochenKauz>
FergusL: ahh okay.. not easy its very hardware depended
<FergusL>
yes ! I just got that now, now I understand better :)
<JochenKauz>
no, not yet.. only rk3066
<AutoStatic>
hramrach__: gcc 4.6.2 also works for rk30xx sources
<JochenKauz>
no
<JochenKauz>
kernel does not work with 4.6.2
<FergusL>
(AutoStatic where are you from ?)
<hramrach__>
it probably depends on the kernel
<AutoStatic>
gcc version 4.6.3 (Ubuntu/Linaro 4.6.3-1ubuntu5)
<JochenKauz>
we have not founf a toolchain that boots
<AutoStatic>
That's what I use to compile
<hramrach__>
maybe it does with 3.0.36
<JochenKauz>
no
<AutoStatic>
Yes it's about 3.0.36
<JochenKauz>
we got it only to work with 4.4
<hramrach__>
you use old sources
<JochenKauz>
there is a bug in 4.6.x that prevents it from booting
<hramrach__>
linaro has heavily patchd compilers, too
<AutoStatic>
Which kernel sources are you referring to?
<JochenKauz>
we have really new toolchains... but optimized for A9 they do not work
<JochenKauz>
you can find all sources on our git
<hramrach__>
oh, there is 3.0.36 too
<JochenKauz>
basically the bq curie
<JochenKauz>
yes
<JochenKauz>
and the only toolchain that work is 4.4
<JochenKauz>
we tried different others
<JochenKauz>
but no way
<JochenKauz>
we have an linaro 4.6.. don't work
<AutoStatic>
Well, the source I hae compile and run fine with 4.6.3
<AutoStatic>
But they're old as hramrach__ pointed out
<hramrach__>
no, that's probaly about the same
<JochenKauz>
we always compile our own toolchain, but also others don<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<#t come up
<hramrach__>
saw 3.0.8 in the repo but that's for rk29
<JochenKauz>
we go 3.0.8 up to rk3066
<JochenKauz>
we've just released 4.2.2 on rk2919 with 3.0.8
<JochenKauz>
only some minor problems
<JochenKauz>
libwebcore.so.. does not work
<FergusL>
where should I start to understand more all this ? apart from getting one of thos goddamn sticks haha
<AutoStatic>
FergusL: you're Linux savvy right?
<FergusL>
yes, kinda
<FergusL>
kind of programming savvy too
<AutoStatic>
Ah ok, wish I was :)
<AutoStatic>
You're opting for a rk3188 based stick, so a quad core one?
<FergusL>
still not sure, even more given how few people have started looking at it
<AutoStatic>
And what is it that you'd like to understand? How to build a kernel for it? How to get Linux on it?
<AutoStatic>
For now I'd go for a rk3066 based stick, they're cheaper but powerful enough for your goal I think
<FergusL>
hm... I think my comment was regarding how I feel when I look the kernel repos, I'm a bit lost, how to know what device it's for ? what arch ?
<AutoStatic>
AH ok
<FergusL>
yes, maybe after all, my only reason is to get more power
<AutoStatic>
Arch is ARM
<FergusL>
yes, I meant, where in the repo or the source tree can I find something like arch = armv7 something
<FergusL>
but initially that was a simple comment, I think I'll slowly figure out things if I decide to jump in and start trying
<AutoStatic>
You can't
<AutoStatic>
the repositories contain the complete kernel source, for all architectures
<FergusL>
Oh, okay
<FergusL>
then it must be in the... hm... "kconfig" or something that one sets this