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<yorickpeterse>
morning
<ljarvis>
moin
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<oddmunds>
MORN
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<ljarvis>
oh node
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<yorickpeterse>
ljarvis: what, you don't like single threaded applications?
<yorickpeterse>
how dare you, have some more callbacks
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* workmad3
wraps yorickpeterse's callbacks in promises
<workmad3>
there we go, much better :P
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<yorickpeterse>
But when will they be fulfilled?
<workmad3>
who cares? :D
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<ljarvis>
herp derp
<ljarvis>
sometimes I just don't understand js and then i get angry and then i remember it's not my fault
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<ljarvis>
then i get angry again because it exists and it's okay that it's bad
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<yorickpeterse>
yet here you are using it
<ljarvis>
sometimes you can't avoid it
<ljarvis>
which leads to more anger
<yorickpeterse>
Guess I've been lucky in avoiding it thus far
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<yorickpeterse>
then again there's only 3 devs here and all 3 hate JS equally
<yorickpeterse>
I can stand JS mainly because of jshint, without it I'd hate to write even a single line
<ljarvis>
heh
<workmad3>
so then... es6, good or bad? :D
<ljarvis>
i just opened node repl and absolutely failed in about 4 lines because nothing worked
<yorickpeterse>
es6 makes JS a bit nicer
<ljarvis>
es6 is late, maybe too late. But it's welcome
<yorickpeterse>
I find the addition of classes odd though
<yorickpeterse>
especially since they're not really classes but just syntax sugar around Object.create IIRC
<ljarvis>
because oop bro
<ljarvis>
if you dont oop, you noop
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<workmad3>
I'm guessing that's because one of the most common things that frameworks and things like coffeescript adds in are some form of class system that provides some wrapper around Object.create :)
<workmad3>
kinda makes sense to at least move it into first-class syntax sugar with a single supported syntax, rather than having to figure out multiple class systems implemented in different frameworks
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<yorickpeterse>
well yeah, I know people have been crying about it ever since JS first came around
<ljarvis>
meh those frameworks will create their own class system for years to come
<yorickpeterse>
But it really doesn't fit in a prototype language in the first place
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<yorickpeterse>
I mean the whole point of prototyped languages is to just create objects on the fly without classes
<yorickpeterse>
Which is both extremely elegant and super stupid
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<yorickpeterse>
it's elegant because you can just create an object without having to worry about inheritence trees and what not. It's super stupid because it promotes mutability and makes it harder to re-use code
<yorickpeterse>
Also if you ever want to implement a language, creating a prototyped language isn't too difficult
<workmad3>
it was elegant for the type of stuff JS started out doing, it's super-stupid for the kind of stuff JS is now doing
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<yorickpeterse>
I'd say that for JS today you'd either want it to be full on functional, or standard OO
<yorickpeterse>
but not this crazy thing in between
<yorickpeterse>
but since JS doesn't do concurrency nobody cares about functional anyway :D
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<yorickpeterse>
hihi, haskell or lisp in the browser, that would be something
<yorickpeterse>
(haskell probably doesn't really work since it's compiled)
<ljarvis>
and other times I'm really glad I didn't go to uni
<yorickpeterse>
Same here, looks like all I missed was the classes on how to read papers
<yorickpeterse>
well, I did 6 months of art academy
<yorickpeterse>
then I ran away in fear
<ljarvis>
creative.
<ljarvis>
I was a carpenter.. so yeah
<workmad3>
heh :) my first year of uni was great... I almost completed KOTOR1 in it at one point
<workmad3>
then my HDD died and I lost my save game :(
<yorickpeterse>
I actually studied photography, naively thinking one can earn money with that
<yorickpeterse>
also the hippies really killed it for me
<workmad3>
yorickpeterse: I never got any classes on how to read papers :(
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<workmad3>
for me, most of my uni experience was theoretical stuff that was kinda interesting, but rarely of use in day to day software engineering, IME, and a fair bit of spare time where I could figure stuff out, play games, get that sort of thing out my system
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<yorickpeterse>
heh, I did that while working :P
<yorickpeterse>
ljarvis: so....I take it you had a lot of cases of wood in the morning?
<yorickpeterse>
( •_•) ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■)
<ljarvis>
harr
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<yorickpeterse>
must've been....a hard job
<yorickpeterse>
ok I'll stop
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<ljarvis>
any suggestions for creating short hashes for strings, doesn't necessarily need to be reversable but should be unique
<canton7>
how short?
<canton7>
and "should be unique" begs the question "how unique?"
<ljarvis>
ideally less than ~5 characters. The strings are generally no more than 30 characters long. There are ~5-10 strings in a set and the result must only be unique across the set
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<canton7>
if there's just a set of them, I'd call them "str01", "str02", etc :P
<ljarvis>
they're not ordered and I need to be able to identify them again from a different set
<canton7>
so they need to be unique across more than just your little set?
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<canton7>
...since they also need to be unique across that different set
<ljarvis>
yeah but the margin of error can be small because it's expected that the different set will mostly contain the same results... :D
<ljarvis>
i need to rethink this
<canton7>
tbh, take the first n chars of the md5/sha1 hash
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<ljarvis>
yeah that's the way my head is going right now
<canton7>
but make sure you read up on the maths of the birthday paradox, and check how quicky you can expect collisions using only 5 chars
<canton7>
(hint: it's a lot sooner than you expect)
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<yorickpeterse>
ljarvis: is this supposed to be secure?
<apeiros>
I still wish there was a seedable Object#hash
<yorickpeterse>
oh hrm, that's for numbers only I think
<yorickpeterse>
derp
<apeiros>
ljarvis: I've used a slightly modified murmur in C for that in the past. not sure I'd still find the code, though. but murmur is quite easy to copy & adapt.
<ljarvis>
yeah I would just use the methods on String if it were for integers
<ljarvis>
apeiros: alright ta
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<_ht>
Ant recommendations for GUI programming with Ruby?
<_ht>
I've used Qt and Shoes in the past
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<_ht>
But they always fell short with respect to "rubyness" or deployability
<yorickpeterse>
There's nothing really better than qt/gtk
<yorickpeterse>
shoes is, with all respect, more of a toy thing
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<_ht>
Is gtk better than qt with respect to ruby integration?
<yorickpeterse>
The Gems are better last I checked, but they're not strictly easier to use or deploy
<_ht>
I also ask, because I seem to be unable to find a Qt5 binding
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<_ht>
But seriously, for example, if I'd build some application to automate, say, editing a tree of files, would I create a class, a module, or just a file (which is an implicit module, I guess) to separate the treewalking and editing from the UI-code?
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<yorickpeterse>
_ht: that's not really specific to Ruby though, that's a more general architectual problem
<ljarvis>
this isn't analogous to ruby
<[k->
you should separate them, many classes
<_ht>
I know, but what facilities does Ruby actually offer to solve these architectural problems?
<_ht>
I almost never use just Modules, but opt for classes instead because I'm familiar with them.
<[k->
Modules are for when you don't want to keep state
<_ht>
Then I often end up using a class that's all functionality and no state
<yorickpeterse>
Language wise there are classes and modules. Modules are mixins, which can be used to inject methods/contants/etc into an existing class/module
<yorickpeterse>
whereas inheritance is something you'd use if you actually want to inherit behaviour and slightly alter it
<yorickpeterse>
Most cases where you see inheritence being used you really want modules instead
<yorickpeterse>
e.g. most ORMs are probably the biggest offenders of this
<ljarvis>
inject modules like yorickpeterse injects opinions
<yorickpeterse>
heh
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<yorickpeterse>
well, the rule of thumb is generally: if you can't use a class on its own in a meaningful value it really should've been a module instead
<yorickpeterse>
errr s/value/way
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<ljarvis>
I generally agree though that inheritance is mostly overused in Ruby. Many beginners see it as a silver bullet and don't realise how powerful mixins are
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<yorickpeterse>
it would be nice though if modules were actual traits :/
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<[k->
refinements destroys mixins ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
<ljarvis>
but that happens a lot. Java has it everywhere too
<yorickpeterse>
e.g. renaming methods upon import can be really nice
<yorickpeterse>
[k-: thou shall not speak about refinements
<[k->
you can rename methods in java?
<[k->
but refinements are HUGE
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<yorickpeterse>
refinements are an atrocity
<yorickpeterse>
They solve a non existing problem
<yorickpeterse>
well, they don't even solve that
<DCameronMauch>
got an rspec question
<DCameronMauch>
is there a way to do something like this:
<yorickpeterse>
Instead they introduce a slightly blunter knife to gut yourself with
<yorickpeterse>
Even better, move it into separate applications
<yorickpeterse>
put some APIs up that pig
<yorickpeterse>
of the many things we've done wrong over the past few years, aggressively keeping things in separate apps was not one of them
<yorickpeterse>
although it can be a bit tedious to jump between a handful of apps to get a certain feature out at times
<ljarvis>
you handle auth across them?
<[k->
microservice?
<ljarvis>
i get nervous about a single app handling my schema whilst others drink from it
<yorickpeterse>
ljarvis: only 1 app communicates via HTTP
<yorickpeterse>
Everything else uses queues in between
<yorickpeterse>
For our API we're using per application credentials
<yorickpeterse>
e.g. for scraping reviews we basically use this flow: scheduler -> scraper -> persister -> sentiment analysis -> metadata extraction -> ranking
<yorickpeterse>
for every "->" there's basically a queue
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<yorickpeterse>
though "sentiment analysis" is made up out of 8 or so apps/queues
<yorickpeterse>
each doing just one specific bit
<yorickpeterse>
currently we have 147 SQS queues
<yorickpeterse>
(that includes dev/staging queues though)
<maloik>
yorickpeterse: I honestly don't think splitting it into services would help us much
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<maloik>
we just have associations that go something like server -> virtual server -> account -> application, mix in some customers, domains, dns records in there and you can quickly see the "problem"
<yorickpeterse>
ah
<[k->
too much geog, i thought sentiment analysis was sediment analysis
<yorickpeterse>
[k-: eh?
<[k->
beach sediments
<yorickpeterse>
aah
<yorickpeterse>
No, we don't do sediment analysis :P
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<[k->
you collect samples of sand at different locations
<[k->
and then you sieve it
<[k->
and you calculate the proportion of the diff types of sediments
<[k->
you have the fine sand, coarse sand, silt, clay, fine gravel, coarse gravel etc
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<yorickpeterse>
I'm aware of what sediment analysis is :P
<yorickpeterse>
also interesting: I have a test that tests a controller, said controller uses an undefined constant, said test passes fine
<yorickpeterse>
wtf
<yorickpeterse>
Oh no, I misread it
<yorickpeterse>
derp
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<Pathfinder>
souvikd: .. just check on the indentation please...it breaks my heart
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<elev>
can someone help me with the question?
<elev>
I got a file with some questions. I want it to print out 1 and 1 question
<souvikd>
Pathfinder: actually, I just finished learning, and the tutorials walked me through constructing a similar application. in this one, i had my own inputs and references from that as well.
<sd__>
Pathfinder: do you maintain or develop projects in ruby?
<sd__>
I mean open-source projects?
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<Pathfinder>
i have contributed to about.gitlab.com ... Haha..i know your beef is with the 2nd line...feeling lazy
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<sd__>
I dunno why but the last link you posted does not seem to open on my browser.
<sd__>
haha. ya well, am on my semseter break, so pretty bored. what better way to waste time than code and contribute? :)
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<Pathfinder>
sd__: i am in session in campus ..I work with in a primarily laravel and nodejs oriented company but I still do a few ruby and rails projects here and there
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<Pathfinder>
sd__: the last link is the same as the first
<elev>
s
<elev>
thanks pathfinder :)
<Pathfinder>
cool :)
<sd__>
ya i got it to open. and i got to know about File.readlines. till today I only knew of file.new and file.open. am pretty new to it , you see.
<Pathfinder>
elev: Now the trick..tell it to skip empty lines ..e.g. if a line is empty...go to next line ...That should be easy
<elev>
how?
<Pathfinder>
it is however not an optimal method and I would only recommend it as a once in a while patch due to optimization issues......
<elev>
skip the empty lines?
<elev>
Now I want to put their answers
<elev>
pathfinder what did you mean with that? my englich is bad sorry
<sd__>
elev, where are you from? :)
<elev>
norway
<elev>
I am only 14
<Pathfinder>
Imagine you had a file with a list of lines and in the middle there is a place where the lines are not next to each other..i.e. there is an empty line between 2 lines..skip that line
<elev>
how do I do that?
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<sd__>
14 and into coding. that's nice ! i wasn't coding much until I was in my high school :D
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<yorickpeterse>
sd__: depending on the country that might be either just before or after 14
<sd__>
oh. I thought it would be more like 17.
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<Pathfinder>
elev: i have included a simple way of storing the answers in an array .. http://pastebin.com/xEUqwVe1
<Pathfinder>
elev: I am 19 .. from Kenya .. nice to meet you
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<imperator>
are there any pure ruby webservers anyone uses besides webrick?
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<Pathfinder>
imperator: I like unicorn .. and i use thin sometimes too
<ttilley>
imperator: dear god, use anything but webrick. check out puma or thin maybe
<imperator>
ttilley, hadn't heard of puma, i'll take a look
<ttilley>
oh, you mean not even c extensions. don't think there are, no.
<ttilley>
why do you need it to be ruby-only?
<imperator>
needs to work on windows
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<ttilley>
imperator: a lot of servers will pre-compile their extension for their windows gem since it's not expected for you to have a sane compiler installed already. i believe at least thin will just install a binary on windows. dont quote me on that though, since i'm not a windows kinda guy. definitely try to gem install thin or puma (puma's pretty minimal so i can't see why it wouldn't be available).
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<imperator>
hm, thought thin was a unix-only server, but i'll double check
<ttilley>
imperator: you could also take a look at the bitnami ruby stack for windows. it should include a fair bit of pre-compiled extensions for windows, including thin. it also seems to have a pre-setup nginx to put in front of ruby. https://bitnami.com/stack/ruby
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<ttilley>
oh damn, i almost forgot about phusion passenger. there's even a distribution of nginx with passenger compiled in. the bitnami stack mentions including that as well
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<ttilley>
guess that'd make thin or passenger your best options on windows. (again, i don't develop on or deploy to windows)
<imperator2>
hm, looks like it installs on windows ok after all
<imperator2>
was thinking it used io-extra internally, which is definitely a unix-only gem
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<imperator>
welp, thin will work after all, thanks
<darix>
i just want to nitpick that neither thin nor puma are pure ruby. ;)
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<imperator>
true, but i figured the odds were better if it were
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<darix>
imperator: they probably are.
<imperator>
though i am a little surprised no one has tried to replace webrick
<darix>
but well you might be lucky with puma or thin in the end
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<darix>
imperator: they did. they just added some C pieces in the process
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<imperator>
darix, well, that's what i mean. i guess everyone starts off with pure ruby, then decides they want performance. ;)
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<darix>
and then steals^wadopts the mongrel parser