dominikh changed the topic of #cinch to: The IRC Framework | Latest version: Cinch 2.1.0
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<lagweezle>
So, are the folks who do the main merge-accepting / feature prioritizing / etc. ... do they hang out in here at all?
<catepillar>
dominikh is the one largely in charge of cinch
<catepillar>
he does all the merge accepting
<catepillar>
as far as feature prioritization, i think cinch is more or less considered stable, and mostly a "done" project
<lagweezle>
Heh. He told me a while ago that he isn't really very involved in it any more.
<catepillar>
in the past month, there have been 2 pull requests, neither merged, and 5 overall commits, none to the master branch
<lagweezle>
The reason I ask is that I started using lita.io for a work-related HipChat bot and was VERY pleasantly surprised by their rspec extensions to make module testing a very doable thing.
<catepillar>
heh, i wish my work used something like that...
<catepillar>
we use skype, which is very rigid and difficult to deal with
<catepillar>
also bloated beyond all words
<lagweezle>
We are/were. New ops director pushed the thing out. We (me & mah manager) were trying to get everyone onto an internal IRC, which worked somewhat successfully. HipChat has more of the company on it, so we're happily adopting that, now.
<lagweezle>
Frustrating in that I need to rewrite tools that ... eventually ... when I can stop making sure things don't catch on fire by being ignored too long. ;)
<dominikh>
sort of busy/semi-afk: Cinch is in maintenance mode; I don't work on features anymore; sensible features can get merged; I'm the sole person allowed to merge stuff
<dominikh>
if you want to work on stuff, you're very welcome to; and if I agreed to the idea beforehand, I'll merge it if the code quality is good :)
<dominikh>
we will not, however, support hipchat ;)
<dominikh>
did I miss anything?
<dominikh>
I do have some work on an unpushed branch; but that's only style changes to fix some stuff I never should've done and learned better
<dominikh>
brb/bbl again
<lagweezle>
dominikh: Not about to implement HipChat (XMPP) support. I was more lusting over the rspec extensions that made testing plug-ins ... well ... doable, to start.
<dominikh>
lagweezle: people have been saying/wishing/promising that for years. I think the underlying problem is that Cinch itself is already hell to test (because I sucked at program design back then)
<dominikh>
lagweezle: you'd have to implement a lot of a fake server for many things
<dominikh>
and the plugin design is… suboptimal as well. e.g. no proper separation between message parsing, message muxing and plugins
<lagweezle>
message muxing?
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<lagweezle>
I ask as I'm not sure what is meant by that. :/
<catepillar>
it's probably how it sends the one message to every plugin that has a match for it
<catepillar>
just at a guess
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<dominikh>
right
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<dominikh>
in a sane design, parser, muxer and plugin would be entirely separate. in our case, the Message object itself handles 25% of the muxing
<lagweezle>
Oooh.
<lagweezle>
muxing being something often handled by the publisher-subscriber ... pattern?
<lagweezle>
I know there are other ways of doing it, but that is the one I'm remembering.
<dominikh>
well, muxing would be a solution for pubsub, not the other way around
<lagweezle>
Oh. Hrm.
* lagweezle
puts on his noob hat.
<dominikh>
routing would be another word meaning mostly the same thing
<onewheelskyward>
Mmm, xmpp.
<dominikh>
XMPP isn't all that bad, if you have a good XML library at hand
<dominikh>
just… complex
<dominikh>
especially considering all the XEPs one can implement
<onewheelskyward>
ugh
<onewheelskyward>
I really dislike parsing xml. Though xpath is good, and clunky.
<onewheelskyward>
I've been thinking about a hipchat module for my bot.
<onewheelskyward>
I want to wire up cap deploys from there.
<dominikh>
there's not much parsing you yourself need, really. you need to know namespaces, and you need a way to unmarshal XML into proper data structures
<dominikh>
well, and of course a way to construct XML. encoding/xml in Go handles it quite well. most parts can be done via the generic Marshal/Unmarshal, some writing needs constructing tokens yourself
<dominikh>
XML libraries for Ruby, for some reason, really fall short on the "take this XML, turn it into that object" front
<catepillar>
that's what YAML is for
<catepillar>
who needs XML when you have YAML
<dominikh>
people who write XMPP libraries? :)
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<catepillar>
personally, i would perfer easy xml serializing over yaml serializing
<dominikh>
it literally took me longer to come up with the XML than with the code for actually turning it into a data structure
<dominikh>
I've always missed that sort of thing in Ruby, some years ago
<dominikh>
especially because I can turn an instance of Foo into XML the exact same way.
<dominikh>
I could also omit fields, if I wanted to, or capture chardata, or comments
<onewheelskyward>
That is pretty slick.
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<dominikh>
and I would've expected something like that from a dynamic language, not Go. heck, even if they slapped a "DSL" on top of it to annotate attributes, it'd still be better than having to work with xpath everywhere and do that by hand
<onewheelskyward>
Yep
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