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<willmore>
I've got non-PMIC and PMIC H3 and H5 boards. By far, the PMIC boards perform better--run cooler, faster, fewer software and performance issues.
<willmore>
Unless you're removing a lot of the need for different power lines in your design, or are severely space or cost limited, I can't imagine being able to justify leaving out the PMIC.
<[TheBug]>
I mean I have a large amount of diferent h3 and h5 boards as well lol
<[TheBug]>
but not sure I payed attention to those with didn't power management specifically
<[TheBug]>
but the BPi M2+ H2+ I think is voltage locked and runs okay
<[TheBug]>
depends on the implementation
<willmore>
Even the Orange Pi One Plus uses a PMIC.
<[TheBug]>
but definently runs hot, must have a heatsink
<willmore>
Compare an Orange Pi One and a PC. The PC is way faster and runs cooler.
<willmore>
It is bigger and does cost twice as much.
<[TheBug]>
well your also talking about OPi though
<willmore>
Sure.
<[TheBug]>
who are known to put better materials in the PCB to use as heat dispation
<willmore>
They make a wide variety of boards.
<[TheBug]>
there is a reason they make boards bigger etc
<willmore>
The One and zero are small boards.
<[TheBug]>
where as you look at a BPi M2+ board and it's tiny size and such and you know they didn't even consider heat at all
<willmore>
Are you seeing a pattern? ;)
<[TheBug]>
I mean its been obvious who makes the better boards from the beginning and who takes short cuts
<[TheBug]>
BPi has always taken shortcuts
<willmore>
Better boards ->PMIC.
<willmore>
People who leave out PMIC->make other questionable design decisions.
<[TheBug]>
Xunlong pretty much produce the better options all in
<[TheBug]>
NanoPi is bad about heat as well
<willmore>
Yeah, I don't buy FA boards anymore.
<[TheBug]>
Libre's boards are 'ok' though so far hven't been able to arse my self to use one in production cause they get pretty hot too and require a fan
<willmore>
I only have a Le Potato and it runs fine, but I've not stressed it.
<[TheBug]>
I have the H3 and H5
<[TheBug]>
from that same line
<willmore>
Ahh, the Potato is S805
<[TheBug]>
the ALL-H3-CC series
<willmore>
Completely different product
<[TheBug]>
there is also an amlogic board in that same series
<[TheBug]>
maybe not the one your speaking of
<willmore>
Yeah, that is.
<[TheBug]>
for H3 it pretty much goes... -> OPi Plus 2E, OPi PC Plus, BPi M2+ H3, OPi PC, NanoPi M1+, LIbre H3, NPi M2+ H2+, NanoPi M1, Libre H2+
<[TheBug]>
at least the order of usefulness and usablility to me
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<[TheBug]>
and actually if you can get one, the Beelink X2 TV box actually is a pretty darn stable H3 platform if you take the time to replace heatsink and add a fan, its almost as nice as Plus 2E just doesn't have gigabit nic
<karlp>
"if you replace the heatsink and add a fan" is apretty major change from "just buy this pretty darn stable platform" :)
<[TheBug]>
um
<[TheBug]>
Personally
<[TheBug]>
even if some vendor says it can run without a heatsink and fan
<[TheBug]>
I don't believe them
<[TheBug]>
and using a thermal pad and a 60mmx60mm piece of aluminum as a heatsink doesn't a heatsink make
<[TheBug]>
but the board it's self is performant with the right cooling
<[TheBug]>
and the emmc is decent quality
<karlp>
I can't get behind any product that I have to modify befor eit's useful.
<[TheBug]>
so if you can find one, they used to be slightly cheaper than Plus 2E and if you have a bit of time on your hands it only takes a short time to update the cooling
<karlp>
you should have said, "beelink x2 is crap, but there's enough space in the box that you can mount a new fan and heatsink and make it sort of worthwhile, if you're only using single units" :)
<[TheBug]>
karlp: then don't use any SBC at all as I have yet to purchase one I didn't have to add a heat disipation solution to outside of what was provided
<[TheBug]>
regardless of the manufacturer or board
<karlp>
obviously it depends what you're doing with it...
<[TheBug]>
for Beelink X2 if it was still on sale it was $30 while Plus 2E was 50$ easy, the 20$ you save can easily be spent on the heatsink and fan you want where I would still argue you are gonna need a heatsink and fan on that Plus 2E as well...
<karlp>
I have a pc plus stuck in shipping somewhere, I wanted the emmc and more usb ports
<karlp>
but I quite like the nanopi duo2 personally :)
<karlp>
unfortuntely mounting spi flash is aftermarket, but at least the footprint's there.
<[TheBug]>
I have a few NanoPi boards but never really been impressed -- the only one I have had my eye on and would like to try is the NanoPi M4 + SATA hat
<[TheBug]>
but everytime I have a budget for it, they are delayed like 2 months in shipping or don't have the things I want in stock
<[TheBug]>
so I kinda gave up on ever getting that board
<karlp>
I don't really see any major difference between nano/orange. you just have to pick what mix of ports you want, with which combinations of wifi modules, and which combinoation of ethernet speeds
<[TheBug]>
HUGE difference in the marterials the PCB is made of
<[TheBug]>
Xunlong includes copper in the PCB for heat disipation
<[TheBug]>
and a larger PCB
<[TheBug]>
where as NanoPi usually have tiny PCB
<[TheBug]>
with no extra heat disipation thoughts
<[TheBug]>
thats my complaint with them
<karlp>
they have tiny pcbs, which means they're actually useful for embedding.
<[TheBug]>
only if you can afford to add a heatsink and fan to your project
<[TheBug]>
or don't mind a really slow thermally throttled SoC
<[TheBug]>
or have in an area with passsive air flow
<[TheBug]>
I guess could be a solution
<[TheBug]>
willmore: are there any other boards besides the OPi boards that have a decent PMIC that you have used?
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<willmore>
[TheBug], I have not really looked for them. I would guess the Pine boards are good.
<willmore>
I have a Pine64 board from when they first came out and it's been very solid.
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<corecode>
so do they run cooler because of pmic or because of larger pcb area allowing more cooling?
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<willmore>
corecode, probably both, but the OpiOnePlus(H6) is as small as the OpiOne (H3), but runs cooler. So, the PMIC makes a lot of difference, but the good PCB design does not hurt.
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<plaes>
anyone aware why the Orange Pi boards have 24-pin camera interfaces?
<plaes>
and whether is there a way to connect 15-pin CSI cable? :)
<plaes>
man.. it's a mess...
<lvrp16>
plaes: it's a dvp camera and not a mipi camera
<bridadan>
I'm trying to learn more about an issue affecting the PinePhone. The LCD panel it has should be able to handle a refresh rate of 60Hz, however glxgears (and other applications like glmark2) always reports 36fps when VSYNC is enabled. I'm trying to narrow down what the issue could be. The SoC used by the PinePhone is an A64 and the screen is
<bridadan>
I'm not sure how familiar you are with this particular set of changes, but any idea if this fixes the refresh rate issue I mentioned or if this is more of a refactor
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<karlp>
is there table view for something like orange pi's lineup?
<karlp>
the numbering and names are like soup to me, and maybe such a table already exists?