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<faigo>
any tips of ocaml in latex?
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<Kempston>
how do i leave function ?
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<Nutssh>
Throw an exception or just let it walk off of the end (where there's an implicit return)
<Kempston>
how do i throw an exception ?
<Kempston>
failwith returns me from function that called function as well
<Kempston>
raise tells me i'm returning wrong type
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<Codename_V>
hey guys. when I just run ocaml, and I'm at the interactive prompt, how do I use libraries? I tried "open Unix;;", but that didn't seem to help much.
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<ax>
i think it is #load "unix.cma"
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<Codename_V>
hmm, load is an unbound value it's telling me
<ax>
use #load
<ax>
i got confused the first time too :)
<Codename_V>
ah, gotcha
<Codename_V>
thanks a bunch
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<Codename_V>
hmm, so I'm trying to make a simple irc client. anyone have any ideas why it would die halfway through spitting out the message of the day?
<Smerdyakov>
Oh, didn't you know? You need to use the optional 'dontDieHalfwayThroughMOTD' parameter to socket functions.
<mlh_>
gets me every time
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<pango_>
ThreadUnix is deprecated
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<jave>
is there some autodoc like facility for ocaml programs?
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<haakonn>
you mean ocamldoc?
<CruX>
can i use gdb,ddd,kgdb for debugging ocaml binaries ?
<CruX>
and gprof ?
<ejt>
you can use gprof on native builds, ocamldebug on bytecode builds
<jave>
haakonn: im a newbie, ill check out ocamldoc
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<haakonn>
i really miss a gui-based easy-to-use debugger for ocaml :(
<haakonn>
i use kprof pretty successfully though
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<haakonn>
i'm pondering a way to iterate a list. i'm thinking i'd like to do some operation on the head, and then return the result along with a function that can be called if the caller wants to continue iteration on the rest of the list, so as only to do as much work as necessary. the idea is that the caller doesn't have access to the list being iterated, and i don't want to start from the beginning of the list each time. sounds sane? is this a technique that could work
<ski>
yes (depending on what you want it for)
<ski>
do you want to return a plain lazy stream ?
<haakonn>
i don't know about stream; i simply want to return a value of some type
<haakonn>
(and the function to "continue")
<mflux_>
codename_v, does the server say 'ping' at any time?
<ski>
what is the value you want to return ?
<ejt>
sounds like a lazy stream to me
<haakonn>
ski: it's a value of some sum type (same as the head of the list in question)
<ski>
is it some local frozen state to be passed to the returned function ? or something that's genuinely useful to the environment ?
<haakonn>
not sure what that means, but i'm guessing the first :)
<haakonn>
i will look into lazy streams though
* ski
would guess you want the second
<ski>
anyway, the second is more or less streams
<haakonn>
are we talking streams as in the standard Stream module?
<haakonn>
or anywhere else i could learn about this?
<haakonn>
looking at Stream, looks very useful
<ski>
depends .. standard Streams are ephemeral .. maybe that is sufficient (or you want that), maybe you need persistent streams
<ski>
also, maybe you want just infinite streams maybe you want possibly finite streams
<ejt>
or just implement what you described, it'll work
<ski>
yes
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<haakonn>
ok, though i have a hard time trying to think so high-orderly
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<ejt>
haakonn: your way seems a little complicated, I would just write a map_until function, that takes the operation to do on each item and a predicate to say whether to continue
<haakonn>
ejt: i've been considering that same thing, but for some reason i decided not to, hmm
<haakonn>
if i can't remember the reason it may not have been a good one ;)
<ejt>
:) it should be quick to try anyway
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<haakonn>
Stream.empty: "Return () if the stream is empty, else raise Stream.Failure" -- huh, why not just return a bool?
<mflux_>
I think the point is to use them with the stream parsers?
<mflux_>
which may actually prefer the exception approach
<mflux_>
haakonn, have you given a look to the calmp4o language extension for streams?
<haakonn>
no ... i'm going down the predicate route, but i was just looking at the Stream doc and thought it was weird
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<mellum>
can somebody explain this to me? module IntMap = Map.Make(struct type t = int let compare = compare end);; let s = List.fold_left (fun s x -> IntMap.add x 0 s) IntMap.empty [3; 17; 666] in IntMap.fold (fun x _ () -> print_int x) s ()
<mellum>
why does this print 666173 and not 317666? The manual says I get the keys in increasing order...
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<mfurr>
mellum: it appears the manual does not match the implementation... perhaps you should submit a bugreport to inria
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<SmerdyOffice>
Anyone know an assembly language frontend for OCaml? (I need x86 in particular.)
<SmerdyOffice>
Actually, I mean a machine language frontend.
<teiax>
do you mean to do something like inline assembly?
<teiax>
or a VM
<teiax>
?
<SmerdyOffice>
I want to parse machine code so that I can analyze it.
<teiax>
ah, that sounds like fun
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<teiax>
but I don't know of any already built
<Schmurtz>
Smerdyakov, you may consider tout write some glue code in C
<Schmurtz>
it's easy to call C code from ocaml
<Schmurtz>
and write asm commands in your C code
<teiax>
I don't think thats what he has in mind though
<Schmurtz>
er, I don't answer the question...
<teiax>
I was thinking the same thing you were though at first
<SmerdyOffice>
Schmurtz, do you mean that you don't understand the question?
<teiax>
I wonder if the code generator in the compiler would be useful at all for you
<SmerdyOffice>
Maybe in some small way, but I wouldn't expect very much, because it doesn't need to _read_ machine or assembly code.
<teiax>
yes, the best you could hope for would be an elegant data structure
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<Schmurtz>
Smerdyakov, you want to write a disassemble tool ?
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<SmerdyOffice>
No, I am doing program verification on machine code.
<teiax>
hmmmm
<teiax>
that sounds very tricky
<SmerdyOffice>
I and many others have been doing it for a while, though my group has worked on assembly code instead of machine code, and I want to start with machine code this time.
<Schmurtz>
assembly code is just a human-understandable version of machin code
<teiax>
hehehe, I wish lilo would say stuff like that during the boot process :{
<SmerdyOffice>
Schmurtz, I don't agree, unless you want to say that OCaml is just a human-understandable version of machine code?
<teiax>
yes, I'd say that there IS some extra information in assembly code which is tossed when it becomes machine code
<Schmurtz>
assembler to machine code or machine code to assembler is a trivial task
<Schmurtz>
teiax, really ?
<teiax>
sure
<teiax>
you can name things in assembly code
<Schmurtz>
ok
<teiax>
some assemblers have features which are very like higher level languages
<teiax>
all that stuff gets tossed out the window when you "assemble" it
<teiax>
yes, you can produce assembly code from machine code, but you cannot often produce the original assembly code from machine code only
<SmerdyOffice>
Not to mention that you must trust in the correctness of your assembler or prove a correctness theorem about it if you want to draw conclusions from program analyses on assembly programs.
<teiax>
you can produce C, or even Ocaml from machine code
<teiax>
yes, hm, that is very true
<Schmurtz>
or assembler
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<mflux_>
and cpu?
<mflux_>
and memory and bus and..
<mflux_>
and if you inspect the machine with your senses they must be provably reliable too.
<mflux_>
if you want to prove something about the code, isn't it better to handle the assembly, because it's one step more from it to the machine code?
<mflux_>
well, I suppose if you already have the machine code it would be an extra step to convert it to assembler first
<mflux_>
but I think that mapping an assembler (not a macro assembler) has between the assembly and machine code should be 1:1
<SmerdyOffice>
Of course it isn't 1:1. These assembly programs have the same machine code:
<SmerdyOffice>
label1:
<SmerdyOffice>
label2:
<SmerdyOffice>
Machine code is easier to reason about, because it's simpler.
<SmerdyOffice>
And assemblers are non-trivial pieces of software to prove correct.
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<ulfdoz>
g'eve, I'm fiddling on a parser for sieve. As sieve shall be extensible, I wonder what possibilities are there, to reflect this in the parser. I could copy the idea with the function table from SooHyoung Oh's Ocamlyacc Tutorial, but how to deal with optional parameters for the commands? I'm new to parser building and not experienced with programming in *ML.
<monochrom>
I have not thought much on parsers for extensible things.
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<ulfdoz>
Probably there are types with labeled fields. That could help, but I don't yet see it. :\
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<Mathman>
hi there. I'm wondering if this ocaml book I'm reading is wrong. it says that when you combine patterns, they can only contain constants or the wildcard. but I did a little test and it seems to work just fine with variables.
<Mathman>
here's my little test:http://rafb.net/paste/results/XknpB139.html
<Mathman>
anyway, according to this book, I shouldn't be able to have those x's in there. is that not right?
<ski>
combine as in combine two patterns together into one pattern with '|' ?
<Mathman>
yeah
<ulfdoz>
x has no value, and you have no chance to change the value of x in myand after definition of myand.
<ski>
(that is called 'or-pattern)
<ulfdoz>
So it isn't really variable.
<ski>
i think the correct statement would be that all branches of an or-pattern has to bind the same set of variables, and each variabe having the same type
<Mathman>
well here's what the book says:The only strong constraint is that all naming is forbidden within these patterns. So each one of them must contain only constant values or the wildcard pattern.
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<Mathman>
alright, well, I guess it doesn't matter too much. just confused me there for a second.
<ski>
$ ocaml
<ski>
Objective Caml version 3.08.1
<ski>
# let myand v = match v with
<ski>
(true,x) | (x,true) -> x
<ski>
| _ -> false;;
<ski>
val myand : bool * bool -> bool = <fun>
<ski>
and it works (note how my version is not same as yours)
<ski>
Mathman : i can only guess either the author didn't know what s/he was writing about .. or s/he possibly describes an earlier version in which this restriction might have been present (i suspect latter)
<Mathman>
I see. thanks.
<Mathman>
I take it you guys don't get too upset about pasting a few lines. =)
<pango>
Mathman: it could also have been true for some older versions... (how old is this book ?)
<pango>
the original (french) book was published in 2000
<ski>
Mathman : well, if it's many lines i think most people think it's surely better to use some paste-service
<pango>
I don't know if they updated the info since then (or while translating it)
<Mathman>
I see. so I guess it's probably good that I'm testing things as I go along.
<pango>
translation occurred around 2002
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<mikeX>
is there an easy way to read the output of a system command (and say display it in a widget etc)?
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<SmerdyOffice>
I'd say you should look at the unix library.
<Schmurtz>
I think you must use unix library
<Schmurtz>
exec and pipes
<SmerdyOffice>
From the perspective of the unix library, there is no need to use anything involving the term "pipe."
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<mikeX>
SmerdyOffice, Unix.create_process?
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<arcticd>
Hi
<arcticd>
I have a question about the example function in this post: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners/message/229 ( the 'let rec read_lines ch lines' one)...How would I call this? Because I need two arguments but the second one (the list) isn't really needed...
<SmerdyOffice>
mikeX, there are a number of variations, determining which IO streams of the created process you get.
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<SmerdyOffice>
arcticd, how is it "not needed"?
<mikeX>
SmerdyOffice, ok, I'll look into it further
<arcticd>
SmerdyOffice: Whats the function's use of me giving it an empty list?
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<SmerdyOffice>
arcticd, do you understand how the function works?
<arcticd>
Its recursive so it calls itself as long as there are any lines left in the file
<mikeX>
I think the 'Some ->' is missing a 'line'
<arcticd>
I found that out myself already but thanks :)
<mikeX>
arcticd, the function is called with an empty list, because a list is build (el :: el :: el :: [])
<arcticd>
Ok...how do I create that empy list when calling it?
<mikeX>
read_lines ch []
<mikeX>
that's the call
<mikeX>
the empty list is symbolised as []
<arcticd>
Oh yeah...now it works :)...Tried it with [] before but gave me strange things back
<arcticd>
Thanks
<arcticd>
This language has the steepest learning curve of all I know :)
<mikeX>
yeah I find it hard too :/
<mikeX>
arcticd, join #flood if you'd like a more complete example
<mikeX>
i just happened to use that function somewhere just now !
<SmerdyOffice>
arcticd, I think OCaml has a much less steep learning curve than most mainstream languages.
<SmerdyOffice>
articd, the problem is that you chose to learn some other languages first, and you can't necessarily transfer all of your knowledge from them to OCaml.
<SmerdyOffice>
While most mainstream languages are nearly identical in the ways that count.
<mikeX>
SmerdyOffice, did you start off with imperative languages?
<arcticd>
It's hard to see when something in ocaml is imperative or functional
<arcticd>
For me as a beginner
<mikeX>
arcticd, what languages did you learn prior to ocaml?
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<arcticd>
Oh I took the Pascal -> Perl -> Java -> Ruby route :)
<mikeX>
I see... i started with pascal too :/
<arcticd>
And I think they'll force me into that this year in school again :(