havenwood changed the topic of #ruby to: Rules & more: http://ruby-community.com || Ruby 2.3.1; 2.2.5; 2.1.9: https://ruby-lang.org || Paste >3 lines of text on https://gist.github.com || logs @ http://irclog.whitequark.org/ruby/
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<daemoen> isnt GEM_PATH supposed to determine where gems are installed to when you run gem install ?
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<ayee> I installed a gem (deb-s3), but regular users don't have execute permissions
<ayee> Is there some setting in gem to make the packages executable by default?
<ayee> when I globally install them
<Radar> ayee: what's it say when you try to execute it?
<ayee> Radar: permission denied
<Radar> ayee: literally those two words and nothing else appears on your scren?
<ayee> I did 'gem install deb-s3' as root. I can run deb-s3 as root fine
<Radar> screen*
<ayee> $ deb-s3
<ayee> -bash: /usr/local/bin/deb-s3: Permission denied
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<ayee> I can see in ls -al, I don't have execute permissions
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<Radar> Right. It'd be because you installed it as root. I don't know how to work around that automatically.
<Radar> You could chown it into a group which both root and the users are in.
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<imperator> ayee, what's your root's umask?
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<ayee> imperator: 0027 :(
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<imperator> change it to 0022 and try again?
<ayee> imperator: yep, that's it
<ayee> Good debugging skills! That is a tricky thing to find
<ayee> thanks for the help
<imperator> yw
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<hxegon> Are the ruby koans depreciated or something? The download link on the website goes to a github 404 and I can't find anything about it.
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<imperator> hxegon, huh, good question - web site is up, but download link is busted
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<hxegon> Anyone know a different place to get it?
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<Arcaire> oh
<Arcaire> i answered this question the other day on reddit
<Arcaire> hxegon:
<Arcaire> let me find it
<Arcaire> they were originally under edgecase, then got moved to neo, and now they're back under edgecase
<Arcaire> the neo github account got recreated on May 22 or so, which is why it's all rm'd now
<Arcaire> cc imperator
<hxegon> ty Arcaire
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<imperator> thx Arcaire
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<tie> New to the whole IRC thing, so I dont know much about the community or the format but is this a good place for quick answers to simple Ruby questions?
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<Arcaire> yes
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<tie> Wewt ^.^ I've got my final project on Ruby due the first and I've never used it before.
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<Nilium> Sounds like fun.
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<tie> Except the workload it is
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<tie> Whats a good environment to use for ruby? Or are there any dedicated compilers or addons to Visual Studio 2015?
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<noisykeyboard> hey
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<noisykeyboard> I don't really know much about ruby but I have a question about the way ruby outputs timestamps as outlined in this blogpost http://blog.matthewrathbone.com/2010/09/28/ruby-json-serialization-sucks-for-time-objects.html
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<noisykeyboard> I'm dealing with an API that's outputting timestamps in that format but I can't find any documentation on what the values mean
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<noisykeyboard> anyone?
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<Arcaire> tie: why would you need a compiler
<Arcaire> most of us use something like Sublime Text, Visual Studio Code, or Atom.
<Arcaire> Some people accidentally bought RubyMine and pretend they're okay with it.
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<Arcaire> noisykeyboard: i have no idea what question you're asking
<noisykeyboard> I'm dealing with an API and it's returning a JSON response
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<noisykeyboard> in the json response it has a section that with a timestamp
<noisykeyboard> like this 'created_at': {'json_class': 'Time', 'n': 154771000, 's': 1464225504}
<Arcaire> n is nanoseconds
<Arcaire> s is seconds
<noisykeyboard> nanoseconds since epoch?
<Arcaire> i think so
<Arcaire> but probably not
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<noisykeyboard> thanks a lot
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<noisykeyboard> kinda undocumented lol
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<zacts> hello rubyists
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<tie> Hey, lost my internet for a while. Did someone answer my ruby environment /copiler question?
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<tie> compiler*
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<Guest99167> Hey, I'm working in rails, and when I ($ rake routes) for some reason, I don't have an index controller action. What happened?
<Radar> Guest99167: show us what you have instead please.
<Radar> Guest99167: ?rails
<Radar> ?rails Guest99167
<ruby[bot]> Guest99167: Please join #RubyOnRails for Rails questions. You need to be identified with NickServ, see /msg NickServ HELP
<Guest99167> on sec
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<Arcaire> how did you even
<Arcaire> find this channel without finding #ror
<Arcaire> Guest99167: /join #rubyonrails
<Guest99167> roger, thank you
<Arcaire> This is a channel for everything except rails tbh
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<Guest99167> Ahh, sorry
<Arcaire> lol all good
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<Radar> Guest99167: See you over on #rubyonrails
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<tie> Im doing my first Ruby project for a final and I'm wondering what you guys use to compile it?
<Arcaire> wait what the hell
<Arcaire> I thought I was talking in #ror-ot
<Arcaire> tie: you don't compile ruby
<Arcaire> (mostly)
<tie> I'm pretty pampered by Visual Studio so i'm a little lost as to how to program in it.
<tie> I've done notepad++ for Python for a single project but besides that its been VS for me.
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<Radar> tie: Ruby is an interpreted language. You don't compile it at all.
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<Arcaire> Ruby is like Python in that regard
<Arcaire> use notepad++
<Arcaire> or, even better, use Visual Studio Code
<tie> I tried to use notepag++ but when i tried to run it in the CMD it just didnt seem to want to run.
<tie> notepad++*
<Radar> Try Sublime Text 3 too.
<Arcaire> 70usd
<Arcaire> developer is in australia
<Arcaire> abusing currency conversion for maximum profit
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<tie> I'm trying out Code VS really quick. Ill tell you how it goes.
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<Arcaire> ojk
<Arcaire> ok
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<tie> read ECONNRESET
<tie> I'm getting this error when I try to install the Ruby extension
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<tie> Any ideas?
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<Radar> nope, sorry.
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<tie> Figured out it was due to me being behind a proxy
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<tie> What time of day is this IRC usually most active?
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<Radar> About 2 or 3 hours from now when EU wakes up
<Radar> EU and US are still mostly asleep now
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<smathy> Zzzz
<tie> I thought us programmers were supposed to be nocturnal. Or is that just the case in college?
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<Radar> Hours of operation for the #ruby IRC channel over the past 4 years.'
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<Radar> X is time, Y is messages
<Radar> Time is in UTC.
<Radar> tie: that should answer your question.
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<tie> Damn dude, nice. That really helps me out. It sucks I came on here at the worst possible time though.
<tie> How did you extract that information?
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<Radar> tie: I log this channel and #rubyonrails with my helpa bot.
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<Radar> I ran an SQL query to extract the data and then graphed it using plot.ly
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<tie> Well thats pretty cool. I'm only in my second year so I havent expanded my horizons very much but I'm impressed you were able to get that information so quickly.
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<Radar> Lots and lots and lots of practicing (and some googling for the right SQL to use for PostgreSQL)
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<tie> May I ask what you do for a living?
<tie> I'm just curious about my future possibilities.
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<Radar> tie: Here's a good summary: http://ryanbigg.com/about-me/
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<Radar> A shorter version: I work at Marketplacer and build sites like bikeexchange.com.au and on the side I write a lot of books / guides for Ruby and Rails.
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<tie> Well that answer was just too easy for you. Youve already typed it up!
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<Radar> Yup :)
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<tie> Are you self taught or did you take courses?
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<Radar> neither, really. I tried teaching myself but I got a lot of help from this channel and #rubyonrails when I was first starting out
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<tie> I still consider that self taught. You didnt live in a dorm for four years writing a half dozen programs a week.
<tie> Crying yourself asleep at night...
<tie> Failing to eat for days...
<tie> Gradually indebting yourself to oblivion...
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<Radar> [15:42:22] <tie>Crying yourself asleep at night... <- yes
<Radar> [15:42:33] <tie>Failing to eat for days... <- no. That's just stupidity.
<Radar> [15:43:04] <tie>Gradually indebting yourself to oblivion... <- See above.
<tie> Aww... Okay, thanks friend
<Radar> "“One cannot think well, love well, sleep well, if one has not dined well.”"
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<tie> Ahhhh okay
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<tie> Yeah, I pretty much live off of Thai and Mac and Cheese
<tie> Luckily the ADHD medication I'm on eliminates my appitite so failing to eat doesnt effect me very much. But It's not by choice. I'm programming or doing classwork 18 hours a day. I dont really get a chance to eat.
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<alfiemax> Hey y'all..
<alfiemax> i'm using nokogiri to scrape a webpage and get the images present in the page. My code seems to work and fetch the images, but not all of it. I think nokogiri isn't reading the entire webpage.
<Ropeney> that sucks
<alfiemax> here is the gist if it even matters, it's just basic two lines (https://gist.github.com/alfie-max/4d26da8ead39ce1daf705432349f87d4)
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<Ropeney> alfiemax, It's because they are loading via ajax. Look into https://github.com/watir/watir-webdriver
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<ayee> I'm trying to install debugger, with gem install debugger
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<ayee> https://gist.github.com/anonymous/d7c2eb1f7e6cbbdcd5eee5a2765b80f4 ... but I get No such file or directory @ rb_sysopen - ./230/ruby_debug.h (Errno::ENOENT)
<ayee> I'm using rvm and ruby 2.3.0p0 (2015-12-25 revision 53290) [x86_64-linux] .. how can I get rvm to install the ruby_debug.h file?
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<ayee> o nevermind, this is a known issue and it's not fixed yet: https://github.com/cldwalker/debugger/issues/125
<ayee> I'll just install 2.2 instead of 2.3 and see if that works
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<ayee> lol, same issue
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<ishe> gem debugger is only for ruby 1.9. for 2.x you should use debugger2
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<Radar> or the pry gem
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<iWantCod> hello?
<iWantCod> help me
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<iWantCod> { cout << "help "<< endl;
<iWantCod> fuck
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<vjacob> is there a beginner channel?
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<jhass> vjacob: we happily take beginner questions, but if the audience is too big for you there's also ##new2ruby
<Zarthus> vjacob: /msg alis list ruby -min 10 seems to suggest at best a ##new2ruby channel, but this channel generally helps anyone so long as the question is answerable.
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<tie_> Nighty night Radar!
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<fu2ristiq> Hi everybody
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<hanmac> shevy i found the perfect game for us programmers; http://tomorrowcorporation.com/humanresourcemachine "Human Ressource Machine" XD
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<fu2ristiq> hi everybody
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<shevy> is there a way to do partial subclassing? like if I want to subclass .tr() and .tr() from string, for a string-like object, but without wanting to subclass from class String
<shevy> hanmac you have way too much time available :P
<fu2ristiq> should I do
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<fu2ristiq> should I do "require 'test/unit' or "require 'minitest/autoload' these days?
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<shevy> fu2ristiq you mean whether you should use one or the other?
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<fu2ristiq> shevy exactly
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<hanmac> shevy: about tr from String, imo you should never subclass one of the core classes like String, you better use a Delegator object for such thing
<shevy> hanmac aha, delegator. let me look up how to use that
<shevy> fu2ristiq minitest probably
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<fu2ristiq> shevy thank you
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<miqlas-H> Hi Guys!
<miqlas-H> I'm working on the ruby port for Haiku.
<miqlas-H> Can you tell me, how do you guys accomplished the colorized configure script output? I pretty like it.
<miqlas-H> It seems, there is a colorizing function in the configure script. Can i use it in other programs too? The autoconf man page doesn't say anything about it, and google search was also helpless.
<miqlas-H> BTW, i got the latest ruby to compile yesterday.
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<shevy> yay, go Haiku!
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<shevy> I think the colourized output is fairly new-ish... 2-3 years or so? nobu probably may have added it
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<miqlas-H> shevy: but can we generate the configure script with enabled colorized output somehow from configure.in with autoreconf? Or is it require manual labour?
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<miqlas-H> shevy: please, don't have big expectations yet, i got plenty problems at packaging properly ruby for Haiku..
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<miqlas-H> So it isn't in the repo yet, i need to work further.
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<jhass> dunno, is it https://github.com/ruby/ruby/blob/trunk/tool/ifchange doing perhaps?
<miqlas-H> As in Haiku almost everything packaged, and just extracted virtually, the good old folders became read-only, so i need to define, where should ruby put the user-addons.
<shevy> dunno where the colourization is, shell scripts scare me
<miqlas-H> shevy: no problem. I just really hope it will be the default in the following years. It makes the porting works really easier.
<jhass> miqlas-H: many distro's deploy a /etc/gemrc that sets --user-install these days
<miqlas-H> I mean i hope it will become standard at other projets too
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<shevy> I remember some years ago when i tried out haiku (but via qemu), I wanted to have ruby on it
<shevy> I can live without linux but not without ruby!
<miqlas-H> jhass: i know about that, and it works with the actual ruby version on Haiku (ruby 2.2.2 i think), but it creates a .gem folder in the user home folder.
<miqlas-H> It shouldn't do that.
<shevy> aha
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<jhass> uhm yes it should
<miqlas-H> there should be no dot folders in the user home.
<shevy> rubygem likes the .gem directory
<jhass> so where do you want them?
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<shevy> I have a file called "credentials" and a directory called "specs/" in my .gem dir
<miqlas-H> there is a folder for that: /boot/home/config/non-packaged/data
<miqlas-H> or /home/config/settings/ruby
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<miqlas-H> they are read-write folders
<miqlas-H> Sorry, we cannot package all the gems, they are changing too oftly
<shevy> that is good!
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<miqlas-H> But btw i got jekyll work on Haiku some time ago. I need it for my webpage.
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<jhass> iirc there's configure optio
<miqlas-H> i had a big headache because ffi, it have C supporting code, and i don'treally remember, how i made it work. I sent already a patch for ffi, but it isn't enough yet to get it work.
<jhass> *options to set/expand GEM_HOME/GEM_PATH ß
<miqlas-H> And i forgot, how i made it work :(
<miqlas-H> Dopt do serious programming in pubs....
<miqlas-H> *Don't
<miqlas-H> jhass: I know about that, and about .gemrc
<miqlas-H> But the .gemrc also cannot be in /home
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<miqlas-H> there shouldn't be an dot files and folders in home.
<jhass> but in /etc/gemrc
<jhass> anyway
<jhass> just ship a profile.d that exports GEM_HOME
<miqlas-H> we haven't got /etc
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<shevy> :)
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<miqlas-H> I tried to port some deep-learning softwares to haiku, but almost all of them require fortran compiler, and we doesn't have any yet.
<shevy> it's a linux world!
<miqlas-H> (it isn't ruby relevant thing)
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<miqlas-H> shevy: i know, and there should be an symbolic link for /etc, but we doesn't have any, i suppose. So we need to hack all the sources, where it is hardcoded.
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<miqlas-H> i tried to enable fortran in gcc, but you just doesn't want to get gcc compile in a bar.... it takes just too much time.
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<tolland> im parsing an XML doc with nokogiri, but its only returning 4 elements, (there are many), any suggestions on whether there is a limit parameter I am missing?
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<ytti> tolland, stab in the dark, try #remove_namespaces!
<miqlas-H> Guys, i'm trying to get as many useful programs to compile on Haiku as much as i can get. But i'm out of ideas. Can you give me any tips for cli or qt based programs what you like to see on Haiku?
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<shevy> ruby-qt!
<shevy> :D
<jhass> tolland: if that doesn't help you gotta share your code & XML
<miqlas-H> for that i should get ruby to compile properly first
<miqlas-H> any other wish?
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<jhass> tmux?
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<miqlas-H> got fish shell to compile on Haiku, but it crashes as i try to start it.... ehhh....
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<miqlas-H> jhass: i think somebody worked on that, but out Terminal isn't enough advanced for that.
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<miqlas-H> our
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<miqlas-H> I think. But fixme.
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<tolland> yep, if I run this in irb, I am seeing output of 4 links http://pastebin.com/Q6rRAuwe
<ruby[bot]> tolland: we in #ruby do not like pastebin.com, I reposted your paste to gist for you: https://gist.github.com/d130ebd2c00e32608d9e98eb4881cd59
<ruby[bot]> tolland: pastebin.com loads slowly for most, has ads which are distracting and has terrible formatting.
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<tolland> but the doc itself has clearly got a bunch of <a> elements in http://limepepper.co.uk/test.xml
<jhass> tolland: that's HTML, not XML
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<shevy> miqlas-H hmm I can tell you my usual setup right now
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<miqlas-H> and tmux requires libevent, what isn't updated for Haiku yet (we have a port actually)
<jhass> tolland: parse it as HTML and it'll work
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<shevy> miqlas-H bash as my main shell; kde konsole as my main terminal; evince usually for .pdf files; libreoffice for documents... ruby for programming... lighttpd for webserver... xchat for IRC (still!)... firefox as browser... bluefish as editor (haha) ... mplayer for video and audio files... ffmpeg for modifying the latter two format types... I may probably miss some. Do these work on haiku?
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<tolland> jhass: its odd that its finding 4 elements
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<jhass> tolland: it's luck that it parses at all
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<jhass> (as XML)
<miqlas-H> BTW, i just become lead engineer :) I got minions, they doing what i say, it is pretty good.
<shevy> miqlas-H where is the temporary files directory on haiku by the way?
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<miqlas-H> tmp do you mean?
<shevy> on linux I guess it is /tmp/
<miqlas-H> We got /boot/system/cache/tmp and it have a symlink to /tmp
<shevy> aha ok
<miqlas-H> so it will work as in linux
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<jhass> since we got some ontopic traffic
<jhass> ?ot
<ruby[bot]> this seems to be off-topic. Please move your discussion to #ruby-offtopic, to keep this channel free for Ruby related topics. Thanks!
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<miqlas-H> jhass: do you mean me? :)
<jhass> yes
<miqlas-H> I'm sitting in a bar, i had 4 beers, so i just cannot be ontopic.
<miqlas-H> But i pretty liek the jekyll. With it i can sleep a bit better, and i don't need to think about hackers and so on.
<miqlas-H> and static html's are etter cacheable.
<miqlas-H> so i like ruby, but i never did any actual developement in ruby yet.
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<miqlas-H> I really want to port rail for Haiku, but it had plenty problems with ruby 2.2.2, so i thought maybe it would be easier with recent ruby, that's why i'm working on ruby now
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<apeiros> miqlas-H: "i just cannot be ontopic" - just don't complain you hadn't been warned.
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<miqlas-H> apeiros: i tried to be ontopic, you see?
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<shevy> :D
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<Dysp> Hi people. I've made my first script! And it works. Yaaay. However, I would like if someone would do me the honors of evaluating what I've written, so I can learn about producing better code. I mean; what am I doing in a bad way here? Is it built correctly? Am I using class the way I should? So on and so on.
<jhass> Dysp: first pass, formatting
<jhass> ?styleguides Dysp
<ruby[bot]> Dysp: here are three popular styleguides, you should read and follow at least one: https://github.com/styleguide/ruby https://github.com/bbatsov/ruby-style-guide https://github.com/thoughtbot/guides/tree/master/style/ruby
<jhass> fix that and I'll take another look
<Dysp> Alrighty!
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<goeast> Hello ! I have a question. I am creating a Music Library. I want to store songs which belong to artists. Here is my code : https://gist.github.com/go-east/33058007cad5985214d79b6658ebaa58
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<goeast> I have 2 class. 1 is creating the artist and the other 1 is storing the artist into the library.
<goeast> I have 2 problems : 1) I am not able to store my artist in the library. The code is not working. 2) I would like it to respect the artist = Hash.new { |h,k| h[k]=[]} because 1 artist can have many songs.
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<goeast> thanks !
<goeast> (line 26)
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<jhass> your indentation is pretty inconsistent :)
<jhass> also if you name your gistfile something.rb you get syntax highlighting
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<shevy> goeast you should include the module where the code will be used, in your class
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<jhass> goeast: anyway, I expect you're getting some error message, shall we interpret them together?
<goeast> Yes please thank you very much
<shevy> I don't really know why you use the modules though
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<jhass> edit your gist, add a file with them
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<goeast> Sorry Jhass Its one of the first time I am using gist. I "edit" and "add"a file. But I don't see what is expected :/
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<jhass> you get a second textarea, paste your error message and hit save
<goeast> ah Get it thanks
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<goeast> done
<jhass> goeast: great, so the first important part is where the error is happening
<jhass> library.rb:26 tells us its in the file library.rb in line 26
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<jhass> now it says you used an undefined local variable or method library
<goeast> yes
<jhass> and I have to agree, library isn't defined as local variable or method there
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<jhass> however there's an instance variable named @library available in that context ;)
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<goeast> yes I just added it
<goeast> I update the gist
<jhass> please name your code in the gist libary.rb and keep the output of invoking it as txt while at it ;)
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<Dysp> jhass: A little better? https://gist.github.com/Dysp/052241f3ad65b46b860ca41a1ecfad9d Anything in particular which catches your eye?
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<jhass> indentation still isn't at two spaces, def's are still not indented towards their class, indentation where there's no nested logical block
<jhass> camelCase method names, private isn't used as recommended
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<jhass> explicit return keywords where not necessary
<Dysp> It is two spaces, I just think Gist changes it
<jhass> it's tabs, you just set your editor to display them as two spaces
<Dysp> Probably.
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<jhass> please convert to spaces
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<jhass> goeast: okay great, next error is in the same line.
<jhass> "undefined method `>>' for {}:Hash" anything you can make out of this?
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<goeast> Yes I get that I can't use >> for a Hash so instead I think I should use something like hash [key ]= value
<alfiemax> Hi
<jhass> Dysp: calling instance_variable_get on self with a symbol literal is pointless, just use the variable directly
<tildes> Dysp: you don't need to use instance_variable_get inside the same class
<goeast> but this is exactly where I am lost since its already created one time :/
<jhass> goeast: spacing is off, but yes
<apeiros> tildes: s/class/object/
<jhass> goeast: are you sure you need a hash? do you know the difference between hash and array?
<tildes> Dysp: and if you ever feel like using it outside the class, use an attribute accessor rather
<tildes> apeiros: yes, and?
<alfiemax> i'm trying to fetch all images loaded in a page, and by just using nokogiri i'm only able to get the html part, so i can only get images with `img` tags
<Dysp> Ehm.
<goeast> Yes I know the difference and I need a hash in this format artist = Hash.new { |h,k| h[k]=[]} or maybe I am mystaking. I want to add many songs to one artist
<tildes> Dysp: also if you're interested in improving style, try rubocop :)
<Dysp> I will
<jhass> goeast: okay so artist shall become your key
<alfiemax> is there any other tool in ruby with which i can get image's rendered via css? using background/background-image properties?
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<apeiros> tildes: there's no "and". it's "inside the same object", not "inside the same class"
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<jhass> goeast: how about renaming add to add_artist and creating an empty array for them in the library?
<Dysp> My plan was to put the bad body into a database when calculated. Then call the methods defined when I want to access stuff in the object.
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<Dysp> But maybe I should take the whole load/calculate part out of the class.
<tildes> apeiros: on a quick read it looks like it's all in the same class
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<jhass> Dysp: can't comment on structure yet, too noisy ;)
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<jhass> Dysp: all those abbreviated names don't help either, please spell them out
<tildes> Dysp: with a language like ruby, fixing indentations is a must, cannot stress this strongly enough
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<apeiros> tildes: yes, instance methods defined in the same class will be executed in the context of the same object. but you still can only access the same object's ivars without ivar_get.
<jhass> Dysp: and while fixing names, avoid generics like "array, hash", describe your data
<apeiros> seemingly small but important difference
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<Dysp> jhass: Which abbreviated names? Like RFD and nm? Why would I write "rateOfForceDevelopmentInNewtonMeter"? ^_^
<goeast> Jhass : I updated the gist and corrected the mystake >> into <<
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<tildes> Dysp: and Norwegian (?) comments :)
<jhass> Dysp: rate_of_force_development
<Dysp> Danish. :P
<tildes> Dysp: sorry, my bad :D
<tildes> just proves I can't really read it properly
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<goeast> Jhass : Thank you very much ! It seems it is working but how can I make sure that the format artist = Hash.new { |h,k| h[k]=[]}
<Dysp> jhass: But when I later want to call that variable inside the object, do you really suggest writing such long names?
<Dysp> from the object*
<jhass> goeast: I don't think you need that autovivifying hash with the structure you're going at ;)
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<jhass> Dysp: yes.
<jhass> absolutely
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<tildes> Dysp: it really is a best practice from all programming, except for some cases, such as embedded software, where you cannot afford the extra characters from hardware perspective
<jhass> get an editor which can autocomplete if you really can't be arsed
<tildes> ^in, not from
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<Dysp> It's not about whether I want to or not.. But generally we don't refer to those long names when we speak about it at the lab.
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<shevy> the unspoken things!
<tildes> Dysp: if it's domain terminology, then abbreviation might make sense
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<jhass> "array, hash" isn't
<Dysp> It is indeed. No one who doesn't know what this is about would ever see the code.
<tildes> nope, never :D
<jhass> so why would you show us?
<jhass> ;)
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<goeast> Jhass : ahah I know. Actually it is much more for a training purpose. What is interesting for me is to learn how to play with a Hash
<jhass> we have no clue, so if you later want feedback on the structural/logical level we need to understand what your code is doing
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<Dysp> Because I am not asking you about the specific data handling the script does, just about whether or not I am doing stuff stupidly. Like the array/hash thingy
<jhass> abbreviations such as nms and n make that extremely hard
<Dysp> That is true indeed.
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<Dysp> newton meter pr second
<Dysp> and newton.
<Dysp> ^^
<jhass> I won't memorize that for you
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<Dysp> But I do get your point.
<Dysp> You should have seen the first version of the script. Just one long set of code. No functions defined or anything.
<jhass> there's always a greater evil
<jhass> doesn't make the current one less relevant
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<Dysp> True story; but slamming me with formatting issues doesn't really help my understanding on how coding works. Of course I will remember your arguments for later on, but what I was more interested in was the structure, tbh.
<jhass> since I see no real progress towards your style issues, please in fact do pipe it through rubocop and come back if you fixed all the issues
<jhass> we can't even recognize your logical/structural issues when we can't understand your thinking through all the formatting issues
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<tildes> Dysp: when I started out with ruby I thought all this formatting and style stuff was a pain...
<shevy> Dysp it often is what people notice first :)
<tildes> but the thing is, because ruby is so dynamic, it is even more important here than with statically typed languages, where you can press the "make nice button" on your IDE and make at least the indentations right
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<shevy> the good old "better" button - when you press it, everything becomes better!
<Dysp> I know it's necessary and I will try my best to follow. But expecting me to provide a perfectly formatted and stylized script on my first try, seems a bit arrogant to me. I am still struggling with understand classes, functions and methods.
<tildes> and in any case, good style just helps people understand your code faster
<tildes> and better chance at understanding it correctly
<jhass> Dysp: not perfectly, it's just very very far off tbh
<apeiros> Dysp: if it was your first try, that'd hold
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<tildes> Dysp: is it your first time writing code?
<Dysp> Yes.
<Dysp> Never ever done anything else.
<tildes> Dysp: congratulations for making it work (assuming it works)
<Dysp> It does! :D
<tildes> and if it doesn't, congrats for improving the structure
<tildes> Dysp: yay
<apeiros> channel logs say you started at least 2 months ago…
<Dysp> Probably not hard to make it break, but I will get there.
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<Dysp> Yeah, apeiros, that is true. Remember I am a full time research assistant too. I only work on these things in my spare time or when there is a slow day in the lab.
<apeiros> then say that, instead of the provably incorrect "first time" claim.
<Dysp> It is my first ever script.
<Dysp> So what is incorrect about it?
<tildes> apeiros: come on, two months occasional fiddling counts as first time
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<shevy> Dysp what kind of lab? chemistry stuff?
<Dysp> Some of it is, yeah.
<Dysp> But it's mainly an exercise lab where we test relevant things.
<Dysp> But we do analyze a lot of our blood samples ourselves.
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<shevy> yay analytics
<Dysp> I don't, though. I'm just a med student helping for a year.
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<tildes> yay relevant things
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<Dysp> I mainly do the tests and draw blood and assist the actual doctor when performing biopsies and such
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<shevy> ewwww not too many details please! :D
<Dysp> Haha, you pussies
<Dysp> :D
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<scepticulous> I am confused by this behavior:
<harushimo> I can never get anyone in the jekyll channel. I know this the ruby channel. Can someone point me in the right direction to this problem: https://gist.github.com/anonymous/5463731bff1ff6156013cee527babde5
<shevy> even the .inject method in ruby scares me, just from the name alone
<scepticulous> why does array.unshift modify all element in case of an array initialized with []
<tildes> shevy: +1
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<Dysp> Two days ago a container wasn't closed properly and I dropped the tube, splashing myself with blood from a stranger.
<Dysp> There goes that t-shirt.
<jhass> scepticulous: Array.new(n, value) does not call .dup or .clone on value, it's adding the _same object_ n times
<Dysp> Should have worn a coat. Oh well.
<shevy> scepticulous they all have the same object_id
<jhass> scepticulous: use Array.new(n) { value } to create a new value for each item
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<scepticulous> jhass: thanks. i just found it in the docs. did not expect that
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<scepticulous> thanks guys. I should have known that, but know i do
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<von-strauss> Hi.
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<agent_white> Happy Friday!
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<ziyan_> Hi guys, I got a simple question. `def method(*args)` - what does `*args` mean and here what is the * operator called?
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<Sou|cutter> splat operator
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<Sou|cutter> it makes it so you can pass any number of arguments to the method, and args will be an array of those args
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<ziyan_> Sou|cutter: Thanks alot, great!! makes sense. (y)
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<von-strauss> agent_white, Happy Friday.
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<von-strauss> Any cool projects?
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<shevy> depends on your field of interest
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<shevy> I'd love to have a lot more activity related to ruby + GUIs
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<wrkrcoop> can someone help me exlain what the difference is between line 3 and 4
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<wrkrcoop> what is it called when a variable = another variable and its value changes when the variable it is set to changes vs when a variable just takes the value of another variable
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<shevy> that sentence is pretty epic :)
<wrkrcoop> haha
<wrkrcoop> yeah
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<wrkrcoop> not sure how to put it
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<joenuts_> the second variable ( the one that points to the first ) would be referred to as a pointer or a reference variable maybe?
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<wrkrcoop> joenuts_: second variable being the one on line 3?
<wrkrcoop> or line 4?
<wrkrcoop> line 3 right?
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<joenuts_> i would say line 3 is a pointer ( or reference ) variable, and line 4 is ... just another variable that (at the point in time) has the same value as another variable
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<Sou|cutter> or a mutable object?
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<von-strauss> hi
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<Guest31201> Hi
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<jhass> wrkrcoop: there's no difference between line 3 and 4 in your example
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<jhass> wrkrcoop: https://carc.in/#/r/zz4
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<joenuts_> I believe wrkrcoop is trying to describe a scenario where two defined variables point to the same memory location ( dont know if ruby has such a construct though )
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<joenuts_> such that changes to the first variable impact the second variable
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<wrkrcoop> jhass: yeah what joenuts said
<von-strauss> junkin joughnuts
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<jhass> wrkrcoop: joenuts_ ruby is entirely pass by reference, copies have to happen explicitly
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<wrkrcoop> jhass: but lets say a = ‘hello'
<wrkrcoop> oh nvm ill use irb
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<wrkrcoop> yeah if a = ‘hell'
<wrkrcoop> b = a
<wrkrcoop> a = ‘barf'
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<wrkrcoop> b #=> hell
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<ohcibi> thats reassigning
<jhass> yes
<jhass> a holds a reference to 'hell'
<jhass> b holds a reference to 'hell'
<wrkrcoop> so b isn’t looking at a’s address
<jhass> a holds a reference to 'barf'
<wrkrcoop> so b refers to a and creates its own memory address to store that reference which is ‘hell'
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<joenuts_> https://carc.in/#/r/zz7 shows maybe assignment to new variables being done as copies?
<jhass> yes, there's no pointer indirection or anything
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<jhass> assignment copies the reference
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<joenuts_> meh, to me if you're coping the value ( whether by reference or not ), the new variable is still a *copy* and not a pointer
<ohcibi> no its not... if its an array and you add an object both references will show the same added object
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<joenuts_> so *some* variable declarations are done by reference, and some are done by copying the value, that's easy enough to understand
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<ohcibi> its always a reference.. some types are immutable, so you can't do the same as with the array
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<joenuts_> ah, so if i understand what you're saying, is that a = 1, b = a, at that point, b is a reference to a, but once a changes, a points to something new, b points to the old value of a ?
<ohcibi> exactly
<ohcibi> because of the nature of an integer
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<`slikts> does ruby have a keyed collection type that supports any type of key, not just strings/numbers?
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<ohcibi> `slikts: i just tried to use an object as key with [] and it worked.. it might not work with an object declaration
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<neha-> hey, so i'm using a gem, and certain functions are defined in a Module. Now i want to just require one other file and extend that default module namespace (without having to do require file and then include SomeModule::Helper for example) how can i do this?
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<shevy> matz talk from a month ago from india, in case someone has not seen it yet but is interested https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4HwanYNkhY
<shevy> neha- you have to require the code anyway right? once you have it required, you can modify everything at "run"time
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<shevy> module Foo; def self.bar; puts 'hi from bar'; end; end <--- last definition always "wins"
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<neha-> well in my monkey-patched module (if thats the right term), i'm using the same namespace as what shoudl be already available in my file. IN this specific case, FactoryGirl::Syntax::Methods is already available. So i just want to add another method to this namespace by just requiring one support file
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<shevy> yes, have that file that you require, modify on FactoryGirl::Syntax::Methods
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<shevy> if the latter is a module, module FactoryGirl::Syntax::Methods; def bla; end; end
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<neha-> yeah, but then if i just include that file (support/helpers/factory_girl.rb), i can't access the new helper methods
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<neha-> sorry i meant "require the file"
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<neha-> oh wait
<shevy> I don't understasnd it
<shevy> if I could just type too ;)
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<von-strauss> What are some neat projects you can contribute to with knowledge of ruby
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<shevy> von-strauss depends on your interest really
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<von-strauss> O
<shevy> most of my own time seems to go into life science related stuff with ruby these days
<von-strauss> *
<von-strauss> I'm interested in a bunch of stuff
<neha-> thanks shevy
<von-strauss> machine learning, computational sims
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<shevy> hmm
<von-strauss> I like just playing around with stuff in general
<von-strauss> anything
<shevy> these seem fairly rare in the ruby land
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<von-strauss> i know ruby is used mostly for making toyish stuff but that's cool too
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<von-strauss> ultimately i want to be a rails dev so i want to build up some kind of github portfolio, also im a huge believer in the free software movement so also that
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<shevy> now you are trolling
<von-strauss> sorry
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<shevy> essentially you have all the old use cases for perl available
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<shevy> matz mentions some of the goals for ruby 3.x there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4HwanYNkhY
<von-strauss> thanks
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<shevy> does anyone know how many projects are on cpan and on the python ... egg store or pypy or whatever was the name?
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<shevy> on rubygems.org there are 118,876 gems - https://rubygems.org/stats
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<`slikts> why is ruby only version 2? other languages of similar age are almost version 10, or 2015 in javascript's case
<`slikts> even perl 6 was released last year
<shevy> via http://www.modulecounts.com/ but it is a bit weird... npm dominates
<`slikts> python is 3k even
<shevy> `slikts php even skipped a version
<`slikts> yeah, case in point
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<shevy> latest python is 3.6.0a1
<`slikts> py3 is aka py3k or python 3000
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<aegis3121> Are we talking about... the versioning scheme or the rate at which Ruby grows/changes?
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<`slikts> versioning
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<`slikts> ruby's versioning is stagnating
<aegis3121> Then I'd say they're attempting their best to follow semver. Major versions only happen with breaking changes.
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<aegis3121> They'd rather not break code frequently, so they do those as a large lump and migration.
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<`slikts> you don't have to break previous things to introduce new ones
<aegis3121> Hence the minor versions that introduce new features.
<aegis3121> 2.2.3, 2.3.1, etc.
<`slikts> it still warrants a major version bump if it's large new things
<aegis3121> Not according to http://semver.org/
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<`slikts> aegis3121, according to semver too, since major changes can be made without breaking backwards compatibility
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<`slikts> see: js
<`slikts> the new versions make major changes but add on top of the language
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<headius> namxam: still around?
<headius> saw you rmessage in #jruby just now
<aegis3121> If that's how they choose to follow that, then that's their choice. I'm not sure that's the strictest way of following semver in my opinion.
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<smathy> shevy, it's not really a great comparison between a gem in ruby and a distribution in Perl (the ~30k number), because a distribution in Perl often contains multiple modules. There are over 100k individual modules on CPAN, bundled into 30k distributions. Ruby doesn't really have a separate notion of distributions, just gems that have other gems as dependencies (like Rails).
<`slikts> aegis3121, major changes = major version bump
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<`slikts> not that js uses semver
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<aegis3121> Reading it strictly, it doesn't say that. "Major Version MUST be incremented if any backwards incompatible changes are introduced to the public API. It MAY include minor and patch level changes. Patch and minor version MUST be reset to 0 when major version is incremented." It says nothing about major improvements. It doesn't NECESSITATE a major version bump, though may precipitate it.
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<aegis3121> Again, it's just a choice of the organizers/contributors/community that this is how they choose to interpret it.
<`slikts> it's a moot point anyway, since ruby is 2.2
<aegis3121> 2.3
<aegis3121> 2.3.1 is stable and released
<`slikts> that changes everything
<aegis3121> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ just saying.
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<aegis3121> That said, here's the Ruby versioning schema as defined by them: https://www.ruby-lang.org/en/news/2013/12/21/ruby-version-policy-changes-with-2-1-0/ It's not fully semantic even then.
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<shevy> smathy aha, did not know that yet. I thought they are quite similar
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<jhass> `slikts: java is only at 1.8 !
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<`slikts> err, no
<`slikts> java is 8
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<jhass> run java -version
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<shevy> `slikts you got a lot of versions wrong man
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<`slikts> shevy, not really; just ruby's 2.2
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<`slikts> no one calls java 1.8
<`slikts> and python 3 is py3k
<`slikts> fight me if you disagree
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<aegis3121> this isn't so much a fight, as now I'm just curious....why it matters
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<jhass> because big numbers are for big things!!!
<norc> aegis3121, heck I think Ruby has had grammar changes in minor release changes even.
* von-strauss fights `slikts
* norc would have to start digging for details on that though
<jhass> see how mozilla changed their versioning scheme in response to Chrome's
<aegis3121> norc: yea, that's why I eventually linked to Ruby's versioning, which says that breaking changes COULD happen in minor releases
<von-strauss> jhass, two wrongs don't make a right
<aegis3121> and that major releases are just for huge events
<von-strauss> i would better from mozilla than to imitate google's exercise in grandiosity.
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<von-strauss> shame
<norc> aegis3121, major releases are just whenever nobu feels like it or had too much sake.
<jhass> linux kinda did the same stunt, changing their versioning scheme so the numbers increase faster
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<shevy> fedora 5000!
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<hxegon_afk> is there a core ruby queue that isn't a part of Thread?
<hxegon_afk> or stdlib really
* von-strauss hi
<hxegon_afk> hey von-strauss
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<von-strauss> what' sup
<hxegon> not much, just building an etl system von-strauss
<von-strauss> whats that
<hxegon> eat transform load
<hxegon> like, get data, do something that changes data, load data somewhere else
<von-strauss> cool
<von-strauss> im trying to teach myself some ml on udacity
<hxegon> like ocaml or like tensorflow
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<von-strauss> scikit learn
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<von-strauss> i think thats what they use
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<von-strauss> should i learn tensorflow instead
<ramfjord> hxegon: I don't think there is, and Array makes a teeeerrrrible queue
<von-strauss> i want to break into programming by teaching myself ruby and then after i get a rails job mb slide into some machine learning gig
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<hxegon> ramfjord: fuuuuuuuuuuuck
<ramfjord> you can make one in like 20 lines
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<hxegon> von-strauss: pretty much my (rough) game plan right now :)
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<von-strauss> wow! cool
<von-strauss> yeah so i'm a math/engineering student that hates uni so that's my impetus
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<von-strauss> what stage have you advanced to
<hxegon> von-strauss: - the learning ruby part, because I've already done that. But learning web + database stuff is useful pretty much anywhere, so it's a nice skill to have
<hxegon> I'm doing rails/other web stuff
<von-strauss> ah im still learning ruby on codecademy
<von-strauss> then rails, then some free work, then some job hopefully
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<hxegon> trying to get to the point where I am making enough money to be a bit more secure financially before I start transitioning
<von-strauss> the thing is it's hard for me to learn ml
<von-strauss> i'm remarkably weak on probability and stat
<von-strauss> gotta hit the books
<hxegon> von-strauss: you should check out https://github.com/hanami/hanami
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<hxegon> it's a lot simpler than rails and I'm going to be trying it this weekend for a side project
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<hxegon> von-strauss: I'm barely able to do algebra, so you have a bit of an advantage on me there :D
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<von-strauss> have you started doing ml?
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<von-strauss> also idk what hanami is...is it like a gem
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<hxegon> it's a web framework like rails, but much simpler. http://hanamirb.org/
<von-strauss> ah
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<von-strauss> i think id learn rails because jobs
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<havenwood> tensorflow fizzbuzz, for the jobs!
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<von-strauss> tensorflow is good?
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<havenwood> von-strauss: Ruby is good. Hanami is a nice Rack framework. My personal favorite is Roda.
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<darkman738> hi all
<havenwood> darkman738: hi
<darkman738> was hoping someone could give me some direction
<darkman738> I'm trying to run a postgres query on a remote host
<darkman738> in a script
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<darkman738> I've found a few posts on doing similar things but I think my ignorance of ruby and postgres is kicking me here
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<von-strauss> roda.
<havenwood> darkman738: ssh onto the remote host?
<darkman738> I've got an ssh gateway set, and from the mysql examples I've seen I need to specify a local port and I suspect this is where I'm running into an issue
<havenwood> von-strauss: Here are some Hello, World! examples in various Rack adapters: https://github.com/luislavena/bench-micro/tree/master/apps
<von-strauss> roda is very simple
<von-strauss> compared to the others
<von-strauss> i note the obvious i guess
<darkman738> havenwood: yes
<havenwood> you can't tell all that much from a Hello, World! but yeah Roda is simple!
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<von-strauss> havenwood, well it's an indicator
<von-strauss> compared with rails.ru
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<havenwood> von-strauss: Then you compose the framework you need with Roda by cherry picking plugins: https://github.com/jeremyevans/roda/tree/master/lib/roda/plugins
<von-strauss> are you a ruby dev by trade?
<havenwood> von-strauss: yup
<von-strauss> cool
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<von-strauss> i used to use python a lot, i'm just learning ruby now
<von-strauss> it's not hard at all so far
<von-strauss> hopefully rails won't have too steep of a curve
<havenwood> von-strauss: nice
<von-strauss> yep
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<darkman738> so I guess my first question is, is this our of the realm of possibility, to start with
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<norc> darkman738, sure it is. Is the postgresql listening on an IP address:Port that you can access remotely?
<darkman738> I don't think so, or if it is, this is a POC and I don't have access to it
<darkman738> so the only way I have to access the db is to ssh onto the box
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<norc> darkman738, then use ssh to set up a tunnel
<norc> That will make the rest so much easier.
<darkman738> so I think I have that part done
<norc> Then the rest can act as if the postgresql was local.
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<darkman738> but when I attempt to run the query I get "could not connect to server: No such file or directory (PG::ConnectionBad)"
<von-strauss> so what's it like developing for ruby
<darkman738> mind you this is like hour 4-5 I have with ruby so it's quite possible I'm doing something wrong. Never worked with pg much
<von-strauss> challenging? fun? comfortable?
<jhass> yes.
<havenwood> von-strauss: yup!
<norc> darkman738, how did you set up the SSH tunnel, and gist the code that you are using to conenct to postgresql.
<darkman738> so far I'm not a fan
<von-strauss> cool
<von-strauss> how's the market in general
<von-strauss> good?
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<havenwood> yup
<von-strauss> nice
<von-strauss> also excuse the questions, but one last one: are you self taught?
<von-strauss> (in ruby)
<jhass> yes
<havenwood> yes
<von-strauss> ah okay okay
<darkman738> that's the meat
<von-strauss> i'm teaching myself i was wondering how normal or weird that was
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<norc> darkman738, pass host/port as string/fixnum
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<norc> darkman738, Im guessing if you do not specify a host that postgresql will attempt to connect to the default local unix domain socket.
<norc> (Which does not exist since you are not running postgres)
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<norc> Hence the "No such file or directory"
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<darkman738> ok thanks
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<darkman738> so now I'm getting a result I can't quite explain however
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<shevy> magic!
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<darkman738> n/m, that did it thanks guys
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<tie> Hello humans
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<tie> Is there a command to disable the timeout warnings?
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<xybre> tie: example?
<tie> I mean this IRC timeouts
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<tie> People logging in and out
<norc> tie, ask the support of your IRC clients vendor.
<tie> I'm actually new to IRC. This is my first time using one. I'm using freenode. I'm not sure how to go around that.
<xybre> tie is using the Freenode web portal.
<tie> It looks like your using freenode. You woulnt happen to know would you?
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<xybre> tie: If you need configuration and customization options I recommend getting a standalone IRC client.
<tie> I'm guessing freenode doesnt provide an option to disable the log in/out warnings?
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<tie> You have any experiance with HexChat? It any good?
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<jhass> tie: click the three bars on the top left, then Options
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<tie> Looks like my window scaled badly and I didnt see that. Thank you.
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<tie> My other question is, when i hear a notification from the chat and your name turns orange. Is that a private message or simply you linking my name?
<zzxc> tie: Its not bad, but this also probably isn't the best place to discuss this. Generally channels have a specific purpose to limit the scope to that topic, but there are plenty there the opposite in true. For example #physics is solely about physics, #not-physics is conversations among the #physics community not related to physics.
<zzxc> Ruby people tend to be pretty chill.
<tie> Sorry about the unrelated questions. I just had a couple to get myself set up and then i'll be moving to Ruby once my C++ project is finished.
<zzxc> tie: Thats not an private message, its a mention. Since your name was mentioned its probably that should alert you
<tie> zzxc: okay, so I just mentioned you? Others can see as well?
<xybre> We can all see mentions in the channel.
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<zzxc> Yep.
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<tie> Great, thank you :) thats all I needed to know for IRCs right now.
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<zzxc> =]
<tie> I'm in my second year of a software engineering degree and my final project requires me to write a program in a language I havent learned before.
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<tie> I chose ruby. And my thought is that I will create an S-DES algorithm.
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<zzxc> tie: S-DES as in Simplified DES?
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<zzxc> or Session Description Protocol Security Descriptions (cause that woudld be fun but might be a little bit more work)
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<tie_> Sorry, DC'ed. Did I miss any messages after sending my last one?
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<jhass> ?logs
<ruby[bot]> You can find a log of this channel at http://irclog.whitequark.org/ruby/
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<tie_> Ohh, thats useful. Thanks. I'm learning all sorts of non Ruby things here.
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<tie_> zzxc: Simplified-DES. Its the most complicated encryption I know so far. I've only take a single term in crypto
<tie_> I figure it would be a good way to show the different features of Ruby.
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<zzxc> Ok cool. DES is cool. ECC and DH are awesome pretty awesome and not to difficult.
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<tie_> I figure I could learn DES but I need to present my project on tuesday and I still have another program in C++ to complete.
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<zzxc> tie_: Ah got you. Soooo what are you looking for then? Meterial to get started or suggestions?
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<tie_> Well right now i'm programming Dijkstra's Shortest Path in C++ since thats due in 10 1/2 hours. But ill be working on ruby this weekend. Right now I figured I could introduce myself to the community and figure out how everything went so I could get the ball rolling.
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<tie_> zzxc: Eventually though, I'll probably ask things like how to do a bitwise op or function calls. Simple things.
<xybre> Ruby is a high-level language, it can do all that stuff but it'll be eeenteresting :D
<baweaver> Might be better to flip through a ruby book first
<baweaver> Eloquent Ruby tends to be good
<tie_> And thats one of the main reasons I chose this language. Because itll take more to to those things.
<tie_> Please tell me Ruby at least has something similar to array[4] = 'C';
<tie_> If I have time to find a book I definitely will.
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<zzxc> Yeha ruby does, as well as hashes(dictionary or hashmaps).
<xybre> tie_: Here's the online docs http://ruby-doc.org/core-2.3.1/ they're pretty comprehensive.
<xybre> tie_: yeah it looks like `array[4
<xybre> ] = 'C'
<xybre> Uh, without the newline.
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<xybre> Is the eval bot alive?
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<xybre> > puts 'Hello, world!'
<xybre> Doesn't look like it.
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<baweaver> doing it wrong
<baweaver> >> true
<ruby[bot]> baweaver: # => true (https://eval.in/578438)
<xybre> Ah there we go.
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<tie_> Well as long as I can edit individual data members I think ill be alright.
<xybre> >> a = Array.new; a[4] = 'C'; p a
<ruby[bot]> xybre: # => [nil, nil, nil, nil, "C"] ...check link for more (https://eval.in/578439)
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<tie_> Nice.
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<norc> xybre, use [] over Array.new
<xybre> norc: I could.
<norc> asm>> a = []
<ruby[bot]> norc: I have disassembled your code, the result is at https://eval.in/578440
<norc> asm>> a = Array.new
<ruby[bot]> norc: I have disassembled your code, the result is at https://eval.in/578441
<norc> The [] variant is optimized (also less to type)
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<xybre> I'm aware.
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<norc> Fair enough.
<xybre> The asm trick is neat though.
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<akkad> how can one compile and deliver a ruby application as a binary?
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<von-strauss> is that possible?
<norc> akkad, there are a few half cooked highly unportable solutions.
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<akkad> well matz copied everything but deliver from lisp
<norc> akkad, look at traveling-ruby, that is probably the most mature solution.
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<xybre> Ruby cannot be directly compiled into native code, AFAIK. There's some wrappers for the interpreter into single packages though.
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<shevy> von-strauss not that I am aware of
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<norc> xybre, the closest thing we have is RubyVM::InstructionSequence.load_from_binary
<norc> And that is not even remotely close. :D
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<wingedsnake> sup?
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<akkad> so rubinius it is
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<wrkrcoop> anyone ever seen .get_instance
<von-strauss> i guess one could build a compiler for ruby
<wrkrcoop> its in some code
<norc> akkad, how is ruby in ruby helping with standalone ruby?
<wrkrcoop> but when i try to use it in IRB it says undefined method
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<norc> &ri get_instance
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<wrkrcoop> norc: any idea what that means? i dont understand it
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<chrisseaton> xybre: this guy is working on a native Ruby compiler http://hokstad.com/compiler
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<akkad> norc how can llvm help?
<xybre> chrisseaton: interesting
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<chrisseaton> LLVM helps you emit efficient code, but the problem is it doesn't help you chose what code to emit
<chrisseaton> In Ruby that's the hard problem
<chrisseaton> If you just emit the obvious code for a bit of Ruby, LLVM won't be able to make that fast
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<wingedsnake> that is why Jose wrote erlang.rb
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<norc> akkad, not at all?
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<norc> akkad, trading one bytecode for another (be it ruby bytecode, java bytecode, llvm bytecode) does not solve the problem that you need a compiler running your bytecode.
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<chrisseaton> The way I describe it is that LLVM can make your Ruby method calls fast, but even if your method calls took zero time your Ruby would still be slow as it would be nothing but slow core library methods
<wrkrcoop> can u create too many threads in ruby?
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<norc> wrkrcoop, Im not sure what the fuzz about llvm is anyway. In the end it is very similar to GCCs RTL.
<norc> errr chrisseaton.
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<chrisseaton> It's useful if you already have a low level IR you just want to pass to LLVM, but unless it's a static language, that's a very small part of the problem
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<chrisseaton> When it was applied for JS in FTL they had to build a full compiler on top of it, and now they've binned it entirely
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<xybre> LLVM does do a lot of things for you, like the optimizers which are language independent which is great. Rust uses it to pretty decent effect.
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<chrisseaton> Right, but Ruby code is almost entirely method calls hidden behind very dynamic dispatch - LLVM can't see through that without manual help (which is very hard) so it can't apply those excellent optimisations in most cases
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<chrisseaton> I'm writing a lecture about exactly this topic and will have a blog post about it next week
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<xybre> Rust is a very different language from Ruby, it'd probably require a hell of a lot of smoke and mirrors to turn Ruby into marginally efficient native code.
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<jnoob22> is this the official style guide for Ruby? https://github.com/bbatsov/ruby-style-guide or is there another one possibly?
<baweaver> It's the most common
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<von-strauss> 25% on codecademy
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<von-strauss> keep trucking along
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<negev> hi, if i have an IO stream and the remote machine sends me an arbitrary chunk of data but doesn't disconnect, how can i determine that i've received all of it? do i have to just use a timeout?
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<von-strauss> How does ruby handle simultaneous I O Streams
<von-strauss> I build some irc client in python, but I can't get the output loop and input loop to run together
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<shevy> one way may be via select http://ruby-doc.org/core-2.0.0/IO.html#method-c-select - there is an example, you can try it, may be easier to understand
<shevy> for my pseudo IRC client I use this line: select( [$stdin], nil, nil, 1.1 )
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<negev> shevy: why 1.1?
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<shevy> hmm not sure
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<von-strauss> how hard is rails
<von-strauss> I thought PHP was easy
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<akkad> von-strauss: Functional PHP is
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<shevy> php is easy!
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<von-strauss> it is yea
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<wrkrcoop> how do i check in rspec to see if a class exists?
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<wrkrcoop> i’m testing a class like User, and i want my first test to be User is a class
<wrkrcoop> or something like that …
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<aegis3121> Seems like an unhelpful test. But, presumably, you could do User.is_a? Class
<aegis3121> or, in Rspec, expect(User).to be_a Class
<wrkrcoop> aegis3121: hmmm yeah unnecessary but im thinking i should test everything ...?
<wrkrcoop> even if its dumb
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<aegis3121> There's a line between testing the language and testing your behavior. The assumption could easily be that User being a Class is...implicitly testing by basically any of the behavior it has working correctly.
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<wrkrcoop> aegis3121: yeah i know …
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<wrkrcoop> idk : \
<wrkrcoop> figure if im doing tdd that would be the first thing i test
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<von-strauss> 30% ruby on codecademy
<von-strauss> so ahppy
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<von-strauss> filled with the spirit of creation
<aegis3121> The idea of BDD is that the behavior is there, which works nicely with duck typing. So long as your THING behaves like you want, is it really THAT concerning what it is?
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<jnoob22> as far as style goes, does Ruby use c-like variable names like say temp_str as opposed to Java-ish tempStr ?
<von-strauss> former
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<von-strauss> camel case is bad
<jnoob22> agreed. just curious how you guys did it.
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<von-strauss> how long have you done ruby
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<jnoob22> hmm... probably the last 2 weeks or so. that's about it von-strauss
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<von-strauss> how about programming
<jnoob22> von-strauss, i come from more of a Java/C/Python experience
<von-strauss> oh cool
<von-strauss> how long have you done that]
<jnoob22> hmm probably about 15 years or so.
<von-strauss> nice
<von-strauss> so you have a few years under your belt
<von-strauss> more than a few
<jnoob22> i really like ruby. love how it's easy as heck to figure out.
<von-strauss> yeah me too
<jnoob22> yeah have been doing it for a while.
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<von-strauss> im trying to drop out of uni and be a software dev
<jnoob22> computer science major?
<von-strauss> it seems like ruby can be learned easily enough
<von-strauss> no math
<iamdevnul> it can but having a degree helps open doors for you
<jnoob22> ah ok... hmm I would say generally stay in school but I realize everyone's situations are very different.
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<von-strauss> it costs a lot of money...and it's really stressful
<iamdevnul> lol
<jnoob22> heh working in software is pretty darned stressful though too ;-)
<iamdevnul> well you make money at work..but the stress is going to be worse, i guarantee it
<von-strauss> ive switched majors so many times i just need to get a job now
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<jnoob22> i work more on the support side of it though.... luckily i dont have to work on call often.
<jnoob22> von-strauss, well hopefully you're in a big city where jobs are plentiful.
<von-strauss> im in southampton now but i have american citizenship
<von-strauss> my brother is in new york and my other family is a stone throws away from london
<von-strauss> stones throw lol
<jnoob22> ok.... i was just working in Maidenhead for about 6 weeks last Nov,Dec. Seemed to be tons of jobs in Reading/Maidenhead areas
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<von-strauss> ruby jobs? :p
<von-strauss> i rly like math and i want to get into ml later but i should probably just break into the industry first
<jnoob22> heh probably not as such. But, do you know Java pretty well? or C or JS?
<von-strauss> nah
<von-strauss> ive done procedural programming with C before but not much beyond that. pointers really confused me
<jnoob22> those will get you some jobs... you may have to get to the more trendier places here in the states to find a decent ROR job or the like.
<jnoob22> heh pointers confuse everyone man ;)
<von-strauss> yeah i can go there
<von-strauss> haha
<von-strauss> well i like seattle
<von-strauss> colorado looks nice too
<jnoob22> or there ;)
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<jnoob22> I live in Colorado Springs ... Denver has lots of jobs like that but you better know your stuff.
<shanemikel> what does rails do for client-side code?
<von-strauss> the pressure's on :P
<jnoob22> you got me... I've only done the ROR tutorial a couple of times.
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<von-strauss> my *summer* goal is to master ruby and ROR so i can start looking for an internship this fall
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<jnoob22> hmm very high goal mate.
<von-strauss> then maybe i can take a leave of absence from uni
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<von-strauss> jnoob22, it's doable i think
<von-strauss> ruby is easy enough so far
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<von-strauss> getting an internship might be the hardest part
<jnoob22> von-strauss, if you do nothing but code... maybe eat a sandwich and then just code... the problem though with solo learning is that you don't usually get to learn how things are done.
<von-strauss> i'm using codecademy
<von-strauss> and some wikibooks for reference
<von-strauss> youre right
<von-strauss> i'm terribly unfamiliar with the dev process
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<von-strauss> i understand revision control is used
<von-strauss> like git and that....not much else i know about it
<jnoob22> sure you can pick up syntax and such but it's always best to find someone who knows it well and do an "internship" with them. I wonder if Ruby has a mentorship thing... I know PHP used to. I learned a lot of stuff from that.
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<von-strauss> the community has been welcoming enough thusfar, asking around will probably yield answers
<shanemikel> von-strauss: that's the sort of thing you can't be expected to know, as everybody has their own way of doing it
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<jnoob22> shanemikel, true... hard to know what's local and what's universal
<jnoob22> probably more stuff is local though.
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<von-strauss> i need to throw up a github profile
<von-strauss> start making some pull requests
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<jnoob22> what's better string comparison method ... == or .eq? ?
<von-strauss> .eq? is so lispy
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<jnoob22> heh true
<von-strauss> that's what i like about ruby
<von-strauss> so much lispish things
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<von-strauss> i code with == in general
<jnoob22> im trying to write this script very basic-like ... probably == is easier to read for a non-rubyist
<shanemikel> having just a tiny bit of experience with a single VCS is enough.. git is your best bet.. just learn enough to clone repos, and commit local changes. usually you only have to deal with one branch, and in many cases merging just has to be done by hand, and as a junior or intern, you won't be entrusted with that responsibility most likely
<von-strauss> i think the important thing is consistency
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<jnoob22> yeah git is easiest. I would bet you any place that is mostly using Ruby/JS/Python is using git and not svn.
<jnoob22> when I went for Redhat interview a few months ago, they only asked about git.
<shanemikel> It may not be the easiest, but it's very popular
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<jnoob22> shanemikel, in your opinion which is easier than git, do you think?
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<shevy> no version control system!
<shanemikel> I don't have experience, but people claim mercurial to be simpler than git
<jnoob22> heh shevy
<jnoob22> hmm i have never played with mercurial.
<von-strauss> shevy, copypasting into a mediawiki site
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<shevy> yay
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<von-strauss> i want to do something with bitcoin/the blockchain
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<von-strauss> blockchain looks very cool
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<shanemikel> the hardest thing to learn seems to be how to pull new changes to your local working copy, and mix your own commits with them.. it looks to me like everybody uses rebase for that (NOT git pull)
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<shanemikel> because otherwise the history gets screwy
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<shanemikel> and project owners are more interested in the timing of when they decided to accept your changes, not when you made them
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<shanemikel> so nobody can tell me what Rails means for the client-side?
<shanemikel> if anything
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<jnoob22> when you say client-side... do you mean client-side from the browser side for instance?
<jnoob22> or something else?
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<jnoob22> for me... (just me), it's an odd question
<von-strauss> i don't think rails means anything from the browser side...
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<jnoob22> yeah there are some ajax modules and such that I've heard of but that's about it. (I'm making an educated guess here).
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<jnoob22> maybe you mean something else shanemikel
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<von-strauss> i think the answer he's looking for is nothing :P
<jnoob22> :-)
<shanemikel> okay so it is really a server-side scripting framework. it doesn't do anything fancy like generate JS from ruby code
<jnoob22> no, not out of the box.
<von-strauss> clientside stuff is creepy
<jnoob22> maybe you're looking for jquery, shanemikel ?
<shanemikel> lol, no
<jnoob22> or some kind of hybrid (though more client, imo) ... angularjs
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<shanemikel> I'm looking for a universe where Javascript is a dirty word
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<jnoob22> i would think you could mix angular and ror ... ive done it for django.
<von-strauss> shanemikel, and flash
<jnoob22> lol javascript is no longer a dirty word man :-)
<baweaver> Web Assembly
<jnoob22> hasn't been since around 2006 or so. ;)
<baweaver> once that's out it's a non-issue.
<baweaver> In the mean time you have things like Coffeescript, Livescript, ScalaJS, ES6, and Opal
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<baweaver> among several others
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<shanemikel> coffeescript is a joke. llvm -> javascript is the future
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<shanemikel> the coffeescript devs didn't even bother to specify the syntax
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<shanemikel> it's pretty, but totally unreliable crap
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<jhass> if you want a framework that blurs the line between backend and fronted, have a look at volt
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<shanemikel> I don't mean to come off aggressive.. TBH I was toying with coffee about a year ago, and was even quite charmed by it, but I've developed some serious expectations recently
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<ramfjord> >> a = {a: 1}.freeze ; b = a.clone ; b[:a] = 'hello'
<ruby[bot]> ramfjord: # => can't modify frozen Hash (RuntimeError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/578473)
<ramfjord> should I just unfreeze b?
<ramfjord> will that affect a?
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<jhass> >> {}.unfreeze
<ruby[bot]> jhass: # => undefined method `unfreeze' for {}:Hash ...check link for more (https://eval.in/578474)
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<ramfjord> ahh, I need to use dup instead of clone
<jhass> a = {a: 1}.freeze; b = a.dup; b[:a] = 'hello'
<jhass> yup
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<al2o3-cr> boo
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<haylon> Hey everyone, I think I'm running into an issue using yardoc correctly. I cloned down the hashicorp vault-ruby repository to attempt to build the documentation for it, but when I run the yardoc command, it says that it can't resolve link to Net::HTTP from text. What am I doing wrong? It seems like its just a regular require call for net/http
<jhass> does it actually abort with that or is it just a warning?
<haylon> Its just a warning.
<jhass> ignore it