lkcl changed the topic of #arm-netbook to: arm-netbook: Don't ask to ask. Just ask! - EOMA68 spec http://bit.ly/ZHqfxA - ML arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk - Logs http://bit.ly/XELKJq or http://bit.ly/15OCYPD - For Allwinner/sunxi discussions prefer #linux-sunxi - iMX6 Card http://bit.ly/XAUGCD - Flying Squirrel http://bit.ly/WgOYaR - Allwinner A10/A20 Card http://bit.ly/zBLAbY - http://rhombus-tech.net
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<mnemoc> hi, do you happen to know any decent chinese "galaxy mini" (clone... size-wise)
<mnemoc> to replace my 9yo's phone without pissing off my 12yo's :p
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<buZz> anyone still looking for a nice 5V supply?
<mnemoc> that's cool if you'll put your board inside a cabinet
<mnemoc> for a bench .... it's pretty ugly :p
<buZz> mnemoc: i will stuff it inside http://www.thingiverse.com/make:40907
<mnemoc> iirc i've seen 12A variants too
<buZz> probably make another section to the case, to hold the PSU, a C13 plug, maybe add some female usb just for charging
<buZz> ok, 120W sounds WAY too much to power a cubieboard ;)
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<penguin42> http://ssvb.github.io/2013/06/27/fullhd-x11-desktop-performance-of-the-allwinner-a10.html is facinating - I don't get why backward memset has a lower problem with screen bandwidth
<ssvb> penguin42: one guy here asked the same question - https://plus.google.com/u/0/105007947798310229700/posts/1MExqLRm8cF
* ssvb does not know the right answer and can only guess...
<penguin42> ssvb: Odd that - it's me :-)
<ssvb> ah, ok :)
<penguin42> but hmph G+ hasn't told me about the response
<penguin42> ok, that's fascinating - G+ still doesn't tell me about the response - it's not in my notification thing - hmph!
<penguin42> ssvb: I agree it might be interference - something like if both the raster and the memset are going forward they might conflict multiple times
<penguin42> ssvb: hmm so you're doing 1MB fills, so OK that's way bigger than the caches - which memsets did you use for those figures? I see you have some NEON ones
<ssvb> penguin42: the test is using 32MB buffers, that should be way bigger than the CPU caches (except maybe on hi-end x86 servers), all types of memset show the same behavior
<penguin42> ssvb: ok, but it makes an interesting question of whether it's worth flipping the ARM memsets to go backwards
<ssvb> penguin42: that would be slower on Exynos5 (Cortex-A15) - https://github.com/ssvb/tinymembench/wiki/Samsung-Chromebook-XE303C12-%28Exynos5250%29
<ssvb> 'NEON fill backwards' vs. 'NEON fill' and 'standard memset'
<penguin42> wow yeh it stinks backwards doesn't it
<ssvb> ARM hardware is weird and sometimes needs some tricky gymnastics to make it run fast :)
<penguin42> ssvb: It's interesting all the cores (and sometimes individual chips) are noticeably different
<penguin42> ssvb: Yeh I spent about a year doing optimised memcpy/memchr etc
<penguin42> my memchr is the current eglibc one
<ssvb> desktop x86 processors have clever automatic prefetches and other optimizations which make them rather 'boring' (the end result is mostly the same no matter what you do)
<penguin42> yeh you just run into bus bandwidths
<penguin42> ssvb: Although there are questions of not just throughput but power usage while hitting that throughput
<penguin42> ssvb: Like people were quite resistent to using Neon because it apparently uses a lot more power
<ssvb> yes, it does :)
<penguin42> oh that's cruel :-)
<penguin42> ssvb: I just remember there were some oddments like having something where Neon was faster from A8 cache than A9
<ssvb> I would also add an a15 version, but don't want to dismantle my chromebook just to connect the multimeter for the measurements
<penguin42> haha - I guess those odroid boards would be good for that
<ssvb> A8 also can dual issue some NEON instructions, which makes it up to ~20% faster than A9 on properly optimized code
<penguin42> yeh https://wiki.linaro.org/WorkingGroups/ToolChain/Benchmarks/InitialMemset if you look at the beagle graph shows the neon memset peak
<penguin42> that was fun stuff
<penguin42> ssvb: You could use ifunc to select the memset and go forward on A15
<ssvb> that's too much hassle and not worth the efforts :)
<penguin42> ssvb: Might be on the high refresh cases
<penguin42> you've got a factor of 2 nearly forward/backwards on the highest refresh
* penguin42 wonders if you can program the raster to scan backwards through RAM :-)
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<penguin42> well DEFE_LINESTRD0_REG is 32bit :-)
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<penguin42> lkcl_: eDP instead of lvds you'd get a decent res then
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<lkcl_> penguin42: how many ultra-low-cost SoCs have eDP?
<lkcl_> how many $5 SoCs have eDP?
<penguin42> lkcl_: I don't honestly know the answer to that, but how many will have them in 18months time?
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<penguin42> I guess eDP is only tending to be for laptop panels not phone panels, so it might stay that way
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<penguin42> hehe someone has got the panels used on Apple Retina products working on PCs - just by wiring the eDP out
<lkcl_> cool!
<penguin42> http://emerythacks.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/connecting-ipad-retina-lcd-to-pc.html says he got it for $55 which is rather nice as well
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<lkcl> penguin42: honestly couldn't tell you.
<lkcl> penguin42: but i do know that there are hundreds of LVDS panels out there, and that LVDS-to-eDP ICs are likely to be 40 to 100% the cost of the target SoCs.
<lkcl> initially anyway
<lkcl> ... if you can get hold of them at all
<penguin42> hmm kind of depressing
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<lkcl> TI has eDP-to-HDMI converter ICs @ $1.50 so maybe it's not so bad
<lkcl> MIPI-to-LVDS converter IC: $1.70
<penguin42> I guess the question is what type of panels do you expect to be used
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<lkcl> high=-1&transmissive_cr=-1&gray_depth_main=&display_colors_amount=&color_saturation=-1&viewing_angle_function=-1&viewing_direction=&3d_display=&sunlight_readable=&signal_type_category=eDP&vertical_frequency=&reverse_scan=&lamp_position=&lamp_type=&lamp_unit_replaceable=&lamp_life_time=-1&embeded_lamp_driver_board=&operating_temperature_low=-1000&operating_temperature_high=-1000&button=Search
<lkcl> 127 models
<lkcl> (sorry about the insane size of the link!)
<lkcl> the only bit on there that's relevant is the signal_type_category=eDP
<lkcl> changed that to LVDS.
<penguin42> yeh, are eDP and LVDS costs similar?
<lkcl> 9408 models, 2086 of which are actively in production
<lkcl> penguin42: that's gonna take a long time to work out.
<penguin42> nod - anyway, just a thought
<lkcl> wow. only 78 of the eDP models in production. *49* already discontinued
<penguin42> if it saves you a pin and lets you get higher res
<lkcl> penguin42: not really. you can get away with 8 lines for LVDS - that gets you 18-bit colour @ up to appx 1280x800 or maybe 1280x1024 if you're really lucky.
<lkcl> i did once find a single-channel 1400x900 LVDS
<lkcl> i think... ah well
<lkcl> but this standard isn't targetted at anything above 1280x800 anyway.
<penguin42> but really think it is worth thinking in terms of what the world is going to be like in say 12-18months when you might have made one
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