sipa changed the topic of #bitcoin-wizards to: This channel is for discussing theoretical ideas with regard to cryptocurrencies, not about short-term Bitcoin development | http://bitcoin.ninja/ | This channel is logged. | For logs and more information, visit http://bitcoin.ninja
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<wallet42>
is mediantimepast strictly monotonic for the entire chain?
<wallet42>
sorry, i meant entirely monotonic (not strictly)
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<tromp>
yes
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<tromp>
if T is median of set S of 11 timestamps, and form S' by adding a time >= T, and removing any other time, then median S' is till >= T
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<Guest86812>
Working on FPGA implementation of signature verification on secp256k1; is there earlier work on this?
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<nsh>
not really, afaik
<Jbaczuk>
Guest86812: nice, I've always thought that would be cool to have for a full node
<Guest86812>
Intent is to help speed up low-power nodes; need to avoid division, so going to use Jacobian instead of affine
<Guest86812>
Not sure if there will be other unexpected complications in making the design small enough
<gmaxwell>
Guest86812: If you're talking about using projective coordinates or not, it sounds like you're unaware of the state of the art in efficient processing...
<gmaxwell>
Guest86812: you should probably review libsecp256k1. A simple starting project would be something like implementing efficient field multiplication.
<sipa>
libsecp256k1 has a number of constant-time algorithms (for signing, keygen, ecdh) and variable-time ones (for verification and others)
<sipa>
the constant-time ones can probably be adapted more easily to FPGAs
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<Guest86812>
gmaxwell - as in using wNAF? I've read through a bit of libsecp but not sure what should change when implementing in HW
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<sipa>
Guest86812: naive wNAF will be hard in hardware, as it uses windows in variable positions based on the scalar
<sipa>
though for ECDH there is a special fixed-window wNaF in libsecp, which should be much more easy to adapt
<nsh>
didn't someone ask about a hw impl of the windowing and sensible defaults a couple of weeks ago in #secp256k1?
<nsh>
ah yeah ddustin
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<gmaxwell>
Guest86812: there are many other optimizations than WNAF.
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<cjd>
Does anybody know if there's been any study on the efficacy of counting forks as part of "total work" on top of a block, rather than just taking tallest chain (sum of targets)
<cjd>
?
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<sipa>
cjd: that sounds like ghost/spectre/phantom protocols
<sipa>
(at least one of those, i don't remember which is which)
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<cjd>
Looking now... I'm not talking about DAGs specifically, just about counting forks toward bestWork
<gmaxwell>
they make selfish mining much worse.
<sarang>
Depends. At least one of them using connectivity to penalize selfish mining
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<sarang>
(don't remember which of them)
<gmaxwell>
IIRC ethereum used to weigh them and had to abandon it because of selfish mining.
<gmaxwell>
the phantom one does some kind of absurd "must solve a NP-hard problem to compute POW" to try to address it.
<cjd>
Oh, they were making partial payouts to the winners of fork blocks, right ?
<gmaxwell>
cjd: they still do. but they don't use them to adjust chain weight anymore.
<cjd>
Hmm, so if you mine a fork of a fork, you keep it quiet for a while and let the other side of the fork seem to be winning and then reveal it ?
* cjd
looking at The Impact of Uncle Rewards on Selfish Mining in Ethereum
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<cjd>
ahh yup, it's GHOST protocol, thanks
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<cjd>
oh nice "On Trees, Chains and Fast Transactions in the Blockchain" claims to have developed some proofs for GHOST and they're pretty positive about it
<cjd>
I guess you just can't go rewarding people for forking the chain (who knew)
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<cjd>
10 minutes looking at the code and I can't convince myself that the author is wrong... It would appear that Ethereum doesn't actually implement GHOST at all, it just rewards forks o_O
<sipa>
cjd: i believe it indeed doesn't
<sipa>
also, i think more recent work improves upon ghost (spectre or phantom)
<cjd>
the dag stuff is really cool, but it's a bit over my head :)
<cjd>
Actually Ethereum is slightly worse than bitcoin because it's not using stated target but rather the hash
<cjd>
(asside from the little part about incentivising forks)
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<gmaxwell>
cjd: I think I said before that ethereum dropped weighing the fork blocks.
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<cjd>
ahh, you're right, I went back to some older commits and indeed they're adding uncles
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