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<orbitz>
Error: The type of this expression, _[> `Foo ] Protobuf.Parser.t, contains type variables that cannot be generalized
<orbitz>
is the actual error
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<flux>
orbitz, is it a value?
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<orbitz>
let enum_conv = function | 300 -> Ok `Foo | _ -> Error `Overflow
<orbitz>
if I change `Foo to Foo (with the correct type) it works as expected
<orbitz>
gotta take a shower and head to work, i appreciate you in advance for any suggestiosn
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<avsm>
i've just added a cluster of 8 raspberry pis to the OPAM continuous build pool
<avsm>
fun!
<flux>
..
<flux>
finally got some use to rpis?-)
<flux>
orbitz, it is different it youw rite it let enum_conv x = match x with | 300 -> ..
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<flux>
?
<flux>
I think it shouldn't be, though..
<flux>
orbitz, or did you resolve the issue otherwise
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<Leonidas>
avsm: isn't that like, less powerful than one x86 box with 8 qemus? :)
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<flux>
leonidas, oh yeah, well I bet your x86 box doesn't decode 8 mpeg4 videos at full hd at the same time !!
<flux>
;-)
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<Leonidas>
flux: actually, with VAAPI I get 1% CPU load when decoding 1 MPEG4 video at full hd, and 10% without, so I think it might just manage 8 MPEG4 videos.
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<Leonidas>
(Sandybridge i5 in a laptop, so probably storage is the bottleneck)
<Leonidas>
;-)
<flux>
leonidas, but how much is your GPU load?
<flux>
it still does palette conversions without VAAPI
<flux>
but I suppose that's still fast
<Leonidas>
flux: can't check that atm, as I am on a laptop which is about as powerful as a rpi ^^
<Leonidas>
and I am not really sure where to check for GPU load
<Leonidas>
(Intel HD 3000)
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<avsm>
Leonidas: yeah, but you just can't beat testing on real hardware. it's also a nice segway to a crowdsourced way of contributing to OPAM tests that we're building
<flux>
avsm, do you have an image people can just stick into their rpi's and it works?-)
<flux>
run random internet folk's code on your home network with ease ;)
<flux>
(ok after you firewall the box I suppose)
<Leonidas>
avsm: how do you manage the 8 rpi's? I currently have one that does nothing for the most of the time, so if there is a way to set it up as a buildbot, I'd be willing to do that
<avsm>
working on it; we'll have an opam package that'll add you to the global build pool automatically and take care of NAT traversal etc
<avsm>
a few bits of infrastructure coming first though
<Leonidas>
ohhh, shiny :)
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<Leonidas>
avsm: you don't need any more readers for real world ocaml? I'm writing my bachelors thesis with ocaml so having one more reference would be cool
<avsm>
email me
<flux>
is it a good reference if it's not available?-)
<Leonidas>
alright, will do when i'm back home where I have a proper mail program :)
<Leonidas>
flux: the current best reference is a book that was never released, so adding a book that might eventually be released is a considerable improvement :-)
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<kaustuv>
Sorry if this is a FAQ, but what is the status of OCaml 4.0 on Debian? Currently I see some 4.0 packages in experimental, but apparently lablgtk2 and batteries don't seem to be updated.
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<Leonidas>
kaustuv: i suppose that is because Debian is in freeze, so no new packages are going into testing at least
<Leonidas>
and considering D-I RC1 is out, Debian 7.0 will probably be "soon"
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<thelema>
avsm: regarding the OPAM build pool; how can I find out if batteries is broken on some platform?
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<avsm>
thelema: we're working on that at the moment. probably a month or so away
<avsm>
(using ocaml to build out the infrastructure, so a nice eat-your-own-dogfood exercise too)
<thelema>
are you re-inventing jenkins?
<avsm>
no
<thelema>
ah, good. From your one month estimate, I was imagining something like this.
<thelema>
I guess most of the work is in nailing things down so all your systems don't get powned by an evil release's test script?
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<notk0>
hello, is ocaml a good language for serializing ?
<pippijn>
you can serialise ocaml data structures in varios ways
<notk0>
how different is ocaml from other languages in that regard?
<pippijn>
either via built-in serialisation or via a syntax extension
<notk0>
is there an advantage to switch to ocaml?
<pippijn>
from what?
<notk0>
from XML
<notk0>
we are using xml as a markup language now
<notk0>
was wondering how good ocaml is
<pippijn>
and you want to use ocaml as markup language?
<notk0>
well ocaml is a markup language
<pippijn>
what ocaml are you talking about?
<notk0>
the markup language, ml = markup language
<notk0>
html, xml ocaml
<pippijn>
ok
<pippijn>
I don't know that one
<djcoin>
notk0: you are hilarious
<tane>
indeed
<notk0>
djcoin: why?
<notk0>
pippijn: Ocaml is a ML language you know
<pippijn>
I should start remembering nicks
<tane>
and that means meta language, doesnt it?
<notk0>
ML = markup language
<rks>
tane: no, markup ! he just told you
<rks>
;)
<djcoin>
notk0: two days, i treat you as a troll
<djcoin>
you came saying ML is meta language
<rks>
(I'm laughing so much right now)
<tane>
:)
<djcoin>
etc.
<pippijn>
it's nice that some people get joy out of this
<notk0>
djcoin: what you said makes no sense...
<djcoin>
O RLY ?
<notk0>
djcoin: I think you expressed yourself wrong
<anderse>
;p
<rks>
:DD
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<notk0>
I don't see how my question is not reasonable guys
<tac>
you just want to know about parsing, right?
<tac>
Ocaml will have libraries similar to most languages in that regard, I'm pretty sure... at least if you're parsing XML or some standard format
<notk0>
tac: there is Menhir a parser generator for Ocaml
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<ousado>
or some other public place you put your code?
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<ousado>
ah yes .. hm it's not there
<ousado>
pippijn: will you put your camlp4-based ocaml-types [de]serializer thing up there?
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<pippijn>
ousado: ok
<pippijn>
ousado: one of these days
<pippijn>
ousado: I won't remember notifying you
<pippijn>
ousado: if it's still not there in a week, ask me again
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<ousado>
pippijn: will do :)
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<adrien>
chambart: hey, I keep on forgetting during the day: can you ask ocp what is the state of his "stripped-ocaml" branch on ocaml svn? (it moves labltk, ocamlbuild, camlp4 to a subdirectory)
<adrien>
I'm very interested in it
<adrien>
(especially for cross-compilation and also because I believe it makes more sense)
<adrien>
(I would do the same to ocamldoc actually)
<chambart>
adrien, it is not stable yet...
<adrien>
ok, but it's ongoing and not a one-shot branch that will die?
<adrien>
that's my fear
<adrien>
I had to add ways to disable ocamldoc, ocamlbuild, and a couple others in order to be able to build a cross-compiler
<pippijn>
I didn't know this existed, but I'm very happy it does
<adrien>
pippijn: saw it by luck with a "gitk --all"
<chambart>
it has been decided at the consortium that the ocaml repository will be stripped of all the uneeded parts for bootstraping
<adrien>
\o/
* adrien
dances
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<adrien>
having to build ocamlbuild while building a cross-compiler simply is impossible
<chambart>
this branch is not ready yet and won't evolve a lot in close future because of lack of time
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<chambart>
but it will be done
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<adrien>
ok
<chambart>
If you are interested in helping us, feel free to play with some git branch somewhere
<chambart>
a big part of this project is also to have clean independent repositories for ocamlbuild/camlp4/labltk/ocamldoc ...
<adrien>
I have a fairly simple commit that makes building ocamldoc, ocamlbuild and ocamldebug optional currently and that's enough for my needs currently (and more than enough for my time unfortunately)
<chambart>
We can't commit anything to the trunk before this is done and someone have accepted to take charge of maintainance
<adrien>
wmeyer has pushed patches that make building without ocamlbuild possible
<adrien>
although I don't really care about whether it's ocamlbuild or something else: all I wish is that it's outside of the compiler
<adrien>
so I can build a native ocaml compiler, then build ocamlbuild, then build ocaml with this ocamlbuild
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<chambart>
I need to go
<chambart>
see you
<adrien>
ok, thanks for the answers
<adrien>
see you
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<Leonidas>
turns out ocaml has $ and it is called **>. Shiny!
<Leonidas>
Batteries that is.
<adrien>
library-provided
<adrien>
:-)
<Leonidas>
yeah, I don't leave the house without batteries :-)
<adrien>
heh :-)
<Leonidas>
pry batteries from my cold dead hands :)
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<m4b`>
are ocaml ints unboxed, if so, how to create an array of unboxed ints? bigarray?
<orbitz>
m4b`: I don't think they are, they are tagged though
<orbitz>
m4b`: and Bigarray creates unboxxed anything I think
<companion_cube>
I think ints are unboxed
<companion_cube>
(char and bool too)
<ollehar>
any comments on new reentrant ocaml? see reddit/r/ocaml for link
<companion_cube>
so if you have an int array, it's unboxed
<m4b`>
companion_cube: how can we find out?
<companion_cube>
m4b`: you may allocate a int array, modify it a lot of time, and check out the GC stats
<companion_cube>
in a small test program
<companion_cube>
if the GC only allocated the memory for the array...
<m4b`>
companion_cube: what should I look for (i assume from gprof?)
<companion_cube>
no, you should use the module Gc
<companion_cube>
Gc.print_stat
<orbitz>
getting someone who knows the system would probably be better
<m4b`>
compaion_cube: how would i know if the gc only allocated memory from array using gc.print_stat?
<companion_cube>
so the loop does not allocate anything
<def-lkb>
m4b`: ocaml int are 31 bits on 32bits arch and 63 on 64 bits (that is, one bit is reserved for the tag)
<def-lkb>
m4b`: but otherwise, they are unboxed, so int array is an array of "unboxed" ints (the same for ints in tuples, records, …)
<julm>
i don't think so
<julm>
afaik, unboxing in array is only for float
<companion_cube>
because for ints it's automatic
<def-lkb>
julm: there are two representations for basic blocks
<def-lkb>
julm: blocks containing only floats have a special flat/unboxed representation, this is the case for float records and float arrays
<m4b`>
orbitz: yes just read that, thanks for the link; companion_cube: thanks for testing a simple program :)
<def-lkb>
but as a tagged int is just a word with a particular tag, they are stored "unboxed" in normal block representation
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<julm>
int are not a word; and they have no tag
<julm>
only block have a 7-bit tag
<julm>
cf. caml/mlvalues.h
<def-lkb>
ok, julm the term tag is misleading, the lsb is 1 to distinguish them from pointers, but yes, that's not a tag is the block-sense
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<julm>
yep
<def-lkb>
however, when storing ints in blocks, there is no boxing and/or indirection because they have the same size as machine word
<m4b`>
thanks for everyone's answers
<m4b`>
i am having problems with aliasing in arrays; as a result i use array.copy, but this causes caml_initialize to go insane; does anyone have a suggestion for a data structure _like_ arrays, but perhaps immutable to avoid aliasing problems?
<fasta>
If you find an interesting application of a persistent-array, call the news.
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<zorun>
fasta: semi-persistent arrays are quite useful for backtracking algorithms
<zorun>
I'm using it in an implementation of DPLL for solving SAT
<fasta>
zorun: yeah, that could be possible, but you don't need them for that problem, do you?
<fasta>
zorun: I think that for SAT you just need to squeeze out everything you can.
<fasta>
(by which I would mean that mutable algorithms are likely going to be faster in combination with MPI)
<fasta>
zorun: why are you using them? For convenience?
<zorun>
fasta: well, DPLL basically involves trying (recursively) to assign some variables at random (or using clever heuristics), deducing the values of other variables, and backtracking when you're stuck
<fasta>
zorun: I reinvented DPLL myself before I knew about it.
<fasta>
zorun: I implemented it 10 years ago or something like that.
<zorun>
I use a semi-persistent array for storing partial assignment, since basic persistence is required (recursive calls and backtracking)
<zorun>
oh, right :)
<fasta>
zorun: I am not saying it is bad software-engineering (it is not), but I am just wondering whether that gets you top-notch performance.
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<zorun>
it's just a matter of convenience, I think
<fasta>
Well, I'd hope that you know :P
<zorun>
with an imperative structure (arrays), you'd have to rollback the changes you made before you can backtrack
<fasta>
Yeah, but that's perhaps less work than using full semi-persistent arrays.
<zorun>
performance-wise, I believe both approaches are strictly equivalent :)
<zorun>
hmm, maybe, but I found the idea of this structure interesting ;)
<fasta>
Yeah, and of course you are using modules to separate the concerns, right?
<companion_cube>
state of the art sat solvers are all written in a very imperative style, with this kind of backtrackable arrays
<zorun>
but I agree I've never needed some kind of persistent array before
<zorun>
fasta: of course
<fasta>
zorun: does OCaml remove all those layers of indirection?
<fasta>
I thought it didn't.
<zorun>
hmm, probably not
<zorun>
I don't think it does inlining between modules
<zorun>
in that case, you're right, it's probably a bit slower
<fasta>
I think a language which has such module constructs must also implement them efficiently.
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<fasta>
Likely mlton doesn't have such issues.
<zorun>
the primary interest of modules is abstraction and reusability, and I believe most people are willing to sacrifice a tiny bit of performance for this
<zorun>
(I do, at least)
<companion_cube>
mlton is really oriented toward performance
<companion_cube>
(I would like such a compiler for ocaml, though)
<fasta>
But mlton only uses one core, doesn't it?
<companion_cube>
no idea
<fasta>
(still beating Haskell on 4 cores, last time I checked, though)
<fasta>
(for some problems, at least)
<fasta>
There is a multicore variant of it now.
<fasta>
companion_cube: is there any reason why compiling OCaml to mlton would be a bad idea?
<companion_cube>
well, SML does not have all the features as ocaml
<companion_cube>
no first class modules (afaik) nor objects
<companion_cube>
of*
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<m4b>
def-lkb: i used the persistent arrays at that location already; they were reasonably fast, better than maps, but unsurprisingly, after some time, the program was using 90% of the system memory
<m4b>
i need something more like an immutable array, to avoid the aliasing, or some other trick i guess; dunno anymore
<def-lkb>
m4b: i don't know what better structure you can use, but it probably depends on the access pattern your program is expected to exhibit
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<m4b>
def-lkb: yea i'm at a loss at this point. essentially the arrays are the items of maps; occasionally, i need to copy an array with key k into key 0's item. that's where the aliasing is getting me, i need to return a fresh copy
<zorun>
m4b: do you need O(1) random access and update?
<zorun>
iirc, Okasaki describes a ML implementation of random-access lists
<m4b>
zorun: not necessarily; but if it's log(n) for both we're just talking about maps again
<zorun>
that is, you have all list operations on O(1) (possibly amortized, I don't really remember), but random access and updates in O(log n)
<zorun>
hmm, right
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<flixr>
hi
<flixr>
I was wondering if anyone can help me with a problem of lot's of accumulating ocamlobj* files in /tmp when linking
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<flixr>
So when are these temporary files created and how could I best cleanup after compilation/linking is finished?
<adrien>
failing to link :-)
<adrien>
rm ;-)
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<flixr>
it seems to link just fine, at least I have a working output file
<adrien>
it was probably before
<flixr>
before? I cleaned everything first...
<flixr>
so the temporary files should only be created (or not removed) if linking is not successful? Or are they always created?
<flixr>
couldn't find any docs on this
<adrien>
they should be removed
* adrien
bed
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<flixr>
they are not in my case, I don't get any error from ocamlfind ocamlc -custom -o foobar -package unix,str -linkpkg mylib.cma myprog.cmo
<flixr>
gn8 adrien
<flixr>
hints anyone else?
<flixr>
so this seems to only be the case when using the custom runtime mode...
<flixr>
I need some automatic way to remove this stuff on our CI server.... rm /tmp/ocamlobj* seems a bit crude
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<vext01>
madroach: yo
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