antocuni changed the topic of #pypy to: PyPy, the flexible snake (IRC logs: https://botbot.me/freenode/pypy/ ) | use cffi for calling C | "PyPy: the Gradual Reduction of Magic (tm)"
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<arigato>
SystemError: unexpected internal exception (please report a bug): <OSError object at 0x7fb50c1f7700>; internal traceback was dumped to stderr
<arigato>
that's what I get from time.sleep(float('nan'))
<arigato>
ah sorry, I see it was fixed very recently
<antocuni>
TL;DR: it is known that C modules not always work, although we improved cpyext a lot
<antocuni>
so, if a module doesn't compile, feel free to open an issue
<andenixa>
Its not so much an extension problem as some error in python.h definition
<andenixa>
I know for the fact people managed to run scandir in pypy
<andenixa>
though probably not at Windows
<andenixa>
antocuni: I've seen similar issues opened
<antocuni>
please file an issue, eventually we will look into it
<antocuni>
or, even better: patches are welcome :)
<andenixa>
guys do PyPy support Cython?
<andenixa>
stupid question yet really always wanted to know
<antocuni>
yes
<andenixa>
oh
<andenixa>
thats cool
<antocuni>
cython has even special support for pypy
<andenixa>
I've stumbled upon pypy page specially stackless part and learned it has incompleate support for stacklets
<andenixa>
I thought pypy was started by the same guys who created stackless
<antocuni>
yes, ctismer
<ctismer>
hehe
<antocuni>
well, it was not started by him alone, but he was there since the beginning AFAIK
<andenixa>
that sounds overwhelmingly bad
<antocuni>
anyway, I'm off for now
<antocuni>
bye :)
<andenixa>
goodbye
<andenixa>
CPYthon rejected stackless and PyPy doing the same mistake
<ctismer>
I don't think so. PyPy's adoption of stackless was very ok for me.
<andenixa>
stacklets could be the most definitive feature nevermind the JIT
<andenixa>
I don't know any mainstream dynamic languages that would have effective microthreads
<andenixa>
ctismer: there was a disclaimer that some important features of stackless are omitted
<andenixa>
I've been pestering #python about stackless and in the end community agreed that its perhaps one of the most overlooked feature
<andenixa>
None has efficient microthread with preemptive scheduler.
<ctismer>
well, it's all my fault. If I were not that much into continuations and were going for Tasklets in the first place, the world might look a bit different...
<andenixa>
ctismer: the major thing is that basically the community couldn't even find much arguments against tasklets except weak voices who'd say they are harder to debug.
<andenixa>
ctismer: anyway you are still here meaning its not over. Tasklets still could change the way people think of python programming in general.
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<andenixa>
stackless should be de-facto not CPython which should technically be subsequently replaced by PyPy
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<andenixa>
ctismer: how impossible it iis to create a real enum statement?
<ctismer>
andenixa whow, I'm impressed :)
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<andenixa>
ctismer: I've been fiddling with python around 10 years of which 7 years I was employed worked professionally. Ever since I learned about stackless I never had CPython installation.
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<ctismer>
andenixa so maybe I should put some work into it? I thought with the appearance of "yield from", the major feature of stackless is doable in Python
<fijal>
eh, os x build only works on 10.13
<fijal>
what should I do?
<fijal>
make another build myself that works on lower OS X?
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<fijal>
antocuni: ?
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<kenaan>
fijal pypy.org[extradoc] 51a69a2367a0 /: regen and add new OS X build
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<mattip>
about scandir and PyPy, I wonder what version they were trying
<fijal>
mattip: so I'm going ahead right?
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<mattip>
osx problems solved? yeah sure why not
<fijal>
well "solved"
<fijal>
we have two binaries and people need to make a plan
<fijal>
I documented it on downloads
<mattip>
how does cpython solve it?
<fijal>
good question, I have no idea
<fijal>
maybe they don't use utimesat on OS X simply?
<fijal>
we can test, but I don't feel like fighting with redoing all the release steps tbh
<fijal>
and OS X users are very good at upgrading too
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<mattip>
does the py2.7 v5.10 download work for you on macos or do we need to rebuild that as well?
<fijal>
pypy2 works
<fijal>
(it does not use fancy new timing stuff)
<fijal>
mattip: ok, it's out, congrats everyone!
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<mattip>
congrats. Did you change the blog theme somehow?
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<fijal>
no?
<fijal>
I mean not intentionally at least
<fijal>
(it also looks for me like it looked before, but indeed it looks like something changed at some stage)
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<fijal>
mattip: well congratulations to you :-)
<fijal>
it feels sometimes the only thing I do is push button ;-)
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<mattip>
it almost is like that for me too
<mattip>
our scripts are getting better
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<LarstiQ>
button mashing works in Streetfighter, why not for releasing pypy
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<LarstiQ>
congrats!
<pjenvey>
what was the osx issue exactly? I remember interp_posix having to wrap calls of things like utimensat with if rposix.HAVE_UTIMESANT, might it be something along those lines
<pjenvey>
speaking of button mashing, someone might wanna double check all that ^^
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<kenaan>
pjenvey pypy.org[extradoc] 42a37d570b66 /: fix formatting of sha lists
<kenaan>
mattip py3.5 85e44c9458db /pypy/module/errno/interp_errno.py: fix for win32
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<mattip>
pjenvey: thanks, lgtm
<mattip>
AFAICT, the issue is that high sierra has utimensat where sierra and lower do not, but we need to build it in
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<mattip>
lxml, numpy seem to behave well with the cpyext-avoid-roundtrip branch,
<mattip>
may I merge it?
<Rotonen>
compiling on a newer macos targeting also older macos versions is tough, at least on CPython one has to manually map the relevant systcalls and patch pyconfig.h manually after autotools configuration
<Rotonen>
mattip, fijal: afaik cpython just compiles on a very old macos and that's how it can work forwards compatible
<mattip>
Rotonen: so the official python builds are forward compatible but miss out on some tweaks like utimensat ?
<Rotonen>
that is my standing understanding of it
<mattip>
thanks
<Rotonen>
that's been annoying me a bit as there is also quite a lot of in the way of compilation warnings in the cpython codebase if you compile it on a modern mac with apple recommended settings
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<xorAxAx>
anybody who will be at fosdem?
<Rotonen>
https://reviews.llvm.org/D34264 <- also this feature had some rather misleading bug in it in some shiped apple llvm version, but don't recall the specifics of that fight anymore at this point, in case you end up chasing this into the same rabbit holes
<cfbolz>
mattip: +1 on merging
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<kenaan>
mattip default 7b550e9b3cee /pypy/: merge cpyext-avoid-roundtrip which avoids some rpython-c conversions