kyak changed the topic of #qi-hardware to: Copyleft hardware - http://qi-hardware.com | hardware hackers join here to discuss Ben NanoNote, atben/atusb 802.15.4 wireless, anelok and other community driven hw projects | public logging at http://en.qi-hardware.com/irclogs and http://irclog.whitequark.org/qi-hardware
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<kyak> DocScrutinizer51 must be happy :)
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<wpwrak> "There have been no significant bug reports since RC2 was announced only three weeks ago" that's not the way i would have put this ;-)
<wpwrak> but it's a great step forward nevertheless
<wpwrak> pity that they seem to copy the step release concept. would be nicer if they used rolling releases.
<whitequark> that is really not a pity, using a rolling release on a server is insane
<whitequark> all my boxes have autoupdate by default to plug CVEs while I sleep
<kyak> i'm running arch on my server since 2012, and i'm happy with rolling releases. Not a single time did i have to reinstall the system to upgrade it
<kyak> and i'm using lts kernel
<kyak> and NO, upgrade procedures don't work without complete reinstallation
<kyak> that's my experience
<whitequark> not a single time I had to *fix* a system after a routine update on debian, and that's more important
<whitequark> once per two years I can spend a single day in a pre-planned fashion, go and run all my ansible scripts on a new machine and sync all data
<whitequark> but putting out fires because some idiot didn't update a package definition right is not what I want to do after waking up on aweekend
<kyak> there is "testing" before it rolls on
<wpwrak> yes, it all depends on the quality of the testing
<wpwrak> and with a rolling release you have a good chance that also testing in the field will happen before problems can affect you
<wpwrak> it's true that failures will be a less predictable, but on the other had, you get things in a more timely manner
<wpwrak> #s/had/hand/
<whitequark> a few people genuinely need the latest greatest features
<whitequark> the rest should just realize that whatever toy they want from the last year should probably not be used in production anyway
<wpwrak> the problem isn't needing the latest features of everything, but there's always a small number of things where you really want to have the latest
<wpwrak> and what's a mere inconvenience for people like us is an nearly insurmountable barrier for less advanced users
<whitequark> I disagree that there 'always' is
<wpwrak> well, that's my experience so far. often there are non-official dailies that can bridge those gaps, but every once in a whole you run into something you just have to build on your own if you need the latest
<wpwrak> and if you're unlucky, it's something like cura, with pretty heavy dependencies
<mth> for me it depends a lot on what the role for the machine is: on a development PC I want recent packages, on a server I want mature ones
<wpwrak> ah yes, if that's the part of "always" whitequark meant, i'd agree. i was referring to the overall personal experience. of course, my server is typically just fine with old base releases.
<whitequark> yes I'm talking about servers specifically
<whitequark> development PCs would be nearly unusable on debian stable, even testing alone is a stretch sometimes
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