<meepdeew>
Since any predicate passed to the check-satisfied test necessarily accepts only a single argument (the result of the prior check-satisfied expression) how can I compare the elements of that list with the input to the aforementioned second check-satisfied expression? At this point in the book, neither lambdas, nor local variable bindings have been introduced into the BSL language yet.
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<erkin>
I'm just starting out with racket/gui and I have a quick question: I want an object that can display text read-only with scrollbars and all. It won't ever be edited. Is editor-canvas% what I'm looking for or is there something else that'd suit this job better?
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<ecraven>
how do I tell racket where to look for r7rs import libraries?
<ecraven>
I have on named foo.sld, which command-line parameter tells racket where to find that when I run racket -I r7rs and then enter (import (foo))
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<ZombieChicken>
Is there a way to get drracket to garbage collect when RAM usage exceeds a certain amount and if a certain amount of time has passed?
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<lexi-lambda>
ecraven: R7RS doesn’t specify how/where to load R7RS libraries, so my r7rs package only loads libraries installed as Racket packages. It’s standards-compliant. Take it up with the authors of the standard if you don’t like it. :)
<ecraven>
lexi-lambda: so there's no way to use actual r7rs packages?
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<lexi-lambda>
There’s no such thing as an “actual r7rs package”.
<ecraven>
I mean, I have a file that contains a define-library form, where will racket look for that?
<ecraven>
say I (import (foo)), what kind of file does racket look for?
<bremner>
is import a racket form?
<bremner>
I should probably read the backlog...
<lexi-lambda>
If you do (import (foo)), that will look for the same module as (require foo) would in #lang racket.
<lexi-lambda>
define-library forms will be expanded to real Racket modules, so if you install the package as a Racket package, with everything set up right, you can, indeed, load r7rs libraries in Racket.
<ecraven>
is there a way to just put a source file somewhere and have racket find that?
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<lexi-lambda>
No.
<ecraven>
I don't know anything about how racket loads modules :-/
<lexi-lambda>
R7RS is a little bit of malicious compliance—it follows the R5RS and R6RS implementations’ philosophy of basically implementing the standards to the letter, but doing no more.
<lexi-lambda>
There is an advantage to this: it’s very easy to find out if you are writing portable R7RS code. If it runs on #lang r7rs, it will probably run on another R7RS implementation.
<ecraven>
hehe, not blaming you at all, just trying to find a way to run code from source without actually installing it :P
<lexi-lambda>
But the R7RS standard is also woefully underspecified, so in a sense it just demonstrates that writing truly portable R7RS is a little hopeless.
<ecraven>
yea, I'm noticing that a lot
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<ecraven>
the actual *code* runs fine, but all the libraries have different names, and the files need to be in different places
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<ecraven>
obvious solution: just concatenate all the code into one long file :P
<lexi-lambda>
If you want to use #lang r7rs but don’t care about being portable, you can always (import (only (racket base) require)) and use Racket’s require. But of course at that point, why use #lang r7rs? ;)
<ecraven>
well, for example in r7rs-swank, I have an r7rs core, and some shims around it for each scheme
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<ecraven>
so in that case, I can run scheme-specific code "around" the portable parts
<lexi-lambda>
R7RS does provide cond-expand, which is kind of the nuclear option for compatibility.
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<ecraven>
which is not implemented by every Scheme :-/
<lexi-lambda>
Well, then those Schemes aren’t even R7RS compliant! :p
<ecraven>
indeed, as almost all schemes aren't :P
<erkin>
Is there any fully R7RS compliant Scheme out there?
<lexi-lambda>
Writing portable Scheme is hopeless! Just write Racket. ;)
<ecraven>
hehe, at least that would be portable to all implementations of Racket :P
<lexi-lambda>
erkin: I believe there are several. Including, I think, Racket.
<erkin>
Is that so?
<erkin>
Huh.
<ecraven>
erkin: I've heard chibi is good, racket's r7rs too
<erkin>
Yeah but is it good or is it compliant? ;-P
<ecraven>
it should be fully compliant
<erkin>
Not just small, right?
<ecraven>
but I haven't tested it fully
<ZombieChicken>
does anyone here use rwind as their window manager?
<ecraven>
in -git, they also implement all the new r7rs-large library name aliases for the existing srfis
<lexi-lambda>
IIUC, R7RS-small is the only specified version of R7RS. R7RS-large is still not finished.
<ecraven>
lexi-lambda: parts of it are "finished"
<erkin>
Ah, that explains my confusion.
<ecraven>
the red edition is done.
<lexi-lambda>
ecraven: They published some preliminary ideas for R7RS-large as a collection of SRFIs, but that does not a standard make.
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<lexi-lambda>
(IMO, at least, maybe I’m misunderstanding.)
<ecraven>
it'll consist of 7 or so parts. the first one is finished. the second one is under voting right now
<lexi-lambda>
So can we project when it will be all done? :P
<ZombieChicken>
lexi-lambda: I imagine the people over at #scheme could give you more data on that if you wanted
<ecraven>
lexi-lambda: 2050 or so :P
<lexi-lambda>
Great, let me know when that happens, and if Racket and I are both still around, I’ll try to add it to #lang r7rs. :p
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<ecraven>
:D
<ecraven>
well, for example (srfi 1) is now also known as (scheme list)
<ecraven>
so there's no actual work needed to implement it, but (import (scheme list)) should just load srfi-1. something like (define-library (scheme list) (import (srfi 1)) (export ...)) works fine
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<lexi-lambda>
ecraven: Unfortunately in Racket it isn’t that simple since srfi/1 works on immutable pairs, but the R7RS version would need to work on mutable pairs.
<ecraven>
lexi-lambda: ah, a very good point I keep forgetting and then running into :-/
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<cosmez>
funny, i was watching this video last night
<cosmez>
made me realize how bad is the whole standardization process.
<cosmez>
but someone said something very interesting there, the revisions are supposed to follow the implementations, but is not doing a very good job at it.
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<ecraven>
cosmez: well, the standard uses srfis, so they are at least used somewhere
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<jcowan>
cosmez: Those are my slides, though it's not me presenting. What do you think is the problem with the standardization process
<jcowan>
?
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<cosmez>
jcowan, whats the point of having two r7rs, people complained about the differences between r6 and r5, and the community was split because of that
<cosmez>
instead of moving on and growing the language, r7rs enforced that split
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<cosmez>
slides are fine, theres nothing wrong with the presentation, but the conversation later opens your mind about whats wrong
<cosmez>
r7rs-big is chasing racket basically, r7rs-small is to keep r5rs people happy
<cosmez>
not an expert at all, thats just what i assumed from the whole talk
<ZombieChicken>
I seem to recall someone mentioning r7rs was going to be comparable to Common Lisp
<ZombieChicken>
well
<ZombieChicken>
r7rs-big
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<cosmez>
racket on chez, gerbil on gambit, would it be possible to have a scheme on some common lisp ?
<ZombieChicken>
probably
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<bremner>
cos
<bremner>
oops
<bremner>
cosmez: in principal, but presumably with more work than on scheme