apeiros_ changed the topic of #ruby to: Ruby 1.9.3-p194: http://ruby-lang.org || Paste >3 lines of text on gist.github.com || Rails is in #rubyonrails || Log: http://irclog.whitequark.org/ruby
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<cesurasean> I require some help to get an app running on my machine. I'm having problems with gems not uninstalling like they should. - will_paginate 3.0 is not compatible with Rails 2.3 or older
<cesurasean> how do i fix this error code? - will_paginate 3.0 is not compatible with Rails 2.3 or older
<cesurasean> when I try to update rails, it fails.
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<iToast> Ughm
<iToast> Why did somone write a brainfuck module for apache...
<iToast> Seriously... why?!
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<iToast> So no one can answer...
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<iToast> What use is brainfuck good for?
<iToast> Can we write a compile compiler in it?
<iToast> complier*
<iToast> compiler*
<iToast> you know what i mean
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<iToast> We should write a new programming language like brainfuck.
<iToast> Basically fork brainfuck and add more functions.
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<fowl> yeah cool functions like twitter feeds
<iToast> no.
<iToast> Jumping in memory to create functions.
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<iToast> Its possible to do in brainfuck
<fowl> yes the functions are a twitter feed which search for your favorite singer
<iToast> you're a failure troll
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<fowl> qq
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<iToast> .....
<iToast> So you want to do it?
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<davidcelis> what did i just walk into
<davidcelis> brainfuck and twitter
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<iToast> Someone wrote a BF interpreter in BF
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<iToast> What'sa simple challenge to do in a programming language.
<iToast> You know like calculating prime
<blazes816> Calculating all primes?
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<iToast> So calculating a prime is basically:
<iToast> Can divide by self or 1
<iToast> or die
<iToast> blazes816: That's correct right?
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<blazes816> many ways to do it
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<blazes816> it's not as simple as that. you have to determine it can ONLY be divided by itself and 1
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<Paradox> i'm trying to use em-http-request with websockets, and I can't get it to do anything at all
<blazes816> which requires trying to divide it by every nonprime integer between 2 and sqrt(n)
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<iToast> I understand
<iToast> but im not sure how to check if its prime or not >_<
<iToast> so if num < num = 1 prime
<iToast> ?
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<iToast> num / num*
<blazes816> num/num is always 1
<Paradox> any recommendations for using eventmachine with webkit?
<Paradox> derp
<Paradox> eventmachine with websockets
<cesurasean> guys, im getting this error; but rspec can not be found in vendor/gems, vendor/plugins or system gems.
<cesurasean> how do i fix that? i tried gem install rspec
<cesurasean> didn't work.
<blazes816> you need to iterate over every integer from 2 to sqrt(n) and check that n%i != 0
<Paradox> aw damn
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<iToast> ok whats a better challenge...
<blazes816> cersuasean: Add "gem 'rspec'" to your Gemfile and run "bundle"
<blazes816> iToast: http://projecteuler.net/
<blazes816> or a simple game. I find games to be the funnest, and often most challenging puzzles.
<cesurasean> anyone?
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<blazes816> cesurasean: Add "gem 'rspec'" to your Gemfile and run "bundle"
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<cesurasean> blazes816, where is the gem file located at?
<cesurasean> and how do i run bundle?
<blazes816> cesurasean: are you using a framework? or just building your own project from scratch?
<cesurasean> using a framework
<blazes816> which one?
<cesurasean> trying to get it installed
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<cesurasean> not sure. it's some script i found on the net awhile ago.
<cesurasean> no documentation with it, but I know it works.
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<blazes816> okay, well you can just create a file called "Gemfile" in the root of your project. Then do "gem install bundler" to make sure bundler is installed, and then "bundle install" in your project root.
<iToast> blazes816:
<iToast> I have a idea for a hash that can only be created once.
<blazes816> Google "bundler Gemfile" and read about how it works, but it's the best way to manage dependencies
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<iToast> blazes816: Im curious about MD5 Hashes
<blazes816> lol
<blazes816> I thought you mean the data structure
<iToast> When a flile is signed with a md5 hash, can't somone replay the hash onto a different file?
<iToast> Or are md5 hashes on files created using their bytecode
<iToast> so it wont match
<cesurasean> blazes816, bundle says command not found
<cesurasean> I installed bundler.
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<blazes816> cesurasean: like in the instructions on http://gembundler.com/ ?
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<blazes816> iToast: a hash is made using the bytes making up the file. Files are made of "bytecode" unless they're like a java .class file or something.
<iToast> ok.
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<iToast> So its impossible to create a new one for a file thats the same as another?
<blazes816> but if you change even a single byte in the file, the entire hash will be different
<iToast> blazes816: I have a idea for a hash thats always random.
<iToast> It's impossible to recreate
<iToast> Use the machines delta time divided by a random number from 1 - 20
<blazes816> theoretically, it is possible to create another file that has the exact same md5 hash as another. that's called a collision, and it's bad
<blazes816> which is why md5 is obsolete.
<cesurasean> blazes816, yeh but when i run bundle it doesn't work.
<iToast> Once that final numer is found divide it by 2
<iToast> thats were it will be put into the hash
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<blazes816> What would be the use case? if you can't recreate the hash, what's it useful for?
<iToast> Then the numer generated by 1 - 20 + delta time will be inserted there.
<iToast> This can be added onto any HASH to make it impossible to collide.
<iToast> Its basically a secure salt for any type of hash.
<blazes816> iToast: That could work like a salt
<blazes816> ah
<iToast> it makes it impossible for a hash to become collided.
<blazes816> cesurasean: sounds like some kind of gems issue.
<blazes816> cesurasean: does "gem list" show any gems?
<iToast> blazes816: Its a much more secure hash once salted with it.
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<iToast> blazes816: The great thing about this hash is it can't be forced.
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<iToast> Even rainbow tables wouldn't be effective against it.
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<iToast> Every time the hash is salted, it becomes unique to that instance in time.
<blazes816> iToast: So you could never reproduce it? a = hash('a'); b = hash('a'); are a and be different?
<iToast> yes
<iToast> it can be secured even harder.
<iToast> Once you pass anything through this hash its gone.
<Goles> Guys does += -= *= work in ruby ? How can I search for them in the docs ? ( searching for *= using google is not very helpful … )
<iToast> Goles: It does if im correct
<iToast> Just test!
<blazes816> how would you use that?
<iToast> blazes816: Password hashing.
<Goles> iToast hahahha ok :)
<iToast> :)
<Goles> pry ftw
<Goles> xD
<iToast> blazes816: Think of it like this.
<iToast> Your DNA could be repeated faster then this hash.
<blazes816> Goles: they are methods on the e.g. Integer class
<Goles> blazes816 cool , :) , thanks
<iToast> Goles: Try this in a ruby shell
<iToast> i = 0
<iToast> i += 1
<iToast> puts i
<iToast> ;)
<Goles> yep
<cesurasean> blazes816, ok, i ran that command, and now it's still saying cannot find rspec.
<Goles> works
<iToast> blazes816: You like my hash?
<iToast> idea
<iToast> I can impliment it in php.
<Goles> still if you do 4 += 1 it errors
<iToast> Goles: you're not assigning it to a variable.
<iToast> Goles: Also, it'd be 4 + 1
<blazes816> cesurasean: do did you install rubygems?
<Goles> yes
<Goles> hahaha
<Goles> I know
<iToast> You want to hear my hasing idea?
<Goles> iToast was just playing around … thanks for the help
<iToast> hashing*
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<blazes816> 4 is a singleton object that can't be mutated!
<Goles> iToast me ? hashing ?
<iToast> Its more of a salt...
<Goles> blazes816 hahahaha really ?
<cesurasean> blazes816, yes i have gem installed
<iToast> Goles: Think of time as a static liniar object.
<Goles> xD
<blazes816> Goles: yep
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<iToast> Goles: Lets say we can take its current value
<Goles> blazes816 well that's actually interesting
<iToast> Goles: Now you can't go back and get that value again.
<iToast> it's staticly written into time.
<blazes816> cesurasean: but how did you do it? RVM? apt-get? yum?
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<iToast> Lets use it in salting
<iToast> Now you got a static salt that's always changing with time
<blazes816> iToast: but if you hash a password using it, how can you later allow a user to log in? they'd have to log in at a time now longer existant.
<cesurasean> apt-get
<iToast> blazes816: True. :s
<iToast> It's more of securing a file's contents.
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<blazes816> cesurasean: try using rvm, rbenv, or rbfoo. https://rvm.io//
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<blazes816> cesurasean: ruby related deb packages are almost always broken.
<iToast> blazes816: The whole idea of this salt is to prevent people from throwing things at it.
<blazes816> iToast: but in that case hashes are used to check for integrity, but in this case being valid is only possible at one instance in time.
<iToast> blazes816: Ok, think of it like this
<iToast> Its a hash that you can continuesly brute force
<iToast> but you can't get the value to
<blazes816> Canonical builds Ubuntu, put up the hash of the valid iso. then you downloaded and hash it again. even if the iso is fine, the hash is different.
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<blazes816> no, you couldn't brute force it, in the same way that the user couldn't use it either.
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<iToast> blazes816: 2 way chat key.
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<iToast> Every message sent is sent with a hash at the end
<iToast> you can confirm it to the original sender with the original hash
<cesurasean> blazes816, what's the best way you suggest to fix this so it can find that gem?
<blazes816> the point being to ensure the message has not been tampered with?
<iToast> yes
<iToast> Somone tampers? trys to put the same hash
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<iToast> its impossible.
<blazes816> but that only works given that the message is received at the same time it was hashed correct?
<iToast> no
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<iToast> As long as the hash is there on the message
<iToast> you can go Hey *sender* this is the hash i got
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<iToast> is it correct? *hash*
<blazes816> cesurasean: install rvm. run: curl -L https://get.rvm.io | bash -s stable --ruby
<iToast> They say no -> Tampered
<iToast> Yes -> Not tampered
<blazes816> iToast: gotcha
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<iToast> The message can't be sent without a fresh hash.
<iToast> so its constantly a new hash :)
<blazes816> iToast, that does make sense
<iToast> blazes816: its basically SSH
<iToast> The hash exists and can't be recreated.
<blazes816> i hadn't considered that type of case. very interesting.
<iToast> the user can confirm it with the server
<iToast> blazes816: want me to whip up a php script that spits out random salts
<iToast> to add to a hash
<blazes816> cesurasean: after rvm is installed, and will handle it all for you.
<blazes816> iToast: I would never wish such a thing upon you
<iToast> why?
<iToast> its about 20 lines of code.
<blazes816> I just can't stand writing php ever since I left
<iToast> lol
<iToast> Im fine with php
<blazes816> but if you like, cool
<iToast> :)
<cesurasean> blazes816, after i run that command it should be fixed, yeh?
<blazes816> I used to be back in the day
<iToast> Think of it like this
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<iToast> blazes816: Lets assume you have the hash 999x94
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<iToast> Now lets say we want to know what made it.
<blazes816> cesurasean: yeah, if you follow the instructions on screen you should have a working gems.
<iToast> Now a machine is generating hashes at 20k/s
<blazes816> you can try to reinstall rspec and whatnot
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<iToast> Every hash is new.
<iToast> can't be brought bac
<iToast> So you're just throwing crap at the wall hoping something sticks.
<iToast> Nothing will ever stick
<blazes816> iToast: yeah, that's interesting. You could also take the message, append the timestamp, and hash that.
<blazes816> but the collision rate would only be as good as the hashing algos
<iToast> blazes816: This hash can be used in any way.
<iToast> its impossible to repeat.
<iToast> You need to be the same date
<iToast> same time
<iToast> same delta time
<iToast> and the same original file / message
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<blazes816> theoretically, but all hash algorithms have some flaws.
<iToast> This one has 1 flaw.
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<blazes816> you could possibly collide with it given a completely different input, that may be near impossible to find.
<blazes816> that's the best we get
<iToast> What every hash you salt with it will tell you how long until it can be recreated
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<iToast> The more complex, the better.
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<iToast> blazes816: Lets call this the 3rr0r Salt
<iToast> The more time goes by, the harder it is to recover the original message.
<iToast> Like bcrypt
<iToast> but a different method
<jtallant> Can someone explain this code to me? https://gist.github.com/3030295 specifically how the + is working as opposed to << …please just comment on the gist if you can provide any explanation. Thank you.
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<iToast> blazes816: wan't a simple live php scropt
<iToast> ?
<iToast> The more variables you throw in the more violent the return is.
<iToast> Lets not call it a hash / salt even.
<iToast> Lets call it a secure salting method.
<iToast> I just blew everyone's hashing alogrythems out of the water creating a hash that can't be recreated.
<iToast> I'm only 16.
<jtallant> I know what recursion is
<blazes816> iToast: you'll change the world
<iToast> not really.
<iToast> I'm more about the evil ;)
<iToast> I wrote a hacked MC Client
<iToast> NoCheat couldn't stop it.
<iToast> a new update has started to detect it, but thats a quick bypass
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<blazes816> i remember those days young grasshopper
<iToast> lool
<iToast> Grasshopper? more like praying mantis.
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<iToast> I challenged the idea of conventional thinking on hacks and exploits.
<iToast> I pull my exploits out of thin air.
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<iToast> Things people don't look at I do.
* rking doesn't look at jumping off a cliff.
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<iToast> I do.
<iToast> People say u cant jump off and survive.
<iToast> I say you can if you have the right variables in place.
<iToast> No parachute.
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<iToast> Your sweater will create a extreme drag.
<iToast> Same with shirts.
<rking> You grammatically diverged on your statement, but fair enough re the point you made.
<iToast> rking: Think of this.
<iToast> If a container contains all containers, does it contain its self.
<iToast> Also tell me the answer and how it'd work.
<iToast> ;)
<rking> Yep, it does.
<iToast> How?
<iToast> IT can't contain it's self.
<rking> Unless you've got some funky definition of a container, self-containment is not a big deal.
<rking> You're throwing that in as a rule after the fact.
<iToast> rking: Think of tupper ware.
<rking> Plenty of things contain themselves.
<iToast> rking: Ok, think of tupperware.
<rking> OK.
<iToast> Now think of the first bin as A
<rking> Then in a classical, 3-dimensional type world, no, Tupperware can't contain itself.
<iToast> A can't exist inside and outisde of it'self at the same time.
<iToast> :)
<rking> But that's nothing like the original question.
<blazes816> iToast: you need to read some set theory
<iToast> rking: Now code that into a line a computer can parse :D
<iToast> Watch how fast it fails to compute
<rking> Code which part?
<iToast> A container containing its self
<iToast> but let it know it cant exist inside and outside of its self at the same time
<iToast> it should quickly throw a error.
<rking> class Tupperware; def add innards; if @current_contents + innards > @size then fail "Too much junk." end end end
<iToast> cheater ;P
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<rking> Not really.
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<iToast> You got me there.
<rking> That's one reason why IRL Tupperware can't contain itself.
<iToast> "This statement is false"
<rking> iToast: A more funky question is the set R described by Hofstadter.
<iToast> A statement that exists is true.
<rking> Right, that's a basic paradox.
<Paradox> no its not
<rking> LOL
<Paradox> its a complex paradox
<iToast> rking: Now how do we solve it in comput9ing
<iToast> LOL
<iToast> rking: if (paradox == "This statement is false"){
<Paradox> ಠ_ಠ
<rking> That is the only accidental nickping that has meant anything.
<cesurasean> blazes816, same error.
<Paradox> false
<iToast> echo("Fuck you!");
<iToast> {
<rking> (IME)
<Paradox> im going to go with false
<iToast> {
<iToast> ;)
<Paradox> that was easy
<Paradox> ok
<iToast> lol
<iToast> No
<Paradox> time to kill you
<iToast> Il tell you the solution to that paradox.
<iToast> echo("Da fuck im doing that!");
<Paradox> no one caught the wheatley reference?
<blazes816> cesurasean: what command did you run, and what error did you get?
<iToast> Paradox: yes
<rking> Paradox: How do you define basic/complex paradoxes?
<Paradox> gareadfahjsdkfasdfasdfa
<iToast> rking: This is not a paradox.
* Paradox turns off highlight
<iToast> This statement isn't a statement.
<cesurasean> I run rake and it gives me this; ********************************************************************************
<cesurasean> * You are trying to run an rspec rake task defined in
<cesurasean> * /home/someonedeletedme/public_html/NEW/lib/tasks/rspec.rake,
<cesurasean> * but rspec can not be found in vendor/gems, vendor/plugins or system gems.
<cesurasean> ********************************************************************************
<iToast> cesurasean: PASTEBION!!!
<iToast> PIN*!!!
<iToast> bin*
<cesurasean> sorry
<rking> cesurasean: Are you using Bundler?
<iToast> Il write a bare basic paradox
<cesurasean> yes, i ran bundle install, and that worked.
<iToast> and a explination that tells you how it works
<cesurasean> but when i run rake it says it can't find rspec
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<rking> cesurasean: Then use bundle exec rake
<cesurasean> now it's giving me this; /var/lib/gems/1.8/gems/bundler-1.1.4/lib/bundler/rubygems_integration.rb:147:in `gem': rake is not part of the bundle. Add it to Gemfile. (Gem::LoadError)
<cesurasean> from /var/lib/gems/1.8/bin/rake:18
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<rking> That's a clearer error message.
<blazes816> add "gem 'rake'"
<blazes816> to your Gemfile
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<iToast> There
<iToast> I made a bare basic explination of the rules and how a computer proccesses a paradox.
<iToast> The problem is a computer can't comprehend these rules are they violate themselfs.
<iToast> You can change your state.
<rking> iToast: Statements that can change their state is an extremely "outside the box" approach.
<iToast> The state of a scentence is static
<iToast> rking: yes.
<rking> Might as well define "false" to mean "purple".
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<iToast> rking: lol
<iToast> Its designed to get the bare basic idea of the problem.
<iToast> a computer wants to say true but the statement tells it to say false.
<iToast> but it thinks it should say true
<iToast> Still, your programming would have to be HORRID for any type of AI to get stuck on this.
<rking> Wait, what answer are you looking for from the AI? A boolean result for "This statement is false."?
<iToast> Either.
<iToast> A ai should not try and understand it.;
<iToast> If the ai is trying to comprehend it's own output it's not a good idea as that's not a input that affects the output
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<rking> Well, if you accept that a statement can evaluate to: True, false, and (at least the additional) paradox, it's an OK problem.
<iToast> IT could end in many varied outputs that result to a horrible non realistic AI
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<iToast> rking: Tell a good ai this
<iToast> This statement is false.
<iToast> it can answer Yes it is.
<iToast> or no it isnt.
<iToast> or "I agree"
<iToast> It doesnt need to understand that kind of a statement.
<rking> Those aren't enough choices for it, or even for a human.
<iToast> why not?
<iToast> "Yes, i agree that statement is false.
<iToast> "
<rking> Because the statement is neither true nor false nor agreeable.
<iToast> We agree to things we can't agree with as humans./
<rking> If you agree that it is false, then you validate its claim, which means it's a true statement, etc.
<iToast> It's making it more realistic
<iToast> rking: Think of it like this, it's more human like.
<iToast> You're thinking of it like a AI not a human.
<rking> To do what? Botch the understanding of that sentence?
<iToast> Depends on its response.
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<iToast> I have a basic learnign theory for computers.
<iToast> Lets say you're a AI rking and I say A apple is a type of food
<rking> I'm not even really messing with the AI aspect, yet. Only saying that 0 and 1 are not enough states to evaluate self-referential statements.
<iToast> Now what is a apple/
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<rking> "a type of food"
<iToast> See how you can respond and seem human like.
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<iToast> rking: Now lets say I say apples are a animal
<iToast> you can now check your reference against the original statement and say, "No, they're a type of food"
<iToast> You dont need to think "Apples are a kind of animal" and check if its defined as a animal when its predefined as a food.
<iToast> Now lets assume we use "FOOD" as a tag.
<iToast> I can ask the ai "Would you like a apple?" and it can respond "I don't wan't any food right now"
<iToast> Quickly the AI starts to become more human like by listening to statements.
<iToast> (i was told before by others just because im 16 I cant write a ai and to leave this to the pros"
<Peregrinu5> err wrong channel.. sorry
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<rking> Peregrinu5: I was about to congratulate you on somehow managing to be even more off-topic than iToast and me.
<Peregrinu5> lol
<iToast> want more off topic?
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<iToast> Cat's are a type of quadorped that can run at high speed and allow their muscles to stretch farther then they normally wood in a time of being stressed out allowing a cat to be more flexible when it's needed.
<iToast> That good.
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<rking> iToast: I'm not sure where you're going with the recent line of statements.
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<iToast> Neither am i.
<iToast> welcome to my world.
<iToast> :)
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<TheHairyWoodsman> when making a gem, and using gemspec to control your depenedncies, what is the syntax to indicate you want the dependency to be a local :path => style reference? In the gemfile, it's straightforward… gem 'blah', :path => '../blah'
<TheHairyWoodsman> but I can't figure it out for a .gemspec (i.e, I'm developing a gem)
<TheHairyWoodsman> been reading the docs that I can find, and they don't address it that i can ese
<TheHairyWoodsman> see*
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<cesurasean> guys, im now getting this error, which i think should be the final one. - http://pastebin.com/G8DU8rqk
<cesurasean> can someone please help me to fix this?
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<banisterfiend> cesurasean: that's not an error you're getting, you're pregnant and about to give birth! quick get to the hospital! u need an urgent cesurasean section!
<blazes816> line 55 of config/boot.rb is trying to require 'initializer', which doesn't appear to exist.
<blazes816> do you have a file called initializer.rb somewhere?
<cesurasean> no, but there is a directory with that name.
<rking> cesurasean: BTW you shouldn't be screwing around as root.
<blazes816> rking: didn't even notice that lol
<cesurasean> lol
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<cesurasean> line 55 reads as such; require 'initializer'
<cesurasean> what is initalizer? a gem?
<blazes816> a file
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<blazes816> or, rather, it should be
<rking> cesurasean: grep -ri initializer .
<blazes816> cesurasean, if it's not too overwheling, pastebin a "ls -R' of the NEW directory
<blazes816> or what rking says
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<cesurasean> blazes816, http://pastebin.com/FqU4Caky
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<blazes816> i thought you said you were using some script you found on the net. had I known it was rails this would've been a lot easier
<cesurasean> :/
<blazes816> what version are you using? "rails -v"
<blazes816> np
<cesurasean> so, how do i fix my issue right now?
<cesurasean> Rails 3.0.7
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<blazes816> cesurasean, try this http://railsforum.com/viewtopic.php?id=3001
<blazes816> danger's first post
<blazes816> but with the correct version of rails
<ironmagma> Hi all, I'm attempting to `gem install bdb` (berkeley database adaptor) but seem to be held up by an error with "lipo: can't open input file".. http://sprunge.us/ZMLj
<cesurasean> blazes816, i ran rm -rf vendor/rails in the main directory and nothing happen, same error.
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<blazes816> cesurasean: I really don't know. Try in #rails or #rubyonrails
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<fowl> _____________________________________________
<offby1> tell it to us straight.
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<offby1> banisterfiend: that happens to me every time I take the car through the car was
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<offby1> h
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<banisterfiend> offby1: yoyo
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<locriani> moo
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<banisterfiend> offby1: check this out, it's pretty awesome: https://github.com/kyrylo/pry-theme
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<davidcelis> nobody uses pry
<mdszy> I do!
<banisterfiend> 'cept noobs
<mdszy> Pry is awesome
<davidcelis> mdszy: you're a nobody, apparently
<mdszy> Apparently!
<bnagy> or a noob, take your pick
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<mdszy> I think I'd rather be a nobody.
<banisterfiend> anyone wants to suggest color themes or create one, file an issue on https://github.com/kyrylo/pry-theme or https://github.com/kyrylo/pry-theme-collection
<davidcelis> noobody
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* mdszy totally gets the Solarized one
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<bnagy> what theme format did you use?
<banisterfiend> bnagy: not me, kyrylo created his own yml thingy, it looks really straight forward ill show u a link
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<bnagy> sometimes I wish 'people' would work out a theme standard
<bnagy> then I lose interest again
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<bnagy> that yaml theme thing is really nice
<bnagy> I'm assuming you can use hexcodes instead of colour names...
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<bnagy> hm maybe not
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<banisterfiend> bnagy: u heard of this? http://www.linuxjournaldigital.com/linuxjournal/201207#pg1
<banisterfiend> looks like pry is on the cover?
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<bnagy> nice :)
<offby1> banisterfiend: I'm anti-theme
<banisterfiend> offby1: you just haven't met the right one yet
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<banisterfiend> offby1: try zenburn
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<banisterfiend> zenburn is like peaches and cream
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<dekz> If I'm returning a base64 string in the body of a message, which will then later be used in a URI, should the original body be urlsafe base64 or should I just return base64?
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<bnagy> zenburn makes me queasy
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<banisterfiend> bnagy: what theme do you use
<bnagy> vividchalk in vim, tweaked monokai in ST2
<bnagy> or solarized light if I'm out in the sun
<banisterfiend> cool
<banisterfiend> ?
<bnagy> something like that yeah
<bnagy> every editor does it a little differently - ST2 has a very similar theme as well
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<tama> o.o
<bnagy> All Hallow's Eve, apparently, but the syntax highlighting sux
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<austinbv> so I have been trying to require a path with require File.expand_path ... but it hasn't worked
<austinbv> load does though why would that happen
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<Hanmac> austinbv use require_relative
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<austinbv> so why would load work and not require when loading a module in a full path?
<bnagy> what's the error?
<austinbv> file not found
<austinbv> require File.expand_path ...
<austinbv> file not found error
<austinbv> load File.expand_path ...
<austinbv> just find
<austinbv> fine*
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<bnagy> what does the FIle.expand_path thing produce as a string, and have you tested require with just that string?
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<austinbv> yup both fail
<austinbv> File.expand_path produces an absolute path based on a relative
<austinbv> tried relative too
<bnagy> yes, I know :)
<austinbv> :)
<Hanmac> ... and why did you not use require_relative?
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<austinbv> because I wanted absolute since it's a weechat plugin that can be loaded from anywhere
<bnagy> what's the actual code and the actual string that is being produced?
<bnagy> because what you're saying is kind of impossible
<austinbv> yeah thought so too
<bnagy> ok well it helps when you don't just make up the error message
<austinbv> sorry cannot load
<banisterfiend> Hanmac: join #gosu
<bnagy> is it a ruby file?
<bnagy> (no)
<austinbv> yup
<austinbv> does it have to end in .rb
<austinbv> oh I know
* austinbv facepalms
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<austinbv> topped the file with a shebang
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<austinbv> and it doenst have .rb
<Hanmac> austinbv its the file-extendion
<austinbv> ty
<Hanmac> require wants a *.rb or *.so file
<austinbv> yeah
<banisterfiend> Hanmac: which get precedence when doing a require, a .so or a .rb ?
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<Hanmac> *.rb gets more precedence
<bnagy> if you don't want to change the filename, which is reasonable, load is fine
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<banisterfiend> Hanmac: yeah, when i learned tht i stopped giving my c extensions weird names :) as i knew the .rb in lib/ would be loaded before teh .so
<banisterfiend> Hanmac: it was a good feeling
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<banisterfiend> Hanmac: was it a good feeling when you discovered it too? or did you feel nothing at all, as it was so natural that it just worked as you expected?
<Hanmac> when you make a c extension, hy do you mixed it? i mean an pure c extension has no problems, but when you mixed it with extra rb files you could get a problem (gosu is a mixed gem too)
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<fowl> nopdfs
<banisterfiend> Hanmac: well, my c extensions for gosu were 'fat gems', so i had both 1.8 and 1.9 binaries
<banisterfiend> Hanmac: so i had a .rb file in lib/ which was responsible for deciding which of the .so files to load whether it was lib/1.8/a.so or lib/1.9/a.so
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<Hanmac> http://packages.ubuntu.com/quantal/ruby-nokogiri << this is a debian package of a gem, its maked that it supports both 1.8 and 1.9 ... without funny a.so names
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<banisterfiend> Hanmac: well it's implementation detail so it' sok
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<banisterfiend> Hanmac: how do you manage fat gems?
<banisterfiend> fat gems aren't so important anymore as often ppl dont care about 1.8 so much
<banisterfiend> but about 1-2 years ago, everything had to be fat gems :/
<Hanmac> my c-gems are 100% in c++ ... and they mosty only work with 1.9+ ... 1.8 support is not planned
<banisterfiend> Hanmac: name one of your c++ gems? i want to see if show-source works on them :D
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<banisterfiend> Hanmac: can i just gem install rwx /
<banisterfiend> ?
<Hanmac> no rwx is not packaged yet
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<jyc> I'm trying to use ruby-opengl on windows, but when I tell aptana to run it, I get this error: https://gist.github.com/3031448
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<jyc> I've installed the precompiled gem for 1.9 off of their website
<jyc> has anyone here successfully set up ruby-opengl on windows?
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<ssa> In eventmachine, is there a built-in way to not start a unix socket server, if there's already one on that socket?
<ssa> Kinda like exclusive socket?
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<ssa> (akin to the address:port behavior, where it raises an exception if there's already a server on that port)
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<Paradox> i remember reading somewhere that |= or ||= did something unique
<Paradox> but i cant remember what it did
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<Paradox> anyone want to clue me in ?
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<hoelzro> Paradox: ||= doesn't call the setter if it wouldn't change, iirc
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<hoelzro> ex. if obj.foo is truthy, obj.foo ||= 1 is a no-op
<Paradox> ah
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<Paradox> yup, thats what it does
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<hoelzro> "The Ruby Programming Language" += 1
<hoelzro> it's really good about covering stuff like that
<bnagy> a=5; a||=5 => 3; a|=5 => 7
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<bnagy> sry a=3 at the start :/
<Paradox> pickaxe?
<Paradox> i have the pickaxe and did a search in it and couldnt find it
<bnagy> copy typing instead of copy pasting
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<bnagy> Paradox: you'll see it a lot for initializing ivars, unless they're already set
<Paradox> yeah
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<Paradox> its the same as herp = derp unless herp
<Paradox> right?
<bnagy> more or less
<bnagy> the return value is different
<Paradox> yeah, i can see that
<Paradox> ||= returns the val of the var, unless returns nil if its already set
<bnagy> yeah
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<shevy> "One of our explicit coding conventions is that non-static functions must be prefixed with the module name they belong to. This keeps us sane and helps prevent name collisions."
<shevy> C is weird
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<hoelzro> that's a pretty common convention in C
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<shevy> we could adopt it for ruby :)))
* Hanmac use namespace in his c(++)-gems
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<bnagy> shevy: I do use it in ruby - by not extending
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<shevy> hehe
<bnagy> means things like Digest and OpenSSL stuff gets long
<bnagy> but I'd much rather see wtf is going on
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<Paradox> Digest is already fairly verbose, heh
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<maasha> hello, do we have some standard math module to calculate the distance between two points in a plane?
<maasha> err surface
<maasha> sqrt( ( $x2 - $x1 ) ** 2 + ( $y2 - $y1 ) ** 2 );
<maasha> Hm, this is kinda unclear -> distance = Math.hypot(x2-x1,y2-y1)
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<apeiros_> maasha: Vector might
<apeiros_> (v1-v2).distance or something like that
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<the-newsman> hello
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<the-newsman> what does it mean in Regexp class to say (/\s+/)
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<chiel> the-newsman: matches whitespace, once or more.
<the-newsman> do u mean any count of whitespace ?
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<Paradox> yup
<Paradox> except 0
<Paradox> + means "one or more"
<Paradox> /a+/ would be a, aa, aaaaa, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<the-newsman> it took me long time to interpret this mathing in regexp
<the-newsman> it requires 20 pages to explain this Regexp
<the-newsman> wonderful !
<apeiros_> o0
<apeiros_> Paradox and chiel just explained it in 1 line…
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<chiel> :p
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<Paradox> /\s+/ is often used when you want to replace whitespace in a file with a single space
<Paradox> ie contents.gsub(/\s+/, "\s")
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<apeiros_> Paradox: you really write "\s" instead of " "?
<Paradox> useful when working with poorly made CSVs and whatnot
<Paradox> apeiros_, easier to see that its intentional
<chiel> \s also matches tabs
<Paradox> yup
<chiel> so it can be useful
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<bnagy> he meants in the replace
<apeiros_> if you have //m, it also matches \r, \n
<the-newsman> apeiros_ i spoke abt the full explination for Regexp
<Paradox> regex seems complex
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<Paradox> but it really is elegantly simple
<Paradox> goddamnit freenode
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<the-newsman> freenose is unstable
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<Paradox> you can do a lot of nice things
<Paradox> like looking for duplicate words in a string
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<Paradox> /(\W+)\1+/
<Paradox> erm
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<Paradox> replace the W with a w
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<Paradox> anyway goodnight
<the-newsman> nightie night man
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<hemanth> vectorshelve, hey
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<vectorshelve> hemanth: hai
<hemanth> vectorshelve, howz it going?
<vectorshelve> hemanth: what ? Life... ?? :)
<vectorshelve> hemanth: It's always been kinda.. roller coster... for me... :) hw abt you ?
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<hemanth> vectorshelve, more like a train
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<vectorshelve> hemanth: fast slow fast ? :D
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<banisterfiend`> hemanth: is it cold where u live during the winter
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<vectorshelve> hemanth: good post :)
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: no its hot during winter and cold during summer... strange but true
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<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: how far away do u live from hemanth?
<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: 5 hours
<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: curious to know how you asked abt this dispairty in climate ... was it accidental /
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<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: will you visit together soon, you two could dance together and then share a curry to regain your energy
<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: i actually didnt think you had seasons, i thought you just had hot season and then monsoon
<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: is that how you make up your days ? :D
<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: do you have monsoon?
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<hemanth> banisterfiend`, i'm waiting for monsoon
<banisterfiend`> hemanth: why is that?
<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: ofcourse... then where the hell do we get water from ? Such a stupid question -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsoon_of_Indian_subcontinent
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<hemanth> banisterfiend`, heh heh ^
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: the climate is refreshing then :)
<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: i thought you had lakes and rivers like most countries
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<hemanth> banisterfiend`, we do!
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<hemanth> India is a subcontinent
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: so where does the water in lakes and river get refilled once they dry out in evaporation during summer... ? :D
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: u need to brush up your basic enviroment and eco system basics and not just ruby... ruby will not fetch u a glass of water :P
<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: well it rains during summer/spring here too, in fact it almost rains as much then as in winter
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: thats coz u probably dont have a monsoon.. we do have it n thats when the major part of water is accumilated.. for agriculture and electricity and all
<Hanmac> banisterfiend` did you try my libarchive-ruby gem?
<banisterfiend`> Hanmac: compilation errors
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<Hanmac> ... yeah its a bit outdated ...
<vectorshelve> Hanmac: he is now more interested in India than gems ... :)
<banisterfiend`> Hanmac: what does it do?
<Hanmac> it can read/write archives ... zip, tar,gz, xz, ... and many
<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve, Hanmac: would u buy a t-shirt with this logo on it? https://dl.dropbox.com/u/26521875/pry%20stuff/t-shirt%20designs/Tshirt_Alt2b.jpeg
<banisterfiend`> vectorshelve: and if u can suggest improvements to it let me know
<banisterfiend`> Hanmac: ^
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: why not I would take it home.. if it's for free... :) dont have money with me ;(
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<vectorshelve> banisterfiend`: ??
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<vectorshelve> getting this error when I run rspec spec/ -> http://pastie.org/4186829 help appreciated
<chiel> l
<chiel> woops. :)
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<mneorr> I have a weird problem with rbenv: it doesn't list the ruby versions anymore :/
<mneorr> with `rbenv versions` . when I enter the .rbenv/versions, I see them there
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<vectorshelve> chiel: any idea ?
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<petoo> hi
<hoelzro> this is fun. apparently rdoc can't handle your code if you use macros for your module/class names
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<petoo> I am using a script to convert bugzilla data to redmine data I am getting these errors http://pastebin.com/AKcR3dMT
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<petoo> Can somebody tell me what's problem with it and how can I solve it, I don't understand ruby.
<petoo> and I have to use it to for the above reason
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<brendan`> first issue is permissions
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<brendan`> see: /usr/lib/ruby/vendor_ruby/bundler/runtime.rb:138: warning: Insecure world writable dir /var/lib in PATH, mode 040777
<brendan`> only a warning, but should be corrected
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<petoo> brendan`: /var/lib needs to made writable?
<hoelzro> wow, documenting C code with rdoc is *damn* frustrating.
<petoo> be*
<ekaleido> no
<brendan`> no petoo, its warning because it IS writable by world
<ekaleido> it IS writable by world, which is not so good
<brendan`> it shouldn't be 777 which is what it probably is
<brendan`> 755 or 775 is my guess as to what it should be
<petoo> ok , there shouldnt be any problem with it then
<petoo> what about the rest?
<petoo> it is giving error in tags, which seem to be alright to me
<petoo> they're Html tags
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<hoelzro> is it possible to document my gem entirely in a .rdoc file, without having to include any stubs of Ruby code?
<hoelzro> I'd still like the classes and methods to appear in the index, though
<taw> hi guys
<taw> i wrote this ruby library which remembers ruby 1.6 or maybe 1.4 even, and I just put it on github https://github.com/taw/libgmp-ruby
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<taw> and i'd like to turn it into a proper gem with proper building process
<taw> except i have only vague idea how to build gems and zero idea how to build binary gems
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<taw> so any assistance would be very much appreciated
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<testssssss> meh
<testssssss> meh meh meh
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<Gurparatp> Why does yard not collect information from class X with filename "x.rb" when there is also a directory named "X" with modules for that class?
<Gurparatp> My doc generated for that class only includes the documentation from the modules in the directory X, and nothing from the file x.rb.
<Gurparatp> Anyone on this?
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<davidcramer_> yo dudes -- how do I install a development version of a package
<davidcramer_> e.g. i have it locally, and i want to debug some problems, so how can i symlink it into the ruby env?
<davidcramer_> the equiv of pip install -e in python
<Gurparatp> see bundler
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<davidcramer_> is that my answer?
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<Gurpartap> yes
<davidcramer_> you are not very helpful
<ij> I saw an svg, which showed the way ruby looks up methods(which objects first, which later and so on) By searching what, could I find it?
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<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: cd projectx; mate Gemfile; bundle install --path .bundle; bundle exec <anything for this env>
<Gurpartap> bundle exec gem list
<Gurpartap> would be different from
<Gurpartap> gem lsit
<Gurpartap> s/lsit/list/
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: does that help?
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<davidcramer_> gimme a sec
<davidcramer_> i should tell you i dont know anything about ruby
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<davidcramer_> wait
<davidcramer_> how does that help me?
<Gurpartap> using a package has nothing to do with knowing ruby language ;)
<davidcramer_> i literally just want to symlink foo as a gem for this project
<davidcramer_> why is this so hard :(
<davidcramer_> should I not be doing this?
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: there's no symlinking in ruby world
<davidcramer_> so how do you generally develop a package
<davidcramer_> or debug, rather
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: if your particular project requires a gem, it's best to have it it's own gem folder
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: debug? you want to access source code?
<davidcramer_> well it requires the gem, and it pulls it down from git
<davidcramer_> but i basically want to run the local copy of that gem
<Gurpartap> bundle show <gemname>
<davidcramer_> so i can throw in some debug info
<Gurpartap> just edit the gem itself
<Gurpartap> see `bundle show <gemname>` for it's path in your system
<davidcramer_> ya i was hoping to just re-use the repo
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<Gurpartap> or gem which <gemname>
<davidcramer_> man
<davidcramer_> this is so much better in Python :)
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<banisterfiend> davidcramer_: what do u do in python?
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: not really. you're just more familiar with it
<Gurpartap> :)
<davidcramer_> you can literally symlink the package
<davidcramer_> pip is ~= gem in python
<davidcramer_> and it has a '-e' flag which means 'editable'
<davidcramer_> and itll symlink things
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: gem doesn't require that symlink step
<davidcramer_> so for me its like "pip install -e ." will symlink the current dir's lib into whatever environment is active
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<Gurpartap> you're already set to edit for debugging :)
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<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: well, you should read about bundle
<davidcramer_> ya i dug through all the help
<davidcramer_> but couldnt find something similar
<Gurpartap> it'll take some time to grasp things :)
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<Gurpartap> do you have a Gemfile in your project?
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<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: ^; if so, install bundler, and then cd to your project directory and `bundle install --path .bundle`.
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<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: this will install your project's required gems into myprojectdirectory/.bundle/....
<davidcramer_> anyways, the gem show is enough for now
<davidcelis> davidcramer_: there can be only one
<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: which is essentially the same as pip -e's symlinking, except that you have a full fledged local copy
<Gurpartap> anyone here good at yard?
<Gurpartap> yarddoc
<davidcramer_> now to figure out how the hell rails works
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<hoelzro> is there a way to tell the rdoc Rake task to use a custom parser subclass?
<hoelzro> RDoc::Parser::C doesn't seem to be able to handle my C code
<davidcelis> davidcramer_: #rubyonrails
<davidcramer_> well, unfortunately i was hoping to flush out a "bug" with this ruby lib, but it seems to work fine for me :(
<davidcramer_> is anyone using Sentry + Ruby client?
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<Gurpartap> davidcramer_: isn't that good?
<davidcramer_> Gurpartap, no :(
<davidcramer_> i was hoping there was some obvious problem and thats why people couldnt get things working
<davidcramer_> now my only response is "uhh, no clue"
<Hanmac> hoelzro: how do your code looks like? ... and do you give the rdoc your files? rdoc without files only parse rb files
<hoelzro> Hanmac: I do
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<hoelzro> I'm running rdoc -r -o doc -a -v keepass.c
<hoelzro> and I have documentation in my local copy
<hoelzro> but the parser doesn't pick up any of my modules, classes, or methods
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<hoelzro> probably because I use macros
<hoelzro> a lot.
<Hanmac> yeah the DATABASE_CLASS_NAME marco is the only problem
<davidcramer_> i need some guinea pigs so i can make this ruby lib better
<davidcramer_> who wants a better airbrake?
<hoelzro> Hanmac: I think my define_exception macro is probably not helping either
<hoelzro> or gen_reader
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<petoo> Ok old wine in new bottle
<petoo> why am I getting errors like this http://pastebin.com/AKcR3dMT
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<davidcramer_> thanks for the help all, im off
<hoelzro> I'm just surprised that rdoc doesn't seem to pick up /* Document-class: $CLASS */ if rb_define_class($CLASS) is not found in the file.
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<hoelzro> I like the Doxygen mentality, where it will try to find such things, but no problem if nothing is found
<kalleth> lmfao
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<mneorr> anyone can help me with rbenv?
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<mneorr> it looks messed up :/ ,. it's recognizing the local versions, but `rbenv versions` outputs nothing
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<rking> mneorr: 1) What's in $PATH? 2) How did you install the versions? 3) What do you mean by "it's recognizing the local versions"?
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<mneorr> let's start with 3 :)
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<mneorr> let's say I have an Octopress repo that uses 1.9.2-p290
<mneorr> running `ruby -v` outputs 1.9.2-p290
<mneorr> elsewhere i'm on 1.9.3
<mneorr> so i've discovered the problem today while trying out Heroku
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<mneorr> it said that it only runs on 1.9.2,. 2) I've installed the versions with ruby-build
<mneorr> so rbenv install 1.9.x
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<mneorr> and the $PATH says:
<mneorr> /Users/mneorr/Workspace/android-sdk-mac_86 3/tools:/usr/local/Cellar/rbenv/0.3.0/shims:/usr/local/Cellar/rbenv/0.3.0/bin:/Users/mneorr/.rbenv/shims:/Users/mneorr/.rbenv/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11/bin
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<mneorr> rking: if it helps, now I've installed rc1 with `rbenv install` and it's showing up in `rbenv versions` .,. weird
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<bnagy> failure to rbenv rehash?
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<mneorr> bnagy: did rehash many times, doesn't help
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<D4T> whats the easiest way of generating xml in ruby?
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<mneorr> hm, maybe this might be causing the issue,. this is what the /usr/bin/ruby points to
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<mneorr> ruby -> ../../System/Library/Frameworks/Ruby.framework/Versions/Current/usr/bin/ruby
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<ramblex> D4T: nokogiri has an XML builder
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<D4T> ramblex: ok thanks :)
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<rking> mneorr: One weird thing is you seem to have rbenv installed to /usr/local/Cellar and also ~/.rbenv
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<rking> mneorr: /usr/bin/ruby can do whatever it wants. /usr/bin comes after your rbenv $PATH components.
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<mneorr> rking:
<mneorr> rking: okay, got it,. what's about with this Cellar?
<bnagy> mneorr: try which ruby when you're having the problem
<rking> mneorr: Look at your $PATH.
<bnagy> also see if any of those off Cellar things are symlinks to usr bin
<bnagy> s/off/odd
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<mneorr> hm,. i'm trying to figure out what's the cellar thing
<mneorr> it seems like it's from homebrew (OSX)
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<mneorr> bnagy: ➜ which ruby ~
<mneorr> ruby: aliased to bundled_ruby
<rking> Hehe, there's another odd thing right there.
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<rking> mneorr: You should also install rvm just so your setup can be 100% odd.
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<mneorr> rking: LD
<mneorr> :D
<rking> Locally and globally.
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<mneorr> i'm not sure if you've heard for the RubyMotion (ruby for iOS), .. not sure if that might caused it
<rking> mneorr: You're using OMZ.
<rking> mneorr: A fun exercise: /join #zsh and tell them you're using OMZ and see what they think of it. =D
<mneorr> yeah, i'm uzing OMZ :)
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<rking> If you disable the bundler plugin things should start to work better, and if you disable all of OMZ everything will start to work better.
<rking> OMZ is valuable as a thing to look at for ideas, but not to actually run.
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<mneorr> ohh... i see rking you're a genius :D I've enabled exactly bundler and 2-3 plugins before a couple of days
<rking> No, I'm on OMZenius. Seriously, ask around #zsh to see what they think of it. =)
<rking> I don't know why, fundamentally, it's so problematic. It might be that they're biting off more than anyone could reasonably chew (due to OS differences, zsh version differences, etc.)
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<mneorr> rking: got it
<mneorr> rking: btw, what's the bundler plugin about?
<mneorr> i've enabled it just because i could :D
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<mneorr> andddd.. the problem was rbenv plugin for OMZ
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<rking> My assumption is that it looks for the presence of a Gemfile and runs ruby-related commands prefixed with "bundle exec", but I'm only guessing.
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<rking> Also creates shell aliases so you don't have to type "bundle exec" before most common ruby commands when you are in a directory with a Gemfile. Here is a list of commands it does this for: annotate cap capify cucumber ey foreman guard heroku middleman nanoc rackup rainbows rails rake rspec ruby shotgun spec spork thin thor unicorn unicorn_rails
<rking> ^ From the docs.
<mneorr> thx
<mneorr> I guess that's a bit too much info for now :)
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<xiphiasx_> i doubt it
<xiphiasx_> but can rake be used for projects in different languages
<xiphiasx_> i.e. C++
<mneorr> rking: I'm a iOS /OBJc dev, and a wannabe Ruby dev
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<rking> xiphiasx_: Yeah but it checks for Gemfile first.
<xiphiasx_> figures
<rking> It's not a bad set of aliases, maybe.
<xiphiasx_> i don't like cmake and i most certainly don't like autotools
<xiphiasx_> heh
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<rking> By "it" I mean the alias. If you were using rake to build something totally unrelated to Ruby, you wouldn't have a Gemfile
<xiphiasx_> ah
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<dekroning> does MiniTest/spec also have contexts blocks? I can't get it to work, I do remember reading something about it, however can't seem to find it anymore
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<Gurpartap> Can a Struct have keys with a question mark?
<Gurpartap> X = Struct.new(:a, :b?); X.new(1,true) => #<struct X a=1, :b?=true>
<Gurpartap> `a` becomes accessible, however, `b?` doesn't
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<apeiros_> Gurpartap: sounds like you answered your own question
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<apeiros_> you can do Struct.new(:a, :b) do alias b? b end
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<Gurpartap> apeiros_: thank you! :)
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<lectrick> whoa, haskell and erlang people really don't like ruby, eh?
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* lectrick loves ruby, and unfortunately it may have to be pried from his cold dead fingers
<xclite> letrick: They're jealous of our amazing String manipulation tools.
<lectrick> type checking to reduce runtime errors even more than thorough testing can do? sigh.
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<lectrick> someone was trying to show off Elm and I lost interest here http://elm-lang.org/edit/examples/Intermediate/Form.elm as soon as I saw "castStringToJSString"
<lectrick> i was like ewww, come on, even strings aren't safe
<lectrick> now they're ragefacing at me
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<hoelzro> lectrick: what makes you say that?
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<hoelzro> lectrick: what do you mean by "strings aren't safe?"
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<lectrick> hoelzro: just having heated discussions with a couple of coworkers who think they are "beyond" ruby and argue that complex systems need more type checking to stay runtime error tolerant. There's actually a paper out there on it which unfortunately makes some good points
<lectrick> hoelzro: I was joking that if Elm can't even deal with auto conversion of javascript strings to elm strings, it's already too much work for me lol
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<hoelzro> hmm
<hoelzro> I'm just curious because I happen to find languages like Haskell fascinating =)
<lectrick> ^^ that paper
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<lectrick> He used Haskell and translated actual code bases from Python to Haskell (and their unit tests) and discovered a number of edge cases that the unit tests would fail to discover
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<lectrick> For me it is something noteworthy but I'm not about to jump ship
<hoelzro> I don't think the important thing is "jumping ship"
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<lectrick> well, apply the right tool to the job then I guess
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<hoelzro> I think the important thing about Haskell and its ilk is to introduce yourself to a new way of thinking about problems, as well as to add a new tool to your toolbox
<hoelzro> exactly
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<lectrick> that's arguably the most important thing about any language. the interaction between the language and the way you think about things to solve using that language. Actually, that's a limitation of human language, too
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<lectrick> i heard an interesting radiolab the other day, about a progressive degeneration of the frontal cortex language center and it resulted in an explosion of creativity (before eventual death). Another odd side effect of it is a compulsive repetition. They actually think Ravel was suffering from it when he wrote Bolero
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<lectrick> Made me really worry about how always having to think within the tools we have available can put a box around our... oh crap i'm restating "think outside the box"
<lectrick> Here is another related thing related to shutting off parts of your "rigid brain" in order to let new ideas flow: http://www.creativitypost.com/science/brain_stimulation_makes_the_impossible_problem_solvable
<lectrick> hoelzro: ^
<hoelzro> interesting
<hoelzro> I'll have to read that later =)
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<lectrick> here is the radiolab podcast about a disorder that has a similar effect: http://www.radiolab.org/blogs/radiolab-blog/2012/jun/18/unraveling-bolero/
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<Quetza> Hi, is there a way to stop gem/bundle from installing binary gems and always build from source?
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<Tasser> Quetza, gems are always source iirc?
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<orlandodelaguila> hello
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<orlandodelaguila> guys one question, is there any gem that do website mirroring, like using wget -m to download a complete website?
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<timeout> My newby ruby program is barfing on 'Köln'. Seems to be a uni-code problem...
<timeout> Anyway to get around this?
<timeout> I'm using the word as the value in a hash.
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<banisterfiend> timeout: use english, those other quirky european languages are dying out anyway
<banisterfiend> :P
<timeout> :D
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<billy_ran_away> Can anyone tell me if they something wrong with this? http://pastie.org/4187967
<timeout> That's very twoo..
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<timeout> banisterfiend: but seriously...
<billy_ran_away> My method key value pairs in the 3rd and 4th array elements seem to be disappearing...
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<hoelzro> timeout: what version of Ruby are you using?
<hoelzro> may we see the source code of your script?
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<timeout> hoelzro: 1.9.3, so as far as I can see via google, there should be no problem, right>
<timeout> But changing to Koeln, is working...
<hoelzro> timeout: what kind of error do you see?
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<timeout> ./bundesliga.rb:66: invalid multibyte char (US-ASCII)
<timeout> ^^
<timeout> ./bundesliga.rb:66: syntax error, unexpected $end, expecting '}' :FCN => '1.FC Nürnberg',
<timeout> ^^
<hoelzro> ok
<timeout> So, it seems pretty sure.
<hoelzro> you'll need to set your file's encoding, I believe
<timeout> hoelzro: ok, great, can do!
<timeout> but actually, I should be using utf8 by default, so that's strange.
<hoelzro> granted, I *think* this should work
<hoelzro> I haven't done any work with Unicode and Ruby yet.
<aszurom> if I have an array set up like this: array[index]["ID","Name","Age"] and I want to know the index values of all elements where "Age" == 30, is there an easier way to do that than mapping over the whole array and building a new array on an if-then condition?
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<timeout> hoelzro: you are the King!! Thanks a lot.
<timeout> All is good in the world :D
<hoelzro> timeout: no, I'm the Newb.
<hoelzro> =)
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<timeout> hoelzro: well, that makes two of us. Great find, though.
<hoelzro> timeout: I learned it from "The Ruby Programming Language"
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<hoelzro> which I constantly plug for being a great and extremely thorough overview of Ruby 1.8 and 1.9
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<hoelzro> aszurom: so it's an array of hashes?
<hoelzro> or an array of arrays?
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<aszurom> array of arrays, as read in by a csv
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<hoelzro> aszurom: ok, so the third element in each second level array is [ $id, $name, $age ]?
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<aszurom> yeah, so I want to say "return a list of the first dimension where the 3rd element in the 2nd dimension = "30"
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<aszurom> [0][443,Joe,30]
<aszurom> so that's true, and 0 would be in the list returned
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<Quetza> Tasser: there seems to be a bunch of binary gems too, and if they exist then they get fetched instead of the source. Such as libv8-3.3.10.4-x86-darwin-10. I don't want the pre-built darwin one, I want the source and to have it compiled
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<aszurom> I feel like this has to be a built in method
<hoelzro> aszurom: rows.select { |row| row[2] == '30' }
<canton7> aszurom, one way is array.each_with_index.select{ |e,i| e[2] == '30' }.map(&:last), but there must be a better way...
<aszurom> I'm just too inexperienced to know it
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<canton7> hoelzro, he wants the indexes of those rows
<hoelzro> ah
<hoelzro> I didn't catch that, thanks!
<ramblex> aszurom: could you filter the array as you build it? rather than building it and then filtering it
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<aszurom> it's built by reading in a CSV file
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<aszurom> array = CSV.read(filename)
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<daed> i just attempted an svn checkout
<daed> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<daed> never seen that one before.
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<ij> Does adding methods to String significantly slows down a large project.
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<mdszy> ij: I don't think it would.
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<keyvan> hi how can i remove my gem from rubygems?
<keyvan> i realized it is redundant and unnecessary
<keyvan> i would hate to clutter rubygems...
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<mdszy> keyvan: I don't think you can.
<keyvan> :(
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<keyvan> thanks for quick reply
<mdszy> keyvan: Ha, there are so many gems that are old and not developed anymore.
<mdszy> So I wouldn't worry about it.
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<keyvan> ok thanks mdszy
<mdszy> No problem.
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<ramblex> keyvan: I thought you could yank a gem from rubygems
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<keyvan> ramblex: if you can it's not immediately obvious how, although i havent dug around the FAQ and such
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<keyvan> ah thanks man
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<keyvan> woohoo, yanked!
<keyvan> so easy
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<ij> What would you call a method that .gsubs strings(/[_- ]/, "%") for SQL?
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<Tasser> a failed escape attempt
<blazes816> badum, TISH!
<mdszy> haha
<ij> ...
<ij> It's for damn autocompletes.
<ij> All over the place.
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<jslvk> i need to remove escape characters from a string, s.gsub("\\\\", "") for example, is still returning s = "\""
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<ij> What does def -@ do?
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<burgestrand> ij: defines the unary -
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<ij> burgestrand: Can haz an example?
<burgestrand> ij: one coming up!
<bricker88> jslvk: try .gsub(/\\\\/, "")
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<jslvk> bricker88: that sill gives me "\"" in irb
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<jslvk> excel escapes any embedded quotations, but ofcourse SQL is complaining about the "\" token
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<ij> Oooh, nice.
<ij> Damn neat.
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<burgestrand> ij: keep in mind, it’s not the same method as: alien - cow
<ij> Yeah, got that. :]
<burgestrand> :)
* ij bows.
<jslvk> bricker88: does .gsub(/\\\\/, "") work for you, have you tried it?
<burgestrand> ij: also, if you name the method using symbols you get this, :-@
<burgestrand> ij: it’s what you’ll look like if you abuse this too much
<burgestrand> D:
<ij> ;-D
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<bricker88> jslvk: Give me an example string and I'll try it out
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<jslvk> bricker88: it looks like an escaped quotation mark inside the string so something like "Johnny \"Bubba\" Jones"
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<jslvk> or if i could remove the whole \" expression
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<bricker88> jslvk: Are you trying to remove two slashes in a row, or just one?
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<jslvk> just one slash
<jslvk> bricker88: they are escape characters embedded in a string
<bricker88> jslvk: I see the problem, the escape is not actually part of the string I think. What if you just do `print s`, do you still see the backslashes?
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<jslvk> print s evaluates as nil
<jslvk> bricker88:
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<bricker88> I mean print whatever your string is
<jslvk> oh yeah
<Tasser> anyone got flushing n shit working with IO.popen?
<jslvk> bricker88: it's a double quote "
<jslvk> so perhaps just
<jslvk> replace quotations
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<jslvk> and hope i don't break anything else
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<ij> I made a Thread.new, but it looks like it's running only when I try to poke it in irb or I .join it, why's that?
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<Mon_Ouie> Ruby has a GIL, even its native threads aren't actually run in parallel — So, most likely your thread is pretty much always blocked by the main thread in IRB
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<shevy> I am on weechat! you all have different colours.... Mon_Ouie is green... ij is pinkish-violet...
<shevy> ij threads are lazy, with .join they become less lazy :P
<ij> Mon_Ouie: Oh, right.
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<ij> I thought it'd at least stop my thread while after a while.
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<ij> So gaay.
<ij> Fucking MRI.
<ij> How can I do magic now?
<Mon_Ouie> With a wand?
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<ij> My lappy is my wand.
<shevy> magic lies in the eye of the beholder
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<ij> True that.
<shevy> you can kill a thread though, via Thread.kill I think
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<ij> YAY! At least I can kill it properly.
<ij> What a blessing ruby has Thread.kill
<shevy> hmm or perhaps Thread.stop and Thread.exit
<ij> kill, kill
<ij> I checked.
<shevy> dunno... I think I used it only once or twice
<shevy> I use .join almost always when I use threads however
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<shevy> fibers I have not understood yet though
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<ij> I wanted to create a slime-like server that'd reload, but not gonna happen.
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<Mon_Ouie> Thread#kill, Thread#exit and Thread#terminate all exist
<shevy> hmm why not?
<shevy> I mean, if it is too much work I can understand :)
<ij> No, because the shell blocks all the time.
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<ij> I want it asynchronous.
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<Mon_Ouie> Using non-blocking IO?
<ij> what?
<Mon_Ouie> Use IO.select to know when there's something to read and do everything in a single thread
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<ij> Is pry doing that?
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<shevy> hmm
<Mon_Ouie> No, Pry is pretty much IO-agnostic
<Mon_Ouie> It just has an arbitrary input object and calls readline/gets on it
<ij> Is the pry creator here?
<Mon_Ouie> banisterfiend: ^
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<Mon_Ouie> I did write some code in Pry too ;)
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<ij> Would it be hard to make it io.select?
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<Mon_Ouie> Depends on what you're trying to accomplish in the end, but it might be as easy as defining an Input#readline method that uses IO.select to read from stdin and other IOs at the same time
<ij> Hmm, that would work.
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<bikr> Anyone in here familiar with the AWS SDK?? Tried joining #aws but got namespaced erg..
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<Tasser> gets blocks until a \n is found - can I specify which char to look for?
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<shevy> hmm that would be cool to have Tasser
<shevy> but I dont think with plain gets one can redefine what char to look... lemme look at the source
<shevy> The optional argument specifies the record separator.
<mdszy> Tasser: I think you can. It's one of those funky Ruby short variables. I'll check.
<shevy> indeed
<shevy> gets(sep=$/)
<mdszy> or you can set $/
<mdszy> yep
<shevy> I never tried that
<mdszy> if you change the value of $/ it'll do the same as if you supplied an argument to gets.
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<shevy> ok odd
<Tasser> cool
<shevy> it just seems to chop away the character assigned to $/
<shevy> first occurence of said character found is used, rest of the input discarded
<Tasser> looking for the \x0 so that won't matter
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<allan_hills> let's say i'm writing a unit test for a module all of whose methods are private or protected. is there some way i can avoid calling send() for everything i want to test?
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<Spooner> You could instance_eval it?
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<fowl> allan_hills, you could also call the methods with obj.method(:meth).call but that is dumb and inadvisable
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<fowl> i find your question interesting, you are looking for a way to send messages to a caller, but you don't like typing the word 'send'
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<allan_hills> i thoguht about instance_eval, Spooner, but i'm not sure that would be any easier without writing one giant spec with lots of expectations
<fowl> quite the predicament
<Spooner> allan hills, I suppose not.
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<allan_hills> as an aside, how do i mute someone? `/ignore nick` ?
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<mdszy> allan_hills: yep
<allan_hills> cool ty
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<mdszy> I tend to avoid it, though. One-sided conversations in channels are horribly annoying.
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<Jackneill> how can i get the memory usage? is there a built-in func for that? in google i only found links with memory leaks and etc.
<apeiros_> I use ps for that
<apeiros_> got a little method that makes it nicer… moment…
<Jackneill> yeah but it's not a built-in func, and works in linux mac, but not in win
<Jackneill> ok thx
<Tasser> Jackneill, generally, I use htop ;-)
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<Tasser> Jackneill, just profile it
<Jackneill> i dont know what you mean tasser: im just getting started with ruby i only know the basics sorry :(
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<Tasser> Jackneill, htop is a process viewer
<apeiros_> Jackneill: https://gist.github.com/3034844
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<Jackneill> apeiros_, thanks
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<apeiros_> Jackneill: this will most likely not work on windows, though
<Jackneill> tasser: ok, but if i make a ruby irc bot, and make a cmd that puts the memory usage htop doesnt solve my problem :)
<Jackneill> yes :(
<Jackneill> but anyway thanks
<apeiros_> oh, so you're on windows then?
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<Jackneill> apeiros_, im on linux currently
<Jackneill> but i want to make it work on windows too
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<Jackneill> https://github.com/Jackneill/Tabornok im just making a bit for learning purposes
<shevy> Jackneill: you probably have to use the windows bindings
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<Jackneill> win bindings for what?
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<shevy> or try result = `systeminfo` on windows
<shevy> Jackneill: you can call any windows API via ruby if you use that ... winapi thing
<shevy> Win32API.new
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<Jackneill> shevy thanks :)
<shevy> mouse_position = Win32API.new("user32", "GetCursorPos", ['P'], 'V'); lpPoint = " " * 8; mouse_position.Call(lpPoint); x, y = lpPoint.unpack("LL")
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<shevy> it's ugly though :\
<shevy> damn verbose
<Agis__> I'm trying to install ruby gems and I get this error on Windows (Greek) http://pastie.org/4188804
<Agis__> any ideas?
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<shevy> no idea. I hate Encoding
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<Gneiss> Agis__: I can fix that!
<Gneiss> First, download a fedora ISO!
<shevy> I think this is greek keyboard encoding (codepage) problem on windows
<shevy> apeiros_: that's a nice method :)
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<Gneiss> Agis__: http://rubyinstaller.org/
<Gneiss> did you try that yet?
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<Agis__> yes and rails installer also
<Gneiss> oh okay
<Gneiss> No success?
<Agis__> same error
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<Gneiss> hmm
<shevy> yeah I think other greek keyboard users have had similar problems
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<Gneiss> maybe
<Gneiss> What about ironruby XD
<Gneiss> or Jruby?
<headius> yay jruby
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<Gneiss> yay!
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<manizzle_> w
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<Gurpartap> what's so special about jruby?
<stephenjudkins> Gurpartap: it has unicorns and other magickal beings
<shevy> Gurpartap: that you can tap into all java things
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<shevy> now if java wouldn't be such a verbose language ... ... ...
<Gurpartap> ah like we can tap into C in mri, etc?
<shevy> yeah, via 'dl' I think
<shevy> or ffi
<shevy> require 'dl/import'
<Gurpartap> and jruby scripts can't tap into C directly as such?
<stephenjudkins> shevy: do not use dl, ever. use FFI
<shevy> dlload "libc-2.3.6.so"
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<stephenjudkins> it is better, faster, and works across all Ruby implementations.
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<shevy> Gurpartap: no idea if you can call dl or ffi from within jruby .rb scripts
<stephenjudkins> shevy, Gurpartap : ffi works in JRuby, just as it does in every other Ruby implementation
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<Gurpartap> stephenjudkins: i see
<stephenjudkins> Gurpartap: JRuby has a lot of advantages. it's probably the fastest now (and will be even faster with JRuby 1.7 / JVM 7 soon)
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<Gurpartap> o_O
<stephenjudkins> it offers very good interoperability with java libraries. (which is much safer and easier than dealing with C libraries, because they are both garbage-collected languages without many undefined behaviors)
<stephenjudkins> it is the only ruby implementation where it's possible to utilize threads across multiple cores, since all others have GIL
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<stephenjudkins> anyways: JRuby = a unicorn
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<Gurpartap> how about objective-c (i know it's just a wrapper around C)?
* Hanmac prefers his gems in c++
<Gurpartap> it provides garbage collection and all that
<Gurpartap> i think the biggest deal breaker in adopting objective c outside apple world is Cocoa.framework/GNUStep
<Gurpartap> unless apple made that opensource, there isn't much trust in the communities to adopt GNUStep
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<Gurpartap> anyways
<Gneiss> Who the hell is going to use GNUStep?
<Gneiss> seriously guys.
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<fowl> Gurpartap, you're forgetting about the majority of pc owners who dont have a mac
<Gurpartap> fowl: objective c is a language
<Gurpartap> fowl: GNUStep is based on it, and hence platform independent
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<fowl> oh because obj c is really popular amongst linux devs
<fowl> right?
<Gneiss> LOL, the problem is, no one uses objc outside of apple
<Gurpartap> gcc has objective c built in
<Gneiss> No absolutely not
<Gneiss> It's been a standard for a LONG time.
<Gurpartap> it was never the point :)
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<Gneiss> But people tend to use GTK/Qt or something of the sort
<Gurpartap> ah you mean for the UI etc
<joel> It seems like when I call thread.current['brown'] = {'crayon' => 'crayola' } I don't get the hash back, thoughts? can I only return a value?
<Gurpartap> that's not what i meant
<Gurpartap> GNUStep also provides basic data type objects like NSArray, NSDictionary
<Tasser> joel, huh?
<Gurpartap> which isn't built-in into objective-c
<fowl> yes, apple and their National Socialist classes
<joel> Tasser: ?
<fowl> NSAryan, etc
<Tasser> joel, example script plz
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<joel> Tasser: docs seem to indicate any object is fine :\
<Tasser> huh
<Gurpartap> fowl: it works
<teratoma> im not sure why you would go through the misery of objective c if you werent developing ios stuff
<otters> objective-C is really nice though
<teratoma> i guess
<Gurpartap> teratoma: it's a useful declarative syntax
<Gurpartap> i really like it
<Gurpartap> very explicit
<teratoma> and you use this to develop non IOS stuff?
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<Gurpartap> and after all, it's all c too
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<Gurpartap> teratoma: definitely possible but there isn't much interest as apparent
<mjb2k> teratoma: why not use Obj-C for Mac OS X stuff?
<fowl> Minus, This is an INSTANCE method! Plus, this is my CLASS method! I"M GOIN COOCOO FOR OBJ-C PUFFS!
<teratoma> you should totally use obj-c for mac osx/ios stuff!
<mjb2k> oh I thought you were just saying iOS
<fowl> @interface MyButt : YourButt
<fowl> @end
<teratoma> mac osx and ios will be the same thing some day
<shevy> obj-c is damn verbose
<fowl> os x is the same thing as a broken TV
<otters> that's the point
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<mjb2k> NO! well yeah probably, but I dread the day
<Gurpartap> what shevy and otters said.
<teratoma> what do you mean probably
<shevy> I hated writing interface or implementation stuff or whatever was the name
<fowl> but nobody will admit it, because they all paid too much for it and feel like a fool
<teratoma> everything they're doing points to that direction
<otters> Lion was only $30
<teratoma> it is nice they share the LLVM development
<shevy> otters: what about hardware :)
<fowl> hi i just spent $2,000 on a tower because it was called "THE PRO"
<fowl> what games can i play on it? uh.. none?
<fowl> I got kewl screensavers
<shevy> teratoma: yeah... until they TAKE OVER AND SEIZE CONTROL
<shevy> iWorldRUs
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<otters> I thought we were talking about OSX vs iOS
<otters> not the computer hardware
<teratoma> that would be funny
<dcope> fowl: "os x is a broken tv" ?
<teratoma> licensed LLVM
<Gurpartap> i thought we were talking about objcruby
<fowl> dcope, u heard
<teratoma> linux will be illegal
<Gurpartap> vs jruby
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<daed> objcruby is a thing?
<dcope> fowl: wat.
<anothervenue> fowl: No one buys macs for gaming.
<mjb2k> fowl: do you actually have any valid criticisms, or just an emotional rant?
<shevy> teratoma: dont think so, got too much traction already
<Gurpartap> daed: i pitched the wish
<otters> making fun of mac users for not having games is like making fun of hairstylists for not having hazmat suits
<teratoma> microsoft will declare linux to be malware, and linux wont boot on anything using secureboot
<shevy> pinched the bish???
<otters> you're looking in the wrong place
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<anothervenue> otters: lol
<dcope> fowl: what do you mean a broken tv
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<shevy> teratoma: nah, they tried that many years ago with palladio or whatever was the name already
<fowl> anothervenue, obviously, that was an answer to a question that was omitted from the hypothetical conversation, it was implied, try to re-read it and stop being so n-dimensional
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<shevy> windows is in a sinkhole, win 8 looks like plain HTML5 ... they no longer innovate, they copy and paste
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<Gurpartap> my imac has played pretty much every game i threw at it
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<Gurpartap> tf2, l4d2, cod, wic
<otters> Gurpartap: you're getting in the way of our anti-mac emotional arguments
<otters> stop
<Gurpartap> :p
<Gurpartap> aight
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<otters> is TF2 fun?
<shevy> but they tried that many years ago too. it's like throwing a red herring and hoping that someone catches it
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<Gurpartap> otters: i have mixed reactions to that question, but i have been playing since 2007 now
<otters> counts for something
<anothervenue> I don't think OSX and iOS will be the same thing, they are just moving some of the conventions of interface over to OSX, which makes total sense, seeing as how Apple has been developing the Desktop Metaphor since 1985.
<Gurpartap> i do take a few months off occasionally though
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<anothervenue> Touch screen stuff lends itself to that abstraction much more than the mouse.
<Gurpartap> around a little over 600 hours of game play right now
<fowl> who cares? none of you will make it past december 21st
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<teratoma> mac and tablet and iphone will just be giant App Store portals
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<anothervenue> so? Thats the "digital distribution revolution"
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<teratoma> i rebel
<shevy> the whole app store model seems like a big scam idea
<shevy> with the main drug dealer being whoever controls it
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<anothervenue> Thats pretty much every commercial platform ever.
<anothervenue> Same thing, new form.
<shevy> dunno, it seems MUCH more controlled by just a few companies than before
<dcope> shevy: please wait whie i put on my tinfoil hat
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<shevy> dcope: wont help you
<dcope> shevy: how is it scam?
<dcope> it's a centralized distribution place?
<shevy> and you pay for the apps
<dcope> it makes it easier for tards to find and manage software
<dcope> shevy: there are free apps...
<shevy> how can you choose outside from it?
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<anothervenue> Open your browser and look for software?
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<anothervenue> brew install foo?
<dcope> what anothervenue said
<dcope> other package managers and distribution places
<shevy> because average joe will do that :P
<dcope> shevy: uh
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<dcope> the average joe uses the app store because that's all they know how to
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<anothervenue> Also, its easy.
<shevy> yeah
<shevy> yeah
<dcope> i don't see the scam in this?
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<anothervenue> serious
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<mjb2k> the App Store is really just a commercialized version of every Linux distros' package repository
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<shevy> oh dont get me started on those linux distributions...
<Tasser> mjb2k, and without dependency resolution ^^
<anothervenue> Tasser: because the dependency is Cocoa, and you already have them all.
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<mjb2k> the apps are standalone, no dependency resolution needed
<anothervenue> You don't need dependency resolution if you aren't depending on it. QtKit? Nah, Cocoa.
<dcope> lol
<shevy> now that would be cool - have an app in app store to replace the OS with another one, on click event
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<anothervenue> Why would you do that?
<anothervenue> Seems overtly obtuse.
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<Gurpartap> bluepill or god?
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<shevy> freedom or slavery?
<anothervenue> Drama queen.
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<shevy> Slave worker.
<dcope> can't tell if shevy is this stupid or if shevy is a troll
<anothervenue> lulz
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* dcope hopes it's just a troll
<anothervenue> I dunno, I'm thinking a combo
<shevy> I just adjust to you guys.
<Hanmac> dcope you will notic a troll when you see them ... banister is some kind of it :P
<shevy> Can't help to downgrade. :(
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<shevy> banister just posts those awful links
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<shevy> when you ignore these, it's ok
<shevy> and never click on them!
<anothervenue> I'm sending Apple drones to turn your BSD box into a Hackintosh.
<davidcelis> banister likes to post a lot of links about something called pry
<Hanmac> shevy it like he has a teaching factor ... he teach you "dont click on untrusted links"
<algldl> anyone know why `Thread.new { sleep 60 }.join` takes 50% cpu on ubuntu 12.04 but none on a macos box?
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<algldl> with ruby 1.8
<algldl> mri
<aszurom> so if I don't want to drop $100 on Rubymine and I want a noob friendly editor I can use across OSX, Win, and Linux which hopefully has highighting, some autosense, and can execute the script in a debug window... what choices have I got?
<Gurpartap> across?
<Gurpartap> why?
<aszurom> and VIM ain't it
<Gurpartap> choose the best for each platform
<Gurpartap> try sublime text 2
<Gurpartap> it didnt cut over textmate for though
<anothervenue> Vim
<davidcelis> Azure: Sublime Text 2
<Gurpartap> not even chocolat
<aszurom> yeah, I use a mac at work, I have windows in my office, and linux in the living room
<davidcelis> aszurom: Sublime Text 2. In vim-mode
<Azure> lol
<aszurom> does Sublime have any autosense about methods and stuff?
<Gurpartap> yes
<davidcelis> yes
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<aszurom> well then that's that
<aszurom> so what's vim-mode make it do?
<davidcelis> act like vim
<Gurpartap> lol
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<Gurpartap> aszurom: you dont need that if you dont know vim much
<aszurom> I know it enough to run from it
<aszurom> :-)
<davidcelis> you sure you don't just wanna learn vim?
<Gurpartap> or if you want to eventually learn it..
<shevy> aszurom: hmm that's quite a lot of features... try sublime though. or geany and bluefish, but I dont think they have all the features you want
<aszurom> I think while I'm trying to learn a language, trying to learn a whole new editor that in weird is going to suck
<aszurom> but I've messed with Sublime enough to see it's sorta like Textmate
<shevy> no worries. only one thing is sure in the eternal battle vim vs. emacs
<shevy> there will be two losers
<Gurpartap> i would just use gedit on ubuntu, textmate on mac
<Gurpartap> and just write code
<anothervenue> In the long run its easier to use vim.
<shevy> hmm gedit lacks a lot of features IMO
<davidcelis> then do sublime text 2
<Gurpartap> and vim in terminal
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<shevy> sublime I liked the most so far
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<davidcelis> ST2 works on all the operating systems
<shevy> and vim for fallback :P
<davidcelis> out of the editors that aren't vim, ST2 is definitely the best
<Gurpartap> it's all about writing basic code when you're just learning the language
<Gurpartap> IDE requirements grow with your knowledge
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<shevy> my ruby code is still very basic
<Gurpartap> and you eventually come up with your preferences over time
<Gurpartap> ST2 is python, jfyi
<davidcelis> shevy: you're in here all the time, you should be a pro by now
<shevy> davidcelis: dunno. I am very lazy...
<davidcelis> lol
<shevy> I want to reach the point where robots code for me
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<Gurpartap> ask siri
<Gurpartap> lol
<shevy> or at least a brain interface, typing is annoying when it is hot outside
<aszurom> instead of picking a nice ease-into-it project I decided to cut my ruby teeth on some csv and array-heavy transformations of data. Perhaps a bad idea
<shevy> yeah. csv isn't a lot of fun
<shevy> only XML is worse
<shevy> but working with arrays is a good idea
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<shevy> aszurom: you used another language before ruby?
<rambda> hey guys, having trouble with TCPSocket, keep getting an error with this code: http://pastebin.com/dYk7pXqF
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<aszurom> basic!
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<aszurom> well, I know a touch of perl, powershell, and not as much bash as I should
<aszurom> but Ruby is my first OOP focused attempt
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<rambda> I'm pulling in csv and taking an ip and port, trying to connect to that ip and port with TCPSocket...keeps saying sw.rb:14:in `initialize': getaddrinfo: Name or service not known (SocketError)
<aszurom> I'm having more process than syntax issues
<baphled> leave
<RubyPanther> arrays are easy in Ruby, all you have to worry about is your math
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<Gurpartap> aszurom: sinatra could be interesting start for you, perhaps?
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<aszurom> is that similar to DeanMartin?
<Gurpartap> are nested threads a bad idea?
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<mjb2k> nested threads sounds like huge nightmare potential
<ged> Gurpartap: What do you mean by "nested threads"?
<mjb2k> or more specifically, like more trouble than worth
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<mjb2k> (I'm assuming child threads that create more child threads)
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<apeiros_> there's no such thing
<aszurom> what I'm running into is what I wish they'd taught more of in comp sci classes in college... not how to code, but how to design and solve common data manipulations
<apeiros_> there's no hierarchy in threads
<Gurpartap> x = Thread.new { y= Thread.new { } /*sleep until timeout*/ Thread.kill}
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<shevy> aszurom: well it will come eventually when your brain has this "click" moment and everything makes sense, then your brain can try to "think in ruby", like you think in a foreign language when talking it well
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<Gurpartap> ged: ^
<shevy> and I think only practicing by writing code on your own can help here
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<mjb2k> even if there is no actual hierarchy to threads, I'm talking about what is creating them. I don't think you should "recursively" create threads. When managing multiple threads, it should be done from a centralized place
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<rambda> let me ask a different question: does Net::Telnet require a prompt? The super-secret equipment I'm connecting to doesn't respond in any way once a successful connection is made.
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<apeiros_> mjb2k: if you've a proper thread management facility, it doesn't matter whether you "recursively" create threads or not.
<apeiros_> a new thread will just be a new thread. its origin won't matter.
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<Gurpartap> mjb2k, apeiros_: i see. while it works well for now, i have put a todo in this gem.
<mjb2k> just the same as keeping all your database connection code in one place, I believe you should keep thread creation in one place, make maintenance easier, of course it depends on the specifics. Maybe there is an argument for apps which have a heavy use of threads
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<karlheinz1995_> Hi. Is there a limit to the length of file-paths Dir.glob returns?
<mjb2k> I haven't done anything with very heavy thread usage, so maybe that's just my limited view on the subject
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<karlheinz1995_> Because: I've got a path that is longer than 339 chars, and the end looks like this: "[...] zur Ent#3A70CB.mp4"
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<karlheinz1995_> If I shorten the filename (to 339 chars), I get: "[...] zur Entdeckungs.mp4"
<karlheinz1995_> OS X, Ruby 1.8.7 & 1.9.3
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<shevy> odd karlheinz1995_
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<shevy> karlheinz1995_: can you test if the same happens if your path has no ' ' in it? in the file name
<Gurpartap> how important is it to support 1.8.7 in a gem today? i know eventually everything moves to newer version, but is there an aspect keeping people to adopt 1.8.7 for new projects?
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<eam> karlheinz1995_: I'd suspect an encoding bug first. Perhaps by editing the filename you changed the encoding?
<shevy> could also be an encoding problem perhaps karlheinz1995_
<shevy> Gurpartap: a few people are still on 1.8.x. I think if it is possible to support 1.8.x then that should be done. if it is too much work, then it should be dropped
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<eam> Gurpartap: I'd say super important. 1.8 is probably the most widely used ruby version
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<ged> Gurpartap: I think it depends on if you anticipate your gem being used with existing code, or if people will likely be starting from scratch.
<rambda> Anyone know how to set up a Net::Telnet connection where the host you're connecting to doesn't issue a prompt on connection?
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<ged> rambda: Did you turn off 'telnetmode'? If it's just a raw socket, it might be trying to do telnet protocol negotiation.
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<rambda> ged: I'm not familiar with telnetmode (kinda new to Ruby)...the equipment I'm connecting to does telnet protocol negotiation, but on a non-standard port and only responds once "spoken" to
<Gurpartap> eam: i see
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<Xethron> ok.... now to do something I've NEVER done before in Ruby....
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* Xethron Googles Ruby XML Parser
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<rambda> ged: should I be setting telnetmode = false?
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<Gurpartap> ged: this one wouldn't be included in people's "apps". i'm writing a god/bluepill alternative while also learning various ruby aspects.
<nlew> Does anyone have a good solution for stripping invalid characters from a UTF-8 string?
<eam> nlew: how would you know which characters are invalid?
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<nlew> The best solutions I've found are encoding it to UTF-32 and back, or manually walking each character and replacing it.
<Gurpartap> ged: 1.9.2 offers pretty good Process#methods for forking/daemon management compared to 1.8.7's
<nlew> eam: valid_encoding? will tell you if there are invalid characters. But there's no good way to remove them.
<cirwin> nlew: string.force_encoding('BINARY').encode('utf-8', :invalid => :replace)
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<cirwin> unfortunately you can't just encode from utf-8 to utf-8 directly
<eam> nlew: I mean, how do you know where the error lies?
<cirwin> ruby helpfully optimises it away to a no-op
<Gurpartap> ged: While it isn't hard science to do in 1.8.7, i thought i'd keep it clean sticking to one version
<nlew> cirwin: That doesn't work correctly for multibyte characters :(
<cirwin> nlew: really?
<nlew> cirwin: Because encode treats 'BINARY' as single-byte characters, none of which have corresponding UTF-8 characters
<karlheinz1995_> This day just keeps getting better … I wanted to create a file with a long filename from inside a script and then Dir['*'] it … but:
<karlheinz1995_> path = File.expand_path ("~/" + ("a" * 256))
<karlheinz1995_> open(path, 'w') { |f| f.write("Hello World.") }
<nlew> eam: I don't, but obviously Ruby does, if it can tell me the string is invalid.
<aszurom> 1.8.7 is the version that ships with OSX 10.7. I kept running into things I wish it did that 1.9.3 just does
<cirwin> nlew: if your string is utf-8 it will convert it to urtf-8 bytes
<karlheinz1995_> crashes
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<cirwin> oh
<karlheinz1995_> but with *255 it creates the file
<cirwin> I'm wrong
<eam> nlew: telling that a string is invalid is easy -- determining which parts are illegal is more difficult
* cirwin goes to find the actual code he's sing
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<nlew> eam: Something like str.each_char.map { |c| c.valid_encoding? ? c : "\xEF\xBF\xBD"}.join
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<nlew> But with the non-UTF-8 Ruby 1.9 path, and then Ruby 1.8 path, I end up having three different sets of code. /sigh
<Xethron> Which gem is the best for parsing XML documents?
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<Xethron> I want to get simple text output from Wolfram
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<Xethron> so its not complex.... but nou ja... There seems to be quite a selection of XML gems out there
<eam> nlew: how do you split by character if you don't know the encoding :)
<ramblex> Xethron: nokogiri is decent
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<nlew> eam: I do know the encoding. It's UTF-8. It's just invalid. And Ruby understands the encoding. each_char will yield the individual bytes if they're not valid characters.
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<rambda> so this line is generating a NameError for me: host = Net::Telnet::new("Host" => ip,
<rambda> uninitialized constant Net (NameError)
<Tasser> rambda, require 'net/telnet'
<eam> nlew: my concern would be whether the unmappable code points / invalid encoding might contain data which should be part of another valid encoding
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<rambda> Tasser: thanks, I'll try that
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<eam> of course you could just delete it all
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<nlew> eam: Yeah this is only for strings which are claiming to be UTF-8. They probably really aren't, but if we don't know any better about what they actually are, all we can do is replace the bad characters.
<Tasser> nlew, input from?...
<nlew> This is to prepare the strings for JSONing
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<nlew> From a system that doesn't yet understand character encodings very well
<nlew> Only just now supporting Ruby 1.9 even :/
<nlew> So there are some places we read files, but don't actually know what encoding they are. So for now, just assume they're UTF-8, because that's as good as anything.
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<Tasser> nlew, there are some libs that can guess the encoding... but they're not 100%
<nlew> Tasser: Yeah, and it's also possible it could legitimately be an invalid string. So we have to handle the case regardless.
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<nlew> Tried using iconv, but it apparently doesn't handle 5- or 6-byte UTF-8 characters correctly. Which is to say, it considers them valid.
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<Tasser> they are?
<nlew> They were part of the initial specification, but removed
<Tasser> nlew, UTF-8 chars can be up to 6 bytes
<mads-> I remember reading a ruby tutorial which within the first chapters covered some twitter stuff. It was very example based. Anyone know what this site was called?
<Tasser> nlew, hups, didn't know that
<nlew> Ruby properly considers strings with 5- or 6-byte characters to be invalid UTF-8
<Tasser> mads-, doesn't matter, grab another ;-)
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<eam> nlew: is it that you really have utf8, or that you want to pass binary strings through JSON?
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<Gurpartap> can you make yardoc respect the order of documented methods/attributes?
<Gurpartap> currently it seems to have it's own random sort algo
<nlew> eam: Really both. We do need a better solution for this eventually, but trying to avoid having to use a format more complex than JSON. Might be better to just suck it up and deal with it now though.
<eam> base64 imo
<Gurpartap> (it's alphabetical i guess)
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<rambda> Tasser: thanks for your help. Do you know if Net::Telnet Hosts and Ports can be variables that were previously defined?
<Gurpartap> i think yard enforces alphabetical sort
<Tasser> rambda, who the heck still uses telnet? ^^
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<Gurpartap> :(
<nlew> Hmm but we don't actually know the intended encodings, and there's some Java on the other end. So even if we base64 encode them, when we decode them, they're going to be the default UTF-16, and have the invalid characters elided anyway. :/
<rambda> Tasser: telecom equipment manufacturers :)
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<rambda> actually around 1000 of those guys...
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<joel> anyone know what this means in english? /Users/joels/.rvm/rubies/ruby-1.9.3-p194/lib/ruby/site_ruby/1.9.1/rubygems/custom_require.rb:36:in `require': cannot load such file -- action_view/test_case/test_helper (LoadError)
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<joel> I'm calling ruby test_helper.rb inside my test directory
<mjb2k> cannot load such file
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<Tasser> joel, no in the $LOAD_PATH
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<joel> Tasser: new to ruby, not sure what I need to add to the load path, test_helper.rb ?
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<baphled> exit
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<Tasser> joel, nope
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<joel> Tasser: ?
<Tasser> joel, no
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<joel> Tasser: ok, so what do I need to do?
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<joel> anyone?
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<ged> joel: So you have a "require 'action_view/test_case/test_helper'" somewhere?
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<joel> ged: no, not at all, not in my tests.
<ged> joel: Like in your own test_helper?
<joel> ged: let me paste the stack trace.
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<shevy> joel: you can try require_relative instead, or add to $:
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<joel> line 5 is require 'test_help' in test_helper.rb
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<joel> shevy: $: is load path, yes?
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<shevy> yeah. it is an array. in irb, you can test what it has when you startup. pp $:
<ged> shevy: His own test_helper is loading fine.
<joel> $LOAD_PATH.unshift File.expand_path(File.join(File.dirname(__FILE__), "..", '.', "lib"))
<joel> I have that, I'm not sure what else Iw ould need?
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<ged> It's just requiring something else that has a missing dependency.
<joel> ruby 1.9.3, rails 2.3.11, I know both arn't up to date, sadly I'm trying to mimic an older project.
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<ged> joel: test_help is depending on something else that's missing. Maybe the rails channel would recognize that, but I haven't used Rails since 2006.
<shevy> so many layers on layers
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<joel> ged: gotchya, will try rails, thanks man.
<ged> Heh, that backtrace is a pretty concise example of why I gave up using Rails.
<rambda> ok, so now my problem with Net::Telnet is that the equipment does not send any sort of prompt upon connection...so my script just hangs waiting for the prompt
<rambda> any way to set it to not expect anything back?
<Synthead> is there a way in ruby that I can define a hash (h = Hash.new), then add elements to it without having to state h[:this] =, h[:that] = ... could I just do h += { ... } or something?
<ged> rambda: can you just send an EOL when you first connect?
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<joel> ged: yeah, I'm from a perl world, my head is spinning at that.
<ged> rambda: If you don't need the expectation stuff, is there still a reason to use Net::Telnet?
<joel> Synthead: you want to add one, or many keys to an existing hahs?
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<joel> Synthead: you probably want merge
<rambda> ged: I'm a novice scripter and had done this with perl and expect in the past, just trying to do it with ruby this time to learn something new...I do need to be able to expect responses to commands and parse them
<ged> Synthead: hash.merge!({ ... }) perhaps?
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<ged> Oh, joel already said that. :P
<Synthead> ged, joel: nice, good idea
<Synthead> thanks :)
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<rambda> ged: do you know of any way to set its prompt expectation to nil?
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<ged> rambda: I don't, but maybe try writing directly to the telnet object's #sock when it first connects?
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<ged> rambda: The problem is that you need to write something before your first expectation, right?
<rambda> ged: yes, that's correct
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<rambda> ged: #sock, how's that work?
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<ged> rambda: Then maybe something like: t = Net::Telnet.new( ... ); t.sock.print( "first command\r\n" ); t.waitfor( ... )
<stephenjudkins> joel: if no one has fixed your problem for you yet, the next thing you need to do--with all due respect--is to learn how to ask questions more constructively in IRC
<ged> rambda: It's the underlying TCPSocket object.
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<stephenjudkins> people are really helpful if you offer all the relevant context you can. what are you trying to load? how is your system configured? when do you get this LoadError?
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<joel> stephenjudkins: I provided all that detail, including a stack trace, but I got it solves over in rails, thanks anyways.
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<stephenjudkins> joel: guess I missed that. sorry.
<rambda> ged: thanks, I'll give that a shot
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<joel> stephenjudkins: yeah, I appreciate the lecture though.
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<stephenjudkins> joel: yeah, if you provided that don't take it personally, all I saw was somebody who was clearly floundering but not offering enough detail for me to offer any help. if people online made it easier for others to help each other out, it'd be a much more productive place.
<rambda> ged: is t then whatever name I gave my connection, such as host, host.sock.print?
<joel> stephenjudkins: I agree, people asking better questions, and providing better help, not lectures, is very important.
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<stephenjudkins> ok, sorry to try to help you.
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<ged> To be fair, he was just getting some vague general suggestions to what I thought was a pretty clear question.
<ged> I don't know the rails stack very well anymore, or I'd have tried to help earlier.
<ged> rambda: It's the Net::Telnet object.
<rambda> ged: ah, ok...threw an error: undefined local variable or method `t' for main:Object (NameError)
<ged> rambda: Did you paste code before? Sorry, I thought you had, but I can't find it now.
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<ged> rambda: Yeah, sorry, was just an example.
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<rambda> ged: yeah, let me try to find it again
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<ged> Heh, sorry.
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<rambda> ged: after reading about Net::Telnet, I had tried to do this with TCPSocket first because I thought Prompt would give me trouble: http://pastebin.com/dYk7pXqF
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<ged> rambda: Ah, okay, but you've since converted that to use Net::Telnet?
<Eiam> typically I see hashes like { "name" =>"team a", "property"=>"100" } but I keep wanting to make hashes like {"team a" => "100"} because the rest seems superfluous, esp if its just a single key:value
<rambda> ged: yeah, maybe I'll have to go back to raw socket though, considering I can't seem to get Net::Telnet to work without a prompt
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<Eiam> however, this leads to cases where I have to say in an .each {|item| item.keys.first or item.values.first} to get the data out
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<Eiam> is there some reason i shouldn't make hashes like that esp if its a single pair, and is there a better way to access the attributes?
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<ged> rambda: Well you can mix them both if you're careful. When you create a Net::Telnet object, you can access the TCPSocket under it via the .sock method.
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<rambda> ged: but the problem is still actually establishing that Net::Telnet connection, since it requires a prompt of some sort
<rambda> ged: the equipment I'm connecting to doesn't seem to send anything at all back, not even a space or new line
<ged> rambda: Right. One sec and I'll post a little example of what I mean.
<rambda> ged: ok, thanks for taking the time to help me out, man...much appreciated
<shevy> Eiam depends whether you need the information or not
<shevy> Eiam when you dont need the information, keeping a hash as simple as possible is the better thing
<Eiam> need in what sense
<Eiam> its just transitory data that I'm mutating again later to yet another format
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<Eiam> it just seems easier to consume in a basic hash like that, where both fields are important
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<Eiam> rather than "descriptor" => "important info"
<shevy> in your example you had more information in the original hash. in the second hash, information was lost ("name") is gone
<Eiam> right
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<invsblduck> sigh, the confusion of threads. i have some threading code that worked great with 1.8; seems to be giving me a lot of problems with 1.9. i know there was a change to 'native os threads' with 1.9, but i'm not sure what to do.
<Eiam> it seems self obvious to me, the name is the key. so why bother with the other part
<Eiam> shevy: okay, so next part, easier way to access those fields aside from .keys.first and values.first?
<Eiam> as I do feel a bit silly doing that
<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: what exactly is the issue?
<invsblduck> what's the word on the street around here w/r/t ruby threads? thanks if you have any opinions
<shevy> Eiam .keys will give you all keys of your hash, in array form
<Eiam> shevy: right
<shevy> you can iterate over a hash via .each_pair { |key, value]
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<Eiam> ahh
<shevy> I am not sure what easier way you want to have, if you need all keys anyway
<Eiam> okay right
<Eiam> well its only a single key
<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: i'm not exactly sure, but things seem to be happening "out of order". previously, synching everything within a mutex was doing what i expected, but now things are completely broken. not sure how to debug it
<Eiam> maybe .each {|k,v| k.first, v.first
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<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: well, first off.. it's usually a bad idea to share mutable state between threads.
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<shevy> {"FgH"=>6, "i"=>7, "j"=>7, "d"=>4, "e"=>5, "c"=>3, "a"=>1, "b"=>2}.values_at 'i' # => [7]
<Eiam> shevy: its always [ { 'team a' => '100'},{'team b'=>'200'}]
<shevy> so it is an array of hashes?
<rambda> ged: I'll be back in a few, transitioning to the house from work...need to disconnect so I can screen this session for when I get home
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<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: this code wraps net::ssh. i spun the threading code myself instead of using net::ssh::multi because i think the latter wasn't flexible enough or something, don't recall.
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<shevy> I thought it was a plain hash ;)
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<rambda> ok, be back in a few..
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<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: i was mostly looking for an obvious "don't use threads," or "do this with fibers this way," etc. there's no hope for me to easily debug the real issue here :)
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<stephenjudkins> between 1.8 and 1.9, the behavior of ruby threading has changed. in 1.8 the interpreter itself runs in a single OS thread, and preempts ruby "green threads" at its will. in 1.9, each ruby thread is mapped to an OS thread, which decides to preempt the other threads whenever it feels like it. There exists something called the "global VM lock" that ruby threads acquire before doing almost anything, which is necessary because so many C structs used by ruby
<stephenjudkins> objects are non-threadsafe
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<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: my advice is that you should not use threads.
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<stephenjudkins> what problem are you trying to solve?
<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: ssh to 50+ machines in parallel. worked great in 1.8.7.
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<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: ahh. so, what state is shared between these threads?
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<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: well, net::ssh doesn't even function anymore--i can't even connect to a single machine. there's not really shared state between them, but the main thread collects statistics and does the logic (who's failed, how many are left, etc.)
<invsblduck> if i 'require "net/ssh"' in irb and connect to a single host, it works. as soon as i run that same command inside the threader it don't work... Again, i don't need you to help me figure out why, just wanted the big picture on threading around here :)
<invsblduck> thx homey
<stephenjudkins> no idea if that's been changed
<invsblduck> hm maybe i was using net::ssh 1.x in the past :^)
<lindenle_> How can i test custom functions I have added to puppet?
<invsblduck> because i'm certainly trying to use 2.x now.
<stephenjudkins> well, that's kind of sad. one problem is that the word "thread-safety" is so overloaded
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<invsblduck> lindenle_: puppet --test ?
<stephenjudkins> i understand that operations on each individual Net::SSH connection could be considered "not thread-safe"
<ged> rambda: Okay, here's the paste: http://pastie.org/4189592
<stephenjudkins> if there is global state shared across all Net::SSH connections in an interpreter, that is really unfortunate
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<ged> rambda: I don't exactly know what the protocol is supposed to do, but hopefully that will get you started.
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<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: https://github.com/simulacre/em-ssh/ looks like it might work
<ged> rambda: The 'dump.log' will contain a log of the conversation so you can see what was written/read, and maybe track down where it's hanging.
<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: ohh, but i don't have multiple threads hitting *one* ssh session--each thread has its own independent connection/session/channel. thanks for the link
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<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: yeah, that was the impression I had of what you're doing. and if it starts breaking in that instance, I still think it's really unfortunate. and an example of why using any sort of global state is usually a mistake.
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<synthemesk> let's say i have a class that has included a module...is there a way i can dynamically include another module into the first module such that the class will pick that functionality up?
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<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: right. i had actually bundled net::ssh with my program, so the version was effectively frozen; the fact it ran beautifully on 1.8.7 and then croaks on 1.9 obviously points to the interpreter changing drastically, not the library. hehe :)
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<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: however, i did rip out the bundled one and try the latest gem, which doesn't work either...
<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: thanks again for your help!
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<krnlsndrs> #rvm is the right room for rvm help, right?
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<stephenjudkins> invsblduck: no problem. if you use em-ssh successfully and i'm around, let me know how it worked out
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<invsblduck> stephenjudkins: interesting, i may very well give that a shot
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<okguy> ruby ruby nice song!
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<Paradox> i'm including modules into a class like so here: https://github.com/paradox460/snoo/blob/master/lib/snoo.rb
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<Paradox> but when i attempt to do the same thing here: https://github.com/paradox460/ruby_ttfm/blob/master/lib/ruby_ttfm.rb
<Paradox> i get NameError: uninitialized constant Ttfm::Api::Helpers
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<rambda> ged: thanks man, I will give this a shot when I get back into the office tomorrow
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<Paradox> anyone know why?
<epochwolf> Is there a ruby way to take user inputted html and convert it to strictly validating xhtml?
<Paradox> epochwolf, rails has sanitise
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<epochwolf> Paradox: sorry, take already sanitized html and output xhtml 1.1 for use in an epub document.
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<blazes816> Paradox: Does changing "Helpers" to "::Helpers" work?
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<blazes816> or Ttfm::Helpers
<Paradox> ill test
<Paradox> its puzzling
<Paradox> this worked before
<epochwolf> Paradox: this code is from 2007.
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<blazes816> Paradox: If you just say Helpers, it tries looking in the current namespace (Ttfm::Api).
<blazes816> I assume Ttfm::Api::Helpers doesn't exist (if it doesn't it isn't loaded)
<blazes816> in the other example, I believe you're including Snoo::Account, etc
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<epochwolf> Paradox: this library also assumes you're working with already clean html. This will not work.
<Nika_> Hello, I am new to Ruby, I would like to know how can I create an executable file from a ruby script ... Thanks
<Paradox> blazes816, both are doing the same thing
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<Paradox> Snoo::Client is including Snoo::Account and Snoo::Posts and similar
<Paradox> this is attempting to include Ttfm::Helpers from Ttfm::Client
<Paradox> :/
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<blazes816> not sure why then
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<Paradox> yeah its really perplexing
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<blazes816> I suspect changing Helpers to Ttfm::Helpers would fix it
<epochwolf> Let me rephrase the question, I am working on a fork for epubbery. I already have an html sanitzer, I now need a way to convert html which may still be invalid into xhtml 1.1 which will validate.
<Paradox> i'll try that
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<Paradox> didnt seem to do it
<Paradox> let me try one or two other things
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<blazes816> hmmm
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<Paradox> lol
<Paradox> its really dumb
<Paradox> like, face-palmingly dumb
<blazes816> puts Ttfm.constants
<Paradox> order of the `require`
<Paradox> i solved it
<blazes816> and lol
<Paradox> here's what was happening
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<Paradox> i was trying to save time by doing Dir.glob("ruby_ttfm/*.rb")…
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<blazes816> lol
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<blazes816> I hate stuff like that
<epochwolf> Okay, I figured out nokogiri actually has the feature I was looking for, it can convert between html and xhtml
<Paradox> cool
<blazes816> you could manually require your helpers file from the api file so it works out
<Paradox> i was going to suggest that but i wasnt sure so i didnt
<Paradox> nah i got the gem to build and it works
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<ksergio> hello. does anyone know what is the name of the ubuntu package for emacs ruby mode?
<Paradox> have you tried sudo rm /bin/emacs ?
<Paradox> lol
<ksergio> silence, heathen
<ksergio> ;)
<Paradox> lrn2vim
<Paradox> or…actually
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<Paradox> sublimetext
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<mjb2k> I bet this guy knows: http://packages.ubuntu.com/
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<blazes816> ksergio: ruby-elisp?
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<ksergio> blazes816: yes, but for some reason apt doesnt seem to find it in the default 12.04 repos..
<ksergio> oh well
<ksergio> thanks
<shevy> ubuntu package
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<shevy> one day we will overcome this
<mjb2k> shevy: what do you have against packages and repositories?
<xiphiasx_> one day I won't be stick with C/C++ forever and ever
<xiphiasx_> stuck
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<ksergio> what's wrong with ubuntu packages?
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<davidcelis> the convenience comes at a price
<ksergio> like everything in life :P
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<anothervenue> haha
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<ksergio> well, crap, I guess I'll install it manually
<epochwolf> ksergio: ubuntu packages are out of date and don't play nice with gems
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<ksergio> epochwolf: thanks. I was just reading I shouldnt really use rails with anything but the latest ruby version...
<ksergio> <- newbie
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<epochwolf> <- expert
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<anothervenue> ksergio: The correct term is Nuby.
<ksergio> haha, ok
<anothervenue> No, I have no idea.
<eam> epochwolf: I think I'd phrase it more like gems don't play nice with established packaging systems
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<eam> except they do, for the most part
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<eam> why every language under the sun feels as if they should invent their own slightly naive and problematic packaging system is beyond me
<ged> eam: Which packaging system should languages use instead?
<anothervenue> eam: because language designers think they have a better way. Which is why they started the language in the first place.
<eam> anothervenue: unfortunately (and empirically) aptitude at developing a language does not typically extend to aptitude at designing a packaging system
<cirwin> javascript have it best
<cirwin> probably because their package management system was designed most recently
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<eam> npm addresses a different set of problems
<anothervenue> eam: True
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<epochwolf> eam: because ruby runs on more than just apt-based systems
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<eam> epochwolf: so does every other distribution-packaged component
<Xethron> REXML or Nokogiri for Parsing XML documents?
<cirwin> Xethron: nokogiri
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<Xethron> cirwin: why?
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<cirwin> it's faster, more reliable and has a richer API
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<epochwolf> Xethron: nokogiri is written in C and does all kinds of useful things. REXML is a last resort written in ruby so you at least can parse xml if you've been shafted badly enough you can't install gems.
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<epochwolf> REXML has no validation and will parse horribly invalid xml without warnings.
<Xethron> ah, I see.....
<Xethron> Nokogiri it is!
<epochwolf> nokogiri can also handle html documents
<cirwin> but not yet HTML 5
<boobah> nokogiri is the bee's knees
<epochwolf> though it does tend to mangle script tags.
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<ryanf> the idea that ruby libraries should be distributed via systems like apt baffles me
<ryanf> for all the extra manpower involved, what exactly is the benefit supposed to be?
<Agis__> guys, I've installed ruby on my windows system, how can I edit some gem's dependencies? where are the installed gems located?
<epochwolf> ryanf: one command install and setup of things like redmine
<epochwolf> ryanf: and one command security updates
<mjb2k> is nokogiri going to add HTML 5 support?
<ksergio> ryanf: one single package manager instead of one for each programming language
<ryanf> ok but you'd better hope you're only trying to install redmine and not any other packaged rails apps
<ryanf> since they'll depend on completely different versions of everything
<mjb2k> (seems odd to since HTML 5 is not XML)
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<epochwolf> ryanf: yup, that's why apt doesn't work too well in practice for such applications.
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<ryanf> also there are a million tiny niche rubygems that nobody is going to bother maintaining apt, rpm, etc packages for
<ryanf> so if you supposed to use apt for the popular stuff, what are you supposed to do for everything else?
<ryanf> *you're
<okguy> wa?
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<cirwin> mjb2k: there was a post on the libxml2 mailing list about adding html5 (which is what powers nokogiri on c-ruby). They're going to wait for the spec to settle a bit more ;)
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<bfig> hello. working on a ruby interp and i have some questions regarding default behaviors of some things. for what i experimented with the interpreter, array indexing works by two operations, in c++ notation: operator[], operator[]=. for the first (operator[]) you get back a ruby object, and take in an int as a parameter. for the second (operator[]=) you take an int for the indexing, and also a computable expression (or an object ref
<bfig> erence) and you assign through whatever underlying object you have, the expression to the indexee
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<bfig> let's say, x = "abc"; x[1] = "zbc"; x; => "azbcc"
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<bfig> in this case you are applying operator[]=. the distinction is important because unlike c++ (and at least in the interp i'm building) i have no concept of object reference (i have the concept of variable in the heap/stack, which points to an underlying object, but not anonymous references)
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<cirwin> bfig: your parser should distinguish the two uses of []
<cirwin> so that you know which function is being called
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<bfig> cirwin, you mean a[] and a[]= ?
<cirwin> yeah
<bfig> the idea was to do it, yes.
<bfig> i was wondering in any case, what is the default behavior of indexing or index-assigning ?
<cirwin> it's the same as obj.send(:'[]=', *args) or obj.send(:'[]', *args) i think
<bfig> what's does .send do?
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<cirwin> calls a method on an object by nae
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<cirwin> *name
<cirwin> i.e. it's the object's responsibility to implement []=
<cirwin> so it's different for Array's and Hashes for example
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<bfig> ok, but there is default error behavior, for some things returning a Nil object is fine
<bfig> for example, indexing an array out of bounds returns Nil, and if assigned out of bounds, the array is resized appropriately
<cirwin> yea
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<cirwin> you could look up the rbx source code
<cirwin> it might have ruby implementations of Array etc.
<cirwin> not sure
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<eam> 16:06 < ryanf> the idea that ruby libraries should be distributed via systems like apt baffles me
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<eam> there's no additional manpower (on the contrary, the overhead of maintaining the gems format vanishes), and the gain is obvious: Ruby libraries often depend on other system functionality (C shared objects) and unless they work within the distribution's packaging framework they cannot properly express their depenedencies
<eam> frankly, it's an absurdly poor user experience to say "sure we have a packaging system called gem, just run some list of commands in conjunction depending on your underlying system"
<eam> "and if you don't, stuff will break weirdly"
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<eam> the entire point of a packaging system is to encapsulate all the necessary steps to bring a system into a particular installed state -- gem can't do that
<eam> rpm or apt can
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<eam> thankfully it's fairly trivial to adapt gem (or cpan, or any other format) to any particular distro's packaging scheme
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<eam> but to the extent that it's troublesome, the fault lies with the custom one-off packaging scheme, which shouldn't exist if not for a typical and unfortunate NIH bias
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<ged> But if not a custom one-off packaging scheme, which existing scheme do you choose? Especially which one that works on every platform Ruby supports?
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<cirwin> distros shouldn't package ruby libraries; but they should package ruby apps. Maybe "bundle package" should be used instead.
<eam> ged: there's no need to chose. There's a clear interface between a build system and arbitrary packaging platforms
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<ged> eam: I don't follow. You mean you could build any arbitrary package format using a Rakefile or something?
<smw_> What does p194 mean? Is there a large difference between p194 and p0?
<eam> ged: correct
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<eam> ged: see, for example, fpm
<ged> eam: Is there an example of such a thing for other languages?
<cirwin> eam: the reason that will never happen is because each existing package management system has its own quirks; so the upfront drudgery to make that happen does not seem worth it
<eam> or any of the other format:format or build:format bridges
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<eam> cirwin: yes that's why I suggest it is a mistake to invent a useless new platform in the first place
<eam> a mistake not unique to ruby, mind you
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<Tasser> cirwin, ohh, dependency resolution :D
<Tasser> cirwin, and updates of one part ;-)
<ged> Hmmm... neat! "gem (even autodownloaded for you)"
<Tasser> ged, I'm pretty sure there's a gem2deb
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<Tasser> archlinux has a PKGBUILD-rubygem.proto
<Tasser> but that doesn't map dependencies
<ged> Tasser: Cool, but I would find it surprising if it worked on extensions.
<ged> E.g., can it auto-detect that the 'pg' gem requires the 'libpq-dev' package?
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<Tasser> ged, hell no ^^
<Tasser> ged, -dev packages are a debian speciality btw
<eam> Tasser: that's not necessarily true
<Tasser> ged, and .deb packages wouldn't need libpq-dev in the end
<Tasser> eam, name one of the bigger distributions that use dev packages as well
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<eam> many packaging toolchains can do dependency detection by (for example) walking the objects and looking at SONAMEs
<eam> Tasser: well, RHEL uses -devel, which is essentially the same
<ged> But that's my point. Until there's some sort of consistency in naming convention, you need some intermediate format to package a ruby library.
<eam> ged: nah
<Tasser> eam, oh, duh
<Tasser> eam, never cared about any *.rpm :-)
<eam> because for example, an rpm can express a dependency on more than just a package name or version
<Tasser> eam, how good are they?
<eam> you can say "I require libxml2.so.1"
<eam> and then packages can express that they supply this shared object
<eam> and you can do a bit of magic at build time to discover this too
<eam> Tasser: eh, they're ok
<Tasser> sounds... complicated
<eam> I'm not in love with apt or rpm, but they're much better than any language specific packaging attempt
<ged> eam: How would you specify dependencies if not in an intermediate format?
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<RubyPanther> it is not realistic to develop new software using only distro tools and dependencies because the software that goes into distros has mostly been tested for a few years ("stable")
<cantonic> hey there. i want to have an application for my personal needs. nothing specific, but automating some of my daily tasks and having everything organized… i wanted to use Rails, but now i consider using Padrino since it is more lightweight. any other suggestions for what i try to do?
<eam> RubyPanther: erm, there are stable and unstable distros
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<eam> RHEL vs Fedora, for example
<RubyPanther> I'm not sure that is a valid example, I've been using RH/Fedora since the 90s
<eam> enterprise will always use stable (old) software, but that's independent of any packaging concern
<eam> RubyPanther: then you should know how trivial it is to build bleeding edge packages as rpms?
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