<wasamasa>
kids don't know 'bout my typedefs these days
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<shevy>
sqlite> .read names.sql
<shevy>
can this really take 2 days?
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<jhass>
if it's big enough, sure
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<asaff>
how to get friends list using koala gem ............... require 'koala' samp = Koala::Facebook::API.new(oauth_access_token) and then this syntax is giving empty array 2.2.0 :019 > frnds = samp.get_connections("me", "friends") => []
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* wasamasa
read this as "how to get friends"
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<shevy>
it is everything and nothing all at the same time
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<shevy>
"My ideal would be an extremely dynamic language (duck typed, Jit etc), that can also statically type and AOT compile functions if it needs to, and can also run anywhere - basically javascript in the future and without all the shit in javascript"
<shevy>
now you see
<shevy>
javascript is ze future
<shevy>
(minus the shit)
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<shevy>
jhass yeah, the .sql file is 98MB
<shevy>
but I seem to remember that it was much faster in postgresql
<shevy>
perhaps sqlite is really good only for smaller stuff :(
<adaedra>
Are you /really/ comparing sqlite to postgresql?
<jhass>
well, 98M is not that big
<shevy>
adaedra I love sqlite!
<shevy>
postgresql is good too though
<shevy>
but sqlite is like that thing you carry with and nobody minds
<adaedra>
As long as you don't use it for big amount of data or performance, it's ok
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<shevy>
how big is big!
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<shevy>
the 98 MB .sql file has 1_278_123 lines
<shevy>
INSERT INTO statements that is
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<jhass>
yeah, that' not that many
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<jhass>
I'd start worrying at about 10 as much I think
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<shevy>
but it already is so slow :(
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<shevy>
I remember, a year ago, on a postgresql cluster (they obviously had more RAM than I had, I have 4 gigs here), it took about half an hour for a total of 330MB .sql files
<jhass>
well, if it doesn't work for you there's no point in using it
<shevy>
but I wanna!
<shevy>
ah well I guess I'll compare to the others
<shevy>
would mongodb be faster?
<jhass>
mongodb doesn't do SQL
<adaedra>
mongodb is totally different
<adaedra>
what's your use case, shevy
<shevy>
adaedra the remote database is this one here:
<apeiros>
abyss: use a profiler, see what parts are slow
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<apeiros>
abyss: note, using -rprofile as profiler will let your script run approximately 100x slower, so be prepared for that (e.g. by using a much smaller input file)
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<apeiros>
abyss: also, what ruby version are you using?
* jhass
wonders where people pickup "#{var}" instead of doing simply var.to_s
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<apeiros>
jhass: I think they simply never pick up var.to_s
<apeiros>
cargo cult
<apeiros>
I mean, most places don't even need .to_s
<abyss>
apeiros: oh, ok I supposed that something will be obvious why it is so slow (for example I am using file.each or datetime). I tested this on ruby 1.8 and 1.9
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<jhass>
I don't know, it seems so common among people new to the language, I wonder if there's a howto or so with that style
<apeiros>
abyss: ok, first step to improve performance - use a ruby version which is not already in the grave
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<apeiros>
best would be the current ruby, 2.2.2
<apeiros>
jhass: I think most howto's simply feature how to interpolate strings. and then people go and think 'I need a string, so I do "stuff"', and if stuff is a variable, they insert it using the #{} they learned…
<abyss>
apeiros: impossible we have production servers and there are some guidelines... Mostly we don't use ruby but I wanted to learn ruby so I have to use the tools that I have (ruby 1.9);)
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<apeiros>
abyss: sounds like shitty guidelines. do you also use windows 2000? linux kernel 2.x? mac os 9?
<abyss>
jhass: it is something to my script then the answer is easy: I have lack of knowledge or I not a programmer and I have a lot to learn:)
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<apeiros>
but well, DateTime.strptime in <=1.9 is slow
<apeiros>
use pattern matching + Time.mktime/.local instead
<abyss>
apeiros: I suppose we could change it if we would use ruby but because only I using ruby in this company nobody give a shit about that;)
<wasamasa>
that indentation
<jhass>
abyss: well, did you come up with "#{foo}" instead of foo.to_s yourself? Note that I'm talking about literally that, not combining it with another string, like "#{foo} bar"
<wasamasa>
I bet using two spaces will speed it up!
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<apeiros>
additionally, you can drop overhead like `"#{matches[2]}"` -> just `matches[2]`
<wasamasa>
abyss: preprocessing the input file will speed it up
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<wasamasa>
abyss: since it's done once and will never be needed again
<apeiros>
the rest depends on what the profiler says.
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<apeiros>
I could imagine that the regexen could be optimized, but I doubt they'd have a significant impact
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<apeiros>
you can also avoid performing the same match twice. do it once, store the result.
<apeiros>
(line 8 & 9)
<abyss>
jhass: sorry, my english isn't so good. I don't get it what you wrote, sorry:( You mean I should use something like puts foo.to_s intead of puts #{foo}, yes?
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<abyss>
wasamasa: you mean I should get whole file to memory?
<wasamasa>
abyss: run your prefered unix utility over it and let it do some regex magic so that it's easier to deal with
<jhass>
abyss: puts "#{foo} bar" is fine, puts "#{foo}" is a bit odd, in this instance puts foo is equivalent, in most other instances foo.to_s is equivalent to "#{foo}"
<wasamasa>
abyss: be it `sed` or `awk` or `perl` or `ruby` or whatever
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<jhass>
abyss: but you're not the first one to do that, in fact many people do, so I wonder if you picked that up somewhere
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<abyss>
jhass: ok I did it unconsciously because - yes it strange;) But where I did that?;)
<apeiros>
all over the place
<apeiros>
13:14 apeiros: additionally, you can drop overhead like `"#{matches[2]}"` -> just `matches[2]`
<jhass>
yep, ^ that
<abyss>
oh, ok in session[here], yes? Hmm I had to see that in some books or example... Because mostly where I read people in hashes did something like this - I don't know why and I repeated the same mistake...
<jhass>
don't worry, as said many people do that so I just wondered if somebody teaches it
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<apeiros>
I might actually underestimate the impact of the regex. /.* \[(.*) .*\] .* ([a-zA-Z0-9]+)$/ contains tons of backtracking opportunities.
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<apeiros>
if e.g. that first .* is supposed to match only until the first space, then use [^ ]* instead of .*
<abyss>
jhass: yes, a lot of examples in books or tutorials in internet. Thank you for point it out.
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<jhass>
do you happen to have an example at hand?
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<abyss>
jhass: sorry I'm not, I have books at home (now Iam at work). But it could be something like this: example["example"] so I invented that " " should be in every hash;)
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<jhass>
ah, I see
<jhass>
so no, a hash can have anything as key ;)
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<abyss>
apeiros: wasamasa thank you as well I will try to avoid "" and read about profile in ruby. And as far as I understand the main problem could be datetime, so I will try to avoid this. I use it, because I found example in internet how to prepare date in apache to date for ruby:)
<abyss>
that: \[(.*) .*\] in my accesslogs is apache date, this: ([a-zA-Z0-9]+) is sessions
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<mikecmpbll>
curiously, how would you use sprintf with a string that has % symbols in it?
<abyss>
apeiros: to avoid double checking regexp I should do something like this: if matches = line =~ parseapache or something? Of course this won't work but...;) (BTW: I put this regexp to variable;) But I suppose it's not what you meant;)
<apeiros>
matches = line.match(regex); if matches; …
<jhass>
abyss: .match returns nil if there's no match
<jhass>
abyss: and the second thing to understand is that, as I showed above, .match returns nil when there's no match
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<jhass>
and nil is considered falsey, that means it's treated like false in conditions
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<jhass>
but just do match = x.match /bar/; if match; put "there's a match!"; end; if that confuses you, that style is actually preferred by many
<jhass>
unshadow: and what's the error message?
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<abyss>
jhass: ok, thank you for explanation.
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<apeiros>
abyss: if you have example data, we can check
<apeiros>
abyss: also, did you profile the script yet? :)
<abyss>
apeiros: No, I will do it at home, I have to do something different now :( (even not reffered to ruby!:( ) ;)
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<abyss>
apeiros: but for sure that datetime is bad in this script;)
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<unshadow>
jhass, the error message is [BUG] Segmentation fault at 0x0000000000025c
<apeiros>
abyss: not bad, just slow ;-)
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<unshadow>
jhass, yeha, I know it dosent really help XD , sadly it just prints tons of info, I managed to make it work once, then it just collapses all the time, My issue is I think, is that I dont know how to pass on the pointer for the Struct I created
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<shevy>
synapplix when I need reminders, from the commandline, I can use aliases such as: "basedir?" and this will then output this here: RbConfig::CONFIG['sitelibdir']+'/name_of_project'
<shevy>
synapplix then I use other helpers, such as "rubygen foo.rb" which generates a custom foo.rb file with my preferences (a ruby skeleton file that I can fill up)
<shevy>
sort of I have a mixed "IDE", if I use the commandline and also an editor on top of that (in my case bluefish 1.0.7)
<synapplix>
the main target is working on an existing redmine plugin
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<thoughnut>
synapplix give me a link
<synapplix>
some students should work on it and need some debug sessions to fix errors ...
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<thoughnut>
yeah why not..
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<thoughnut>
synapplix that one is slippery slop
<thoughnut>
you should fix the gaps
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<thoughnut>
otherwise it's gonna be a pain in the ass
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<synapplix>
i don´t someone else should do it :D
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<shevy>
one of the hardest things I face is the psychological one... to adjust to how someone else wrote in a specific ruby style when it is different to mine
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<thoughnut>
shevy yes it works
<thoughnut>
please check it now
<allcentury>
shevy: every developer that starts at my new comapny instantly wants to rewrite every piece of code they see in our codebase.
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<synapplix>
personally i would kick ruby, i like java and scala, but shit happens and there are people using redmine and rails apps ;-)
<shevy>
hahaha
<allcentury>
they all have 15 different ways to redo it
<synapplix>
i think most of the time we have a problem with good library knowledge, most languages come with great libraries but many developers dont know them
<shevy>
Rewriting small classes is usually simple, but rewriting a lot of different classes is hard and takes so long
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<shevy>
synapplix not sure if all libraries in default ruby stdlib/core are that great :)
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<synapplix>
i personally dont talk about ruby, ruby is a mess for me, java runtime or scala runtime has many years of refinement
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<shevy>
I have no idea about java
<shevy>
but you sort of need an IDE for it right?
<certainty>
nope
<certainty>
emacs
<certainty>
or vim
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<shevy>
are you saying that you are a java hacker certainty
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<certainty>
no
<shevy>
you were my lisp hero
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<certainty>
i just have an oppinion on everything
<certainty>
xD
<shevy>
well, they have those big fat things
<shevy>
eclipse
<shevy>
and that other one
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<certainty>
yeah i've used that
<certainty>
didn't like it
<shevy>
it's so big, it's a full linux distribution
<synapplix>
no i only want to know how ruby developers think, how they work ... but most time i get answer like ... ??? it is a mess
<jhass>
people say that about emacs too :P
<certainty>
only the os in emacs lacks a proper editor :D
<shevy>
synapplix it's really true, we work in a simple way. and rather OOP centric
<shevy>
we model the data into classes or modules and let the methods define their behaviour
<jhass>
synapplix: the most common workflow is some decent editor (vim, emacs, sublime, textmate) and a terminal with pry
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<shevy>
certainty you could always use vim from within emacs
<certainty>
viper mode?
<TheBrayn>
hi
<certainty>
evil mode?
<certainty>
M-x term and then start vim?
<synapplix>
i dont know if you know martin odersky or scala, but if you know that scala is not OOP centric it can but it must not and it is working on jvm, if you really think about it that is really great language development
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<TheBrayn>
I would like to iterate over the capture groups of a match, is there a better way than doing “Hash[match.names.zip match.captures].each do |key, value|”?
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<synapplix>
you can develop the best langauge but if you dont distribute support tools for it is bad
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<jhass>
synapplix: pry + pry-doc + pry-byebug + pry-stack_explorer and maybe + pry-rescue + pry-remote make the best debugger you can get (in ruby), and it's completely sufficient which is why you don't see open source graphical or integrated debuggers in the Ruby world
<jhass>
there's simply no demand for them
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<jhass>
TheBrayn: not really, you could .each the names and retrieve the value in the loop with MatchData#[], depends on the usecase what I'd prefer
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<ericwood_>
yeah I found that beyond inserting binding.pry for inspecting state I don't use many other debugging features
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<jhass>
I have pry-stack_explorer in the standard toolset since I sometimes trace an execution path not only forward from the current breakpoint but also backwards (up the stack)
<jhass>
makes it easy to figure out where your values came from
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<synapplix>
jhass thanks and you working with emacs or vim command line?
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<jhass>
no, I use sublime + zsh
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<thoughnut>
what kind of environment is that?
<jhass>
sublime text as editor and zsh as shell
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<jhass>
terminology as terminal and gnome shell as DE if you want to know all the details ;)
<hewenho__>
k-vim
<synapplix>
jhass yeah i know that, any special ruby plugins for sublime?
<synapplix>
jhass some recommendation how to setup sublime projects for rails apps? or should you really go only with the editor ?
<adaedra>
hallååå
<NinjaOps>
I don't think fish supports ! quick history
<adaedra>
synapplix: sublime and shell should be all you need
<shevy>
as said, fish is weird
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<NinjaOps>
zsh, is the bomb
<shevy>
but it has fancy live colouring
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<jhass>
synapplix: yeah, you don't really need anything more
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<havenwood>
shevy: I do like colors...
<TheBrayn>
jhass: thanks, I think I'll stick to my solution
<jhass>
editor, shell, browser for docs (devdocs.io is decent for something combined)
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<Nilium>
I mostly tell people to stick to bash or zsh at most
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<shevy>
havenwood I do too but it's a bit too much in fish... I remember pp vs ap, awesome print, awesome print was like colour overflooding my eyes....
<Nilium>
Or at least only write scripts for sh or bash
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<synapplix>
jhass perhaps some license key? :-) i hate such menu entries
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<NinjaOps>
yea, I use ZSH for all my dev work access, and BASH for server scripting
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<NinjaOps>
if I am not using Ruby
<thoughnut>
Bash is better
<jhass>
synapplix: if you want to get rid of the nagging popup to buy it every dozen saves
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<thoughnut>
than zsh
<thoughnut>
:P
<certainty>
powershell rules
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<jhass>
synapplix: it just keeps nagging forever, no limited functionality
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<waxjar>
fish is great, it has a nice scripting language, tab completion for everything (it parses man pages :D) and the colouring is really neat :D
<Nilium>
certainty: You just go back to the hole from whence you came
<jhass>
the license is more a tip to the dev
<NinjaOps>
Bash is not better in ZSH, they are both good for different things
<certainty>
Nilium: :)
<waxjar>
only downside is it isn't POSIX compatible
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<synapplix>
jhass a tip to Yukihiro Matsumoto would be first ide than language. "Matsumoto has said that Ruby is designed for programmer productivity and fun, following the principles of good user interface design". but something he was missing ...
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<ponga>
im not sure what IDE could offer ruby than an editor
<havenwood>
synapplix: We prefer REPL driven development.
<ponga>
its a high level scripting language
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<gr33n7007h>
this ssd is rapid booya!
<ericwood_>
refactoring tools are a great feature of IDEs
<synapplix>
"I hope to see Ruby help every programmer in the world to be productive, and to enjoy programming, and to be happy. ..." -- Yukihiro Matsumoto
<ericwood_>
RubyMine and friends have some really powerful stuff to make refactoring/renaming/whatever much simpler/safer
<jhass>
synapplix: that an IDE achieves those goals is simply opinion, you seem to forget that
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<havenwood>
synapplix: Jump between your REPL and editor of choice. It's just text. That makes some of us happy!
<synapplix>
yeah i personally know rubymine, but it must be licensed and that is not working for my company
<jhass>
the other opinion is that an IDE forces a workflow onto you
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<synapplix>
jhass maybe but that is not true for great ide´s
<NinjaOps>
Anyone ever use ruby-ruesday?
<NinjaOps>
Anyone ever use ruby-tuesday?
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<havenwood>
synapplix: Great text editor and REPL combo is a delight as well. There's more than one way to do it.
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<jhass>
synapplix: what makes a great IDE is again purely opinion
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<shevy>
emacs
<NinjaOps>
ed
<synapplix>
havenwood i know that from scala it is ok, but if you have really great projects you will need more than that
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<shevy>
actually, yukihiro uses emacs
<jhass>
synapplix: I used and preferred Sublime over Eclipse for the simple Java exercises during my studies for example, creating an eclipse project for each one was just too much overhead
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<jhass>
synapplix: you also forget at what time Ruby was written
<synapplix>
jhass: great ide means universal ide, i think eclipse is an universal ide
<shevy>
but ruby is not an IDE, it is a "scripting" language, which as name implies lightness. java also does not come with some obligatory IDE, you can use notepad
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<shevy>
use eclipse as you write ruby code
<jhass>
synapplix: I'm starting to think you're here to troll...
<synapplix>
jhass: "1995; 20 years ago"
<ponga>
but i 'd want IDE for java tho
<ponga>
but for ruby im okay on terminal
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<synapplix>
jhass: time to build "infrastructure"
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<Selinda>
Hi
<synapplix>
shevy: ruby is not for writing scripts only
<shevy>
ponga synapplix needs an IDE
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<havenwood>
Selinda: hi
<Selinda>
Kinda wondering, how popular is Ruby nowdays?=
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<NinjaOps>
Selinda: Ruby is VERY popular... it's what Chef and Puppet are based on, and just about every cloud service out there has a SDK for ruby
<shevy>
synapplix well you could try to see in which editor rails was written - that was a fairly big project
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<shevy>
The size of the rails-4.1.1 gem is: 1.4M
<shevy>
that's huge for ruby
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<shevy>
it's one tenth of the size of ruby!
<shevy>
ruby-2.2.2.tar.xz: 10M
<havenwood>
ponga: TIOBE is so bizarre...
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<ponga>
havenwood: i know..
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<shevy>
TIOBE says java is the best programming language out there
<synapplix>
"you also forget at what time Ruby was written" -- jhass; "1995; 20 years ago" -- synapplix; i worked with rubymine or jetbrains/ruby plugin. it is great (many features ... ) . but i ask myself. 20 years and no mainstream ide
<Selinda>
Horrible language
<Selinda>
Java
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<synapplix>
Selinda try scala
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<shevy>
synapplix there is no use case, jhass also said that, I said that. Look at rails, it's one of the biggest, and I am sure they used something like vim or emacs for it
<ponga>
C# , a better dressed brother of java from another land
<havenwood>
synapplix: Or a nice language on the JVM like JRuby.
<Selinda>
Many people talk about Scala but it's not mature yet.
<ponga>
no wonder i love C#
<Selinda>
C#?
<synapplix>
scala or F#
<havenwood>
Selinda: JRuby is lovely.
<Selinda>
C# sucks even more.
<shevy>
ponga well it is ranked #5 now
<ponga>
shevy: what, C#?
<shevy>
yeah
<ponga>
im ok with C#
<ponga>
its versatile
<ponga>
not hella verbose
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<shevy>
C# looks better than java
<shevy>
but it also looks like these languages are soooo similar
<jhass>
synapplix: and it doesn't occur to you that it's simply not needed? 20 years time, major companies that depend on it and it didn't happen
<shevy>
can't they all agree on one language to rule them all
<synapplix>
ruby (or rails) gave great influences to java frameworks too, i know the play!-framework and it has copied many ideas from rails
<jhass>
why is it so hard to accept the majority of Ruby devs simply don't need an IDE to be productive with their language?
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<havenwood>
synapplix: If we wanted an IDE we'd have one!
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<Selinda>
If you code in C#, you must have depression.
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<DefV>
well
<DefV>
I like IDE's
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<shevy>
I am sure the java frameworks are much bigger
<havenwood>
shevy: I guess people use Ruby more than they have questions about it. :P
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<synapplix>
havenwood: i hope that is true, and not only a matter of missing the bigger view
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<shevy>
:(
<Selinda>
shevy, The Java libraries are the biggest right now.
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<shevy>
ponga: let's unite in a fight against the java
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<ponga>
shevy: was i ever not in?
<Selinda>
havenwood, Folk have been coding for 20 years without understanding algorithms or even know how to translate binary to decimal. That's what they are, coders. Not programmers.
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<shevy>
ponga: ah I don't know, we just have it more spirited from now on
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<ponga>
my first impression at C# was that i totally got to ditch Java away
<shevy>
hehe
<havenwood>
Selinda: Coders are programmers who write code, right? And programmers are coders who program?
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<shevy>
I am a PHP programmer
<Selinda>
havenwood, No.
<shevy>
I program PHP
<Selinda>
havenwood, Learn the difference between coders and programmers.
<ponga>
shevy: how did PHP help you
<havenwood>
Selinda: Stop pretending there's a difference.
<ponga>
in terms of well being
<Selinda>
havenwood, There is a big difference.
<shevy>
ponga hmm. When i switched to ruby, I dragged custom_functions.php with me
<havenwood>
Selinda: Twice as many letters in "Programmer" I suppose.
<Selinda>
havenwood, Stop pretending there's none because it hurt your feelings. The truth is one.
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<shevy>
ponga that lateron became custom_methods.rb in a module
<shevy>
ponga I sort of dump everything useful into it; often it's just a method, that then goes to invoke some other class somewhere else. but php, for www stuff, was actually not bad - I kind of carried over everything I used back then into ruby, and now I use ruby for web stuff
<NinjaOps>
Oh and your forgot Developer (So you have Programer, Developer, Coder)
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<Selinda>
A developer can be a programmer or coder.
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<synapplix>
if you work with redmine (ruby rails app) using plugins for redmine, you will notice that this can be a huge project. for me it is funny that i find call failures (stack...) only at runtime
<shevy>
ponga one day I hope to use opal and get rid of any javascript that I would have to write myself
<Selinda>
The programmer-coder difference is big and you should look it up before someone laughs in your face.
<ponga>
shevy: you hate javascript?
<shevy>
ponga not really hate, but I want to "think" in ruby if I can
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<synapplix>
an ide could percompile and test it, give you hints
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<havenwood>
Selinda: Five letters isn't too big of a difference.
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<ericwood_>
I found tools like underscore/lodash made JS life easier
<ponga>
shevy: i think and write in ruby, sometimes i rewrite my ruby code into javascript
<Selinda>
havenwood, I feel sorry for your knowledge.
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<shevy>
synapplix ok but you can use test/ files too
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<ericwood_>
a lot of my fave ruby/FP methods were usable again :D
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<havenwood>
Selinda: I never pity knowledge, maybe existential angst.
<shevy>
angst!
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<shevy>
a german word!!!
<Selinda>
havenwood, Agnostic.
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<synapplix>
shevy: often those plugins are not from myself, plugins have sometimes no test files and are for some specific version of redmine, that is not funny
<ponga>
shevy: is your first language German
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<shevy>
Angstostic!
<quazimodo>
pundit is weird as
<shevy>
Angst = Fear... but it is actually a cool guttural word... reminds me of monty python sketch
<shevy>
"woody words"
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<ponga>
oh yeah
<ponga>
woody words..
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<havenwood>
Selinda: Like all those massive differences between a lawyer and an attorney. So different it hurts!
<Selinda>
German word? You mean greek word..
<Selinda>
God..
<shevy>
ponga yeah, sort of. a local dialect here
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<Selinda>
havenwood, Braindead confirmed.
<shevy>
ponga but english sort of is where everyone can or should understand one another
<havenwood>
Selinda: The words mean the same thing. If you like to read meaning into the one or the other have fun, but don't expect others to agree with you.
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<ponga>
i thought Eng was ur 1st language shevy
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<ponga>
and plus, Selinda would you stop behaving like that
<Selinda>
havenwood, No, the words do not mean the same thing. Go look it up before you make your own definitions.
<havenwood>
Selinda: One who programs. One who codes. One who develops.
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<Selinda>
havenwood, You are clearly giving vibes that you have no idea about computer science.
<Selinda>
I feel sorry, truly.
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<ponga>
i feel pity of Selinda ridiculous behaviour
<ericwood_>
oooh did I walk in on some kind of argument
<gr33n7007h>
ruboto: !assinate Selinda
<Nilium>
What argument?
<quazimodo>
ericwood_: did you ever do a computer scince?
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<ericwood_>
I studied CE, yes
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<quazimodo>
i once did a computer scence
<ponga>
what is it , am i like only one without CS background
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<jonaslund>
Hi, i'm writing a thesis and i'm trying to compare what i'm doing in JS to what someone else did in ruby
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<quazimodo>
ponga: they get to water trees and everything
<Nilium>
I studied English.
<jonaslund>
values in Ruby objects
<jonaslund>
erm, properties
<jonaslund>
(or called attributes in ruby land?)
<quazimodo>
jonaslund: i think you'll find they're known as "things" in ruby
<jonaslund>
when and how can they be added?
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<ericwood_>
jonaslund: are you talking about instance variables?
<ericwood_>
like @whatever
<jonaslund>
ericwood_: yes
<quazimodo>
ericwood_: instance things, yes
<Selinda>
havenwood, "That said, coder is a pejorative term used to imply that one is not passionate about their work and is merely a "day coder." I.e. they do not spend much of their own time outside of work programming, learning about programming, computers and other matters useful to the profession."
<Selinda>
Open a book, learn something.
<quazimodo>
pejorative?
<jhass>
jonaslund: the general answer about "when can things be added" in ruby is: all the time
<ericwood_>
you can define them whenever, althouhg you have to use things like attr_accessor and whatnot to access them easily outside of the class itself
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<quazimodo>
so i'm not a coder?
<havenwood>
Selinda: Seems you're trying to insult me. Stop that!
<quazimodo>
i thought iwas
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<jonaslund>
jhass: can they be removed also ?
<ericwood_>
books are stupid open a PDF gosh
<jhass>
yes
<jonaslund>
(like javascript's delete operator)
<Selinda>
havenwood, Use your brain then.
<quazimodo>
jonaslund: they all implicitly 'exist' as nil
<quazimodo>
you can do @anyoldthing and it'll return nil
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<quazimodo>
i'm sure the ruby implementation allocates memory and everything too
<jhass>
quazimodo: first access defines though
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<quazimodo>
yep
<jonaslund>
can the type be changed after the first access ?
<ericwood_>
it'll get GC'd away eventually if it doesn't get used
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<quazimodo>
jonaslund: no such thing as type
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<jonaslund>
right
<jhass>
or we do have types, variables just don't
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<havenwood>
Selinda: I don't think these words mean what you think they mean. Maybe that's your local parlance, but it isn't what most folk mean by "coder."
<ericwood_>
you can reassign it to whatever
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<jhass>
*oh
<quazimodo>
jhass: what typeS?
<quazimodo>
everything seems to be an instance of a class
<quazimodo>
and all inherit from object, no/
<quazimodo>
?
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<ericwood_>
yes
<jhass>
yep, and some people call a class a type
<Selinda>
havenwood, Get a better understanding, it's your definition that's wrong.
<ericwood_>
havenwood: don't engage
<quazimodo>
oh, but a class certainly isn't a type
<ericwood_>
havenwood: this is a good use-case for /ignore :)
<jhass>
Selinda: what's your point, currently you're just repeating the same thing again and again
<quazimodo>
not at all
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<jhass>
Selinda: you on't convince anybody with that
<jhass>
Selinda: if you want to argue, argue, provide background for your own claims
* jonaslund
is writing a static JavaScript compiler and one of the other implementations of the static type inference algorithms was the ecstatic compiler for Ruby
<jhass>
Selinda: currently you're showing exactly the behaviors you accuse others of
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<quazimodo>
i wanna know why ruby, which is *less* abstract than common lisp, is so so so much goddam slower
<jhass>
Selinda: and that's why you're getting such backlash
<ericwood_>
jonaslund: along the lines of typescript and whatever that otehr one is?
<quazimodo>
with super terribad thread support
<jonaslund>
I'm reading their paper and trying to see how they did a particular thing
<Selinda>
jhass, Not my fault if he won't understand.
<quazimodo>
mri, to be specific
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<jhass>
Selinda: yes it is, you refuse to explain
<ericwood_>
quazimodo: I mean I guess fibers are system-level threads
<ericwood_>
but...yeah not amazing lang for threading
<Selinda>
jhass, I have already tried.
<jonaslund>
ericwood_: no, more like starkiller, shedskin and ecstatic. the compiler has to deduce all information from regular files without any specific annotations
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<jhass>
Selinda: I didn't notice so
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<ponga>
omg crown is having words
* ponga
runs off
<quazimodo>
ericwood_: reads like a picture book though
<synapplix>
jhass: i am not confident with sublime and zsh
<Selinda>
Also, every normal capable human can google.
<ericwood_>
jonaslund: iirc typescript will do type inference without annotations, but only for literals
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<synapplix>
i think i will go the emacs way
<jhass>
synapplix: and I'm not confident with eclipse, tools need time to learn, that's natural
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<Selinda>
synapplix, Emacs is slow on startup.
<ericwood_>
eh not really
<ericwood_>
and that's not an issue if you leave it running all the time
<Selinda>
I have been using it for over 12 years, it is slow.
<ericwood_>
okay cool
<jhass>
synapplix: additionally zsh and sublime are highly customizable tools, so they also need time to customize to your workflow, or better put it takes time till you develop a workflow for a new environment
<unshadow>
Hi guys, I'm workig on integrating a filter for SQL Injections and XSS attacks for ruby using the libinjection (c lib), it looks like it's working right now (not even sure how hahah), you can use it as much as you want , enjoy :) (Thanks jhass) it's here --> https://github.com/bararchy/ruby-libinjection
<ponga>
perhaps slow startup means you need a cup of tea to relax
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<ponga>
or is it?
<ericwood_>
ponga: like 1 or 2 sec
<Selinda>
It's not bad, but if you want to edit open/close files, you should consider vim.
<synapplix>
like with eclipse it is not recommended to install the ubuntu packaged version, is that true for emacs too?
<Selinda>
Emacs, vim is not same as an IDE.
<Selinda>
You have to learn how to use them.
<jonaslund>
ericwood_: ah, i might need to take a closer look at the details but in general if you find that someone has added type annotations it tends to be fairly restricted variants
<Selinda>
It will take time.
<Selinda>
There are commands, scripts.. a lot of things.
<ericwood_>
jonaslund: wish I could elaborate more, I haven't messed with them much, just watched a talk on them at empireJS yesterday tho!
<ericwood_>
synapplix: you don't really need them tbh
<quazimodo>
sadly the people behind emacs are too autistic
<jonaslund>
ericwood_: also typescript is more about giving programmers ways to check their code, my compiler generates C code to compile to native code
<quazimodo>
all they needed to do was package it up more nicely
<ericwood_>
synapplix: there's some nice ones in vim-rails but really I never find myself wanting them
<quazimodo>
my emacs looks and works better than sublime
<ericwood_>
jonaslund: ah okay that's very different :P
<quazimodo>
took me god knows how many hours to make it do that
<Selinda>
It would be weird if your emacs didn't work better than sublim.
<NinjaOps>
quazimodo: you got a screenshot?
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<zotherst1pidguy>
anyone with some guso experiance?
<Selinda>
I have a heavily modified microemacs, faster than any vim. But it's self modified.
<quazimodo>
NinjaOps: hold up. The color scheme is... very suited to me but may ... be offensive to you
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<ericwood_>
I'm a huge believer in starting with an empty vimrc then building up as you want/need stuff
<ericwood_>
highly recommend Vundle and its ilk for managing plugins too
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<ericwood_>
makes it easy to manage and try out packages
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<Selinda>
synapplix, If you manage to learn Emacs or Vim, it's like learning a mini language.
<synapplix>
ericwood_: thanks for insight to vim workflows
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<synapplix>
i love vim, but i say i am not an expert with it
<quazimodo>
NinjaOps: stupid emacs
<ericwood_>
give it time, don't hesitate to look stuff up if you feel like there's a better way to do something
<quazimodo>
NinjaOps: it's not looking beautiful enough
<Selinda>
synapplix, Yes it takes time.
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<ericwood_>
the minute you're doing something repetitive step back and see if there's a better way to go about it (there usually is!)
<quazimodo>
NinjaOps: honestly it's a cunt of a thing to configure sometimes
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<jhass>
jonaslund: if you're interested in type interference, you might also be interested in Crystal, which is a type interfering compiled language with a syntax very close to Ruby. Especially where their algorithm fails to interfere the types might be interesting
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<havenwood>
zotherst1pidguy: Having gosu issues?
<jhass>
jonaslund: also most of the syntax changes are due to that, so comparing ruby to it might be interesting
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<quazimodo>
sorry it took so long
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<NinjaOps>
quazimodo: nide
<NinjaOps>
nice
<jonaslund>
jhass: I stumbled upon Crystal earlier today actually, might take a peek but i've plowed a lot of type inference litterature in the last year(s) :)
<quazimodo>
NinjaOps: i went to town on the theme
<quazimodo>
really ought to load up a normal theme :P
<ponga>
crystal!
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<quazimodo>
whats Crystal
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<synapplix>
ericwood_: vim-pathogen, Vundle, vim-addon-manager -- all try to do similar things?
<ericwood_>
synapplix: somewhat. I recommend Vundle honestly
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<jonaslund>
jhass: Kinda short on time to get the thesis done right now so new reading has to go on the backburner, thanks for pointing at it though :)
<ponga>
quazimodo: soft type language that has syntax similar to ruby
<ericwood_>
pathogen is great if you're developing plugins and want to do some of the management manually but Vundle is more what you're looking for imho
<quazimodo>
ponga: what's the poin?
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<ponga>
its faster, its compiled
<synapplix>
ericwood_: for that i am here, .. recommendations :-) thanks
<ponga>
it builds exe
<ponga>
standalone
<quazimodo>
ponga: yeah but, what's the point?
<quazimodo>
i mean, those are things it does, but what's it's selling point
<quazimodo>
why would I use it?
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<quazimodo>
(learning haskell over here)
<ponga>
quazimodo: its compiled and faster
<gr33n7007h>
use lua
<quazimodo>
lua's cool
<quazimodo>
love3d
<quazimodo>
love2d?
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<quazimodo>
3d i thing
<quazimodo>
i can't remember
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<gr33n7007h>
lua is awesome imo
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<quazimodo>
i'm gonna stick to haskell tho
<quazimodo>
freaking amazing language
<dreinull75>
I love how Integer.new(3) doesn't work. Breaks my cool code.
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<aiRness>
Hello. Is the "info" log level include warn and err on the logger?
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<Selinda>
Any recommended for book towards mastering Ruby for a C++ geek?
<Selinda>
(Mainly interested in web development)
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<havenwood>
Selinda: The Well-Grounded Rubyist, Second Edition or The Ruby Programming Language are good books for a coder. ;)
<jhass>
aiRness: should be
<aiRness>
jhass: ok
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<Selinda>
havenwood, Hm, I have looked into The Well-Grounded Rubyist before a bit but it seems a bit dry.
<Sou|cutter>
Selinda: learning ruby the language and applying that to web development are two slightly different things. Could probably go for books on both topics separately
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<jhass>
Selinda: or if you're up to something more interactive, codeschool.com might be something for you
<Selinda>
Nah I prefer books really.
<Selinda>
I hate missing important stuff.
<havenwood>
What's a book that covers Rack apps well?
<Sou|cutter>
j/k, that would be a great title though
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<havenwood>
jhass: I was thinking more the ecosystem, like Rack adapters and webservers. I guess it changes a good bit over time but I'd be interested in a survey of the ecosystem.
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<adaedra>
jhass: wow, since you first discovered ruby?
<Selinda>
I know really nothing about Ruby.
<jhass>
adaedra: started contributing to diaspora and picked up rails & ruby in the process
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* gr33n7007h
shocked
<adaedra>
wow
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<Selinda>
Would you recommend Ruby and RoR for web development now days? I mean there is Nodejs and such languages starting to mature.
<jhass>
it always depends on what you want to do
<adaedra>
NodeJS?
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<adaedra>
Yuck yuck yuck
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<jhass>
web development is a diverse topic, these days you can ask the same question, taking out the word web and it's pretty equivalent
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<Selinda>
Hm?
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<jhass>
you write code that produces something, if that something happens to be a bunch of text that can be read as HTML & CSS you call it web development, if it's a bunch of text that can be nicely displayed on a terminal you call it CLI development
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<jhass>
"Is X good for web development?" is as good of a question like "Is X good for development?"
<adaedra>
er
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<adaedra>
I may oppose that
<jhass>
the question you need to ask is "Is X good for my [specific goal]?"
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<adaedra>
A language may be usable for general development, but not provide fit tools for web and be then not really good for web
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<jhass>
and even then "good" is very much open to interpretation
<adaedra>
yeah
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<Selinda>
jhass, I know quite how to ask the question. I have been a system developer for a lot of years. I'm not familiar with the web, which I want to be a part of now.
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<jhass>
"what's a good language to write GUIs?" Could you answer that question? Because I can't
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<Selinda>
That's not the same at all. A similar question would be, what's a good language for system development?
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<jhass>
"what's a good language to write a Gtk application?" might be easier to answer, it narrows down the scope already, however the good question to ask is "what should I use to write this simple calendar application with feature X and Y to be used by people using Gnome?"
<DefV>
I wouldn't know how to answer that
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<DefV>
"It depends on your background"
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<eam>
there are pretty clearly some language which are good for web development and some which are not -- the question is fine
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<eam>
I wouldn't use forth to make a webapp
<jhass>
well, then I better bail out of it I guess
<nickjj>
jhass, yeah or what platform it's designed to run on
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<waxjar>
to answer your question Selinda, yes i would. Ruby's ecosystem for webdevelopment is excelllent and it doesn't perform too bad
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<Selinda>
This is not philosophy, either you don't want to understand the question or you don't know the answer yourself.
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<eam>
ruby is a good language for prototyping things quickly or for processing text
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<jhass>
my point is that I simply can't recommend a single tool for all usecases I can imagine under the term "web development"
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<DefV>
Ruby is a bad language to create a contact form for a website
<Selinda>
jhass, Then say instead what Ruby is good and bad for. I already told you, I know nothing about Ruby, All you need is common sense.
<DefV>
but it's a good language to build a system like Basecamp
<DefV>
"But wouldn't basecamp be better built with x?"
<DefV>
It depends
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<DefV>
if you have a team of developers proficient in PHP, Ruby is a bad language to start creating a web app in
<jhass>
What's C good for?
<Selinda>
eam, waxjar Hm yea I also heard that. At what scale of a project would you say Ruby will start performing less good? For example, how long can you go with the prototype?
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<jhass>
nvm, I should bail out
<DefV>
haha jhass
<Selinda>
jhass, Embedded systems and low level programming.
<eam>
Selinda: ruby will work indefinitely. When capex of your deployed base is more expensive than developer time, you might consider something more efficient
<RegulationD>
Selinda, it depends on how much money you have to spend on servers :)
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<jhass>
Selinda: so Gtk made a bad choice by using C
<waxjar>
Selinda, hard to answer that. it'll depend on what your application does
<Selinda>
jhass, Yep.
<wasamasa>
lol
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<jhass>
no further questions
<Selinda>
Actually, it's 2015.
<eam>
jhass: frankly, C is a poor choice for business logic in GUI apps
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<jhass>
"yes, Ruby is good for web development" is my answer for you then
<wasamasa>
eam: let's use javascript instead
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<eam>
wasamasa: javascript is a poor choice for .. anything
<wasamasa>
eam: yet it's used for that kind of thing :P
<Selinda>
Even tho C is used a lot because of legacy code, it is obsolete. So yes to your question jhass .
<waxjar>
it's a good choice for humourous talks! :D
<eam>
wasamasa: yeah, installed base is huge
<wasamasa>
eam: welcome to qml
<adaedra>
eam: too bad, I have to use it for in browser interraction
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<eam>
in a similar vein I write a lot of C, though I know it's not the best tool for most jobs
<Selinda>
eam, When say I should consider another language, you meant a statically one correct?
<eam>
Selinda: at that point it depends on the details of what you're doing
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<Selinda>
Well, github was made with RoR (if I'm not mistaken) and it's a pretty big project.
<eam>
when you're at a point that you consider moving from ruby to another language you'll be able to hire someone to do a proper analysis
<DefV>
OMG YOUR IGNORANCE IS HURTING MY BRAIN
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<adaedra>
what now
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<DefV>
Selinda: you can't make that kind of statement
<RegulationD>
twitter was predominantly Rails for a long time before switching to (predominantly) Scala (I think). but they also had lots of VC dollars
<Selinda>
eam, Of course, that's true.
<DefV>
what makes Github work is a combination of smart people, the right tools at the right place, a lot of good caching, ...
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<adaedra>
aaaaand?
<DefV>
but Github could've been written in PHP, Go, Elixir, Python, ...
<DefV>
it depends on your team
<DefV>
Facebook uses PHP
<DefV>
maybe you should consider that
<adaedra>
What's the point
<Selinda>
DefV, Facebook uses PHP?
<DefV>
jup
<Selinda>
You should go update yourself about the JIT and Hack
<DefV>
so does Wikipedia
<DefV>
..
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<DefV>
Selinda: no matter their runtime
<DefV>
they still use PHP
<DefV>
I could be using JRuby in production, I'm still "writing Ruby"
<adaedra>
AAAAAAAAAAND?
<Selinda>
DefV, You have misunderstood the whole thing.
<adaedra>
I thought we were talking about viability of Ruby for the web
<DefV>
OK, good, I'll go that route
<adaedra>
Were we not?
<DefV>
yes. Ruby is a very good option to do Web-development
<DefV>
both small and big to huge projects have succesfully been built in Ruby
<DefV>
some projects (like twitter) moved away from it though
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<DefV>
but developers are on the fence wether this was because of Ruby not "scaling", or poor developer decisions
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<Selinda>
DefV, How many years of experience do you have in development?
<Selinda>
In general.
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<DefV>
professionally 9 years
<Selinda>
What languages?
<DefV>
Perl, PHP, Python, Ruby, Go, Nodejs
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<eam>
Selinda: speaking of alternate runtimes, jruby is often used for certain workloads
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<DefV>
But I'm best at Ruby
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<Senjai>
Selinda: Thats a silly question, I know people with 8+ years of experience who are dumb as a doorknob
<eam>
yahoo is also primarily php. It's an ugly language, but anything can be scaled
<adaedra>
Selinda: like a 9-years-old doorknob?
<adaedra>
Senjai, not Selinda
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<Senjai>
I'm late to the party here but: C is a poor language for interfaces due to how well interfaces fit within the object orientated much better than a system without OOP paradigms. Though it can still be made to work, and work cleanly
<Senjai>
Facebook does NOT use php, they use a very hacked up version of PHP because PHP is bad
<Selinda>
Senjai, A silly question? I was interested how long he/she have been developing. Stop fuking making your own definition that I consider him/her bad.
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<adaedra>
Selinda, How many years of experience do you have in asking questions?
<DefV>
My point is just that you can't say yes to the Q "is X good for Y" when Y covers so much ground
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<DefV>
would I use ruby for a content site? Yes
<havenwood>
Is spaghetti-lang good for web dev?
<DefV>
Would I use ruby for a websocket server? Probably not
<adaedra>
DefV: yeah, I think discussion started with that, trying to break down the real need
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<DefV>
Would I use elixir for a content site? No. Why not, because I don't know the language
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<DefV>
Would it be a good language to do web dev in? Probably
<Senjai>
Ruby on rails powers some extremely high traffic sites. TBH, use whatever tool your most productive in
<Selinda>
<DefV> Would it be a good language to do web dev in? Probably
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<Selinda>
Which brings you back to my question :)
<Selinda>
Nailed it.
<Senjai>
By the time you need to change due to scaling, or some other opaque restraint, you'll have your VC funding or customer base or whatever
<DefV>
Senjai nails it
<DefV>
use whatever you're most productive in
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<havenwood>
<kerrizor>
Senjai - I'd agree, with the caveat that languages tend to have something they're really good at, and so the "best language" is the one whose strengths match up to the problem posed by the domain
<adaedra>
srsly
<adaedra>
ffs
<Selinda>
DefV, That would be overkill. My experience are heavily in C, C++, x86 asm and some Python.
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<Senjai>
Selinda: You wouldnt be most productive in C++ and C for webdev, probably would be in pythong
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<Senjai>
same rule applies
<Senjai>
use python then
<DefV>
Selinda: go would also be a good fit for you then
<adaedra>
Go use asm for webdev
<adaedra>
It's webscale
<DefV>
golang*
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<havenwood>
go-long
<Selinda>
adaedra, You are just making stupid comments.
<Senjai>
Selinda: Hey, dont batter people
<havenwood>
Senjai: Be nice.
<DefV>
havenwood: behave
<Senjai>
havenwood: You did it again ...
<havenwood>
^.^
<adaedra>
Senjai: sorry, forgot the /s switch.
<Senjai>
:P
<adaedra>
Rah
<adaedra>
Selinda: sorry, forgot the /s switch.
<adaedra>
Senjai: soory, tab is silly today.
<Senjai>
All good
<Senjai>
I should reserve all nicknames with an e after an S
<Senjai>
#fixedforever
<havenwood>
DefV: Just saying, it's verbose.
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<jhass>
Senjai: start with everything that has xy next
<havenwood>
DefV: Is there an untoward innuendo I'm missing or are you jesting?
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<Senjai>
jhass: You're a genius!
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<jhass>
I know right! I feel so smart right now!
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<jhass>
but actually it'd eat up 80% of the spammer nicks, so it's a good cause!
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<havenwood>
I wonder how well the classifier gem could spot regular trolls here. Might be fun to have ruboto try to spot them.
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<failshell>
is it possible to set environment variables from with some code?
<failshell>
tried to do it with `` or system() and that doesnt seem to work
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<jhass>
you can not modify the environment of the parent process, only of your own process and its child processes
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<failshell>
jhass: i dont want to set it for the parent, but the system itself
<apeiros>
the current process?
<apeiros>
ENV[]
<failshell>
no the shell
<apeiros>
but why'd you do that?
<jhass>
which shell? that sounds a lot like the parent process
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<apeiros>
and `` opens a subshell, which means a child-process, so setting an env var there is pointless (because as jhass already said - you can't affect the parent)
<failshell>
ok
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<toretore>
failshell: it might help to explain why you want to do this
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<failshell>
this tool im writing needs to save various environment variables so that another tool can use them
<toretore>
still too vague
<failshell>
basically, use various AWS secrets depending on which account needs to be used
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<toretore>
so you have a scope, in which you want to set some vars?
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<toretore>
and you have a program that can find the contents you want to put in these vars?
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<toretore>
kind of like `VAR=program`
<failshell>
tool1 sets a bunch of symlinks to point to the required directories. it needs to set env variables also. so that when tool2 runs, it can read those env variables.
<failshell>
2 different processes
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<toretore>
what you are trying to do is cause a side effect, which most of the time is undesirable and not the best way to do things
<apeiros>
failshell: again, as said - you can't set env vars for unrelated processes. only for child processes.
<failshell>
apeiros: i got that. he wanted more detail
<apeiros>
ok
<failshell>
toretore: its not a side effect.
<toretore>
is too
<apeiros>
failshell: but the implication of that restriction (which comes from the system, not ruby) has an implication on your design. i.e. you probably have to rethink that two process thing.
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<baweaver_>
(n) a secondary, typically undesirable effect of a drug or medical treatment
<toretore>
>> def tool1; var = 'foo'; end; def tool2; p var; end; tool1; tool2
<ruboto>
toretore # => undefined local variable or method `var' for main:Object (NameError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/319515)
<jhass>
well, it'll work if the second tool is launched by the first
<toretore>
that is what you're trying to do ^
<apeiros>
you could a) start other processes from a process which collects the env vars
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<failshell>
apeiros: yeah, that's what im pondering right now
<apeiros>
or b) write the env vars into a file the shell you start the other processes from sources
<baweaver_>
JSON/YAML config files.
<failshell>
just checked, you can't do it with bash either
<rubynoon>
can you help me to understand the issue?
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<apeiros>
rubynoon: you'll have to check your system's logs to figure why it was killed
<apeiros>
likely candidates: out of memory, out of file descriptors
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<rubynoon>
@apeiros How to find the sytem log?
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<apeiros>
rubynoon: I don't know your system
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<rubynoon>
@apeiros sorry, this is a VM with buntu 14.04
<apeiros>
then probably somewhere in /var/log
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<rubynoon>
@apeiros gott it
<rubynoon>
@apeiros ERROR:socket IOError args: (-2, 'Name or service not known')
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<apeiros>
that sounds like an odd reason to kill a script, though
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<rubynoon>
@apeiros I guess the server of the website was down for few moments.
<apeiros>
that should not cause your OS to kill your script
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<rubynoon>
@apeiros oh, that's true.
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<Outlastsheep>
Hmm.
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<Outlastsheep>
All UNICODE characters are indicated with '\uXXXX' with the 'X' being a digit?
<jhass>
"indicated"?
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<jhass>
you can define all of them like that
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<Outlastsheep>
Good, good.
<Outlastsheep>
With 'indicated' I meant how they were defined, yeah.
<Outlastsheep>
They're /ALWAYS/ 4 digits?
<jhass>
well, hexadecimal digits
<Outlastsheep>
Fair 'nuff. As long as it's always 4 of them cx
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<sohrab>
pulling my hair out trying to trace this bug
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<GaryOak_>
what's going on?
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<nettoweb>
guys Im trying to upgrade to ruby 2.0 but there some files that are using Iconv.conv
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<apeiros>
jhass: not correct re 4 hex digits unicode
<adaedra>
Isn't it String#encode now?
<jhass>
apeiros: educate me!
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<apeiros>
4 hex digits = 2 bytes
<nettoweb>
adaedra I think so, but how I convert it? for example: today I have it Iconv.conv('UTF-8//IGNORE', 'UTF-8', @q + ' ')[0..-2] but dont know how to convert because till now I just used Iconv
<bmurt>
hey ya'll, question for you regarding Mechanize. im trying to fill out a form, but it looks like the first <select> has a delay after the inital selection which i think is throwing off my other <select> code further down. is there a way to handle this type of behavior?
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<bmurt>
i have license_status = search_form.field_with(:id => "MainContent_ddlLicenseStatus").value = "A"
<bmurt>
which works, but the other selects are not getting populated in the search results
<_blizzy_>
thanks, ekaleido
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<bmurt>
it looks like those elements might be disabled until the first select is chosen
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<_blizzy_>
hmm, if I could find out how the api for eval.in works
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<adaedra>
_blizzy_: last time I checked, it was a difficult thing to achieve
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<_blizzy_>
adaedra, oh. c:
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<Mon_Ouie>
Do you mean using eval.in in your program or implementing something similar to the sandbox used in eval.in?
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<_blizzy_>
well, the latter
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<_blizzy_>
I want to use a ruby sandbox for my eval command that I have
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<_blizzy_>
atm it uses eval, but only I can use the command
<_blizzy_>
because security reasons.
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<jhass>
playpen seems fairly solid
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<Mon_Ouie>
eval-in used something based on ptrace for sandboxing, I'm not sure on the details
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<abyss>
apeiros: profiles shows that nil# String#=~ and Regexp#match are the most consuming time methods...
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<Mon_Ouie>
Other solutions that I have seen rely on running the Ruby process in a virtual machine
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<apeiros>
abyss: I'm more interested in demo data :-p
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<apeiros>
also I wonder whether those =~ happen in strptime
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<abyss>
I installed ruby-prof as well
<abyss>
apeiros: do you need a lot of lines or only few?;)
<apeiros>
I'd say ~100 are probably sufficient
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<abyss>
I don't know what is that nil# but ruby-prof shows: 51% String#=~ and 36% Regexp#match
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<abyss>
sorry I used the old script, it shows Regexp#match is the most consuming
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<apeiros>
hm, that `nil#` is odd
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<apeiros>
I first thought you wrote something wrong, but it's indeed there…
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<_blizzy_>
I'm thinking of downgrading ruby to 2.2.0
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<abyss>
;)
<havenwood>
_blizzy_: having 2.2.2 issues or just yearning for adventure?
<abyss>
I using ruby-prof now
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<_blizzy_>
havenwood, well, I might wait. nokogiri doesn't work yet on 2.2.2
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<last_staff>
crowell: doesn't that give me the hostname instead of the IP?
<apeiros>
abyss: yes, I'd expect awk to be faster. it was built for that purpose :)
<crowell>
last_staff: no, it gives you the IP
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<crowell>
Socket.gethostname gives you the hostname
<abyss>
yeah, but I supposed the differences would be in a few minutes not 20min ;)
<crowell>
IPSocket.getaddress gets you the ip of the hostname :P
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<last_staff>
crowell: huh, cool. How do I force ipv4-format?
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<last_staff>
...i asked without searching online first... Dx
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<apeiros>
abyss: btw., I have no idea what that nil# is.
<apeiros>
nil# and =~ are the making up 66% of the execution time now. so I guess optimizing the regex is the most promising. but my attempts failed badly :(
<Temur>
How does the yield keyword work?
<abyss>
First I did it with awk and outcomes I parsed in php and whole took about few seconds. I had to rewrite it in order to do more things with data... But I did exactly the same that I'm doing with awk+php and for awk+php it last about few seconds for ruby about 10minutes or more
<adaedra>
Temur: you mean, how to use it, or the internals?
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<last_staff>
crowell: ruby-doc actually didn't give me any info on forcing ipv4 output from IPSocket.getaddress
<Temur>
adaedra, how to use it
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<adaedra>
Temur: you use it in methods that takes a block as argument. When you call yield, it will calls the given block.
<Temur>
oh
<Temur>
That makes sense
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<adaedra>
i.e. def foo; yield; end then foo do puts "Hello" end will puts "Hello"
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<adaedra>
You can also give arguments to yield, which will be passed to the block
<Temur>
ok
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<adaedra>
It's an alternative way of explicitely naming the block argument with & then calling .call on the argument
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<b4tm4n>
when moving a RoR application to nginx/unicorn, is it just the rails server that is replaced?
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<adaedra>
If you run Rails in production mode with default settings, you also have to serve /public yourself through nginx
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<b4tm4n>
the command line i was using before moving to production was "redis-server & bundle exec sidekiq -l log/sidekiq.log & bundle exec rails s &"
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<b4tm4n>
no I am using nginx/unicorn the website is working, but some of the functionality is not - i'm wondering if i still need to be running sidekiq for example
<adaedra>
yes
<adaedra>
unicorn is just a rails server, it replaces rails s
<b4tm4n>
what about redis-server?
<b4tm4n>
and unicorn is just a proxy for nginx?
<adaedra>
you also have to have it run, but I think you can relay that to a daemon, see your distribution
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<adaedra>
unicorn will act as a server, and nginx is a front server which will pass requests to unicorn
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<adaedra>
But those are issues you should discuss with #RubyOnRails
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<b4tm4n>
yeah, no one responded there - adaedra thanks for your input!
<adaedra>
ah
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<adaedra>
In that case, just state it when you introduce the question, so we know it is pending somewhere else, b4tm4n
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<b4tm4n>
adaedra, will do
<adaedra>
thanks
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<shellfu>
I have a string like: %{::operatingsystem}-%{::kernel}, and a hash with operatingsystem, and kernel as keys with their respective values. I have been playing with gsub, but can only seem to replace one or the other. I am currently using scan on the string then in a block im using gsub.
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<shevy>
shellfu it is possible with .gsub
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<shevy>
you can use capture groups + "\\1" or `\\1'
<poskoli>
is a degree necessary for being in a programming bootcamp?
<poskoli>
I'm 23 with a GED and I failed college
<shellfu>
I havent used \\1 before. I will read up on their usage.
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<poskoli>
I want to go to a programming bootcamp
<xxneolithicxx>
poskoli: what in the world is a programming bootcamp
<poskoli>
and find work after
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<ytti>
only thing you need to do, is to write code
<ytti>
and you certainly can be employable
<xxneolithicxx>
the bar for the is very low
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<xxneolithicxx>
a lot of times too low lol
<xxneolithicxx>
*that
<GaryOak_>
If I know Ruby can I get a decent job doing Rails?
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<ytti>
small problem is, that it it takes somewhat untrivial amount of hours
<ytti>
and if you keep pushing writing code back with reasons like 'can i attend bootcamp' or 'do i have the right book'
<ytti>
it might be, that you're not motivated enough to do it
<xxneolithicxx>
^ well said
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<ytti>
write code 2h a day, and you'll certainly can get a 50k/year job in a year
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<adaedra>
*_*
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<Senjai>
ytti: wat
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<poskoli>
I am motivated. I'm preparinng for the program right now
<Senjai>
GaryOak_: Rails is just ruby, so sure
<ytti>
poskoli, then i think there is no reason why you won't succeed
<Senjai>
ytti: Not everyone can actually solve problems with code.
<GaryOak_>
For me I need to build a project, or else it gets boring, it's not like practicing a sport where you can practice just kicking for 2 hours though
<ytti>
Senjai, i disagree
<adaedra>
So fight
<ytti>
if we excluded legally mentally handicapped people
<Senjai>
poskoli: Have you done any coding previously?
<ytti>
anyone can be employable programmer
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<poskoli>
I'm 23 with a GED and I failed a lot of college courses. I don't think I'll get into a 4 year school and if I do I'll be 25-27 when I graduate
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<Senjai>
poskoli: Have you done any coding previously?
<poskoli>
I started over a year ago and I'm now just getting the hang of it
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<shellfu>
aha. thanks shevy, didnt know about accessing matched groups. Thanks. Ill play around with this for awhile, and if I have further issues ill just ask :)
<Senjai>
ytti: You obviously havent seen the codebases I have, there is a large portion of "employable" programmers, that should never be emplyoed. I call them cut and paste, or brute force programmers.
<poskoli>
coding was the hardest thing I've ever tried to learn in my life
<xxneolithicxx>
I agree with Senjai, i find a lot of people get caught up over programming language semantics and never get to a position where they learn to solve a problem first and translate to language semantics later
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<Senjai>
poskoli: The best programming bootcamps dont accept just everyone, and you would want to avoid the ones you do
<Senjai>
poskoli: A bootcamp is not really necessary, you can get into the industry self taught after 5 months or so of decent self study
<poskoli>
I already got accepted into one
<Senjai>
poskoli: YOu actually have to like coding, because the studying never stops.. ever.
<ytti>
xxneolithicxx, Senjai now it seeems we're discussing two different matters, can anyone who wants be employed
<poskoli>
senjai I don't know how to study. that is why I failed school :)
<Senjai>
You cant just do it for the money, there are people who do and succeed, but most will fail
<poskoli>
:(
<ytti>
and then should they
<ytti>
almost certainly we can find people, who would say none of us should be employable
<ytti>
and we can find people who say no ruby code should be ran in production
<ytti>
but those are opinions, and not very interesting
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<ytti>
what is interesting, someone working minimum wage can become programmer, and earn much better living
<ytti>
and only thing they need to do, is to put in the hours
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<xxneolithicxx>
you can do it, and yes even a crappy coder can make better than min wage
<GaryOak_>
and figure out how to sell themselves in an interview
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<Senjai>
ytti: I dunno man, I make my living fixing mistakes that drove businesses to the brink of failure
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<xxneolithicxx>
but i guess what we were saying is that most of these types dont end up being very good programmers
<ytti>
what is good? is it normal distribution?
<xxneolithicxx>
a good programmer is a problem solver first and can translate into any language of choice
<ytti>
if so, then 97% of people are 2 standard deviation away from average programmer
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<ytti>
i.e. there is 97% change that you won't be terrible or exceptional
<xxneolithicxx>
if you cant solve a problem you are the brute forcer/copy paster Senjai mentioned
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<xxneolithicxx>
and you write shitty code
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<Senjai>
And you make us lots of money
<Senjai>
because the business who trusted you, are now in a huge trench of despair
<Senjai>
and have to hire external consultancies to fix their stuff, and do it the right way (tm)
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<ytti>
if it's normal distribution, as explained, then at least 97% will carry their weight
<ytti>
so trying to place artificial barriers to people, before they even start
<ytti>
that it takes some exceptional qualities to succeed, is not very productive
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<ytti>
only exceptional quality is motivation and putting in the hours
<Senjai>
All I'm saying, is you gotta love coding to be good at it, its a 1% scenario where that case is not the rule
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<Senjai>
People who dont love coding and problem solving, generally dont practice
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<GaryOak_>
I just like learning new stuff
<Senjai>
GaryOak_: Then you'll do fine :)
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<GaryOak_>
I already have a job though, I just can't work on stuff outside of work :(
<bricker>
Why?
<GaryOak_>
No internal motivation to do that
<bricker>
ah
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<GaryOak_>
I try, but I start lots of projects, and never finish any
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<bricker>
GaryOak_: I find that working on side projects is best when there's a real, immediate use for it, and often that is related to work. For example, some bug fix or feature addition to an OSS that your company is using.
<Senjai>
Dont need to finish projects. I start lots of projects to learn x, once I've learned x, I often dont complete them
<bricker>
Or some internal tool or whatever
<GaryOak_>
I do contrib back to OSS for work projects, but generally on company time
<bricker>
I have no motivation to start a project for the sole purpose of learning something. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. If I'm going to work on a project, why not get something useful out of it while learning something at the same time.
<ytti>
we're all spending time on irc right now, which is procrastination 1-0-1
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<GaryOak_>
hahaha
<bricker>
learning is easy, applying is difficult. So if you can combine both into the same process, more efficient.
<ytti>
if we'd ve all the way in the right in the long tail
<ytti>
we wouldn't irc
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<Senjai>
I use IRC to relax from thinking
<Senjai>
to get fresh eyes on the problem, after 30 ish mins
<Senjai>
err, 30 mins might be exagerrating
<xxneolithicxx>
its the only place i can come to speak to above semi competent ppl
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<Senjai>
xxneolithicxx: Competence is still rare trust me :P, lots of good folk here though
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<i8igmac>
inside the block, x is not recognized as a html document
<i8igmac>
x.html? => false
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<i8igmac>
how would i make x a html document?
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<i8igmac>
puts Nokogiri::HTML(x.to_s)
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<Eiam_>
I want to map over an array of strings and have it make a regex.union.. it would seem fairly basic, strings.map { |x| Regex.union(/#{x}/)} except this gives me an array of regex, instead of a Regexp like you'd make with Regex.union ... suggestions?
<Eiam_>
I guess I could try to join them with | or something
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