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* tsume
drops a pin
<tsume>
*ting tiink tk tk tk*
<mustachio>
wasting pins!
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<mflux>
mellum, btw, emacs has 'ctypes' for that, that it finds all types from source code for colorization
<mflux>
but unfortunately it becomes unbearably slow when you have many files open and you load a new one -> all other buffers need to be recolored
<mflux>
tuareg mode could use the output from -dtypes, as it uses for implementing type information ;)
<mflux>
..wouldn't work after you modify the code though..
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<vincenz>
Hi
<vincenz>
Anyone know a wiki that works stdalone ?
<pango>
what do you mean, stdalone ? no db ?
<vincenz>
well ... most wikis use files instead of db
<vincenz>
I mean no apache
<pango>
don't know... what's wrong with apache ?
<vincenz>
it's my computer at work, don't got admin rights
<vincenz>
so just want to run a prog that works on por 80
<pango>
if you don't have root rights, you won't be able to bind to low ports
<vincenz>
well then I'll bind it on a higher port
<pango>
and then you use apache too, IIRC
<vincenz>
I want something lighterweight
<vincenz>
simple prog...
<pango>
s/you/you can/
<vincenz>
zoo
<vincenz>
woo even
<solarwind>
All the wikies I tried were based on Apache and PHP.
<vincenz>
one written in ERLANG
<pango>
some wikis can be run as CGIs, if you can find a lighter web server that accepts CGIs, something can probably be done
<vincenz>
the one I've used so far is based on python
<solarwind>
Oh, it also implements a custom web server?
<solarwind>
I was thinking along the lines of pydoc.
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<Svrog>
hi
<Svrog>
has anyone here used c--?
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<Ag_47>
wow. camlers.
<Ag_47>
anyone publicly alive?
<mellum>
no, just lurkers here
<Ag_47>
i thought that
<Ag_47>
r there anyone who wrote anything with jabbr?
<solarwind>
You forgot an A and an E.
<Ag_47>
me rait bad englisch
<Ag_47>
;)
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<Ag_47>
does anybody here what _jabbr_ (spelled exactly this way) is?
<Ag_47>
know, sorry, does anybody know, etc.
<mellum>
Google usually does.
<Ag_47>
i've already asked google. and i know what it is. i just try to find anybody with programming experience in it.
<Ag_47>
cause there is a _big_ error in the library afaik.
<Ag_47>
and the author kinda abandoned his project.
<solarwind>
What version that library has?
<Ag_47>
0.0.2002112
<Ag_47>
afaik
<solarwind>
No wonder there's an error in it.
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<Ag_47>
that's te question. probably there's somebody who's familiar with one..
<solarwind>
Can't you have a look into that lib and fix the problem?
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<Ag_47>
solarwind: i try to.. but it is stuck somewhere in yaxpodom, which is abandoned by the same author, too.
<Ag_47>
:(
<solarwind>
Lovely.
<Ag_47>
i can't believe nobody hasn't worked with xmpp/ocaml...
<vincenz>
double negative
<solarwind>
Common in latin languages :)
<Ag_47>
slavic as well ;)
<solarwind>
Yes.
<picard>
but not in english
<vincenz>
yes, and besides your sentence does not make sense
<vincenz>
you can not believe that nobody hasn't worked
<vincenz>
so you can not believe that anybody has worked
<vincenz>
so you think it's crap
<Ag_47>
vincenz: crap what?
<vincenz>
and nobody hasn't is not correct in english
* solarwind
steals the syntax analyser from vincenz
<vincenz>
:P
<Ag_47>
vincenz: ok, my teacher Ö)
<vincenz>
your sensei
* vincenz
bows
* Ag_47
bows wata'k'shi va gak'sei des ;)
<vincenz>
en spreek nu eens een taal die ik ken
<Ag_47>
me understand not
<solarwind>
That's Dutch.
<vincenz>
me neither what you said before
<vincenz>
correct solarwind
<Ag_47>
that one was kinda japanese. but don't force me to curse russian here :D
<picard>
russian is too confusing
<Ag_47>
picard: and i'm living in it, imagine ;)
<picard>
I was born in ukraine
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<Ag_47>
that's why i like programming languages lica ocaml, haskell, etc.
<Ag_47>
picard: i'm 1/4 ukrainian :)
<picard>
im 0/4 ukrainian
<Ag_47>
picard: however
<picard>
half cossack, half jewish
<Ag_47>
picard: that's a binary warhead, you know?
<picard>
so I've heard
<Ag_47>
picard: /me is just an ukrussianjew, not that marginal ;)
* Ag_47
reads rfc3920
* vincenz
is 0/3.14 russian
* vincenz
is 0/2.7 jew
<picard>
but quite belgian
<vincenz>
rihgt
<vincenz>
though if you ever repeat that I might have to smack you
<vincenz>
cause I don't feel belgian AT ALL
<Ag_47>
see ya... must reboot to windows, sorry
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<picard>
so my french teacher in high school told me that the french treat the belgians like americans treat candians
<mattam>
you're belgian vincenz ?
<vincenz>
sadly...yes
<mattam>
:)
* vincenz
has lived most of my life abroad
* vincenz
doesn't feel belgian
<vincenz>
I am european
<vincenz>
:)
<mattam>
nobody does apparently
<vincenz>
lol
<vincenz>
dis le francais
<vincenz>
qme j'suis flamand pas wallons alors on devrait avoir moin de probs
<vincenz>
...moins
<picard>
vincenz: I have lived *all* of my life abroad
<solarwind>
vincenz: Oh, you're belgian. In this case, that language wasn't Flemish?
<mattam>
:)
<vincenz>
yes it was
<vincenz>
but flemish = dutch
<vincenz>
a FEW words change
<solarwind>
A dialect though.
<vincenz>
and pronounciation
<vincenz>
it's like uk english and us english
<solarwind>
*nod*
<mattam>
i heard there are still independentists for both sides in belgian, is that right ?
<vincenz>
there's assholes in all of the world
<mattam>
that i know
<vincenz>
just like those people in the north of italy of the "lega nord"
<vincenz>
*rolls his eyes*
<vincenz>
it's so petty
<mattam>
hmm
<picard>
at least you guys dont have to deal with texas
dan2 is now known as beta3
<mattam>
we have britains, basques and corsicans(?)
<vincenz>
and parigiens
<mattam>
héhé
<mattam>
texas wants its independency ?
<picard>
mattam: so if you ask most normal americans where they are from they will say america... but texans will say texas
<vincenz>
of cours
<vincenz>
texas will be the next afghanistan
<vincenz>
catholic fundamentalists with rifles
<mattam>
that would be real fun
<picard>
vincenz: there aren't many catholics there
<vincenz>
already the us has closed it's borders in a major way
<vincenz>
and they appeal to god "cfr bush"
<vincenz>
and most of the middle states don't have a clue of the outside world
<solarwind>
To quote Chris Rea on Texas "big steaks, big girls, no trouble there, that's the place for me, I'm goin' to Texas".
<vincenz>
imo in 20 years the us will be a third world country
<vincenz>
fundamentalist and isolated
<vincenz>
cause people will start to ignore the us and do commerce with the new china
<vincenz>
as the us becomes more and more paranoid and republican and religiously fundamentalist
<picard>
vincenz: I doubt that will be true, most of the US has always been really backwards. But the east cost is very liberal
<mattam>
and china is still a dictarorship...
<vincenz>
they better get back on top of it
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<vincenz>
china is a great new market
<picard>
vincenz: take a look at the election results, it was south vs north east
<vincenz>
if the us keeps up their aggressive and closed off attitude...
<vincenz>
picard: I'm just saying... they better jump to the other side soon..
<vincenz>
I heard there's a LOT LESS foreign phd students whatnot in the us
<picard>
vincenz: well also about the borders, we are more open than a lot of countries... for example it is much easier to become a US citizen then a french citizen
<vincenz>
I'm not talking about citizenship
<vincenz>
just entering the coutnry
<vincenz>
and trust me, us is a lot harder
<mattam>
911 syndrome
<vincenz>
citizenship is not a necessary thing
* vincenz
nods at mattam
<vincenz>
but even before... always been hard to get into the us
<picard>
vincenz: no, I know first hand because I become a us citizen, but I am looking into bolting the country because I dont much like it here
<picard>
vincenz: and it is fairly difficult to get a citizenship in say france
<vincenz>
picard: see most foreigners flee
<vincenz>
picard: you dont NEED citizenship
<vincenz>
just residency
<picard>
vincenz: a lot of foreigners are fairly happy
<picard>
vincenz: well I am probably going to go to israel soon
<mattam>
we don't give citizenship easily that's right
<vincenz>
mattam: but it's not needed
<vincenz>
mattam: and yes you do
<picard>
belgium gives it pretty easily
<vincenz>
yip
<vincenz>
but who cares about citizenship?!?
<picard>
I was actually considering belgium for a while
<mattam>
well, if you want to live here...
<vincenz>
mattam: residency is enough
<mattam>
you'll need an ID card sooner or later no ?
<picard>
vincenz: it is annoying to have just residency, I am a mathematician and I could not get a job at the NSA before I had a citizenship.... and then even after I became a US citizen I didnt pass the security check
<vincenz>
id card of your original country?
<vincenz>
picard: I told you the us was hard
<vincenz>
picard: what sort of math do you do?
<vincenz>
I might be interested
<picard>
mattam: no, if you are resident you will get an id card from the country
<picard>
vincenz: right now, I work with neural networks
<vincenz>
oh
<mattam>
oh
<picard>
vincenz: I love number theory and analysis though
<vincenz>
hmm
* vincenz
has looked into category theory
<vincenz>
gotta love that
<vincenz>
what does number theory do exactly?
<vincenz>
or analysis...
<picard>
it looks at the rigorous foundations of math (analysis that is)
* vincenz
is also gonna look into logic (linear logic... for separation logic)
<vincenz>
picard: which?
<vincenz>
everything is a foundation lately
<mattam>
it's the exact dual of categ theory and algebra vincenz
<vincenz>
ah
<vincenz>
but number theory?
<vincenz>
2 is a nice number?
<picard>
we just look at properties of math... for example fermats theorem
<Submarine>
number theory is an extension of arithmetics
* vincenz
is not a CS or math major
<Submarine>
it's like, you study whether certain algebraic objects have some nice properties, or not
* vincenz
has been studying category theory some set theory linear logic and separation logic lately
<Submarine>
you study diophantian equations
<Submarine>
etc
<picard>
vincenz: logic is a lot of fun
<vincenz>
well I am working with a logic where weakening/contraction don't always hold
<picard>
vincenz: how easy is it to get hired at a university in belgium?
<vincenz>
what's the use of studying diophantian?
<vincenz>
picard: no idea
<picard>
vincenz: for its intrisic beauty?
* vincenz
is an ee, everything has got to have a purpose ;)
<vincenz>
which means that right now I'm BOGGED down by semantics
<solarwind>
Hm.. I graduated ee as well.
* vincenz
tried to read Winskels book but found of it TOO hazy
<picard>
bah, nothing needs to have meaning or purpose
<vincenz>
so I'm rereading schmidt and then I'll do nielsen&nielsen
<mattam>
winskels book ?
<vincenz>
yah
<vincenz>
"The Formal Semantics of Programming Languages"
<vincenz>
I wish they would have some excercise solutions :/
<mattam>
TAPL has solutions for most exercices
<vincenz>
tapl is not what I need
* vincenz
needs semantics
<vincenz>
hehe
<vincenz>
too many books
<vincenz>
also got "Programming Languages - Theory and Practice" by Harper but it's too easy and not what I need
<vincenz>
then I have "Theories of Programming Langues" by Reynolds...that seems to be in the same direction
<mattam>
well, its semantics all the way.. or are you talking about models specifically ?
<vincenz>
I'm trying to form myself a bit
<vincenz>
so I can extend upon separation logic
<mattam>
what's separation logic ? (i know LL)
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<vincenz>
it treats how programs alter data
<vincenz>
having a store AND a heap
<vincenz>
store = variable -> value
<vincenz>
heap = location -> value
<vincenz>
where value = location | number
<vincenz>
(of course could be extended)
<vincenz>
and you have such things as
<vincenz>
(x -> 3) * ( y-> 5)
<vincenz>
the variables x points to 3 and y to 5
<vincenz>
and these are in separate cells
<mattam>
ok
<vincenz>
so ...
<vincenz>
(x -> 3) /\ (y -> 5) = false
<vincenz>
(x -> 3) /\ (y -> 3) = heap with one cell... and both x and y point to it
<vincenz>
(x -> 3) * (y -> 3) = heap with two cells...
<vincenz>
...
<vincenz>
x and y are variables in the store containing as value locations
<Submarine>
ah ah ah
<Submarine>
BI logic!
<vincenz>
YES
<vincenz>
Pym
<vincenz>
Mostly O'Hearn and Reynolds
<vincenz>
buy Pym covered the theoretical logic
<vincenz>
so I'm trying to form myself in semantics what not
<vincenz>
as I'm not a CS person
<vincenz>
so I have some of the lingo
<vincenz>
Submarine: you know of it?
<Submarine>
somewhat
<Submarine>
I've heard talks on it.
<Submarine>
Friend of mine doing a phd on it.
<vincenz>
who?
<vincenz>
maybe he might know other good literature that could serve my purposess
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<picard>
does ocaml support overloading?
<grirgz>
no
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<picard>
is there a function that returns the type of a variable? or that checks if the variable is an integer?
<jourdechance>
hum, what's the type of a type ?
<smimou>
it's not a type
<smimou>
it's does not exist (in caml at least)
<picard>
smimou: so if I say let a = 4;; a does not have a type?
<jourdechance>
yes, i know. I say that in order to illustrate what a strange question it is.
<smimou>
picard: no
<smimou>
but a := 4 has type unit
<mflux>
hmm
<smimou>
ah sorry
<mflux>
a does have type int, but the statement doesn't have type?
<smimou>
yes a has type int
<picard>
smimou: so i there a function that will tell me if a is an int or not?
<mflux>
in any case, it isn't really useful in ocaml even if you were able to ask a type of a binding
<mflux>
because whatever you might do with that information would lead into that the type must always be something
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<smimou>
picard: no (without a deep hacking)
<mflux>
atleast that's how I thought it, I welcome someone to point my mistake ;)
<mflux>
hmm, I did think about polymorphic functions too, but could there still be a useful case left..
<mflux>
and now something completely different: I've found this function to be immensely useful when dealing with exceptions : let valuefy s = try Value (s ()) with exn -> Exception exn
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<mflux>
especially in recursive functions
<mrvn_>
picard: You can't ask ocaml if a is an int or not, it either is always an int, never or you don't care.
<mrvn_>
picard: It's like quantum physics. By asking is this an int you influence the type and it becomes int.
<mrvn_>
sort of
<mrvn_>
picard: but for a backdoor look at Obj.*
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<picard>
thanks
<jourdechance>
if you want to retrieve types to code a sort of overloading, you can use a Constructor or a Variant.
<jourdechance>
like in : let print_string_or_int obj = match obj with `Int n -> print_int n | `String s -> print_string s;;
<mrvn_>
| _ -> print_string "<unknown>"
<jourdechance>
yep, if you want.
<mrvn_>
for an open set
<jourdechance>
print_string_or_int (`Int 5);; ==> prints "5"
<jourdechance>
and
<jourdechance>
print_string_or_int (`String "hello");; ==> prints "hello"
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<_JusSx_>
cartesian product of 2 lists
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<shrimpx>
is anyone aware of an issue with making static binaries on osx? ocamlopt -ccopt -static gives me a linking error (-lcrt0.o can't be found)
<mlh>
my guess is that crt0 is actually called something else on osx
<mlh>
or not needed
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