<tobiasBora>
Before to get the content of a module in Toplevel I used something like "module A = String";;
<tobiasBora>
but now it doesn't work anymore
<tobiasBora>
I saw a few weeks ago a workaround with a #... command, but I can't remember it's name and I can't find the link anymore
<Leonidas>
cmtptr: well, that's a first step. Awaiting your progress on Saturday and Sunday :)
<Leonidas>
tobiasBora: still works for me in utop…
<Leonidas>
module A = String;;
<tobiasBora>
Leonidas: But it does not work in the classic ocaml "shell" (just run ocaml)
<Leonidas>
tobiasBora: does anyone still use that? :p
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<tobiasBora>
Yes me :D I use it with tuared mode in emacs and I don't see what's wrong with it ^^
<Leonidas>
but yeah, it doesn't work. Not sure why. Maybe because it is an instruction of the "module language"?
<Leonidas>
I think you can use utop in tuareg-mode too, but no idea, vim user here
<Leonidas>
oh yeah, that's described in the utop readme
<thizanne>
tobiasBora: #show_module A;;
<tobiasBora>
Leonidas: I just tried to install utop (it's pretty beautifull ^^), but It does't work either : http://paste.ubuntu.com/10638793
<tobiasBora>
thizanne: Thank you :D
<thizanne>
and yes it does not work anymore with module A = String, because this phrase used to define a new module A, which had the same definition as List
<thizanne>
and now it defines a new name for the same module List
<thizanne>
(so the top-level tells you "module A = List" to show it's really the same one)
<tobiasBora>
I see, it's clearer now !
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<Drup>
Leonidas: are you sure you are not using an old ocaml ?
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<zoetus>
how do you get ppx_deriving to work in utop?
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<Drup>
#require "ppx_deriving" ;;
<Drup>
probable .show or .thing at the end
<zoetus>
that doesn't seem to work for me
<zoetus>
i've opam installed it
<zoetus>
when i type `#ppx "`, it doesn't show up in the autocomplete list either
<Drup>
I never said #ppx
<zoetus>
i know, i tried it both ways :)
<zoetus>
just following your steps though didn't seem to work
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<zoetus>
the require works fine, but i get syntax errors when i try something like `type t = Foo of int [@@deriving show]`
<zoetus>
i tried requiring ppx_deriving.show also
<Drup>
remove one @
<zoetus>
ah! that did it! thanks so much!
<zoetus>
the examples use `@@`, what is the difference?
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<seangrove>
I have two documents I've created with Xmlm - I want to place one inside the other, but looking at the library, I can't figure out how to do it
<seangrove>
I definitely feel like OCaml is a big reorientation away from data structures compared to e.g. clojure
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<Drup>
well, if you take xmlm as an example, obviously ... it's a library with literally no data structure in it. You are supposed to design your own and use Xmlm as a streaming input to construct your data structure
<seangrove>
Drup: Ah, that makes sense
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<bernardofpc>
besides, I see a lot of <<>> syntax there, instead of the functions (head (body (... ))
<Drup>
ah yes
<Drup>
I know.
<Drup>
I should just remove them, I think
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<bernardofpc>
I'm looking for a nice way of 1) Managing a list of items, 2) displayed in a table, 3) which can have some data altered by user input
<mrvn>
so a hashtbl or mutable records?
<mrvn>
persistent? how many?
<bernardofpc>
mrvn: the problem is not the datastructure, is the iteraction in Eliom
<bernardofpc>
more precisely, how to make a "click / input / <Enter>" trigger an action on server side
<bernardofpc>
(that knows which "row" was affected, probably by using some hidden id as in a database)
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<kakadu>
It is interesting topic
<bernardofpc>
mrvn: it's toyish for the moment, so I can definetely handle this fully loaded on memory
* kakadu
just found Object.observe() in google
<mrvn>
QT has a nice model/view conept for that
<kakadu>
Qt !
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<bernardofpc>
yeah
<mrvn>
evry gui should have one
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<Drup>
bernardofpc: there are several way to do this, and it depends a lot of various details
<Drup>
but a simple way is to build the list of html elements
<Drup>
put them in a table
<Drup>
and attach an handler (using Lwt_js_events for example) to the element to replace the element on click by some form (and replace back when you are done)
<Drup>
the rest is server-side and/or rpc
<bernardofpc>
thanks Drup
<bernardofpc>
I'll read on Lwt_js_events
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<adrien>
(actually MVC is awful when it has to be cross-language, especially when the other language has limited expressivity)
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<cmtptr>
let rec insert x xs = match xs with [] -> [x] | head :: tail -> if x <= head then x :: xs else head :: insert x tail;; (* why does "insert -1 [1; 2; 5];;" give the error: This expression has type 'a -> 'a list -> 'a list but an expression was expected of type int? *)
<companion_cube>
yes, the problem is your expression is parsed as (insert - 1) [1;2;5]
<companion_cube>
try: insert (-1) [1;2;5]
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<cmtptr>
ah, makes sense. thanks
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<_obad_>
hi everyone. is there an existing program for grepping into s-expressions?
<companion_cube>
what would such regex look like?
<_obad_>
companion_cube: that's syntax, but semantically it could be something like css node selectors.
<_obad_>
in more concrete terms, I'm using sexplib and I have code that dumps a bunch of data, which are generally records. and I want to search them.
<_obad_>
let's say you have a sequence of sexps that have been serialized from type foo = { blah : int; baz :string } and you want to extract all the baz values
<companion_cube>
well, I don't think there is anything like that, but it would certainly be interesting
<_obad_>
ok I just pushed a simple prototype that does the job at https://github.com/berke/fling ; there is no input syntax as I'm using sexplib to deserialize the ast
<Drup>
_obad_: fieldslib ?
<ggole>
I've pondered some kind of heap search utility that worked like that (in the toplevel, say)
<_obad_>
drup: let me google that
<Drup>
it's part of the core stuff
<Drup>
with sexplib.
<_obad_>
drup: ok I was looking for a command-line tool like grep
<Drup>
oh, ok
<ggole>
There's sgrep
<ggole>
But that's for xml
<_obad_>
ggole: is that the structured grep?
<_obad_>
it's actually more general than that and interesting, but I always found it too difficult to use.
<ggole>
Yeah, I've never actually fired it up in anger
<_obad_>
anyway I uploaded a prototype called "fling" and the usage looks like this: fling '(Tag My_tag (Seq ((Fields (foo bar baz) Emit) Newline)))' <foo.sexp
<_obad_>
so if you have type bar = My_tag of blah | Other_tag of other and blah = { foo : int; bar : string; baz : string }
<_obad_>
the expression would select fields foo, bar, baz from entries having the tag My_tag. needs conrete syntax.
<Drup>
basically lenses ? :D
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<_obad_>
dunno, is that what lenses are? maybe there is a command-line lens tool
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<ggole>
Lenses are a Haskell library for exercising the type checker.
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<ggole>
(They actually seem kinda cool, but hell if I can understand the more abstract parts.)
<Drup>
the base concept is very simple, and then haskell people generalized it :D
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<ZenMatt>
HI foks, beginner @ ocaml here. I have a question, if I write a function signature like : let somefun : (int -> int) -> int -> int = .... with the intention beign that (int->int) will be a function of itself, applied to the next arguement, how would that look?
<ZenMatt>
so I want to call the program somefun (fun x -> x / 2) would return an int
<ggole>
ZenMatt: What do you mean by 'how would that look'? Are you asking us to supply a possible definition of somefun here?
<Drup>
ZenMatt: to what would you apply (fun x -> x /2) in this example ?
<ZenMatt>
sorry I missed an int. I essentially want to create something like somefun (fun x -> x / 2) 10 or somefun (fun x -> x * 2) 5 where I'm applying the latter number. I'm not asking so much for a solution, but moreso if anonymous functions can be made in this way
<dmbaturin>
ZenMatt: let apply f x y = f x y
<dmbaturin>
Or, let apply (int -> int) -> int -> int = fun f -> fun x -> fun y -> f x y
<Drup>
dmbaturin: the y is not necessary.
<dmbaturin>
Sorry. missed the colon.
<ZenMatt>
oh I see!
<ggole>
(Or just (@@).)
<dmbaturin>
ZenMatt: Why would you want it not to be polymorphic though?
<ZenMatt>
well
<ZenMatt>
ultimately I'm trying to create a function as above, and will return the number of times the function can be called, until a negative number is given
<dmbaturin>
Drup: Not just not necessary, I misread the original type. :)
<dmbaturin>
So it would be even harmful.
<ggole>
You want to repeatedly call the function (on its result, I assume) until it returns a negative result?
<ZenMatt>
my problem was that I saw some tutorials online regarding anonymous functions, how to create them etc
<ggole>
let until_neg f init = let rec loop count x = let r = f x in if r < 0 then count else loop (count + 1) r in loop 0 init
<ZenMatt>
but I wasnt sure how to create an anonymous function that could be called unto itself
<ggole>
(Not tested.)
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<ZenMatt>
regardless if x * y or x / y or x - y etc
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<ZenMatt>
ah interesting, let me go try that
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<dmbaturin>
ZenMatt: Well, in this case there is no anonymous recursion, the thing that is called recursively is named.
<dmbaturin>
You can make a recursive function without naming it (the keyword is "Y combinator"), but it's a different story. :)
<ZenMatt>
I see. Do you know of any good web resources for more on using ocaml in this way?
<dmbaturin>
Did you check the Learn section of ocaml.org?
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<dmbaturin>
There's also a list of books, many of which are free.
<ZenMatt>
I've been reading that yes and some of the 99 problems which are good
<ZenMatt>
oh any books you recommend?
<ZenMatt>
I've been reading Real World Ocaml
<ZenMatt>
A very good book
<dmbaturin>
RWO is good, just watch for Core.
<dmbaturin>
If you like Core and use it, it's not a problem of course.
<cmtptr>
and if you don't? I had to abort rwo because I don't like learning languages by first installing 20 packages on top of it, obfuscating everything
<dmbaturin>
"dmbaturin, advocating SML in #ocaml since 2014"
<ZenMatt>
cmtptr I felt that way too in some parts
<ZenMatt>
thanks for the link
* destrius
learnt SML first, and it was a great language to learn functional programming in
<Drup>
cmtptr: that doesn't make much sense in OCaml though, most of the stuff that is including in the stdlib in most languages are in "user space" in OCaml.
<dmbaturin>
Regardless, the concepts it teaches are equally applicable to any language, and SML syntax is easy to read if you know some ocaml.
<destrius>
its similar enough to ocaml that you can move between the two quite easily.
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<cmtptr>
Drup, I respect that, but still. I don't see why I need this utop thing when I have an perfectly fine ocaml repl that came with the compiler
<dmbaturin>
cmtptr: I enjoyed the book even though I had to mentally filter the coreness out because I don't use it.
<Drup>
ahah, perfectly fine repl
<Drup>
utop is better.
<cmtptr>
does it somehow read, evalulate, and print better?
<dmbaturin>
cmtptr: Yes, no, yes.
<Drup>
it autocompletes.
<cmtptr>
I have no use for that
<Drup>
actually, it also evaluates better, since it has custom support for lwt too.
<dmbaturin>
No use for command history too? :)
<cmtptr>
anyway, my point is: even if there are things like that out there, that's fine. but my first steps into a language shouldn't be trying to make heads or tails of that shit
<dmbaturin>
For SML and Scheme REPLs I have to resort to rlwrap.
<cmtptr>
I just want to learn the language right now. I can decide later whether I want utop
<companion_cube>
the very first start could be the tutorial on ocaml.org, which doesn't require much
<dmbaturin>
It has some interesting bits about implemeneting persistent datastructures.
<Drup>
cmtptr: I find that weird, since in most languages, the right tooling helps tremendously when starting.
<dmbaturin>
Personally I find lack of command line editing and history unbearable.
<cmtptr>
yeah, that's irritating but it doesn't prevent me from learning the basics
<cmtptr>
and as you mentioned earlier, there's always rlwrap
<Drup>
(doesn't give you autocompletion though)
<cmtptr>
I seriously have never used or even wanted autocompletion in my life
<cmtptr>
in any language
<ZenMatt>
dmaturin: Much appreciated !
<cmtptr>
well, unless we're talking about file paths in a shell
<Drup>
cmtptr: which languages ? by curiosity
<cmtptr>
any of them
<lyxia>
cmtptr: What about command history in a REPL?
<cmtptr>
lyxia, < cmtptr> yeah, that's irritating but it doesn't prevent me from learning the basics < cmtptr> and as you mentioned earlier, there's always rlwrap
<ZenMatt>
thanks pal, I have a few saved now which would keep me going :-)
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<dmbaturin>
As long as it still runs on classroom machines, people tend to put effort into improving the course content rather than translating it to another language, so CAML Light is still alive in long running courses.
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<Drup>
unfortunatly
<Drup>
making generations of students thinking ocaml is a completely dead language, as caml light is.
<dmbaturin>
We teach people dead literary works, dead natural science concepts, dead math... Teaching dead programming languages is consistent with it. :)
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<Drup>
I disagree with the analogy :D
<def`>
+1 :P
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<dmbaturin>
Drup: Why? (If anything, I'm no _advocating_ it, just making observations)
<Drup>
dead literary works is not always dead and is sometimes quite relevant (it's done terribly in france though)
<Drup>
dead math is not dead math, just building blocks.
<dmbaturin>
Well, if it's still relevant, it's not so dead.
<Drup>
that's my point, it is not.
<Drup>
caml light is neither relevant nor active.
<Drup>
it's just deprecated
<Drup>
It's not even simpler than OCaml, since you can pretty much restrain yourself to specific parts of OCaml
<dmbaturin>
By dead math I mean things like trigonometric formula transformation techniques that were once useful for calculations with tables and a slide rule, and aren't good for anything now.
<mrvn>
dmbaturin: I just implemented a cos/sic table yesterday.
<mrvn>
cos/sin
<Drup>
dmbaturin: still a basic block, simpler than the later stuff
<mrvn>
dmbaturin: C++ code though and the compiler realy doesn't like templates with 16384 parameters.
<dmbaturin>
I'm not saying trigonometry is useless. What I'm talking about is teaching it by artificial and complicated examples instead of really fundamental concepts and practical examples.
<mrvn>
dmbaturin: when you implement 3D graphics yourself instead of just using GL you still use all that trigonometric stuff.
<Drup>
dmbaturin: that's not dead then, just badly explained.
<dmbaturin>
mrvn: Doing a great trigonometric survey of the school yard is also a good start. :)
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<mrvn>
dmbaturin: like. pick 2 points a known distance appart and measure all the angels so you can compute the size?
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<dmbaturin>
Measure the angels? Sounds like applied theology. :)
<mrvn>
or just bad typing.
<dmbaturin>
Back to serious, yes, that's what I meant.
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<mrvn>
never did that in school. We measured the length of a hallway using different devices to show cummulative errors.
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<bernardofpc>
Drup: I could only make it work using D.fake_input, not F.fake_input as in your example
<bernardofpc>
maybe I'll stick to using D everywhere, at least until I understand better why some elements must be D
<bernardofpc>
(I guess to be sent through %() something must be a D ?)
<bernardofpc>
(it's strange, since everything is supposed to be running on the client side...)
<Drup>
you can send both with %
<Drup>
but if you are trying to transform it with To_dom, or attach an event handler to it, it must be a D
<Drup>
(or use Manip)
<bernardofpc>
I need to_dom to extract its ##innerHTML
<bernardofpc>
(I'm trying to adapt the example with minimal overhead)
<bernardofpc>
nice to know the "evet_handler" part as well
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<seangrove>
I'm trying to build a custom toplevel, but getting an error from ocmalfind: ocamlfind ocamlc -c -g -annot -bin-annot -safe-string -principal -package threads,utop -o myutop_main.cmo myutop_main.ml ====> ocamlfind: Error from package `threads': Missing -thread or -vmthread switch
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<Drup>
add -thread ? ^^'
<Drup>
(on top of (-package threads, yes)
<seangrove>
Drup: I'll try that...
<Drup>
(the tag is "thread")
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<xificurC>
I see polymorphic variants used as "enums", e.g. oUnit has type log_severity = [ `Error | `Info | `Warning ]. Why not just type log_severity = Error | Info | Warning? What makes one choose polyvars here?
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<mrvn>
keeps them out of the module namespace
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<xificurC>
mrvn: not sure I understand
<axiles>
you can also do subtyping
<mrvn>
xificurC: you can use "match foo with `Error -> " instead of "match foo wiht OUnit.Error -> "
<xificurC>
mrvn: I see, so it's just for brevity?
<mrvn>
xificurC: i don't know if that is why the oUnit author choose them here. But that is one reason one can choose them.
<xificurC>
mrvn: thanks
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<seangrove>
What is this signature saying? val rope_of_string : string -> ('a, Blueprint.prov) XmlRope.t
<mrvn>
converts a string into a rope
<seangrove>
It takes a string, and returns a tuple of (sometype, Blurprint.prov) XmlRope.t
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<seangrove>
I guess I'm not clear on (sometype, Blurprint.prov) XmlRope.t
<seangrove>
What is the XmlRope.t doing there - parameterizing the tuple?
<mrvn>
that depends on the module
<mrvn>
the tupöe is the parameter for the rope
<mrvn>
like 'a list
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<seangrove>
Ah, ok, so I was reading it backwards then
<seangrove>
It's returning a XmlRope.t parameterized by said tuple
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<xificurC>
the postfix notation still feels strange to me (e.g. 'a list)
<companion_cube>
it's strange, yes
<xificurC>
test package tips? Someone recommended oUnit not too long ago here on IRC, but I'm tempted to try something quickcheckish
<companion_cube>
they serve different purposes
<companion_cube>
you can combine both
<companion_cube>
what are you testing?
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<xificurC>
companion_cube: not much yet, slowly (very slowly) working on the hold'em AI
<xificurC>
I only have some input reading done yet
<companion_cube>
oh
<xificurC>
no AI yet, just checks all the time :)
<companion_cube>
well if you're used to unit tests, OUnit it is
<companion_cube>
imho, quickcheck is nice if you want to check some invariant
<xificurC>
companion_cube: sadly I'm not used to tests as VBA has 0 support for that and that's what I have to use at work
<companion_cube>
:D
<xificurC>
but I know them
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<companion_cube>
well then, give a try to both, but for input I think regular tests (ounit) are simpler
<companion_cube>
or even writing a small .ml file and run it on an input
<companion_cube>
the compiler does that
<xificurC>
what about stuff like pa_test or ppx_test
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<companion_cube>
I don't like camlp4 so the first is out for me, and ppx_test requires my code t be >= 4.02, so right now I tend to use qtest (tests in comments, pretty hackish)
<whitequark>
ppx_test is super ugly inside
<companion_cube>
:D
<companion_cube>
it's written by a beginner, isn't it?
<whitequark>
i feel dirty just reading the source
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<companion_cube>
or do I confuse it with something else?
<whitequark>
oh wait, no, not ppx_test
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<whitequark>
ppx_test is not that bad actually
<whitequark>
ppx_ounit
<xificurC>
quickly reading through it's bitbucket main page I don't have a clue what it is
<ollehar1>
possible problem: parsing xml leads to one giant match case for different tags.
<ollehar1>
any meaning trying to split it?
<Leonidas>
xificurC: I can recommend QCheck by companion_cube :)
<companion_cube>
quickcheck-like stuff would be so much better with typeclasses
<xificurC>
companion_cube: well they are coming, no?
<companion_cube>
I hope so
<xificurC>
or is it still distant
<xificurC>
many things would probably look nicer with them
<companion_cube>
but don't sell the fur before you shot the bear
<companion_cube>
(or whatever translation)
<companion_cube>
good night, anyway!
<nicoo>
Was the sheriff a bear?
<whitequark>
the hide
<nicoo>
'night, companion_cube
<whitequark>
not the fur
<companion_cube>
thanks whitequark
<companion_cube>
but don't sell the fur (or the moustache) either
<xificurC>
companion_cube: night
<whitequark>
... moustache?
<whitequark>
companion_cube: fun fact, in russian version of the proverb it's not "sell", it's "divide"
<whitequark>
[a joke about capitalism and communism]
<companion_cube>
:)
<ia0>
lol
<whitequark>
dividing the hide of an undead bear
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<whitequark>
(unkilled, to translate it literally, but undead is funnier)
<companion_cube>
you still must kill the undead bear, but it's harder
<mrvn>
whitequark: I don't have to run faster than the bear. I only have to run faster than you.
<whitequark>
that went dark quickly.
<mrvn>
it's allways darkest before the dawn^Wthe approaching train enters the tunnel
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<Algebr>
For Cohttp.Header's map, I'm wondering if there is some reason other than convience for why it passes the value of the key of the Headers as a list rather than just a string.
<Algebr>
the mli doesn't say anything in particular for map
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