ChanServ changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://www.ocaml.org | OCaml 4.02.1 announcement at http://ocaml.org/releases/4.02.html | Public channel logs at http://irclog.whitequark.org/ocaml
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<n3ss3s> I'm running into some weird behavior with Sys.remove. I have this block of code, which is supposed to remove a file if it already exists, create it, write into it, and close the handle. It's being called a bunch of times to keep a log of the freshest information. However, when the file already exists, Sys.remove seems to remove it just fine, but execution magically stops there ("Opening file" is not printed) http://pastebin.com/Vcc7jMqA
<n3ss3s> If the file does not already exist, the exception is handled and the rest of the code runs as you'd expect
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<Drup> n3ss3s: reindent your code, you should see the issue
<Denommus> ah! I should use lazyness!
<n3ss3s> oh. The rest of the code is in the with.
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<n3ss3s> Ugh, I rewrote it as try Sys.remove ("./" ^ dump_filename) with Sys_error e -> begin print_endline e end; but the problem persists
<n3ss3s> oh, it's the whole try-with that needs to be begin/ended, right?
<n3ss3s> hmm, that sounds too ugly to be true
<Drup> unfortunatly ...
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<Denommus> ok
<Denommus> I need a fixed pointer combinator for loop
<Denommus> I don't know how to implement it yet, I have to study it
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<flux> wellll, there's the "let in"-trick, but..
<flux> (re n3ss3s' issue, though he's gone)
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<flux> is FaCiLe at all suitable for constraint-solving layout-problems?
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<flux> or maybe the nlopt bindings are more suitable..
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<xificurC> I just added `open Batteries' to the top of my file and got an error on all my type definitions saying `Unbound value Format.asprintf'
<flux> I guess Batteries doesn't come with Format.asprintf. it's been introduced in ocaml 4.01.0
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<xificurC> so noone uses batteries right now or what :O How can I solve this
<flux> well, nobody uses .asprintf is perhaps the correct interpretation :-)
<flux> I don't know if Batteries has some escape hatch to format
<flux> but if it doesn't
<flux> you can: module Format' = Format open Batteries
<flux> now you have the original Format with name Format'
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<xificurC> flux: the file doesn't build, with the module defintion or without it
<MercurialAlchemi> it would be nice if ocaml had a 'from foo import Bar' equivalent
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<apache2> doesn't it kind of have that?
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<apache2> let base64_encode d = let open B64 in B64.encode d
<xificurC> I think it is colliding with ppx_deriving, if I don't derive anything from the type it works
<zozozo> apache2: you don't need the let open in if you already use Module.function
<reynir> you can always do 'let foo = Bar.foo'
<xificurC> any ideas?
<reynir> you could probably make a ppx for doing that ^^
<apache2> good point
<apache2> are there any tools that looks at .ml files and determines which modules to import?
<xificurC> flux: ah so what you were saying is that Batteries' Format module doesn't include asprintf and I'm using it. But I'm not using it explicitly, it must be ppx_deriving looking for it
<apache2> it seems a bit strange that you have to specify ocamlfind packages on your own
<zozozo> apache2: ocamldepends does something like that I think
<apache2> oh, nice!
<apache2> `ocamldep`
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<zozozo> apache2: as for ocamlfind packages, there's always the problem of two packages defining the same module : in this case which package would you want to import ?
<xificurC> hm, my issue is described here https://github.com/ocaml-batteries-team/batteries-included/issues/597 with no solution :(
<apache2> zozozo: In that case I'd like a conflict message to be displayed. But it would still help 99% of the cases where they don't
<apache2> `ocamldep -modules bla.ml` is nice though
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<xificurC> so apparently I can't use batteries with ppx_deriving..
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<flux> ppx_deriving itself probably works fine, but some deriving module of it doesn't?
<flux> show?
<flux> so ppx_deriving has been updated to use the newly introduced Format.asprintf but Batteries hasn't
<flux> so not a new issue..
<xificurC> flux: yeah I linked the issue a couple posts ago :)
<xificurC> flux: its from november though :(
<flux> oh :)
<flux> so it seems to me this could be fixed by simply changing the signature in the .mli file
<flux> xificurc, ok, so but your issue was with ppx_deriving. so in addition to doing module.. open.. add also: module Format = Format' after it ;-)
<flux> then ppx_deriving.show should work just as before..
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<xificurC> flux: I have open Lwt.Infix \n open Batteries \n module Format = Format', is that what you meant? Cause that doesn't seem to help
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<flux> hmm
<flux> so you have also module Format' = Format somwhere?
<flux> otherwise I don't see it compiling at all
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<xificurC> ah so set it as Format' first and then set back to Format?
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<MercurialAlchemi> xificurC: as soon as you "open Batteries", Batteries's Format will shadow the original
<MercurialAlchemi> aliasing Format after this just means aliasing Batteries' version
<xificurC> module Format' = Format , then open Batteries, then module Format = Format' seems to work. I understand now
<xificurC> sorry, taking a while for me
<flux> it's still not very pretty, and it's a bit shame that Batteries has this kind of open issue for such a long time
<flux> but I guess people will PR what they feel is important to fix :-)
<xificurC> flux: yeah, pretty hacky solution. Please submit a pull request :)
<xificurC> what other extensions are there? I know of batteries, core_kernel, extlib and containers
<flux> I wonder how Batteries deals with 'supported after version X' kind of constraints in .mli files..
<flux> there are some .mlv and .mliv files, that's probably related..
<flux> ah, teh magic of preprocessor:
<flux> ##V<4.2##val make_float : int -> float array
<flux> ##V>=4.2##external make_float : int -> float array = "caml_make_float_vect"
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<xificurC> flux: so they'd just need to update BatFormat.mli to include the asprintf signature?
<flux> correct, as far as I can tell
<flux> well, they would also need to rename batFormat.mli to batFormat.mliv, because that would be the first version-dependant entry there
<flux> and that might affect some lists of files in the build system
<flux> ..but that would be the core of the change
<xificurC> strange to see the issue open for half a year then
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<xificurC> tried opening Core_kernel instead, 25 errors :)
<flux> Batteries tries to keep backwards compatilibity.. Core doesn't :-)
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<xificurC> this all started when I found out pervasives don't have List.take :)
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<kido1412> Hi, does anybody use Sedlex+Menhir before? I have read the demo from the source code (http://cristal.inria.fr/~fpottier/menhir/menhir-20141215.tar.gz) and found it uses ocamllex as a lexer.
<kido1412> I only found a github project which uses sedlex+menhir (https://github.com/unhammer/ocaml_cg_streamparse), however, there isn't any document or comment on it.
<haesbaert> could someone clarify me what are the semantics of a module without a .mli ?
<haesbaert> I seem to be able to use all the symbols from other modules, so I'm assuming when a module has no .mli, everything is exported ?
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<flux> correct
<haesbaert> great, thanks :D
<flux> curiosity: this can result in some code not compiling when it would compile with an empty .mli
<flux> example.ml: let foo = ref None
<haesbaert> why so ?
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<flux> because the type of foo is '_a option; the '_a is fixed when it is used within the same module
<haesbaert> ah I see
<flux> I guess you can see how it would break down if mod1.ml would have Example.foo := Some "hello" and mod2.ml would have 4 + !(Example.foo)
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<flux> (oops, well not working example but almost ;-))
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<haesbaert> ack, I think I see it
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<xificurC> even containers breaks some stuff, like List.find
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<flux> Containers doesn't try to replace the standard library, does it?
<zozozo> companion_cube: ^^ ?
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<adrien_znc> his future plan is to take over the ocaml compiler directly so that he can remove the stdlib from the source repository and move containers there
<MercurialAlchemi> sounds like a plan
<MercurialAlchemi> with ocaml-re for the regexp part?
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<flux> ok, so the site does say '..also provides a drop-in replacement to the standard library..'
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<MercurialAlchemi> well, don't complain if it gets dropped over your head
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<xificurC> not sure I understand the jokes, is there something wrong with the lib?
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<flux> no, the library is quite fine
<flux> but people like to tease companion_cube maybe?-)
<flux> also, containers definitely has the best support on #ocaml ;-)
<MercurialAlchemi> eh, I'd trade the stdlib for containers in a heartbeat
<MercurialAlchemi> :)
<xificurC> c-cube's libs look pretty good, from the view of this particular ocaml noob
<xificurC> any preference of () or begin end?
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<flux> a tough one. I tend up to use () always. but I've sometimes considered if begin/end would also have their place.
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<Drup> xificurC: answer some previous question, but will work regardless: "Just don't open Batteries" =°
<xificurC> Drup: I thought the purpose of some libs is to open them
<xificurC> namely the ones that extend/replace stdlib like core, batteries, extlib, containers
<xificurC> is it a bad idea to e.g. open Containers then?
<Drup> I just use the CC.. or Bat... modules directly
<Drup> I never open
<Drup> it brings stuff in my scope I don't want, shadow other stuff
<Drup> it's just plain annoying
<Drup> The exception is for infix operators, like CCFun
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<dmbaturin> Another reason I don't like opening modules is that it makes it hard to remember where exactly that thing comes from next day. :)
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<xificurC> I understand and appreciate that. Tried to read this a couple days ago - https://github.com/nim-lang/Aporia/blob/master/aporia.nim . God knows what comes from where after those imports!
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<MercurialAlchemi> from * import *
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<octachron> I would argue that opening a module is fine if you are using a significant portion of the opened module almost everywhere in your file
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<xificurC> in this case I understand there's no big difference in calling List.take or CCList.take and it makes it more clear where is the function coming from
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<Drup> dmbaturin: that can easily be solved with enough merlin
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<xificurC> what is the correct way to write this: ocamlbuild -use-ocamlfind -I /path/to/files /path/to/files/foo.native
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<xificurC> I'm getting an error stating included or excluded directories must be implicit
<zozozo> xificurC: use the -I before both paths
<dmbaturin> Drup: Good point.
<theblatte> xificurC: I think it means that in -Ipath, path is not allowed to be absolute
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<zozozo> or use -Is and comma separated paths if I remember correctly
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<xificurC> trying to get emacs compile the file opened on a shortcut :<
<xificurC> it seems the compilation is using an older version of the .ml file then what I have in my main directory right now. It's complaining there's an unbound module on line 2, but line 2 is empty
<xificurC> worked after rm _build/*
* xificurC feels like a complete idiot when doing ocaml
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<reynir> MercurialAlchemi: is that legal python??
<MercurialAlchemi> no :)
<reynir> that would be insane heh
<MercurialAlchemi> sometimes doing import * from foo is convenient
<MercurialAlchemi> of course, like most convenient things, it can be used for evil
<reynir> yea
<reynir> I wish python had foo.(things(from(foo_module)))
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<Drup> reynir: pmark merged :3
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<reynir> Yea, I saw :D
<adrien_znc> pmark?
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<flux> drup, I must have asked this earlier ;-), but why doesn't ocaml-re support resuming matching when exec_partial returns `Partial. CPS is too big of a performance hit?
<flux> or perhaps there are other internals making that difficult, haven't looked :-)
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<xificurC> is there any difference in Re.compile and Re_posix.compile?
<Drup> Me: "Why is this two fields in the info record ? They do not really belong semantically"
<Drup> Jerome: "Because it was optimize for processors with a low number of register"
<Drup> flux: We are looking how to do that
<flux> drup, cool!
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<Drup> basically, it would be a matter of exposing (some version of) the loop function.
<Drup> (in re.ml)
<flux> it would give the ability to match with infinitely long input
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<flux> how about exec_partial returning type t = [.. | `Partial of (string -> t)] ?
<flux> I suppose explicit loop function is fine as well
<Drup> no, you don't want that
<flux> why not?-(
<flux> I guess you don't get matches so far that way
<Drup> because in practice, you must put the new string back in the buffer
<flux> in any case I would like to get -out- of the loop if possible
<Drup> (otherwise, indexing becomes too messy, imagine a group matching some part of the first string and some on the seond string)
<flux> instead of requiring one to be driven by the Re-module
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<Drup> flux: the loop function is open
<Drup> it's not really a loop and more like "find the next state in the automaton"
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<Denommus`> I'm having nightmares with the word loop :-(
<Drup> ahah
<adrien_znc> I'm having nightmares with CSS, JS and C++
<adrien_znc> consider yourself lucky!
<adrien_znc> and perl
<adrien_znc> now I need to get back to my XML over SOAP
<Denommus`> adrien_znc: I work with JS and C++
<Denommus`> adrien_znc:... Are you working with me?
<xificurC> can someone explain where and how can I find what module is called how and should be called how? E.g. I write Re_posix.re in code but have to write re.posix in .merlin. How should I know that?
<adrien_znc> did you endure Never Gonna Give You Up just a few minutes ago? if not we're not in the same office :P
<Denommus`> adrien_znc: also SOAP
<Denommus`> I didn't leave home yet
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<adrien_znc> xificurC: re.posix looks like the "re" ocaœmlfind package with its "posix" subpackage
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<reynir> I find it weird how you often can't combine regular expressions in other languages/libs
<adrien_znc> there's no rule between that and module names
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<xificurC> adrien_znc: ok, so where can I check the packaging of e.g. re?
<flux> I guess in a fantasy world there could be a database from module names to .cmas to ocamlfind packages
<adrien_znc> ocamlfind query re
<adrien_znc> that would give you the location on the file system of the isntalled files
<adrien_znc> but many ways to skin a cat
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<flux> first step: grep -l 'Re_pcre' $(ocamlfind query re)/*.cma
<flux> second step: grep -C10 're_pcre.cma' $(ocamlfind query re)/META
<flux> I guess I too could have used this approach earlier :-)
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<xificurC> I'd need to sit down with an ocamler and go through all these things :( I don't know what all these files are anyway, all the extensions used.. cmi, cmo, cmx, o, mliv, mllib etc
<xificurC> also, ocamlfind, ocamlbuild, ocamlc, ocamlopt, ocamldep, ...
<zozozo> it might be nice to have a tool that, from a module name, finds all packages that export a module with that name
<zozozo> any idea how hard it would be to write something like that ?
<flux> in ocaml and not as a shell script? no idea ;-)
<xificurC> right now I'm mostly guessing what to do when writing stuff. And when I add a dependency I have to edit .merlin, .ocalminit and _tags ..
<dsheets> zozozo, need to collect this as part of a build/test infrastructure
<flux> oh, how I completely missed the part of using ocamlobjinfo
<flux> so I guess I would start with the source code of that
<flux> and then look at how to use findlib to access the META files
<flux> I mean if you want to do it properly
<zozozo> dsheets: sure, but that would already be a great standalone tool I think
<xificurC> no more tools please! :)
<dsheets> if you only want to know of already installed packages, yes
<adrien_znc> flux: also, ocamlobjinfo to peek at cmi files
<xificurC> isn't there a tool that generates all the *possible* files you need from 1 file? Like for my simple case write down all the deps, run a command and get .merlin, _tags, .ocamlinit
<reynir> I think maybe there's a script somewhere for generatng .merlin from _tags
<flux> adrien_znc, would it help, though?
<xificurC> the language is great and I'm sure all the tools are as well, but it's very steeeeep for a newcomer to learn all of this
<flux> there's a script for generating .merlin from all available packages
<flux> haven't seen one for creating one from _tags, though
<flux> but I suppose optimally this would be implemented with myocamlbuild.ml
<adrien_znc> flux: that's the right way to list exported modules
<flux> adrien_znc, you get a list of the interfaces.. but you cannot learn what is the findlib package?
<adrien_znc> you'd need to iterate over all findlib packages
<flux> well, certainly it's enough in 100% cases to check only that particular package..
<flux> in the end you have a module like Re and you need to know which .cma you must use to find the implementation
<flux> ocamlobjinfo re.cma will reveal that re.cma is the one
<flux> and those same .cma-files are then referred from the META file
<flux> if you have foo.cmi you already know it exports foo.cmo, the question is in which .cma it is in :-)
<flux> (well it doesn't really export foo.cmo, but the implementation side of the .cmi, if there is one, will exist in foo.cmo)
<dsheets> https://github.com/dsheets/ocamlfind-units contains some code to interact with the cma and findlib
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<flux> drup, note that it should allow for using the same kind of structure for looping even if there isn't any regular expression match (ie. partial match) on
<Drup> what do you mean ?
<flux> let say I have input "hello" and I have regexp (l)
<flux> I want to get access to those two separate l matches
<flux> and I want to resume the matching with new data
<Drup> right, yes, compatibility with Re.all
<flux> and the loop would preferably look the same even if my regexp was (ooo)
<Drup> I have that in mind as well, yes, but you can add it to the ticket
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<Denommus> what does the syntax [`Foo of bar] means?
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<dmbaturin> Denommus: type foo = [`Foo or bar] is a polymorphic variant type definition.
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<Denommus> thank you
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<Denommus> if I have a lazy tuple, can I force ONLY one element of it?
<ggole> Not unless the bits are lazy
<Denommus> ggole: hm
<ggole> You could have a foo lazy_t * bar lazy_t instead of a lazy_t (foo * bar)
<ggole> Er, a (foo * bar) lazy_t
<Denommus> ggole: I got it
<Denommus> I'm thinking about how to use that for my purposes...
<Denommus> thanks for now
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<Denommus> ok, I quit ArrowLoop, I can't do it -.-
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<Simn> OCaml on our CI complains about "This comment contains an unterminated string literal" on a line that consists of `(* this probably comes from {| completion so we need some context} *)`. What am I not seeing here?
<ggole> {| ... |} is a string literal
<Simn> Oh wow...
<Simn> Thanks
<ggole> In fact, it's {x| ... |x} (for matching identifiers x)
<ggole> It's a strange quoting thing
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<Simn> Was that added recently? It only fails on our OSX tests which I assume use a different OCaml version.
<ggole> 4.0 something?
<ggole> I think
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<octachron> maybe in 4.0.2 with ppx extension?
<Drup> yes
<Drup> 4.2*
<Simn> I see, thanks!
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<Denommus> what would be a good GUI framework for OCaml?
<Kakadu> lablgtk is most mature
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<Kakadu> Qt/QML is best IMHO, but its approach is a little bit untraditional (can look awkward in the begining)
<Kakadu> Tcl/Tk must die, probably
<smondet> Denommus: Cohttp + js_of_ocaml (+ eliom? + tyxml?)
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<axiles> Denommus: ocaml-efl is also a possible option
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