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<Leonidas>
megeve: so, finance and web basically.
<Leonidas>
I've seen people from Intel post on mailinglists, so I assume they also seem to use it
<Leonidas>
I was working with OCaml in a company that did 3D graphics.
<Leonidas>
Is there a way to select text in vim on an expression level?
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<_xvilka_>
also program analysis
<_xvilka_>
is quite often written in OCaml
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<discord1>
<khady> I think thales has some ocaml, siemens too
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<discord1>
<Perry> Is there any serious negative to running full time with flambda as one's compiler?
<Drup>
compilation might take longer, and might take quite a bit of ram, but not always
<Drup>
compatibility wise, I don't think there are any issues
<discord1>
<Perry> In terms of performance, how much better is it?
<discord1>
<Perry> and is the flambda compiler compiled with flambda? 😃
<Drup>
ocaml is bootstraped, so it can if you want, it's not right now though
<discord1>
<Perry> but that would presumably speed up flambda.
<Drup>
well, that's not exactly the right answer, let's say yes
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<Drup>
iirc, the **average** speedup is around 20% on -O3, and negligeable on -O1
<Drup>
that's average, it highly depends on the software. Functional workloads tend to get the most out of it
<discord1>
<Perry> 20% is significant but not a game changer for the stuff I do day to day which is mostly research.
<discord1>
<Perry> Maybe I'll avoid playing with it for now.
<Drup>
(You can finetune it as well, see the documentation)
<discord1>
<Perry> I've often wondered how well an LLVM back-end might do over the native one. The GHC people seem to have switched over mostly to LLVM over their own older C-- stuff.
<Boarders>
Hi I was reading Pierce's book and don't speak ocaml (I do speak haskell though). In this type declaration: https://lpaste.net/4267478276944953344 I just want to check the point of the info
<Boarders>
is it roughly to indicate whether a term is meant to be infix or prefix or etc?
<Drup>
Perry: iirc, llvm is an optional backend to ghc, and is not the default one
<Drup>
it's also not particularly faster .... unless you consider stuff that can be vectorized
<discord1>
<Perry> I think that used to be the case, but they've mostly switched over at this point. But I might be wrong.
<discord1>
<Perry> The LLVM people changed a lot of stuff to accommodate GHC.
<discord1>
<Perry> That side I know about because of my work with LLVM. Like there's a whole extra calling convention for the benefit of the GHC people.
<Drup>
Is that recent? Because afaik, they just added a new calling convetion, and that's it
<discord1>
<Perry> And a bunch of work was done on the garbage collection support.
<Drup>
anyway, llvm is not good at functional workloads
<discord1>
<Perry> There were also a bunch of small tweaks the GHC people needed that got done, though I'm struggling to remember any of them.
<Drup>
llvm is very good at C
<discord1>
<Perry> LLVM is not better at functional workloads. The functional stuff isn't optimized by the existing set of llvm optimization passes.
<discord1>
<Perry> You really want stuff to handle functional-only optimizations in your front end before passing it to something like LLVM.
<Drup>
Boarders: that's just an algebraic data type declaration, exactly like an Haskell one
<Boarders>
yes, I just want to know what "of info" means after each term
<discord1>
<Perry> But it will do nice things with stuff like (as you noted) vectorization and instruction scheduling etc.
<discord1>
<Perry> "info" is presumably a type.
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<discord1>
<Perry> "TmZero of info" means that you have an "info" stored with the variant "TmZero". It's just like Haskell in this regard.
<discord1>
<Perry> The syntax is just slightly different.
<Drup>
Boarders: `Foo of bar * baz` is the same as `Foo Bar Baz` is haskell
<Drup>
`a * b` is the type of tuples with a and b
<discord1>
<Perry> Though in this case, it's not a tuple! That confused me forever.
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<Boarders>
would it be ok to write "TmTrue of term"?
<discord1>
<Perry> Foo of bar * baz is a constructor Foo that takes two parameters.
<discord1>
<Perry> "TmTrue of term" is fine.
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<discord1>
<Perry> (syntactically.)
<Boarders>
ok, makes sense. Thanks for the info!
<Drup>
Perry: whitequark (and others before him) tried to provide an LLVM backend
<Drup>
the conclusion was that 1) it would take a lot of work on the GC aspects 2) it's not really worth it
<discord1>
<Perry> The LLVM GC stuff keeps getting better with time. A lot of LLVM languages now use it.
<discord1>
<Perry> But I'm not saying it would be worth the effort.
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<freyr>
Can I use Lwt_main.run with js_of_ocaml?
<freyr>
I'm getting a compile error
<freyr>
Error: Required module `Lwt_main' is unavailable
<Drup>
freyr: Lwt_main is only for unix
<Drup>
you don't need to launch promises in js
<freyr>
I want to wait for the result
<freyr>
bind is not always convenient
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<steenuil>
not using the ppx?
<flux[m]>
it might also not be possible not not wait for the result?
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<flux[m]>
s/not not/to not/
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<Drup>
freyr: you can't really do blocking wait in lwt-in-js
<freyr>
I see. It seems that Lwt.async is doing what I need
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<discord1>
<Perry> Stupid question given the length of time I've been using OCaml now, but: if I have a module that pretty much literally only exists to define a set of types, should I (1) leave the defs in a .ml file and not create a .mli, (2) leave the defs in a .mli and not create a .ml, (3) have identical .ml and .mli files (what a waste!) or (4) something else?
<def`>
(1)
<discord1>
<Perry> And the rationale is...?
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<hdon>
hi all :) why does mutual recursion in ocaml require jumping through extra hoops as compared to languages like C which only ask you to write a function signature or have a forward declaration of a struct type? i feel that i must be missing something that explains why ocaml does it this way
<lyxia>
It might have to do with the fact that in ocaml, definitions are evaluated sequentially.
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<octachron>
hdon, you can do mutual recurence the C way by declaring forward reference if you really really want
<octachron>
but automatic mutual recursion + type inference + parametric types would create a lot of confusing situation
<octachron>
declaring small group of mutually recursive functions/types make it simpler to keep such complexity in check
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<octachron>
small example: "let f x = x let g x = f x, f (x,x)" vs "let rec f: 'a. 'a -> 'a = fun x -> x and g x = f x, f (x,x)"