ChanServ changed the topic of #picolisp to: PicoLisp language | Channel Log: https://irclog.whitequark.org/picolisp/ | Check also http://www.picolisp.com for more information
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<mtsd> Hello everyone
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<Regenaxer> Hi mtsd!
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<mtsd> Hi Regenaxer! How are things in Bavaria these days?
<mtsd> Winter arrived yet?
<Regenaxer> Not really. I cm snow but melting
<Regenaxer> How in Sweden?
<Regenaxer> s/I cm/1 cm
<mtsd> Getting colder here, around -7 today. No snow yet though
<mtsd> Nice and sunny today, but cold
<Regenaxer> here sunny too, after foggy a long time. Around zero C
<mtsd> We have had a few nice, wintry days so far. We'll see if/ when snow arrives
<mtsd> I read the changelog, java removed completely now?
<Regenaxer> Yeah, it was completely out of date
<Regenaxer> All these changes went directly into PilBox
<mtsd> Makes sense, really
<mtsd> One port less to keep updated?
<Regenaxer> yeah, don't want to maintain twice
<Regenaxer> T
<Regenaxer> Ersatz will remain
<Regenaxer> it is separate
<Regenaxer> and ok, though limited
<mtsd> What about Cygwin?
<Regenaxer> I thought about that too
<Regenaxer> But not much code, and only pil32
<Regenaxer> I'd rather like to abandon pil32, but perhaps too early
<Regenaxer> just keep pil64, mini and ersatz
<Regenaxer> and PilOS and PilBox
<mtsd> It would make sense, I suppose. I myself have no 32 bit machines left
<Regenaxer> puh!
<Regenaxer> Some use pil32 for bootstrapping
<Regenaxer> eg the Debian maintainer
<mtsd> T, forgot about that! I always download your .s files myself
<Regenaxer> but it is not necessary as the pre-built *.s files exist
<Regenaxer> yeah
<Regenaxer> No big problems anyway :)
<mtsd> So, "Just" keep pil64, mini, ersatz, PilOS and PilBox. "Only" those few ports ;)
<Regenaxer> haha
<mtsd> That is a very impressive array of versions, in my view, haha
<Regenaxer> yeah, grew over time
<Regenaxer> Almost all work recently went into PilBox anyway
<mtsd> I find PilBox interesting. Got it to boot on yet another laptop a while ago. Thinkpad x230 this time
<Regenaxer> you mean PilOS?
<mtsd> Well, it happened to boot there. I did not do anything
<mtsd> Yes, sorry. PilOS
<Regenaxer> I did not do anything new for PilOS, only kept the sources in sync
<Regenaxer> changes to src64/ -> pilos/src/
<mtsd> Pure accident. I happened to pick my PilOS USB stick instead of the one I had in mind :)
<Regenaxer> Good to know that it runs at least on a *few* machines :)
<mtsd> :)
<mtsd> I like the idea. Having a complete environment like that
<Regenaxer> yes, me too, but the amount of work to make it full-blown is huge
<Regenaxer> especially networking
<mtsd> I don't know where to start, unfortunately. Far beyond my capabilities..
<Regenaxer> would need a larger community
<Regenaxer> writing drivers for all kinds of hardware
<mtsd> The old Forth systems were like that, right? Self- contained environments etc?
<Regenaxer> yep
<mtsd> I have never encountered those myself, only read about it
<Regenaxer> Only Forth on embedded systems
<Regenaxer> others used the underlying system (eg. CP/M)
<mtsd> And linux seems to be the most common today, from what I gather
<Regenaxer> right, including Android
<Regenaxer> I find Android convenient, runs on many hardware platforms
<Regenaxer> And I can update the App in the Play Store myself without waiting for maintainers etc.
<mtsd> I like it too, just a bit worried about what Google might do
<Regenaxer> So PilBox is updated every few days
<Regenaxer> yeah
<Regenaxer> me too
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<mtsd> They have a habit of shutting things down at times. And the surveillance part
<Regenaxer> Exactly
<aw-> hi all
<aw-> hi Regenaxer
<Regenaxer> Also nasty changes to Android, making life hard
<Regenaxer> Hi aw-!
<mtsd> Perhaps just me being overly paranoid, but I do find Google scary
<aw-> maybe you can release Pilbox on F-Droid?
<mtsd> Hi aw- !
<Regenaxer> aw-, thought so too, but it needs a repo
<Regenaxer> git perhaps
<Regenaxer> which I don't like ;)
<Regenaxer> Play store is easier, I can do the build process as *I* like
<mtsd> haha, wonderful!! I don't like git either!!
<Regenaxer> :)
<mtsd> :)
<aw-> hmmm... maybe mmans can setup the repo for you?
<aw-> similar to github.com/picolisp/picolisp
<Regenaxer> And, in fact, I did not understand the process for F-Droid
<Regenaxer> There are pages pretending to explain how to put a project into f-droid
<aw-> well.. i think F-Droid is a much better alternative to Google*
<Regenaxer> but I did not get it
<aw-> it would be worth the time to figure it out
<aw-> i could look into it next week
<Regenaxer> read it, but the instructions were circular
<Regenaxer> cool, that would be great!
<Regenaxer> When I used LineageOS I used only f-droid
<Regenaxer> But now I must use PlayStore anyway for my customers :(
<Regenaxer> They don't manage to install from another source
<mtsd> Have a nice day, everyone. Time to take care of my youngest son :)
<mtsd> see you soon again!
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<Nistur> g'mornin'
<Regenaxer> Hi Nistur
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<tankf33der> git repos ?
<tankf33der> new hosting platforms - https://meta.sr.ht/
<tankf33der> and
<tankf33der> Regenaxer: or host yourself via gitea
<beneroth> host yourself with git init --bare
<beneroth> :P
<tankf33der> i dont think so this is enough.
<tankf33der> i dont think this is enough.
<beneroth> depends for what. when working in a team or using git for deployment, then yes its not enough as you want to use multiple different access rights on different branches etc
<beneroth> I'll look at the links, thanks mike
<tankf33der> check sr.ht first, a lot of features
<tankf33der> unique from one person.
<Regenaxer> All good, but I don't want to set up a Penti Repo *only* for F-Droid
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<beneroth> [OT] my newest webhoster story: graphic design company working for one of my hosting clients creates a new subdomain and tries to install their favourite PHP CMS. They (I assume) also setup HTTPS. Actually my clients can just click one single button to do this in the webhosting management account, then Let's Encrypt gets installed/configured for the domain. But they apparently didn't do this, no, they uploaded a self-signed certificate and actually named i
<beneroth> t in the webhosting certificate management the same as an automatically installed Lets Encrypt cert would be named. But its not a Lets Encrypt certificate, no trace of LE on it, its an uploaded self-signed cert. *facepalm*
<beneroth> so in the account it looked like Let's Encrypt was setup, but it actually was an self-signed cert (obviously not being accepted by standard browsers)
<beneroth> cargo-culting at it best. I could not imagine that shit.
<Regenaxer> Oh ;)
<beneroth> I get red patches on my face from too much facepalming
<beneroth> maybe I should start a "webhosting class for graphic designers" course offering or so ...
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<razzy> red face from facepalms, nice
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<razzy> hmm cannot figure out, how the nametags "BlackQueen" are created.
<razzy> scary black magic :]
<razzy> transient symbols that came fom nowhere. :[
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<freemint> Hello sometimes you come across problems where there is no single right question or approach to solve it. If the design space is huge it would be interesting to see what other people can come up with.
<freemint> Is there interest in "coding challenges" where a paragraph long problem description is given and people send in code (all on the mailing list) to solve these problems
<freemint> Would you be for or against scoring/picking a winner?
<freemint> If there is scoring would "one person judges" or "everybody gets a vote" be prefered?
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<aw-> tankf33der: i think Regenaxer's problem is with Git, not with the Git hosting itself
<freemint> if i understood Regenaxer right, he did not see any need for git in his development tool chain (patches are sent via IRC or eMail) and he thinks git makes thinks more complicated. Since there is an picolisp git mirror somewhere (which is auto updating if i recall correctly) i do not see what git would add for Regenaxer.