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<xiangfu>
how can I count the vias in KiCAD?
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<wpwrak>
xiangfu: in pcbnew, File > Fabrication Outputs > Drill (.drl) File. The dialog that comes up has the number of vias. (Then just cancel.)
<wpwrak>
hmm, does IRC have a "send when user returns" feature ? would seem useful when communicating with those who are not "always on", particularly when timeshifted
<viric>
nickserv has a mailbox
<viric>
when the nick identifies, gets notified of messages there
<viric>
hm maybe it's not nickserv, but another freenode bot
<larsc>
wpwrak: that's called email ;)
<wpwrak>
bah, that's so pre-social media
<viric>
wpwrak: it's memoserv. /msg memoserv help
<larsc>
wpwrak: twitter should work fine as well
<wpwrak>
viric: thanks ! let's see if it works :)
<viric>
memoserv is both the past and the future!
<wpwrak>
larsc: hmm, or maybe open a linkedin account, invite the recipient, and let linkedin flood him with nag mails
<wpwrak>
viric: so you say xiangfu will have read the message i just sent now before he left some time ago ?
<viric>
eh?
<viric>
I can't decode your message
<larsc>
timetravel
<wpwrak>
that was a reference to the past. ... yup :)
<wpwrak>
send message now, memoserv delivers it before it was sent.
<wpwrak>
viric: kewl, works :)
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<viric>
amazing technology
<wpwrak>
these fancy new "electronic brains" are quite something, eh ? maybe one day, they'll even play chess
<wpwrak>
that may be good. other soc makers may be unwilling to license powervr if imagination are competing in the soc market.
<paul_boddie>
Knowing Imagination and their highly proprietary PowerVR stuff, this probably means that they want MIPS vendors to saddle their products with it.
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: you may have news from MemoServ ;-)
<paul_boddie>
Obviously Intel, AMD and ARM have dumped Imagination, so they're effectively a patent troll in waiting.
<wpwrak>
if you see a patent, the trolls usually aren't far ...
<paul_boddie>
Actually, AMD probably never used them, but now that AMD will also produce ARM-based products, it's almost reassuring that ARM seem to have dumped PowerVR. Then again, ARM aren't completely trustworthy.
<wpwrak>
from what i've heard, mali is somewhat open. not sure if that's thanks to ARM or thanks to good reverse engineers, though.
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<xiangfu>
wpwrak, how do I know if them are blind vias or buried vias?
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, do you remember, once you talking about 'azonenberg' fpga PCB board. that something is not easy for command pcb fab?
<xiangfu>
something on azonenberg's board.
<xiangfu>
I have 2 azonenberg board kicad files here. one is 'minimal-spartan6-tq144 2 layers board', another one is xc6slx9 ftg256 4 layers board.
<paul_boddie>
What was the word on OpenRISC, by the way? I may go to a talk about that soon, and it'd be interesting to hear what people think of it in advance.
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: in general, you should try to avoid fancy vias. the best are through vias. then blind. buried are worst.
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: kicad doesn't seem to distinguish blind and buried in its statistics
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, ok. got it. I saw those fancy vias cost more money in PCB fab. :-)
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: azonenberg designs his boards to the capabilities of his pcb house. so you have to be a bit careful with his designs. they may be more demanding than necessary for a given design.
<wpwrak>
fancy vias also restrict your choice of fabs. and they're harder to debug if anything goes wrong.
<wpwrak>
s/for a given design/for a given circuit/
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, what is the special design?
<wpwrak>
what i mean is that he does some things in ways that complicate producing a board. that may include difficult via types or very narrow mechanical tolerances.
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, also there is a 'Impedance Control' like 10% or 5%. is that very important for 4 layer board?
<wpwrak>
i do the other extreme :) my boards are generally meant for DIY, so all vias are very simple, there's a lot of mechanical tolerance, etc.
<wpwrak>
depends on whether you have signals that need to be impedance matched :)
<wpwrak>
things like RF or other high-speed signals
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, (impedance matched) ok. what is the Impedance control on m1 board? do you know that?
<wpwrak>
not sure if any impedance constraints were specified for M1. most of the signals there are slow. you'd have to ask adam.
<xiangfu>
ok. then I think I also don't need that at all. :-)
<wpwrak>
with your little FPGA board ? no, i hope not ;-)
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, last question. how do I know the 'Min Annular Ring' on KiCAD?
<xiangfu>
every vias cost money. :(
<xiangfu>
about the Thickness (Finished Board), most common 2 or 4 layer board is 1.6mm. right?
<xiangfu>
some RF board may need 0.8 or 1mm PCB board.
<wpwrak>
(annular ring) that's a question from your pcb fab ? it would be either the outer diameter of vias or the difference between inner and outer diameter. not sure which.
<wpwrak>
1.6 mm is very common, yes. for small boards, you can also pick thinner pcbs. but 1.6 mm is a good default choice.
<wpwrak>
your vias seem a bit odd. the drill is quite large (0.3 mm / 12 mil) but the ring is narrow (only 0.1 mm)
<wpwrak>
i would make the hole a bit smaller (e.g., 0.25 mm / 10 mil). maybe also grow the ring a bit, in case you want to make DIY board from these parameters.
<xiangfu>
hmm...
<xiangfu>
in kicad. the Via shows: Diam: 0.551mm, Drill 0.330mm.
<xiangfu>
is that means ring is 0.22mm
<xiangfu>
0.221mm
<wpwrak>
0.22m / 2 for the ring width
<xiangfu>
oh. yes. 0.22 / 2
<xiangfu>
thanks wpwrak. I think I understand all those PCB Specification now. :)