00:31 <XgF> i think it has both issues but otoh there are fairly well implemented protocol stacks now and the range isn't really an issue

01:06 <JacobWeisz[m]> In my case I wanted to speak at the lowest possible layer with my devices so avoiding needing a complicated protocol stack was a selling point.

14:10 <kentonv> It occurred to me that I could just tell the electrician to wire every switch in the house as a 3-way switch with a second switch in the server room. No microchips, no protocols, hah.

14:13 <JacobWeisz[m]> That sounds potentially horrifying.

14:13 <JacobWeisz[m]> Also, pet peeve of mine: Most smart switches don't really account for three way setups. :/

14:14 <kentonv> good thing these aren't smart switches then! :)

14:14 <JacobWeisz[m]> Mine suggest using a standard switch and then having additional switches with no load, and solely using programming to trigger the lights from those.

14:14 <JacobWeisz[m]> And I want everything to work well when the smart stuff fails.

14:15 <simpson> That'd be a lot of extra effort, depending on how far away some of the rooms are, since the wires have to run back and forth, right?

14:15 <JacobWeisz[m]> I just imagine the wiring nightmare of that. You'd also probably be mostly on your own to set up all the relays to control them.

14:16 <kentonv> simpson, it'd be some, but: (1) the circuit breaker is in the server room anyway, so wires are already running, and (2) otherwise I'd want to run ethernet to these switches which seems more complicated

14:16 <kentonv> the more I look into RF for these, the less I like it.

14:16 <simpson> Good points. PoE really would have been great in an alternate timeline, huh.

14:18 <JacobWeisz[m]> A breaker usually has several outlets and switches on each one, whereas every switchable input would need it's own run in your scenario.

14:19 <JacobWeisz[m]> I am curious if you'd have Electrical Code issues with doing that.

14:19 <kentonv> I guess the electrician will tell me

14:19 <JacobWeisz[m]> Regulations are surprisingly picky about how you wire homes.

14:30 <TimMc> Has anyone yet produced a mechanical smart switch that throws a solenoid or whatever to flip physical switches?

15:20 <JacobWeisz[m]> I mean, if he does a three way, you don't need that, you replace the other switch with a relay.

15:30 <TimMc> Sure. Just curious. I have a fascination with control systems where there's dual mechanical/electronic control.

18:54 <JacobWeisz[m]> simpson, arguably PoE is an option, but Kenton doesn't want to run Ethernet to every switch and light fixture it sounds like.

18:55 <JacobWeisz[m]> It's probably a very expensive solution, and would probably require one heck of a switch powering it.

19:00 <simpson> Yeah.

19:04 <JacobWeisz[m]> Whole home backup power becomes a lot more straightforward though.

19:09 <TimMc> Hmm, how so?

19:19 <JacobWeisz[m]> Battery backup your switch and you've battery backed up all of your lighting.

19:20 <JacobWeisz[m]> I'm about 300% more comfortable working with anything that doesn't directly interface with the electrical panel.

19:20 <TimMc> Heh, fair. That *is* a lot less scary than a generator wired to the panel.

19:24 <JacobWeisz[m]> Could probably write some pretty cool rules in the automation system too for a power outage. Maybe automatically disabling some extraneous light fixtures and dimming the rest to lower the draw.

19:25 <TimMc> or apocalypse mode -- dim orange lights, a couple flickering on and off

19:30 <JacobWeisz[m]> lol

19:30 <JacobWeisz[m]> Outside of consumer smart bulbs lIke Hue there's not a lot of full RGB options.

19:31 <JacobWeisz[m]> One of the things I considered once was if one could use DMX-controlled stage lighting for home lighting.

19:31 <JacobWeisz[m]> ...Arguably, it's a wired lighting control standard.