<MasterChief10>
Got hello.exe in ~/rtems-beagleboard/arm/arm-rtems4.11/c/beagle/testsuites/samples/hello
<MasterChief10>
anyone explain please, this file is just Hello World executable and RTEMS kernel is another file or this is a Hello World together with kernel
<TheSeven>
MasterChief10: I guess you'll have better luck asking that in #rtems
<ccaione>
moin
<MasterChief10>
TheSeven: Never got any answer on that channel, seem like channel is dead
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<TheSeven>
anyone around who got mali to work on a20?
<TheSeven>
is limadriver worth it already?
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<libv>
TheSeven: have you tried looking at our wiki?
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<TheSeven>
libv: which wiki? lima or linux-sunxi?
<TheSeven>
I couldn't find useful information in either of them
<TheSeven>
rm: are your kernels based on an unmodified linux-sunxi tree, or do they contain some patches?
<libv>
andyjoecn: stop whining about generalities, and start asking real questions.
<CaptHindsight>
I'm playing catch up here, A10/20 was given lots of source and docs but the A13 and A80 no so much?
<libv>
andyjoecn: and don't expect people to know everything
<mnemoc>
libv: to get anything we need to touch their PR/Marketing sensitiveness
<libv>
CaptHindsight: a10, a20, a13 is decent
<libv>
CaptHindsight: everything else is not
<mnemoc>
and been a non-profit vendor neutral group we can actually talk freely
<libv>
mnemoc: right
<mnemoc>
followed by a reply to eva with a link to the gpl violations state page
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<mnemoc>
CCed to the ML
<libv>
ok
<mnemoc>
agree?
<andyjoecn>
so there is no board with LPDDR for sale, right ?
<libv>
i will do that, as we both have a reputation to keep up :p
<mnemoc>
:D
<libv>
but first, shopping, and then vacuuming, as otherwise my other half will beat me even more than usual :p
<mnemoc>
:D
<CaptHindsight>
what is Linaro's position on a founding members GPL violations?
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: they remain neutral
<mnemoc>
same as ARM itself
<libv>
CaptHindsight: but do nothing
<mnemoc>
"not-our-problem" (tm)
<CaptHindsight>
I've been watching this for over 20 years
<mnemoc>
linaro is a company which's business is to help other companies get mainline support
<libv>
i am not too fond of linaro, they achieved only part of what they could've achieved, and they are way too tied in to change anything fundamental within their member companies, making the whole thing far too washed down
<CaptHindsight>
when coreboot around 1999' met so much resistance I knew something funny was up
<libv>
resistance?
<libv>
it was called linuxbios then though
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<CaptHindsight>
yeah, why the x86 vendors just didn't want to touch it
<libv>
CaptHindsight: because it fundamentally changed their mode of working
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<CaptHindsight>
we offered to work with Intel when they were first starting EFI
<libv>
CaptHindsight: cfr. the RadeonHD project
<CaptHindsight>
they didn't even have it running yet
<libv>
modesetting and bios free display drivers
<libv>
oh, and arm gpus
<CaptHindsight>
there's a pathology at work here
<CaptHindsight>
control and backdoors, no privacy
<libv>
CaptHindsight: it's human nature and the weight of corporations
<libv>
s/weight/inertia/
<CaptHindsight>
"institutional mindsets"
<libv>
that's true everywhere
<libv>
the difference between open source software and corporations, is that the shit throwing happens in public, and there's no-one to keep people in check when it explodes
<CaptHindsight>
yeah, thats the problem
<CaptHindsight>
not sure when people are going to fix that
<CaptHindsight>
well we fixed the deification problem eons ago
<libv>
CaptHindsight: not really.
<libv>
CaptHindsight: it's amazing what some of the open source gods have on their records, and how they still are seen as such.
<CaptHindsight>
fanboy-ism
<libv>
there's just no actual blood flowing
<libv>
but only just
<CaptHindsight>
I see it with makerspaces and open hardware as well
<libv>
explain
<CaptHindsight>
like the open source gods
* libv
has no experience with makerspaces, and only knows olimex hw
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<CaptHindsight>
people just need someone to put up on a pedastal, if you' in the game early it happens the rest is like the room of monkeys
<CaptHindsight>
nobody even knows why they are still exalted but everyone still does it
<CaptHindsight>
with the open hardware projects and makerspaces there are few people that published some awful designs...
<CaptHindsight>
but their words are taken like gospel now
<libv>
people are stupid
<libv>
and don't remember anything much
<CaptHindsight>
I think Bre Pettis of makerbot is the only one that people stopped following
<CaptHindsight>
but he had to sell his co to Stratasys for ~$600M to get to that point
<CaptHindsight>
now he's off patenting everything in those reprap type printers
<CaptHindsight>
i was going to get back on designing and Allwinner board with an FPGA, not sure which SOC to use now
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: extend the lime
<libv>
for instance, for all my display work, i spent years working on actual code that nobody cared for, and i spent a lot of time talking about it while noone cared. people either ignored me or told me i was completely wrong. when the latter went off and actively proven me right (without mentioning me of course), i went and pulled this one big figures pants down
<libv>
what do people remember: i am a whiny guy who was wrong, and who then cried out loud and stabbed this one person in the back
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<CaptHindsight>
I recall
<libv>
humans are stupid
<CaptHindsight>
i was waiting for the A80 but not so sure now if the docs and source will not arrive
<CaptHindsight>
mnemoc: whats the lime?
<libv>
and unless you really go over a certain boundary, like bre pettis apparently, they ignore/forget the nastiness
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: the lime is the flagship of allwinner based OSHW :)
<libv>
if you cross a certain line, people only remember the nastiness
<mnemoc>
the "winner" gets the nastiness forgotten, the "loser" get's it exagerated
<CaptHindsight>
fanisim
<CaptHindsight>
I started getting excited when Makerspaces stated popping up
<CaptHindsight>
people actually looking at facts and science and building things
<mnemoc>
too much "artist" aura on those places...
<CaptHindsight>
but they ended up being like an unsupervised junior high with tools
<CaptHindsight>
mnemoc: the one I visited around here just required a shower and soap to clear the auroa/aroma
<mnemoc>
:D
<CaptHindsight>
been using the cubie2 here
<CaptHindsight>
we have an FPGA and IO breakout board that it plugs into for power and extra headers
<mnemoc>
can you name one makerspace born project that "graduated" into a oshw startup?
<CaptHindsight>
makerbot went closed
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: the thing with the lime (and other olimex designs) is that you can make your own board based on them adding the fpga
<CaptHindsight>
there are few that aren't very popular
<CaptHindsight>
yeah, I need to keep cost down. I'm mainly a hardware guy 30+ years of cpu board designs mostly x86
<CaptHindsight>
so an allwinner pcb is a few days work for me
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: olimex has a bunch of allwinner based designs you can use as starting point. and in the mean time get a board for prototyping the extension
<mnemoc>
assuming you want to go for OSHW
<CaptHindsight>
yeah, we have a few cubie 1 and 2's
<mnemoc>
cubieboards aren't opshw
<CaptHindsight>
I have the reference designs from allwinner as well
<CaptHindsight>
Tom Cubie didn't post his design files?
<mnemoc>
only the schematics
<CaptHindsight>
crappy board layout anyway
<mnemoc>
hipboi's goal was on size and price more than elegance ;-)
<CaptHindsight>
they way can write a few hundred lines of code a day and work with compilers is like me with pcb layout tools and soldering irons
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<specing>
CaptHindsight: is anyone working on a oshw x86 laptop that doesen't use ancient cpus?
<CaptHindsight>
it works, just not a great layout
<CaptHindsight>
specing: I get design files right from AMD. I could publish my own spin on them but Sage has that one open board
<CaptHindsight>
the guys at Sage used to work for AMD
<mnemoc>
joke case, joke keyboard, joke display, no sata
<specing>
what mnemoc said
<mnemoc>
they insist in thinking a laptop is a tablet with keyboard
<CaptHindsight>
I'm printing multilayer PCB's using nothing but fluids now, core + traces
<specing>
I want something I can program on for 16h a day without making my eyes/fingers/whatever hurt
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<CaptHindsight>
that should make low volume PCB's and assembly lower cost
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<specing>
I wanted to buy that new lenovo T440s but was turned off by encrypted bios, lack of thinklight, CLICKPAD and THE UPSIDE DOWN LOGO!
<CaptHindsight>
next week is computex taipei
<mnemoc>
solid 13.3" full hd display with old-thinkpad keyboard, large battery for under 2k and I'm sold.
<specing>
now I have my 7y old laptop on life support
<CaptHindsight>
you can walk down the aisles and pick out parts
<specing>
pending something worth buying
<specing>
mnemoc: me too
<CaptHindsight>
same for a visit to Shenzhen
<CaptHindsight>
all we need to do is lock in the enclosure, LCD, Keyboard etc from a vendor without the mainboard
<CaptHindsight>
then just make an open mainboard
<mnemoc>
there are nice inexpensive ips 11-13" >1080p panels these days
<specing>
there are nice inexpensive IPS panels for all sizes these days
<specing>
system vendors just charge an arm and a leg premium for them
<CaptHindsight>
there are lots of OEM/ODM's that have it all, we just want that minus the mainboard
<mnemoc>
but manufacturers still believe in 1366x768 as a good resolution...
<specing>
e.g. Lenovo charges $200 more for the IPS panel
<specing>
same panel is $70 new from laptopscreen.com
<CaptHindsight>
all these parts get purchased in high volumes, you get the low prices for low volume buy purchasing them out the backdoor from the assemblers
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: so, when can you expect your laptop? :p
<CaptHindsight>
they get the million piece price, you pay that + 1-2% in the markets
<CaptHindsight>
I asked the coreboot group to decide on something and they were looking at some off-the-shelf laptop to port
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: having a good design/specs/prototype, indiegogo will tell you in 2 weeks if there is market for it
<CaptHindsight>
with the success of Bunnys project maybe
<CaptHindsight>
I'm mostly working on new tech for additive manufacturing now
<CaptHindsight>
when I get some time I'll see about it again
<CaptHindsight>
but if someone sources the laptop from one of the whitebox vendors minus the mainboard it's easy
<mnemoc>
the novena is like the apple of open hardware. we need an open laptop for programmers :)
<CaptHindsight>
it's imx6?
<mnemoc>
yes :
<mnemoc>
:\
<CaptHindsight>
I can make it with any cpu under 50W
<mnemoc>
rk3288 :p
<CaptHindsight>
but an APU board is easy
<mnemoc>
yes, the APUs are nice.
* mnemoc
uses a thinkpad with a4-5000
<CaptHindsight>
AMD APU + TI ARM EC use in the Google chromebook
<CaptHindsight>
the firmware for the EC is all open and already written and working
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: the novena is an "Apple", overpriced symbol of style, for the OSHW hipsten niche
<mnemoc>
hipster*
<CaptHindsight>
specing: no, you'll start a fire
<jelly-home>
CaptHindsight: could you really design a board from scratch in a few weeks?
<specing>
I'd be so proud if I could walk around the street with a bunch of plain batteries taped to the screen/bottom :D :D :D :D
<jelly-home>
mnemoc: also, you pay for a year or two of design finetuning
<specing>
CaptHindsight: I mean, for the board to include a charge controller
<CaptHindsight>
jelly-home: if I don't then I get fired, that's all the time we get
<CaptHindsight>
jelly-home: some boards we do in days
<mnemoc>
jelly-home: those 2 years of design can also be paid if you aim at lower price/larger quantity
<CaptHindsight>
pcb layout takes the longest
<jelly-home>
CaptHindsight: that environment does not sound too open, tho
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<CaptHindsight>
jelly-home: I can post my designs under any license
<specing>
CaptHindsight: those are desktop APUs, we need either mobile ones or a 500Wh battery
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<mnemoc>
jelly-home: also, lowering the price you have lower risk of getting cloned
<CaptHindsight>
we get the reference designs right from AMD, but they aren't good for making a laptop that you'd want to sell, you modify the files and layout the board
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<mnemoc>
can you OS a design based on the reference design from AMD?
<CaptHindsight>
yes
<mnemoc>
nice
<CaptHindsight>
we just download Orcad and Allegro files
<mnemoc>
ssvb: around? taking the dust out of my CT, wrote the latest u-boot-sunxi on the card. and... ethernet support doesn't work. I was told you are the one to bother for that :)
<mnemoc>
rm: patches welcomed :)
<mnemoc>
rm: code runs every hour
<ssvb>
mnemoc: how does it fail?
<mnemoc>
tells ethaddr is not set, but it is.
<ssvb>
mnemoc: then it's something else
<ssvb>
mnemoc: the problem I was nagging about was a failure with lots of "ERROR: v7_dcache_inval_range - start address is not aligned - 0x7fb677e0" spam
<mnemoc>
i'm not getting that start address is not aligned stuff
<ssvb>
mnemoc: don't know, I'm using static ip addresses myself
<mnemoc>
ok. i'll do that as well
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<mnemoc>
when using mainline, where do you normally load the initramfs?
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<Turl>
mnemoc: where do you load it for 3.4?
<Turl>
mnemoc: I always embed mine in the kernel, fwiw
<Turl>
but it should work the same as 3.4 in that regard
<mnemoc>
Turl: I've never used initrd on 3.4... we have real root= there :p
<Turl>
mnemoc: then just load it somewhere after the kernel
<mnemoc>
ok
<Turl>
it shouldn't matter where, as long as it's in the first 256M or so
* mnemoc
wonders why `source` tries to exectute 48000000 instead of ${loadaddr} by default
<mnemoc>
Starting kernel ...
<mnemoc>
resetting ...
<mnemoc>
:(
<Turl>
mnemoc: paste your commands so I can take a look
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<mnemoc>
[ 0.000000] Linux version 3.14.4-116315-g073040b (amery@builder) (gcc version 4.6.3 (Ubuntu/Linaro 4.6.3-1ubuntu5) ) #3 SMP Mon May 26 18:28:33 CEST 2014
<mnemoc>
%.img: mkimage -A arm -T script -C none -d $< $@
<mnemoc>
so I define the env in my laptop and not in the target
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<mnemoc>
auto dhcp'ing a boot script is fun. a bit less fun when your u-boot decides to not let you clear ${bootfile} and `source` insists in using a god-knows-where address instead of ${loadaddr} by default, but fun anyway
<mnemoc>
setenv bootcmd 'dhcp; source' would normally be enough
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<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: maybe you are the one :p .... read that page
<CaptHindsight>
easy enough, I have more projects than time
<mnemoc>
that's what makes life fun
<CaptHindsight>
too bad the eoma stuff just went batshit crazy
<CaptHindsight>
if there was a new lapdoc it needs power supply and batter charger and place to doc the mainboard
<CaptHindsight>
so it doesn't sit there in two parts with a cable
<CaptHindsight>
you thought about making them work with HDMI sticks
<mnemoc>
and devboards
<mnemoc>
mounted on the back of the display with a vesa mounted plastic grid
<CaptHindsight>
what about power supply and battery charger?
<CaptHindsight>
where would that fit?
<CaptHindsight>
brick for power
<TheSeven>
hm... which linux desktop environments run somewhat smoothly (if at all) on OpenGL ES these days?
<TheSeven>
I saw announcements of GLES ports of Unity from two years ago, yet the current ubuntu builds seem to require full OpenGL
<mnemoc>
battery inside the laptop, feeding the board via usb
<mnemoc>
TheSeven: there is a variant of unity that doesn't use 3d
<CaptHindsight>
mnemoc: ok for low power cpu boards, not good for x86
<TheSeven>
mnemoc: where can I find that?
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: it wasn't intended for x86 :p
<mnemoc>
TheSeven: apt-get install unity-2d
<CaptHindsight>
mnemoc: yeah, I know :)
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: personally I'm a big fan of 12V 5.5/2.1 DC in
* TheSeven
can't believe he didn't find that...
<mnemoc>
TheSeven: :)
<mnemoc>
CaptHindsight: what voltages the APU needs?
<TheSeven>
mnemoc: hm, unity-2d is just a transitional metapackage that depends on unity :/
<mnemoc>
TheSeven: probably unity learned to support 2d too now
<TheSeven>
the unity compiz plugin depends on the opengl one, which fails to load on my A20 olinuxino...
<TheSeven>
now the question is: is that opengl plugin supposed to work with GLES?
<CaptHindsight>
mnemoc: everything is 3.3V or less, the 12 is for analog and 19V is the common input for LithiumIon battery chargers
<TheSeven>
hm, looks like unity-2d was actually the old "ubuntu classic" thing that didn't need any HW accel at all, and was deprecated when they introduced llvmpipe
<mnemoc>
unity-2d was just like unity. not gnome2
<TheSeven>
basically unity without desktop effects though
<TheSeven>
anyway, it doesn't exist anymore since 12.10
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<ssvb>
TheSeven: AFAK, kwin-gles is the best option if you want to do GLES compositing
<TheSeven>
hm, it's not so much the compositing that I'm after, but something that runs at all and fits well on small LCDs
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<ssvb>
TheSeven: then very likely you don't need GLES at all
<TheSeven>
...if I get unity (or something similar) to work without full GL
<ssvb>
TheSeven: as for the desktop environments, there are a number of options: XFCE, LXDE, MATE, ...
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<ssvb>
TheSeven: if you specifically want the unity user interface, then that's another story
<ssvb>
TheSeven: basically, somebody needs to make this junk usable on low end ARM hardware
<TheSeven>
I'd prefer it at least... if it can't be done that's one thing, but it bugs me that people seem to have been doing it for 2 years apparently...
<TheSeven>
could also be that it's supposed to work out of the box and I'm just screwing up something of course
<ssvb>
TheSeven: the current ubuntu does not seem to care about such hardware anymore, so somebody has to do their homework
<ssvb>
TheSeven: or just buy a powerful hardware and be happy
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<mnemoc>
Turl: if you have a minute, can you tell me until which part of sunxi-devel is already code accepted by maintainers?
<mnemoc>
for sunxi-3.14.4-r1
<mnemoc>
v3.15rc7 is already covered by sunxi-3.14.4-r0
<Nyuutwo>
I read wiki, and I don't know if I want to jump mainline kernel or jus stay on 3.4
<mnemoc>
Nyuutwo: depends of what do you need the hardware for
<Nyuutwo>
I have 2 devices, tablet which I want to unandroize
<mnemoc>
no display in mainline
<Nyuutwo>
and cubie2 as car media center
<Nyuutwo>
ouch
<Nyuutwo>
so 3.4
<mnemoc>
:)
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<Nyuutwo>
and also in sunxi-bsp make update makes some magic
<Nyuutwo>
what exactly it checkouts
<mnemoc>
it uses gitsubmodules, and it's kind of unmaintained :\
<mnemoc>
if you are happy with the default configs you can just use the nightly builds