Topic for #qi-hardware is now Copyleft hardware - http://qi-hardware.com | hardware hackers join here to discuss Ben NanoNote, atben / atusb 802.15.4 wireless, and other community driven hw projects | public logging at http://en.qi-hardware.com/irclogs
<DocScrutinizer>
roh: ping
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<roh>
pong
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<roh>
DocScrutinizer: pong
<roh>
*blink*
<DocScrutinizer>
roh: hi! :-)
<DocScrutinizer>
roh: any news or ETA guessing for the big move of doc.om.org et al? seems quite some people are missing svn and a few others
<roh>
nope... sean sadly doesnt react on mail so its delaying
<DocScrutinizer>
:-S
<roh>
but i think i will happen sometime soon
<roh>
propably while regular work-hours
<DocScrutinizer>
any chances you kick svn and doc vserver? until the move
<roh>
the vm is up, but its filtered on the outside
<DocScrutinizer>
o.O ??
<roh>
had some 'guest' using it as spam-relay quite a while ago
<DocScrutinizer>
yeah, munin seemed to suggest they are all running
<roh>
kicked him out, but the block needs (signed?) paperwork
<DocScrutinizer>
oh shit
<roh>
well.. it will be resolved with the move, afaik
<DocScrutinizer>
could somebody (me?) contact hetzner and ask what's the deal?
<roh>
nope.
<DocScrutinizer>
re block
<roh>
in the current legal think i think sean would need to sign, but since we change all that it will be much easier.
<roh>
legal thing of course
<DocScrutinizer>
mhm
<roh>
relay. is ostermontag. nothing will happen in germany anyhow.
<roh>
irgh. relax
<DocScrutinizer>
sure
<DocScrutinizer>
no hurry, no hassle. Just asking
<DocScrutinizer>
esp since admintrac is down
<DocScrutinizer>
and I published nagging me via IRC is the fallback method then
<DocScrutinizer>
s/down/blocked
<roh>
weird.
<roh>
hetzer said they replaced the hw..
<roh>
well.. it seems agni is completely down and i dont know why.
<DocScrutinizer>
duh, again?
<DocScrutinizer>
not since long
<roh>
i cant reach it.
<roh>
anyhow.. will drive to the lab now. and dont think much will happen soon
<roh>
bbl
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<kyak>
xiangfu: hi
<kyak>
xiangfu: a question: do we still need everything from nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files/etc/uci-defaults?
<kyak>
it's setting up some links which was a workaround in previous releases, but now it could be unnecessary/dangerous
<kyak>
xiangfu: another question: nananote-base-files only provides kernel-6x11-font. Maybe we should move it to script-files and get rid of base-files at all? It seems strange that we provide both scripts/data with script-files and kernel-6x11-font looks like forgotten in base-files :)
<kyak>
xiangfu: and the last question; is there a reason why you decided not to send all openwrt-xburst patches to openwrt upstream?
<kyak>
my understanding is that if we use these patches for release, they are all ready for openwrt upstream. I'm not saying they are ready for kernel upstream
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<xiangfu>
kyak, Hi.
<xiangfu>
just back from lunch.
<xiangfu>
1.(nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files/etc/uci-defaults) I think we still need this one: 01-optimization-for-ben-nanonote. the other two can remove.
<xiangfu>
2. (kernel-6x11-font) totally agree.
<xiangfu>
the plan is 'scripts' for the files that nanonote needs and don't over-write any other openwrt base files.
<xiangfu>
and hte 'data/qi_lb60/files' is for the files that over-write the openwrt base files.
<xiangfu>
I needs clean up them.
<xiangfu>
I think the namd of 'script-files' is not fit for those files any more.
<xiangfu>
I will move all files to base-files. just like the openwrt names
<kyak>
this is a good idea
<kyak>
btw, do we need the posinstall section in nanonote-files Makefile?
<kyak>
i think the idea was to overwrite openwrt base-files, but this doesn't always work (depends on installation order).. since we set up a symlink like feeds/local_qipackages/nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files/ in openwrt-xburst, we coudl remove the postinstall
<xiangfu>
I think we needs keep the nanonote-data-files/postinst. it should be works fine on overwrite
<xiangfu>
kyak, my plan is remove the 'CONFIG_PACKAGE_nanonote-base-files=y' in config.full_system.
<xiangfu>
but people can still opkg install this package.
<kyak>
ah
<xiangfu>
the opkg install should works fine with postinstall.
<kyak>
yeah, totally agree then
<xiangfu>
kyak, the build order. yes correct.
<xiangfu>
I think we needs move 'gmen2x' to base-files
<kyak>
xiangfu: maybe we should do like that: put all gmenu2x icons in nanonote-gmenu2x-icons package, OR - just get rid of all nanonote-whatever-package and just keep everything (except for example files) in nanonote-base-files
<kyak>
to make things simple
<xiangfu>
(nanonote-gmenu2x-icons) great.
<kyak>
xiangfu: btw, gmenu2x-settings, can't exit on "S" -\
<kyak>
have to kill gmenu2x :)
<kyak>
we kind of paid too small attention to gmenu2x, and it floated away in direction of dingoo.. too many regressions on Ben
<xiangfu>
let me commit first. I will split the gmenu2x-icons in next commit.
<kyak>
it's great if we reorganize nanonote-files in a smart way. I'm starting to get lost in all those files :)
<xiangfu>
kyak,(gmenu2x) maybe we switch to David's 'alfilesel' someday :-)
<kyak>
xiangfu: so basically it's like that now: 1) nanonote-base-files is to keep all files (both scripts and data) except for gmenu2x icons and /etc. 2) Those files in /etc are provided by the "files" symlink or nanonote-data-files on "opkg install" 3) nanonote-gmenu2x-icons holds gmenu2x icons
<xiangfu>
kyak, yes.
<kyak>
4) and there is nanonote-example-files holding music and whatever
<kyak>
ok, this is great.. perhaps i would suggest one more change to make it more clear: move nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files to nanonote-files/files (so that other directories in nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60 don't confuse)
<kyak>
then by looking at root of nanonote-files/ we can't directly say which directory goes where
<kyak>
*we can
<qi-bot>
Jon Phillips: @christopheradam made a concise post about @qihardware and @milkymistvj + has a great new picture of the hardware: http://t.co/l7P8mabZ ( 189239979438907392@rejon - 1m ago via Ping.fm )
<xiangfu>
kyak, yes.
<kyak>
i wonder if git will handle it when i pull all the changes :)
<kyak>
need to recreate the symlink in openwrt-xburst then
<xiangfu>
I have asked sdwalker add openwrt-package
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<LunaVorax>
Hello everyone!
<wolfspraul>
hi
<Fallenou>
hi
<wolfspraul>
Fallenou: hey, nice to see you in Qi Hardware too! ;-)
<wolfspraul>
I thought you were an exclusive milkymister
<Fallenou>
hehe I'm trying to be more social
<Fallenou>
I have just read your email
<Fallenou>
about Ya NanoNote being based on Milkymist SoC
<Fallenou>
what a crazy (and awesome) idea :)
<wolfspraul>
well, why do we work on an SoC if we then don't use it *everywhere*?
<wolfspraul>
it's like the Linux kernel, my friends for many years knew me as someone who would first install Linux on *every* computing device he got. OF COURSE!? huh?
<wolfspraul>
:-)
<wolfspraul>
so let's see. I am learning about IC design and SoC. total beginner.
<wolfspraul>
but I think we will use a free IC design as the central digital signalling hub for everything, sure. yes. what else? :-)
<wolfspraul>
is there any legacy stuff left out there?
<Fallenou>
that makes totally sense to me
<wolfspraul>
see!?
<wolfspraul>
I knew it
<wolfspraul>
so then
<Fallenou>
why using some proprietary chip if there is a functional competitive alternative which is open source :)
<wolfspraul>
yes, a few pieces of legacy here and there, we clean them up, and then into the future
<Fallenou>
indeed it's work
<Fallenou>
but I think you don't fear working =)
<wolfspraul>
there's just enormous power available to us once we move beyond the x86/arm black box / iron curtain
<wolfspraul>
since I only do what I love, how could I fear anything?
<wolfspraul>
no, it feels right
<wolfspraul>
milkymist one today is still too basic, many things it could do don't work today
<wolfspraul>
so...
<DocScrutinizer>
moo
<Fallenou>
yes a lot of work to do
<Fallenou>
you would need a few dozen engineers
<Fallenou>
every open source project does not have the Linux work force
<wolfspraul>
well I don't like to look at this just by how much one could work
<wolfspraul>
the reason there are many linux devs is because linux is valuable to many companies and lots of the devs make their living that way
<wolfspraul>
keep in mind that we made a usable and fun product around the milkymist soc today
<wolfspraul>
it's not like "we need another xyz"
<wolfspraul>
no we need nothing
<wolfspraul>
we just need m1 and some good music
<wolfspraul>
the rest is non-technical :-)
<Fallenou>
sure
<Fallenou>
I was just thinking about work force because there is a road map and a lot to do (usb, mmu, linux etc)
<wolfspraul>
every creator is faced with shortage of resources
<wolfspraul>
from people with access to vast resources - how many create something lasting?
<wolfspraul>
so let's see. you have limited resources, and became passionate about the mmu, which a lot of people would love to have. is it enough to create something? we shall find out :-)
<wolfspraul>
but whatever the result is, it's worth trying and the most important is that you enjoy being on that path! irrespective of the result
<wolfspraul>
by the time we just buy what we need things are boring
<wolfspraul>
Fallenou: you mentioned some roadblocks recently? did sleeping over them help in any way?
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<wolfspraul>
writing this up could be helpful in itself, since there are a number of beginners/lurkers around
<Fallenou>
oh a sum up of the state of the mmu dev ?
<Fallenou>
I'm planning on sending a sum up email with a call for advices and ideas, not done yet, I tried a few more things yesterday
<wolfspraul>
you mentioned something you got stuck on
<wolfspraul>
ah ok
<Fallenou>
yes I'm still stuck :(
<wolfspraul>
I see
<Fallenou>
I asked a few fpga engineers , they didn't help much about my problem
<Fallenou>
but they did point a few things in Milkymist design
<Fallenou>
not sure if it's a real issue but I could talk to lekernel about it
<Fallenou>
about meta stability, asynchronous reset and DCM initialization
<wolfspraul>
trust yourself
<Fallenou>
I lost a few hours trying to get my hands on ModelSim , a verilog simulator
<wolfspraul>
the most those people can often help you with is to be angry at their uselessness and finally realize yourself what's going on :-)
<Fallenou>
right now I am doing simulations using ISim (ISE stuff)
<Fallenou>
I wanted to try something else, since ISim does not help much here
<Fallenou>
the MMU is working in ISim, so there must be something wrong with the simulation being too optimistic somewhere :)
<Fallenou>
17:11 < wolfspraul> the most those people can often help you with is to be angry at their uselessness and finally realize yourself what's going on :-) < ahah yes, that's the good moments, when you eventually figure out what is going wrong and fix it yourself :)
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<kyak>
!seen dvdk
<qi-bot>
kyak, dvdk (~dvdkhlng@g225045026.adsl.alicedsl.de) was last seen quitting #milkymist 1 day 16 hours 52 minutes ago (08.04. 00:06) stating "Remote host closed the connection" after spending 3 hours 37 minutes there.