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<kanzure>
someone suggests designing a hash function that uses a local lookup table to make the hash constrained by memory-bandwidth. he claims that this prevents asics (which i doubt.. why can't i make high-memory-bandwidth asics?) (plus i'm not convinced that's desirable).
<narwh4l>
kanzure: has he not heard of the hash functions that rely on memory bandwidth?
<narwh4l>
kanzure: prevent asics? lol
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<kanzure>
well, i certainly haven't looked at memory-bandwidth-constrained hash functions yet
<gmaxwell>
kanzure: see descussions of the bcrypt like sboxes in yescrypt... but the argument is kinda weak.
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<StephenM347>
Does BIP62 cover addition of OP_NOPs into the scriptSig?
<StephenM347>
I suppose this counts as a 'non-push operation'
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<wumpus>
StephenM347: yes
<wumpus>
only direct pushes, OP_PUSHDATAn, OP_n are considered push opcodes, see CScript::IsPushOnly
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<StephenM347>
wumpus: Just double checking, thanks
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<kanzure>
petertodd: can you show me "recursive snarks" stuff if any exists?
<amiller>
this does *one layer* of snark composition... it has an inner snark and an outer snark... its practical and efficient but no code is released yet (the author is nice and will probably release it soon)
<amiller>
this one finds parameters for arbitrary recursive composition.... it's about finding two related elliptic curves, such that you can run the snark algorithm for B in the exponent of curve A, and vice versa.... the concrete performance is a lot worse than geppetto but you can do as many layers as yo uawnt
<amiller>
i have heard that there is recursive composition as per the 2014/595 paper already implemented in libsnark, but I can't see it. maybe it's not released yet.
<kanzure>
unrelated, but have you looked at sequential abbreviated signatures before?
<kanzure>
oh strange; for some reason i was not aware that libsnark has active development.
<kanzure>
(just fetched their latest commits)
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<amiller>
yeah, libsnark is definitely under active development
* Luke-Jr
wonders how long until there's a sandbox that can just execute snarks <.<
<amiller>
Luke-Jr, ive been working on that actually
<zooko>
☺
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<theymos>
weex, maaku: BitcoinJ only connects to nodes returned by the DNS seeds, so if you ensure that all of the DNS seeds return trustworthy peers on the right side of the fork, this'll protect most SPV wallets.
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<phantomcircuit>
theymos, that's hilariously the same security model as a bunch of the PoS things
<phantomcircuit>
"if the first node you hear about is trustworthy then you're securE!"
<phantomcircuit>
k
<phantomcircuit>
i assume you're not seriously proposing that as a valid security model :)
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<theymos>
phantomcircuit: It's not good, but that's what BitcoinJ actually does now. So it's an option until that's fixed.
<theymos>
Fixing it is more difficult than it looks at first because SPV clients have less ability to detect bad peers.
<phantomcircuit>
theymos, i've actually been arguing recently that there basically shouldn't be any SPV nodes as they exist today
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<theymos>
What do you propose as an alternative?
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<phantomcircuit>
theymos, start with a pure spv node and then upgrade the security of the installation overtime
<phantomcircuit>
ie
<phantomcircuit>
first spv checks
<phantomcircuit>
then sanity check all blocks
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<phantomcircuit>
saving only the hash of the last blocks you checked
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<phantomcircuit>
congrats you've now managed to significantly improve security without storing much of anything
<phantomcircuit>
the key is to note that running most of the sanity checks like maximum blocksize are independent of each other
<phantomcircuit>
brb
<theymos>
That's a good idea. Probably miners should commit to that sort of "sanity" stuff by including it in their coinbase transaction or something. Then lightweight clients don't have to download as much data.
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