sipa changed the topic of #bitcoin-wizards to: This channel is for discussing theoretical ideas with regard to cryptocurrencies, not about short-term Bitcoin development | http://bitcoin.ninja/ | This channel is logged. | For logs and more information, visit http://bitcoin.ninja
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<dgpv>
if you change behaviour for SIGHASH_NOINPUT so that it ignores only the current input, and to ignore all inputs you need NOINPUT|ANYONECANPAY,
<dgpv>
you could create a script that would require certain UTXO to be spent along with the currently spending
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<dgpv>
you create NOINPUT_SINGLE signature with a known key, and include it in scriptPubKey (or check a hash of it in scriptpubkey)
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<dgpv>
because it does not commit to the current input, there should not be circular dependency
<dgpv>
if you can force that certain UTXO2 must be spent along with other particular UTXO1, you can revoke the rights to spend UTXO1 without moving it, by spending UTXO2
<dgpv>
I wonder if you can emulate SECURETHEBAG with NOINPUT with the same scheme
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<dgpv>
you include a NOINPUT signature of the known key in the scriptPubKey, and check it. This signature commits to the outputs, and does not commit to the inputs
<dgpv>
the key can be publicitly known, because what we need is just the signature to be correct for the hash of the tx without inputs
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<dgpv>
so you will be able to force the transaction to have particuar inputs or particular outputs (or both, with two such signatures), without additional opcodes like SECURETHEBAG
<dgpv>
the script would be <noinput-sig-known-key> CHECKSIG <pubkey> CHECKSIG
<dgpv>
the script would be<known-key-pubkey> <noinput-sig-known-key> CHECKSIG <pubkey> CHECKSIG
<dgpv>
do I miss something obvious ?
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<dgpv>
s/scriptPubKey/redeemScript/ obviously, skp would be standard p2sh/p2wsh etc
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<dgpv>
> include a NOINPUT signature of the known key
<dgpv>
obviously the nonce should also be known/fixed, but we do not care that anyone can create such signature, we care that it forces inputs/ouptus to be fixed
<dgpv>
this signature is the part of redeemscript
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<dgpv>
oh, sighash includes the script, and if we include even a fixed signature in it, we get circular dependency. So this won't work :-/
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<dgpv>
aj talked about the same idea in mailing list, "SIGHASH_ANYPREVOUTANYSCRIPT". if you can have 'IGNOREPREVOUT' sighash flag you can then have NOINPUT via IGNOREPREVOUT|ANYONECANPAY and IGNOREPREVOUT|ANYONECANPAY|NOSCRIPT would be the same as SIGHASH_ANYPREVOUTANYSCRIPT
<dgpv>
and if you want to commit to inputs and have this 'transfer/revoke the right to spend utxo without moving it' you could use IGNOREPREVOUT|NOSCRIPT|NONE
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<dgpv>
because the signature does not commit to the script, you can use "<sig> <P> CHECKSIG" script.
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<dgpv>
Turns out I use the chat to think aloud again. Sorry for the noise.
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<Blackwolfsa>
Hi, I am playing around with idea of payment channels in MimbleWimble. If you have 1 commitment on chain (lets call it VH + kG), which is 2 commitments summed together form the sidechain (lets call them VaH+ kaG and VbH+kbG). So in effect you have VH + kG = (Va+Vb)H + (ka +kb)G. If (VaH+ kaG) and (VbH+kbG) both have a valid bulletproof. Is it possi
<Blackwolfsa>
ble to present a bulletproof for Vh+kG without the owners of both (VaH+ kaG) and (VbH+kbG) being online?
<Blackwolfsa>
Or even a differant rangeproof like Zk-snarks, for that matter...
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<waxwing>
if you sum two commitments to values v_a and v_b, and you have proof that each are < N, then the summed commitment is proven to be to a value < 2N.
<waxwing>
but thats just the dumb "show both original proofs", i guess one could do better. aggregation after the fact, i guess, doesn't quite work, but .. not sure.
<sipa>
actually even value < 2N-1
<waxwing>
(in the sense that you apparently want no involvement of the original parties in construction of new proof)
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<Blackwolfsa>
Yeah the idea is not to involve the parties
<Blackwolfsa>
They have created their commitments with valid proofs so you know they are valid. But the block chain won't know that
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<elichai2>
Is the contract in the pay-to-contract(taproot) considered to be scriptPubKey/RedeemScript/ neither?
<sipa>
it's the merkle root of the script tree
<sipa>
the term redeemscript is usually only used for p2sh
<sipa>
scriptpubkey is the script that actually goes into the txout
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