<veltas>
"The code was written in 68K assembly and Forth. The code would be considered as multiple applications if run from a normal OS. It includes a word processor, spread sheet capable, sort, 90,000 word spell checker, phone modem protocol, disk interface, keyboard interface for multiple foreign languages, learn( macro capable), built in help, screen saver and multiple printer drivers."
<veltas>
"As complicated as the software is, it has the rare distinction never having had a bug found and, according to Jef, created on schedule. I like to think that part of this reason is that it was written in Forth but it was mostly that no piece of code was excepted as complete without a testbench. This was true, no matter how trivial."
<mark4>
so i sorted 1 million items 10 thousahd times with my shell sorrt in 23 minutes. quicksort took 20 minutes
<mark4>
i dont think thats too shabby
<veltas>
In Forth or C?
<mark4>
c lol
<mark4>
forth might have been faster because i could probbaly do the logic way better
<veltas>
Have you written sorting in Forth?
<mark4>
yes but a long time ago
<veltas>
I've only written merge sort, not such a long time ago
<veltas>
Some of my more elegant code
<mark4>
merge sort is better than quick sort because it can be paralellized
<mark4>
in c or in forth?
<veltas>
In Forth, I've written a few different algorithms in C
<veltas>
It's one of the first programs I wrote in C(++) when I learned it, quicksort
<mark4>
i always favor shell over quick because its not recursive, i do not like recursive algorithms
<mark4>
while((gap = (gap * 7) / 9) > 0)
<mark4>
l1 = 0; h1 = gap;
<mark4>
{
<mark4>
while(h1 < n)
<mark4>
{
<mark4>
h2 = h1; l2 = l1;
<mark4>
while((l2 > 0) && (p[l2] > p[h2]))
<mark4>
{
<mark4>
tmp = p[l2];
<mark4>
p[l2] = p[h2];
<mark4>
p[h2] = tmp;
<mark4>
h2 = l2;
<mark4>
l2 -= gap;
<mark4>
}
<mark4>
h1++; l1++;
<mark4>
}
<mark4>
}
<mark4>
thats basiclaly the ENTIRE sort right there
<veltas>
Do you like bottom-up merge sort?
<mark4>
never did a merge sort before
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<veltas>
It's a non-recursive version of merge sort
<veltas>
Naturally iterative, rather than just a recursive function written out with explicit stacks
<mark4>
godbolt wont let me enter any coe wtc
<mark4>
cannot edit in read only mode? wtf is that bs
<veltas>
world trade center?
<mark4>
miss type on wtf
<veltas>
mark4: Metric or Imperial
<mark4>
?
<veltas>
Which do you prefer
<mark4>
i use both so depends on context :)
* Zarutian_HTC
seen attoparsecs used in some engineering drawings for electronics
<veltas>
Degrees Rankine
<veltas>
Metric for engineers, Imperial for people
<mark4>
which is better while((gap = (gap * 7) / 9) > 0) or for(gap = n; gap > 0; gap = (gap * 7) / 9)
<mark4>
and why
<Zarutian_HTC>
well, I have seen kubit and such used
<mark4>
there is a gap = n in front of the while version
<Zarutian_HTC>
veltas: and here is the question: which Imperial?
<veltas>
Your nation's imperial probably
<Zarutian_HTC>
so, the length unit would be áln then
<veltas>
I don't order 568ml of beer and I don't want to remember the number of feet in a mile when working with a technical drawing
<mark4>
1760 * 3 :)
<veltas>
I think metric's better at measurement calculations and imperial's often better at describing everyday tangible quantities
<mark4>
there is one reason why imperial is superior to metric
<mark4>
imperial is divisible by 2 and 3 etc
<veltas>
If people think metric's so much better I'll ask why there aren't 1000 hours in the day, or 1000 bytes in a kilobyte
<Zarutian_HTC>
and once more, there was a diffrent name for a thou. The mil. And mil-spec as in connectors and such refers to that. Not millitary, that is much later. But thou is prefered nowdays because it can not be misunderstood. Whil mil can be as millimeters.
<mark4>
10 hours in a day!
<mark4>
but you still have to work 8 :)
<veltas>
mark4: Why 10? Metric is based around 1000. Still further inconsistancies
<Zarutian_HTC>
veltas: metric is based around 10
<veltas>
And the cherry on the cake is if you truly want a utopian unit system it should really be base-12 focused.
<Zarutian_HTC>
ya just do know yer si prefixes
<Zarutian_HTC>
like I once asked for a piece of pcb one times one and a half desimeter on a side
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<veltas>
Normal people had to conform when metric was pushed, but when scientists discover electricity is backwards we just carry on because it would be effort
<mark4>
metric is based on 10
<veltas>
Anyway that's enough stirring the pot for today :P
<veltas>
I like these pseudo-pointless arguments, the arguments nobody cares about anymore. There is some meaning in here buried somewhere but it doesn't matter too much.
<Zarutian_HTC>
veltas: when was it pushed? and you should know why it was invented. Because the plethora of Imperial units all over europe.
<veltas>
Why not invent a new language as well, to replace the plethora of european languages?
<Zarutian_HTC>
because you need a compatible system of measurements for engineering, tolls, and contracts
<mark4>
good idea :)
<veltas>
Don't you need compatible language for such things too? Surely it's harder to translate general language than measurements?
<Zarutian_HTC>
it irritated me no end when journos gave the length of Ever Given as four football fields
<veltas>
Although that said maths has different forms across Europe, less defined now though
<veltas>
I think it's dumb because "football" is so badly defined
<mark4>
or for gap = n * 7 / 9 or something
<Zarutian_HTC>
'which football? American, Soccer, or traditinal?'
<mark4>
miss chan
<Zarutian_HTC>
traditional*
<veltas>
Or rugby, is technically football too I think
<veltas>
So it turns out communication is complicated, and the needs of the communicators depends on context
<veltas>
Doesn't mean you can't try to reach lots of people, but the larger the audience you try to reach, the less it means to anyone
<Zarutian_HTC>
but the Indian times gave the length in wicket cricket spacing
<Zarutian_HTC>
that is the distance between the two wickets on a cricket field
<veltas>
The ship is so large you will struggle to give a meaningful comparison, and an 'everyday' comparison is impossible
<veltas>
And the cost of the ship being stuck is similarly hard to quantify
<veltas>
One of these measurements is more important than the other, I would say
<Zarutian_HTC>
one comparison I got was "too late to turn the sove off distance if you went for a walk"
<veltas>
Large enough to accidentally block the Suez canal
<veltas>
And does anyone believe the 'wind' explanation?
<Zarutian_HTC>
the cost is hard to quantify for two reasons
<Zarutian_HTC>
the former is that the delay costs and tetriary effect costs have yet to be determined
<Zarutian_HTC>
the latter because they are trying to use an eleastic value unit the USD
<Zarutian_HTC>
veltas: I beleive wind might be a big factor
<Zarutian_HTC>
in the accident
<veltas>
I wonder if there are conspiracy theories that it was not an accident
<Zarutian_HTC>
but it might also be part the inertia momentum that takes a while to change
<veltas>
Yeah no doubt there is a significant delay between input and result on that boat
<Zarutian_HTC>
it is relatively easy and quick feedback to turn a x-cross motor bike around versus a huge ship
<Zarutian_HTC>
have you watched aprs and ais feeds for ships?
<veltas>
Maybe
<Zarutian_HTC>
it is fascinating when say a huge oil tanker prepares to start voyage
<Zarutian_HTC>
they often broadcast their intended ?track? at least two hours in advance
<Zarutian_HTC>
just so other ships can avoid potential collisions
<Zarutian_HTC>
these big ships are more like small islands on the move than any sort of normal vechiles or vessels
<Zarutian_HTC>
re the Ever Given, I wonder how deep she drafted and if that might have been a factor
<Zarutian_HTC>
like if she drafted deep enough to affect the current in the canal such it got interferantly turbulent
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<veltas>
It looked like in the log the ship went wildly left before going right and getting stuck