<astr>
I'd use fm transistor for turning old boomboxes into wireless speakers
<astr>
whats the range of the fm transmitter in the gta04 and neo900?
<nox->
transmitter? yeah
<nox->
only a few inces or so i guess...
<nox->
inches
<astr>
yea, woopsy spell correction
<astr>
inches... oh well there goes that idea
<astr>
good enough for being able to use car radio?
<nox->
yeah
<nox->
thats what its meant for i guess
<astr>
interruptions? so it would be strong enough? well thats useful, best thing is for me to get a gta04 or neo900 then i guess i could try it assuming sound backend supports it?
<astr>
wpwrak, thanks for the info about eci
<astr>
DocScrutinizer51, ok, the efforts/thoughts are appreciated
<astr>
expansion: the efforts, even if they turn out to be thoughts that didn't happen, arr well still love you the same but if they do happen then well i guess i should say extra ;D then hehe
<sixwheeledbeast>
short distance FM is fine in most countries, however, wouldn't DAB need license to use?
<nox->
i think dab was about receiving not sending
<astr>
"FM receiver and transmitter, both with RDS" RDS?
<DocScrutinizer51>
~wiki rds
<infobot>
At http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rds (URL), Wikipedia explains: "{{Wiktionary|RDS|rds}} 'RDS' may refer to: {{TOC right}} *Rajolibanda Diversion Scheme, an irrigation project in Mahbubunagar district in Karnataka (India) *Reddish South railway station, England has the National Rail station code "RDS" *Radio Dimensione Suono, an Italian radio station *Réseau des sports, a French-language television network in Canada **RDS Info, a sister sports news ...
<DocScrutinizer51>
well, try Nradio data systemN or somesuch
<DocScrutinizer51>
well, try "radio data systemN or somesuch
<DocScrutinizer51>
gnah!
<DocScrutinizer51>
maemo wiki might also help a lot
<astr>
i guess the music players don't support when using fm transmitter sending the the current song title,artist,etc via rds? yet another thing that would need implementing
<astr>
refraise: well need...could be implemented if there was the will too
<astr>
but i don't blame people if they don't want to.
<astr>
urrg what a mess i made of that
<astr>
the gta04 kernel did support usb audio interfaces right? class compliant ones.
<astr>
the module was compiled right?
<astr>
where would i see the kenel .config of the build options?
<dos1>
astr: I had it working at some point with N900. AFAIR there's a package in some extras repo with widget that sends out some data via RDS, like song titles, incoming messages etc.
<Oksana>
It's fmrdsnotify ?
<dos1>
possibly. I haven't played with it too much, so I just vaguely remember its existence :)
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<astr>
dos1, thanks
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<Oksana>
Can somebody tell me why Polarcell battery is said to be "fully charged" by DT-33, and yet fails awfully at booting-up the N900? N900 behaves as if there was no battery at all, black, dead, and so on. Just one battery behaves that way.
<Oksana>
Physically, it looks whole. It's one of two new batteries.
<Oksana>
And it's not like I have a volt-ampere-ohm-meter to say whether it's full or empty.
<Oksana>
DocScrutinizer: is there a clear number of devices expected to be manufactured? 1000, 2000, or 10 000? Or should it remain undefined until more pre-orders are received? Is the number of pre-orders around 400, or higher already?
<Oksana>
Quuiiieeeettttt......
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<DocScrutinizer51>
dos1: neo900.org frontpahe video links to youtube which inserts friggin advertisment. Don't we have same video on owb server?
<illwieckz>
Unless it has been changed, there are advertisements on video only if "Revenue Share" was requested by a submitter who has an associated adsense account.
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<DocScrutinizer51>
I have no idea. A friend of mine checked neo900.org on his iPhone, clicked on the youtube video and next I got confronted with been nasty voice from his phone annoying my ears
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<wpwrak>
now there's an idea: find a site with a large but hostile audience. make them watch the video, then let them flame all day long about how much we suck. then point out that they've missed some detail in the video, so they'll watch it again and just get more aggressive. maybe repeat the trick a few times. -> €$¥£ ;-)
<sixwheeledbeast>
While not ideal, the iFone was partially to blame :D
<wpwrak>
i think a bigger problem are generally "vastly superior specs" that are established in the market. people somehow got the impression that anything that's doesn't have at least a dozen cores buzzing away at 4 GHz each, can't possibly be of any use
<wpwrak>
and of course, it MUST be capacitive sensing and at least 500 dpi
<wpwrak>
so when mentioning the project's specs, one could perhaps also point out that it's not only open but also efficient. no massive compute power needed to have decent functionality
<kerio>
wpwrak: the only reason we don't have better specs is that there's no omap3 with better specs
<xes>
one core for visual effects, one for spyware, one to take care of os crashes, one to manage background services....
<kerio>
if there was a quad-core, 8gb ram omap3, you can be sure we'd be all for it
<xes>
we don't need such features^
<kerio>
if you think that lack of cpu power is not an issue for certain usecases on the n900 you're just delusional, xes
<wpwrak>
fun project: if you know someone who spends excessive amounts of time and as a result is exaggeratedly muscled, get that person holding some samsung or such, then have a scrawny geek, maybe bookish-looking female, with neo900. put pictures next to each other.
<wpwrak>
make the body builder look angry and the geek happy / triumphant. then label them "muscled up" vs. "efficient". (or something)
<sixwheeledbeast>
I also agree more core's can enable more bloatware.
<wpwrak>
kerio: (better specs) yes, that's why it is important to exercise the art of silence :)
<kerio>
oh, ofc
<kerio>
but we shouldn't go all "meh nobody really NEEDS extra specs"
<kerio>
it makes us look ridiculous
<kerio>
better specs weren't available without sacrificing other stuff that was deemed more important, that's all
<wpwrak>
besides, what one may want isn't always what one actually needs. e.g., would i want to have caviar and champagne for breakfast ? sure. but then i may not be very productive for the rest of the day. so it's a trade-off.
<wpwrak>
yes, exactly
<wpwrak>
but i also think it's important to point out that the current specs are "good enough". in fact, they're much better than nokia's original specs.
<kerio>
nokia's original specs were trash tho
<kerio>
so idk if it's that useful to point that out :>
<wpwrak>
well, does the n900 work acceptably for you, in general ?
<kerio>
i taught myself to accept how it works
<xes>
kerio: you are right but i can't forget that any P4 of 10 years ago with an optimized linux is is often faster than some Winzoz on recent hardware
<kerio>
ok, you're delusional
<kerio>
nice we cleared that out
<wpwrak>
don't forget that a lot of the fancy specs just serve to drive inefficient software. and of course, the more pixels, the more oomph you need on cpu and memory system. so it's good to have a bit less dpi :)
<kerio>
yeah, 800x480 is still really nice
<kerio>
it's a really small screen
<xes>
kerio: :) maybe but i still believe that every purpose has the proper device
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<norly>
wpwrak: do you have any idea why GTK2 is so slow and how we could speed it up?
<norly>
i mean, there even has been an ubuntu 8.04 GTK1 remix
<wpwrak>
hmm no, i'm not much of a gui toolkit internals guy. it just baffles me that they keep on getting slower :)
<norly>
yeah, *all* systems seem to go down the bloatware hole. i wonder why? are they really impementing so much more complex features than older systems?
<norly>
anyway, looking forward to speedier graphics on the 1GHz neo900 :)
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<wpwrak>
i think it's developers getting lazy. in the good old days, you knew that it would take forever (CPU-wise) if you implement things in certain ways. so you didn't even think of doing that. instead, you picked a more CPU-efficient approach, even if it meant that the critter was harder to write and/or less generic in the end.
<wpwrak>
now, with CPUs getting faster, developers receive no negative feedback if they do that. their code is still fast, even if it does all that could be integer math in some arbitrary-precision complex number package with five layers of abstraction, and where they may have had a function pointer in the past, they now have a snippet of javascript to be interpreted at run time.
<kerio>
wpwrak: in most cases, it leads to faster dev time and less bugs
<kerio>
i trust some high level string handling library more than handmade C string handling code
<wpwrak>
in the end, the interfaces may be a little nicer. i mean, cairo is cute, isn't it ? kinda like postscript. but you can accomplish much of the same with SDL and it'll be 10x times faster.
<wpwrak>
faster dev time ... depends. sometimes yes, sometimes no. there's the risk that, since the basics were now so easy to do, they heap some more complexity on top. stuff you don't really need but that you have to deal with.
<SylvieLorxu>
In the good old days, where computers were insanely expensive and browsing the web was easily done by chaining several cryptic commands :D
<norly>
thanks for the insights, that's what i suspected :)
<kerio>
mostly, it boils down to "writing efficient code is hard"
<wpwrak>
hey, in the good old days we had gopher for the text and drugs for the colors :)
<norly>
cool!
<norly>
argh, wrong window
<norly>
yes, how about a touch-based gopher browser for the n900, to show the love
<SylvieLorxu>
Gopher was what we used to visit MySpace, right?
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<wpwrak>
kerio: yes, but nothing new there :) by the way, it's nice to see all this culture of inefficiency backfire when the conditions change. e.g., think of what they're trying to do with smartwatches. there are several major companies who so far just have produced a string of embarrassing failures in terms of "fit for real life"
<kerio>
well, the new part is that inefficient crap works
<kerio>
with shittier computers, you could not ship an inefficient software
<kerio>
because it would fail to run
<wpwrak>
SylvieLorxu: only if you were retro, myspace being so new-fangled stuff. back then, we discussed our gopher problems on usenet ...
<kerio>
also, it's often cheaper to buy more hardware rather than to hire better programmers
<ShadowJK>
and faster
<wpwrak>
kerio: yes, but with smartwatches it suddenly stops working so well :) sure, you can still pack a fat CPU into them, but you'll pay dearly for it
<kerio>
well yeah
<mvaenskae>
hello world
<mvaenskae>
smartwatches? i would love an open hardware smartwatch \o/
<dos1>
DocScrutinizer51: hmm, didn't know that there were ads (adblock)
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<mvaenskae>
kerio: depends on what scale you go; at one point you might run into trouble as the software has no idea how to run stuff in parallel because it implements a bogosort ;)
<DocScrutinizer51>
adblock doesn't block those trailer ad movies ("you can abort this ad in 5s")
<kerio>
yes it does
<kerio>
at least, adblock plus for firefox does
<kerio>
adblock for chrome is crap
<mvaenskae>
are talking about youtube-ads on android or desktop? on desktop i never get ads on youtube, on android all the effin time... and the same ad...
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<mvaenskae>
accidently a word; are _we_ talking...
<sixwheeledbeast>
DocScrutinizer51: it definitely blocks youtube ads on desktop. for ifone/android they probably use analytic adsense bollocks.
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<DocScrutinizer51>
sixwheeledbeast: quite possible
<sixwheeledbeast>
hence the previous ifone remark
<DocScrutinizer51>
((octocore feature bloat)) not only useless and needed only for bloatware written by sub-par coders, also power hungry and thus reducing standby time massively
<sixwheeledbeast>
standby time... another fine point
<DocScrutinizer51>
a coder not capable to explain the differences between an embedded app and a generic 'general purpose' (actually desktop) app shouldn't get permissin to upload apps to maemo-extras... Wait, exactly this once been the purpose of testing in maemo-extras-testing
<DocScrutinizer51>
meanwhile sub-par coders collect sympathiy-tumbs-up votes for extras-testing granted by users with no clue, to get their power greedy apps promoted to maemo-extras
<kerio>
what the fuck are you talking about
<kerio>
programs don't become bloated just cuz you have a faster cpu
<wpwrak>
kerio: didn't i just explain above why this is what almost inevitably happens ? :) faster cpu -> you don't see where your program is slow -> you no longer care about efficiency (well, until you've consumed the speed advantage your new cpu has. then you're back to square one)
<kerio>
except that on mobile devices you have something even better
<kerio>
battery life
<wpwrak>
corollary: give your developers slow PCs ;-)
<wpwrak>
with all the bloatware jiggling in the background, there's no shortage of excuses for not getting great battery life :) tragedy of the commons
<xes>
wpwrak: corollary approved at 100%
<DocScrutinizer51>
100 percen ACK
<DocScrutinizer51>
I even dare to claim that in former times a 10..15min offtime while the compiler built new binary was positive for the code quality in the end
<DocScrutinizer51>
it effectively err efficiently punished the no-so-popular try&error coding style
<DocScrutinizer51>
s/no-so/now-so/
<DocScrutinizer51>
coders had a 15min time to actually read mauals or manpages
<DocScrutinizer51>
and then hopefully do the *right* thing in next sourcecode version, instead of just testing the next possible code permutation and neither understand why it seems to work now nor why it indeed does not really
<kerio>
right, things were better in the past for anecdotal reasons
<kerio>
i forgot
<DocScrutinizer51>
whatever that means, I guess you didn't get what I or wpwrak told you
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<bencoh>
15:53 <+DocScrutinizer51> it effectively err efficiently punished the no-so-popular try&error coding style
<bencoh>
true :)
<kerio>
in former times a 24 hours offtime while the computer ran the punch cards was positive for the code quality in the end
<kerio>
it effectively err efficiently punished the no-so-popular try&error coding style
<bencoh>
haha
<bencoh>
that's still true :)
<bencoh>
but no-one said it was a golden age :)
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<deafboy>
I just want to say that I'm thankfull for everyone supporting neo900 and maintaining the maemo5 stuff. It's so frustrating every time I try to move to android...
<deafboy>
It's like you need a phd in computer science for changing the ringtone or receiving a file over bluettoth in android.
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<mvaenskae>
admittedly bt is still a mystery
<sixwheeledbeast>
hmm, snow
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<DocScrutinizer51>
dang snow!
<DocScrutinizer51>
~waether eddn
<DocScrutinizer51>
~weather eddn
<infobot>
Nuernberg, Germany; (EDDN) 49-30N 011-03E 318M; last updated: 2014.12.26 1820 UTC; Dew Point: 28 F (-2 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.30 in. Hg (1026 hPa); Relative Humidity: 100%; Sky conditions: mostly clear; Temperature: 28 F (-2 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Weather: Shallow fog; Wind: from the NNE (020 degrees) at 1 MPH (1 KT)
* DocScrutinizer51
ponders hijacking that train and redirecting it to south of Spain
<DocScrutinizer51>
~weather lejr
<infobot>
Jerez De La Fronteraaeropuerto, Spain; (LEJR) 36-45N 006-04W 28M; last updated: 2014.12.26 1900 UTC; Dew Point: 46 F (8 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.42 in. Hg (1030 hPa); Relative Humidity: 93%; Temperature: 48 F (9 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: Calm
<DocScrutinizer51>
~weather gclp
<infobot>
Gran Canaria - Canary Islands, Spain; (GCLP) 27-56N 015-23W 47M; last updated: 2014.12.26 1900 UTC; Dew Point: 57 F (14 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.33 in. Hg (1027 hPa); Relative Humidity: 72%; Sky conditions: mostly clear; Temperature: 66 F (19 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the NNE (030 degrees) at 14 MPH (12 KT)
<sixwheeledbeast>
~weather egcc
<infobot>
Manchester Airport, United Kingdom; (EGCC) 53-21N 002-17W 0M; last updated: 2014.12.26 1850 UTC; Dew Point: 32 F (0 C); Pressure (altimeter): 29.83 in. Hg (1010 hPa); Relative Humidity: 100%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Temperature: 32 F (0 C); Visibility: 1 mile(s); Weather: Snow; Wind: from the ENE (070 degrees) at 12 MPH (10 KT); Windchill: 23 F (-5 C)
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<astr>
DocScrutinizer51, how much mA can the usb host supply from the neo900?
<DocScrutinizer51>
1000, tentatively
<DocScrutinizer51>
1A
<astr>
pleanty for a usb flash drive then!
<astr>
plenty
<astr>
hard to belive that the gta04 can only output 100ma when i hear that...
<astr>
assuming that is correct
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<DocScrutinizer51>
iirc it is
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<DocScrutinizer05>
heyho! HOHOHOHOOOO
<kerio>
SantaScrutinizer05
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