flux changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://caml.inria.fr/ | 3.11.0 out now! Get yours from http://caml.inria.fr/ocaml/release.html
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<mfp> Yoric[DT]: tried to build on GODI + 3.11.0+beta2-dev2, make opt died: problem with a type in src/core/extlib.mli not matching Unix.socket_bool_option
<Yoric[DT]> mmmhhh....
<Yoric[DT]> Could you file a bug?
<Yoric[DT]> I'm going to stop for the night.
<mfp> is 1.0-alpha-2 supposed to build on 3.11, or do I need a diff branch?
<Yoric[DT]> Thanks for the feedback, though.
<mfp> IIRC this was fixed somewhere else
<Yoric[DT]> It should build on 3.11
<Yoric[DT]> (and it does on my computer)
<mfp> (either this or a very similar issue)
<mfp> ah
<mfp> maybe it's because 3.11.0+beta2-dev2 ?
<Yoric[DT]> Possibly.
<Yoric[DT]> I'm using OCaml 3.11 .
<mfp> I'll try to build 3.11 final tomorrow and see what happens
<Yoric[DT]> Ok, thanks.
<maxote> i will wait until 3.11.1
<mfp> (or just look at Unix.socket_bool_option to find if it's changed)
<Yoric[DT]> In the meantime, I've found a minor bug, the fix of which I'm going to upload tomorrow.
<Yoric[DT]> Anyway, time to call it a night.
<Yoric[DT]> Cheers.
<mfp> night
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<astronut> what's the order of operations on functions if no parenthesis are used?
<astronut> for example, if foo and bar are functions and baz is a data type, what order does it attempt "foo bar baz"
<astronut> is that the same as foo(bar(baz))
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<mfp> astronut: application is left-associative => ((foo bar) baz)
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<tsuyoshi> if bar isn't a function, it does the same thing
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<middayc__> sorry for a little newbie question... I need to quick look up (if word exists) in a huge list of words.. common sense says me I should try to make this tree structure from words and recursively search?
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<middayc__> let words_tree = ['t',['e',['s',['t',[]]];'i',['m',['b',['e',['r',[]]]]]];'f',['o',['e',[]]]]
<middayc__> this would be the tree for : let words = [ "test"; "timber"; "foe" ];;
<middayc__> am I looking at the right direction?
<middayc__> I read about ternary search tree which seems similar and have found a partial implementation by khigia, but it seems not fully finished complex (I am OCaml newb) and too capable for what I need
<kig> if it's not a really huge list, you could also get by with a Hashtbl or a Map
<tsuyoshi> middayc__: how huge?
<middayc__> Not sure but after a while it will contain most words from my language probably
<middayc__> slovene language, but I have no idea how many words that is
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* brendan is down on hashtbls now
<brendan> could try a trie
<middayc__> on a sidenote.. can you split a string to head and tail somehow (without making a function of my own) - I googled and looked at String and Str and coulnd't find anything?
<brendan> batteries (or extlib) have a nice split
<brendan> jane st has split_on_char
<middayc__> I saw trie mentioned on the blog of the guy who made TST (khigia) .. I will look up what it meand
<middayc__> means
<brendan> Str has split, but it's on regexps
<kig> trie is what you're doing in words_tree
<tsuyoshi> middayc__: probably less than a million words then.. a map should be fine
<tsuyoshi> or a hash table
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<middayc__> thanks for all answers about both things, I am reading about trie and looking batteries :) @tsuyoshi - probably less, but trie or what's it called seems quite interesting :)
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<thelema> how is batteries doing?
<hcarty> thelema: The alpha3 .tar.gz released yesterday compiles and runs here (3.11, 64bit), with some errors Yoric[DT] commented on
<thelema> hcarty: I must have missed those comments.
<hcarty> Bigarray.* in Batteries is missing a few functions (unsafe_*) for 3.11
<hcarty> thelema: Init file not found: "/home/hcarty/Applications/godi/lib/ocaml/pkg-lib/camomile/../batteries/top.ml".
<thelema> ah, godi problems.
* thelema wonders if a uservoice for batteries would be useful
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<hcarty> uservoice?
<thelema> uservoice.com
<thelema> a nice "feedback" site
<thelema> hmm, we don't really have a good logo...
<thelema> I guess I'll just use the camel with duracells in it
<thelema> hmm, the # of downloads has dropped - yoric must have uploaded a new alpha 3
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<xah_lee> how to print a array? or is there a general way to print any of list, tuple, record?
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<mrvn> Array.iter
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<Yoric[DT]> hi
<flux> xah_lee, no. it is possible to use a language extension such as sexplib to generate such functions for your data types, though.
<flux> or, for debugging purposes, there is a library that dumps the contents of a value without exploiting type information
<xah_lee> flux: i c. thx & mrvn
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<flux> in general one could write something like: let string_of_2tuple f1 f2 (x, y) = (f1 x ^ ", " ^ f2 y) let string_of_array f a = String.concat ";" (List.map f (Array.to_list a)) let identity a = a let s = string_of_array (string_of_2tuple int_of_string identity) [|(4, "foo"); (5, "bar")|] (may contain typoes)
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<Yoric[DT]> Grmph.
<Yoric[DT]> GODI seems down.
<Yoric[DT]> Hard to update to the latest version of Batteries.
<flux> godi does annoyingly seem to have one big central point of failure
<Yoric[DT]> yeah
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<Yoric[DT]> Ok, it seems back up.
<Yoric[DT]> Uploading Batteries...
<Yoric[DT]> I'll be looking for volunteers for testing, by the way.
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<Yoric[DT]> Looking for volunteers now.
<Yoric[DT]> Any GODI user willing to try and install the latest version of Batteries?
<Yoric[DT]> Well, I'll go and eat something.
<mfp> Yoric[DT]: I'm building GODI (section 3.10) atm., installing batteries when done
<Yoric[DT]> If you're willing to test, it's on GODI.
<Yoric[DT]> mfp: yeah :)
<Yoric[DT]> Both 3.10 and 3.11 should work.
<Yoric[DT]> Gasp, there's still a bug in the help system.
<Yoric[DT]> er...
<Yoric[DT]> And there seems to be a bug with documentation generation.
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<mfp> Yoric[DT]: installed fine, got the errors you're probably seeing in the docs (missing html/api/System.Unix.html, etc.)
<mfp> then #man "for programmers"; => Several definitions exist for "for programmers". (...) please use one of #man_topic "for programmers" #man_topic "for programmers"
<mfp> is it normal for doc gen to be so noisy? (the GODI "protocol" file is huge)
<mfp> and missing renames(?) like Extlib.ExtSet.Set.S.ExceptionLess (and the page for Set refers to itself as module Set: Extlib.ExtSet.Set)
<Yoric[DT]> Yeah, I need to check all of this.
<Yoric[DT]> Ok, I know what happened to the missing documentation.
<Yoric[DT]> It's either camlp4 or sexplib.
<mfp> regarding 3.11, turns out I wasn't building the right sources
<Yoric[DT]> ok
<Yoric[DT]> Yeah, just checked, it's a sexplib bug.
<mfp> died w/ Error: The variant or record definition does not match that of type Gc.control, because allocation_policy was added after 3.11.0+beta2-dev2 (the one I have running with GODI)
<mfp> changed & tried again, then Error: Unbound constructor Parse_error -> another beta2 -> final change I guess
<Yoric[DT]> No, that's probably an issue with Sexplib, too.
<Yoric[DT]> They changed a constructor name from ParseError to Parse_error.
<mfp> there's a #if ocaml_version >= (3, 11) there
<Yoric[DT]> Yep.
<mfp> is there any way to get more fine-grained version info?
<mfp> with optcomp
<Yoric[DT]> Ideally, there should be a [#if sexplip_version >= 3.7.5] but I don't quite see how I could do this.
<Yoric[DT]> Perhaps with autoconf magic.
<mfp> ah, so there's a diff sexplib for 3.10 and 3.11
<mfp> this is a bit like functors
<Yoric[DT]> Technically, it's not different for 3.10 and 3.11, it's just an arbitrary difference which more or less matches the release of 3.11 .
<Yoric[DT]> And it's quite annoying.
<mfp> instead of handling the "polymorphism" inside (opt comp for 3.10 and 3.11 inside sexplib), it bubbles up to the surface
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<middayc> hi, can I make a record with hashtable slot? I can with array for example but can't with ht.. type linkbase = { links: int hashtbl } ? It says "Unbound type constructor hashtbl"
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<Yoric[DT]> middayc: that's because the type name is not hashtbl, it's Hashtbl.t .
<mfp> middayc: ('key, 'value) Hashtbl.t
<Yoric[DT]> mfp: yeah
<mfp> middayc: (or 'value MyHashtbl.t if you did you own hash module with Hashtbl.Make)
<middayc> aha, I saw t definition in docs and tried hashtbl.t but not with the upper case
<middayc> thanks a lot
<Yoric[DT]> np
<Yoric[DT]> Ok, that should be one thing fixed.
<Yoric[DT]> Next item: the double "man".
<mfp> Yoric[DT]: is it me or are some modules missing? (back to the fresh, working GODI + 3.10 batteries install)
<Yoric[DT]> mfp: what do you mean?
<mfp> not only in the docs, but in the module itself
<mfp> rlwrap ocamlfind batteries/ocaml
<Yoric[DT]> Which modules would that be?
<mfp> module R = Rope ok
<mfp> module V = Vect => not found
<Yoric[DT]> Gasp.
<Yoric[DT]> That's possible.
<Yoric[DT]> Let me check.
<mfp> but it's in the .mlpack
* Yoric[DT] realized yesterday that LazyList was missing.
<Yoric[DT]> Ok, adding Vect.
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<Yoric[DT]> Mmmhh...
<Yoric[DT]> Vect would need a serious update.
<mfp> Yoric[DT]: are all extlib modules supposed to be exposed under Batteries (flattened) now?
<Yoric[DT]> Yes.
<mfp> k, building a list of those missing
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<Yoric[DT]> I've just checked from .mlpack .
* Yoric[DT] rebuilds
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<mfp> LazyListLabels Std Vect Result LazyList Substring OptionLabels EtNativeint InnerIO InnerWeaktbl Interfaces
<mfp> k
<Yoric[DT]> Yeah, LazyListLabels and OptionLabels should disappear.
<Yoric[DT]> I've just added Vect, Result and LazyList
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<Yoric[DT]> Std, InnerIO and InnerWeaktbl are internal only.
<Yoric[DT]> And Substring, too.
<Yoric[DT]> As for ExtNativeint, I'm surprised.
<Yoric[DT]> Are you sure?
<Yoric[DT]> Okay, #man problem should be fixed.
<mfp> # module E = ExtNativeInt;;
<mfp> Unbound module ExtNativeInt
<Yoric[DT]> Well, it's just called [Native_int] in the public API.
<Yoric[DT]> # module E = Native_int;;
<Yoric[DT]> module E :
<Yoric[DT]> sig
<Yoric[DT]> type t = nativeint
<Yoric[DT]> val zero : nativeint
<Yoric[DT]> ...
<Yoric[DT]> (that's with OCaml 3.11)
<Yoric[DT]> I'll push the release this evening.
<Yoric[DT]> Now, time to demonstrate.
<Yoric[DT]> Cheers.
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<mrvn> middayc: upper case is the Module path and the lower case at the end is the type.
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<middayc> mrvn: - aha, from what you say it all seems logical now, and now that I look at it is .. Hashtbl.(anything) is upper case like .create .find .. so .t is also , types outside module are lower case , good
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<middayc> btw: developing with emacs and it's interactive top-level really impressed me, now I write code in toplevel and when it works I copy it up into the file.. I works better in this intractive mode than anything I tried so far at so called dynamic languages
<middayc> too bad there isn't a command that would put the last input you wrote to top-level into clipboard .. something in menus looks a little like it but it doesn't seem to work that way
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<gildor> Snark: ping
<gildor> I need some info
<Snark> gildor, pong
<Snark> about?
<gildor> I need some data for your inscription to OCaml Meeting
<gildor> What organization/firm do you belong to ?
<Snark> gildor, uh... I'm an individual
<Snark> gildor, math teacher in CPGE
<gildor> Snark: just to know what to write on your "badge"
<Snark> ok
<gildor> what CPGE ?
<Snark> spé PC
<Snark> (no computer science)
<gildor> I mean which one
<Snark> (but I still have maple sessions for Saint-Cyr)
<gildor> the name of the school)
<Snark> École des Pupilles de l'Air
<gildor> You want "Ecole des Pupilles de l'Air" on you badge ?
<Snark> if you wish -- or "EPA" ;-)
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<gildor> EPA is nice (and will be short enough to write)
<gildor> Snark: thanks and see you next wednesday
<Snark> :-)
<Snark> I should be there for 13h30
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<middayc> what meeting is this?
<middayc> nice
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<Snark> <- gone
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<middayc> can I ask for opinion, I have a list of records { a: int; b: int; x:int } I need the ability to change x (ab stay the same) at any time. I see 2 ways.. (1) I set x mutable in record and change it directly - I don't like this one that much;
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<middayc> (2) I insert new record with { a b new x } at the begining of list and when I will seek list I will always find the first one , the dead elements would be cleaned out every once in a while (by creating new list from just undead values)
<middayc> but list is immutable too so there is no insert so I guess there must be something that will take element or list and list and create a new list with that el. at the start.. but I don't see that in List
<middayc> module
<mfp> middayc: x :: list
<mfp> (aka cons)
<middayc> the reverse of append , which seems to be rev_append, but I don't get why it I would need the reversal and all and it seems there should be something more basic for this
<middayc> ups.. so :: goes both ways?
<mfp> both ways?
<mrvn> :: prepends an element to a list
<middayc> I used it so far for " match l with h::tail -> ... "
<middayc> to split to head and tail .. I know :: doesn't split it but somehow declares it
<mrvn> middayc: Well, if you will the "match" does the reversing.
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<mrvn> same as if you write match foo with Tree (Leaf 1, 2, Leaf 3) ->
<mrvn> (except :: is inline)
<middayc> aha, yes I used this too.. didn't fully get the "magic" with match yet
<mrvn> that magic is what makes ocaml so great. :)
<middayc> :) yes must be something about it
<middayc> I only now 5% of ocaml and I already like how my functions come nicely together :)
<middayc> now=know
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<ChrisRoland> Does anyone use a gui library in OCaml? If so, what do you use and do you like it? So far LablGTK2 looks like the best bet
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<mrvn> is there another?
<ChrisRoland> I know there is F#, but I wanted to find something with a little less vendor lock-in
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<middayc> wxwidgets is a crossplatform GUI library too, it has native L&F on all systems and there is a binding to it in Ocaml, but I don't know what state it's in
<ChrisRoland> yeah I was looking at that too: http://wxocaml.sourceforge.net/ - but, the last release was on Oct 2004 :/
<middayc> there is some 2007 article that mentions it (I haven't read it) http://technfun.wordpress.com/2007/06/15/making-win32-gui-applications-in-ocaml/
<middayc> I think wxocaml is autogenerated from haskell's binding so if they have been updating theirs maybe it can get updated simply
<ChrisRoland> hm, cool. I'll read that.
<ChrisRoland> middayc: ah ok, I'll go check theirs out.
<middayc> I am not trying to persuade you.. yust saying what I heard :)
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<ChrisRoland> Yeah wxHaskell's latest release was on Jan 4 2009. I like wx better than gtk, so I might look into wxocaml first.
<middayc> now that QT is free for windows it can be worth checking out too
<ChrisRoland> yeah, I know the QtCaml project was a Google Summer of Code project, I'm just having a hard time finding source. Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong spot :)
<ChrisRoland> I'm hoping it takes off. Out of the three, Qt would be my first choice since I've done work in it and I love GraphicsView
<ChrisRoland> hm, this looks like a start: http://bitbucket.org/ninoo/qtcaml/src/
<middayc> yes, Qt looks best to me to.. I used wxPython long ago for some serrious project and didn't really like it.. it shows that it's a wrapper above multiple different gui libs not a designed set on it's own
<middayc> interesting
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<ChrisRoland> I think I'm going to do a couple prototype apps first using LablGTK, then wxOCaml and go out from there.
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<Yoric[DT]> Hi again
<brendan> are you rested? :)
<Yoric[DT]> :)
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* Yoric[DT] rebuilds and installs Batteries for GODI.
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* Yoric[DT] rebuilds and installs Batteries for GODI (again).
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<Yoric[DT]> Grmpf.
<Yoric[DT]> Still that sexplib bug biting us.
<vixey> sexplib from jane st. or what?
<Yoric[DT]> yep
<vixey> oh weird I am surprised that it is buggy
<vixey> I expected better off them :p
<Yoric[DT]> Well, the bug only appears when generating documentation from .mli files.
<Yoric[DT]> And just because some comments are dropped.
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<mrvn> Yoric[DT]: aren
<mrvn> 't they kind of essential for documentation?
<Yoric[DT]> Yep.
<Yoric[DT]> Hence the bug :0
<Yoric[DT]> Hence the bug :)
<hcarty> Has anyone here used FrGui much, either the OSP version or the earlier one?
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<Yoric[DT]> grrrrr
<Yoric[DT]> still not working
<Yoric[DT]> hcarty: I tried it briefly, one or two years ago and I liked it.
<hcarty> Yoric[DT]: They seem to be significantly different... the OSP version does not include a syntax extension
<Yoric[DT]> There was no syntax extension when I tried it.
<hcarty> So it seems to be much easier to build on 3.10+
<hcarty> Ah
<hcarty> The version I found from 2006 on Google Code has an old-camlp4/camlp5 syntax extension
<hcarty> Whereas the 2007 OSP version does not. I'm not sure what differences they have in function though.
<hcarty> It seems like a potentially very nice library though
<Yoric[DT]> Well, if there was a syntax extension, I didn't see it.
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<hcarty> Perhaps "the earlier one" is a dropped branch then. I'm hoping to try the non-camlp4 version soon on a new app
<Yoric[DT]> I used the version I found from Chris King's page.
<Yoric[DT]> It was on his darcs repository.
<Yoric[DT]> Can't remember anything more specific, sorry.
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<hcarty> Ok, thanks. Just curious.
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<Platyna> Hi.
<Platyna> ocamlfind: Package `snippets' not found
<Platyna> Where can I get this package?
<bla> snippets; hm.
<bla> Hi Platyna.
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<Yoric[DT]> Platyna: what's that package supposed to be?
<Platyna> I have no idea.
<Platyna> I am trying to compile nmag.
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<Platyna> I see something like snippets in one dir.
<Platyna> How can I make ocamlfind to find it?
<Platyna> ;)
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<sanguinev> Is there a way to make an output_channel that just accepts output and doesn't do anything?
<brendan> open_out "/dev/null" ?
<sanguinev> brendan: I am looking for something that won't require a file/any specified location.
<Yoric[DT]> Shameless plug: with Batteries, it's possible.
<Yoric[DT]> (other than that, you could trick it with a pipe, but that's much more complicated than /dev/null)
<sanguinev> Yoric[DT]: I am hoping for something nice and system agnostic so I can run the same code on linux/unix/mac OSx/cygwin...
<Yoric[DT]> Yeah.
<Yoric[DT]> The problem is that output_channel is necessarily connected to a Unix file descriptor.
<Yoric[DT]> So /dev/null seems the best way to go.
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<sanguinev> Yoric[DT]: What about if you have a unix file descriptor for it, but don't want it to actually send anything (or at the very least to prevent a "flush" of the channel?
<Yoric[DT]> flushes happen every so often
<brendan> you'll probably have to use wrappers for output_*
<Yoric[DT]> Shameless plug: such as Batteries'.
<brendan> hehe
<Yoric[DT]> We do have an abstraction layer on top of channels just to allow subtle manipulation of inputs and outputs.
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<sanguinev> Ok, assuming I can't use batteries because I am stubborn/stupid/not allowed to induct other code... ;)
<brendan> does batteries have a hashtbl that doesn't waste tons of ram too?