<flux>
I could try to investigate it a bit, but I don't have time before weekend
<Kakadu>
flux: ok
<flux>
kakadu, would it be possible to use solely Qt signal/slot mechanism instead of inheritance?
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<flux>
or doesn't qt provide slots for everything interesting?
<Kakadu>
flux: no. some things (like QWidget::keyPressEvent) are imlemented with inheritance. Qt developers said if all such think are implemented with slots Qt objects will be very fat.
<Kakadu>
(I feel some problems with English grammar in second sentence)
<Kakadu>
think <- things
<Kakadu>
btw, how often yezariaely appears in this chat?
<flux>
I have records of in in my /lastlog from monday and wednesday
<adrien>
quite often according to lastlog
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<adrien>
has anyone used module packing with oasis?
<adrien>
NaCl: I'm never able to pull flamel ='(
<adrien>
Kakadu: lablqt's aaa.xml is getting quite big :o
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<adrien>
Kakadu: also, do you think you could have a camlp4 extension instead of moc?
<adrien>
Kakadu: also, lablqt's latest git fails with zomg-long error
<adrien>
too long for my terminal backlog
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<adrien>
Kakadu: and the "regular" compilation process creates object files in the source folders, which make ocamlbuild unhappy ='(
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<adrien>
Kakadu: basically, in "CAMLlocal3(camlobj,_ans,meth);", all variables are undeclared
<adrien>
also, "^GET_CAML_OBJECT(this,the_caml_object)$" <- no ending ';'? is it included in the macro? it's more readable not to omit it imho and it makes editors much happier
<Kakadu>
oops, Im here
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<Kakadu>
now there are some problems with compilation
<Kakadu>
It was because I've written some code, and more code and suddenly I've understanded that I'm make wrong architecture. That I've switched to have fun in /inher folder. now I'm still looking at this crash.
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<Kakadu>
about GET_CAML_OBJECT I've not catches
<Kakadu>
catched*
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<adrien>
GET_CAML_OBJECT is fine but most macros look are used like regular functions and regular C syntax (the uppercasing is enough to show they're macros)
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<hcarty>
thelema: For what it's worth, PLplot does support multiple plots, both on the same output and separate outputs.
<NaCl>
adrien: try it now
<adrien>
"Already up-to-date." :P
<adrien>
thanks
<adrien>
and forge.ocamlcore.org!
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<adrien>
it's fun to put more pressure on gildor's shoulders :P
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<adrien>
NaCl: xD
<adrien>
"(* Whoa a closure *)" :P
<adrien>
NaCl: also, a library to make progress bars in lablgtk (that are updated automatically) may not be a bad thing
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<NaCl>
adrien: perhaps. I don't know if/what/when I'll be working on something else again
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<adrien>
NaCl: btw, according to git blame, there are 25 lines left from my code, including "open Unix/Printf", blank lines, lines with only "in" on them, a bunch of trivial lines and maybe only one or two non-trivial lines
<adrien>
NaCl: I might do it
<NaCl>
haha
<NaCl>
my next project may be a handwriting recognizer. was going to do the algorithms in ocaml, wasn't sure about the UI.
<NaCl>
except I'd had to either implement or bind the learning algorithms
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<adrien>
I don't know if I had made it clear to you: goocanvas isn't very friendly to automatic bindings
<adrien>
s/automatic //
<NaCl>
yeah, you did. hence the "IDK about UI" part
<adrien>
ok, wanted to be sure you weren't believing it was working ;-)
<NaCl>
Yeah. I may do it in Qt for all I know.
<NaCl>
if I do it
<adrien>
well, you can use lablqt now :P
<Kakadu>
I think u cant
<adrien>
you mean I have to make lablefl/enlightened-caml (enlightenment foundation libraries) instead? :P
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<reynir>
I have trouble implementing something in camlp5
<reynir>
I have a list of (identifier * expression) pairs that I want to transform into let id_0 = e_0 and id_1 = e_1 and ... and id_k = e_k in ...
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<hcarty>
adrien: You do. Because that would be Pretty Cool.
<hcarty>
adrien: Who knows if anyone would use it...
<hcarty>
But it would be cool :-)
<adrien>
I'm going to try to get an internship to do precisely that :P
<reynir>
good tutorials or documentation for ocamlp5 is also welcome
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<adrien>
the advantage of ocaml being that it's so picky about bindings that if you provide enough information for automatic OCaml bindings, there will be enough information for bindings to all other languages :-)
<adrien>
reynir: 1- why camlp*5*?
<reynir>
adrien: I don't know. It had the better tutorial that I could find, I guess :-)
<adrien>
reynir: because camlp5 is mostly ocaml < (<= ?) 3.10's camlp4 that got taken and developped outside of the official ocaml distributions
<adrien>
the camlp4 in newer ocaml versions is actually a different one
<reynir>
Yes, I read that
<adrien>
if you find this confusing, you probably have understood how the versions are
<adrien>
reynir: I'm not suggesting anything in particular since I'm not experienced in this field, I mostly wanted to make sure that you were aware of the situation and weren't only using camlp5 because 5 > 4
<adrien>
NaCl: made some (cosmetic) changes to flamel
<adrien>
to the code, not the appearance
<adrien>
currently it's not adding anything to the UI for new jobs ='(
<NaCl>
yeah, I started that but never got around to finishing it
<adrien>
how can I start some renderings?
<NaCl>
the "go" button doesn't do it?
<adrien>
10 -> "GO!", nothing happens, including in top
<adrien>
the corresponding callback is called but that's it
<NaCl>
uh
<NaCl>
I am in no position to try to debug flamel right now. I would make sure that flam3 isn't dying
<adrien>
right, strace :P
<NaCl>
The way the process starting is rigged up is soooo mesy
<NaCl>
messy
<adrien>
I've been trying to stop using it ever since Robby Workman told me I probably was crazy after I strace'd hald =/
<NaCl>
haha
<NaCl>
adrien: and if it still doesn't work, I'd try reverting to an earlier revision.
<NaCl>
if I look at that code again, I'm going to have to spend some time figuring out what I did
<adrien>
I've tried earlier ones and had the same issue; I'll do more tries
<NaCl>
adrien: I know for a fact that earlier versions worked for me
<NaCl>
adrien: try enabling debugging in lwt
<adrien>
how do you do that?
<NaCl>
it may be some argument to camlp4 that may already be enabled, actually
<adrien>
ok, I'll look that up
<NaCl>
check the makefile
* NaCl
can't use ocaml at work
<adrien>
='(
<NaCl>
I could, but then I'd be stuck maintaining stuff indefinitely
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<adrien>
hmm, dunno what's going on
<NaCl>
unfortunately, console I/O there is really funky
<NaCl>
I remember that it took me a while to coerse it to work
<adrien>
it's not starting processes
<NaCl>
Whenever I had problems with processes, it was always the file descriptors being broken
<adrien>
found a good revision
<NaCl>
so I couldn't capture I/O
<adrien>
hhahahahahahahaha
<adrien>
*I* fail
<NaCl>
xD
<adrien>
and aI failed a *long* time ago
<adrien>
when I first made the code
<NaCl>
Is it something broken I left there? xD
<adrien>
it doesn't create the output folder (named "e") automatically
<NaCl>
oh, haha
<adrien>
so I mkdir'ed it
<NaCl>
yeah
<NaCl>
I never got around to that either. xD
<adrien>
ah, nice flames =)
<adrien>
wallpapers, here I come :P
<adrien>
my poor E-350 is going to die :P
<adrien>
the CPU might be quite weak, the computer has 3GB of RAM nonetheless =)
<gildor>
adrien: what about forge.ocamlcore.org ?
<NaCl>
adrien: send me an e-mail and I'll get around to fixing it this weekend
<gildor>
adrien: concerning packing module with oasis, there is a patch from JaneStreet to do that, not yet apply
<gildor>
(will be applied in v0.3.0)
<adrien>
gildor: oh, nothing is wrong about f.o.o, I was only pushing NaCl a bit to put his code on it
<adrien>
100 minutes of rendering for a single flame.......
<adrien>
gildor: any chance it is applied earlier in trunk? I'm currently deciding how I'm organizing caravel and I might need it (not sure yet)
<adrien>
gildor: or is the patch good enough that I apply it by myself?
<adrien>
NaCl: unless I fix it myself first :P
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<adrien>
NaCl: my other projects got quite serious and therefore less fun (but not less motivating): flamel is less serious for me and therefore more fun =)
<adrien>
which is why I'm going to be more eager to hack on it on my free time
<reynir>
I found a solution, in case anyone is interested
<adrien>
reynir: I'd say that someone is always interesting, especially since the channel has (public) logs
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<adrien>
and I remember why I've been considering flam3-render as the ultimate CPU-stability test: uses a lot of CPU, a lot of memory and no workload had ever made my CPU that hot
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<gildor>
adrien: it should be good enough to use it, but you'll need to recompile oasis (and find the patch, it was maybe in the feature request tracker I have deleted accidentally)
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<adrien>
ok, I think I remember seeing the bug report not long ago
<adrien>
and I can always ping the submitters
<adrien>
also, I installed my own oasis so it isn't an issue
<adrien>
I still have some time before I'm completely set on how I want to organize everything in caravel
<reynir>
adrien: I found out that <:expr< let $list: (PATTERN, EXPRESSION) LIST$ in EXPRESSION>> worked
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<reynir>
I don't know how to preserve comments in the "and ..."s though
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<thelema>
reynir: preserving comments isn't something that camlp4 does well
<hcarty>
reynir: IIRC, camlp5/only-camlp4 was not able to properly preserve comments. camlp4-new has somewhat better support, but there are a number of bugs.
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<reynir>
I'm using camlp5
<reynir>
It works some places
<reynir>
It's pretty cool to extend the syntax, I think
<hcarty>
reynir: It is a lot of fun
<hcarty>
Dangerous at times, but fun
<reynir>
Yea :-) The extension I have made will save me from doing a lot of redundant typing
<hcarty>
reynir: Keep in mind that camlp5 and camlp4 are not likely to play well together
<hcarty>
And most extensions are written in camlp4 at this point
<reynir>
Oh, ok
<reynir>
Is camlp4 much different?
<thelema>
hcarty: not by volume, but the maintained ones are in camlp4
<reynir>
I mean, is it hard to learn?
<thelema>
reynir: knowing camlp5 gets you most of the way there, from what I understand
<thelema>
reynir: there's just different hooks into the grammar
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<reynir>
Ok, thanks
<hcarty>
reynir: As you noticed, the camlp5 documentation is much more thorough.
<hcarty>
camlp4 documentation comes down to wikis and reading code, primarily
<reynir>
That's a shame
<hcarty>
reynir: Truly
<hcarty>
thelema: That's fair. Although the volume is likely comparable at this point.
<hcarty>
Most of the popular extensions I've seen were ported to the new camlp4.
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<thelema>
yes, but there's tons of code out there that never made it to ocaml 3.10
<NaCl>
adrien: wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
<thelema>
I'm often impressed at the quality of the ocaml code that I've never heard of.
<thelema>
that I find references to from 8-10 years ago
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<Drakken>
Is there a general-purpose (macro) library somewhere that defines DEFINE and INCLUDE?
<hcarty>
Drakken: pa-do has one and I think that camlp4 includes a simple version as well
<thelema>
Drakken: yes, iirc it's something built in, let me find which one...
<hcarty>
Drakken: Regarding your PLplot question the other day - you can have multiple plot windows open, and you can have multiple plots on a single page.
<Drakken>
hcarty I wasn't asking about pages, I was asking about overlapping windows on the monitor
<rixed>
thelema: Hi! Is it me, or is batteries's mailling list borken for some days?
<hcarty>
Drakken: You can have multiple plot windows
<thelema>
rixed: I dunno - are there messages that are supposed to have come through?
<thelema>
rixed: I just assumed it was quiet
<rixed>
thelema: I send one regarding the link you posted to a msg on recursive mutex. I didn't sae my email so resent it, then still nothing.
<hcarty>
Drakken: Multiple pages in one plot (PDF or PS for example), multiple distinct output devices (ex. windows or PNGs) and multiple plots rendered on a single surface (ex. 2x2 arrangement of plots on a single PNG)
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<thelema>
scrappy_doo_: `Impulses look good for the chart of runtimes, something like [Array.y vp ~style:`Impulse ~const_y:true res.times]
<thelema>
[let plot fn res = let vp = Archimedes.init ["Cairo"; "PNG"; fn] in Archimedes.Array.y vp ~style:`Impulse ~const_y:true res.times; Archimedes.close vp]
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<reynir>
thelema: the reason I asked was because the lecturer in the mathematical analysis class I attend claimed that some places they used reverse Ø
<thelema>
interesting. Wikipedia doesn't have anything about that, it lists "{}", "\emptyset", a variant of this, "^" and "0"
<reynir>
I don't believe him, honestly
<reynir>
Ø is also a danish letter (I live in Denmark and the course is in danish)
<thelema>
yes, that's noted as the inspiration for \emptyset
<thelema>
maybe he's run into people misusing this notation and he was especially sensitive to it because of the character being in his alphabet
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<reynir>
That sounds reasonable
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<Anarchos>
reynir André Weil is the creator of the Ø notation around 1930. He took inspiration in danish
<Anarchos>
Anyway Ø and {} are ontologically different : {} reminds to a set thought in comprehension, while Ø stands more from a behavioural definition (for all x, x is not in Ø)
<thelema>
gildor: ping
<reynir>
I *always* use Ø, and I rarely see anyone use {} here :-)
<thelema>
pretty rare for me to see {} here too.
* Anarchos
thinks that everybody lives and thinks in a different "here" :)
<gildor>
thelema: pong, still at work
<gildor>
thelema: will go back RSN
<gildor>
ping you when I am at home
<thelema>
gildor: isn't it late there?
<thelema>
:)
<gildor>
something like 10:30 PM
* gildor
packing my stuff
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<flux>
what a coincidence (?)
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<flux>
the broken ocaml core package on debian unstable I complained about yesterday has been now fixed, according to the bug tracking
<flux>
is there a secret agent on the channel?-)
<Anarchos>
flux sure, but not me :)
<flux>
ahha, sgnb!
<flux>
thank you :)
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<gildor>
thelema: mailing list up and running
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<gildor>
thelema: your old message seems to be there also
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<adrien>
NaCl: TODO: save to disk :P
<thelema>
gildor: this problem won't happen again?
<gildor>
thelema: don't know
<thelema>
gildor: no real cause?
<gildor>
thelema: the daemon crashed, I just restarted it
<thelema>
ok. so probably not.
<gildor>
thelema: no obvious cause, probably related to file left due to /tmp being full
<gildor>
thelema: but I cannot be 100% sure
<gildor>
thelema: e.g. /var/run/mailman/mailman.pid not being deleted
<thelema>
Thanks for fixing it.
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<superbobry>
how do i go about adding a new sub command to setup.ml, generated by OASIS? there seems to be no docs available on the subjet :(
<adrien>
whenshould the command be executed?
<adrien>
configure time, build time, clean time, dist-clean time ?
<superbobry>
what do you mean when?
<superbobry>
ah, any time i guess, i just want to collect and print all dependencies of an OASIS project
<superbobry>
seems like BaseSetup.ml is just what i need
<adrien>
only collect them? "grep BuildDepends _oasis"?
<superbobry>
afaik oasis also does topological sort on them
<thelema>
umm, I don't think oasis knows the relationship between the depends
<thelema>
only ocamlfind
<superbobry>
hrm, i'm pretty sure I saw it in the code somewhere
<thelema>
it depsorts internal dependencies, but not BuildDepends
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<superbobry>
you're right, it's only for internal code
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<superbobry>
but i think it would still be easier to implement as an OASIS command, compared to greping _oasis and then doing quering / sorting
<thelema>
superbobry: what's your goal?
<adrien>
NaCl: 20 or 21 flames to render in high-quality; ETA for the first one is currently 180 minutes; flamel needs a "pause" button :P
<reynir>
adrien: ^Z?
<superbobry>
thelema: my goal is to have an easy way of collecting all deps for an oasis project (that can be useful to odb as well)
<adrien>
reynir: yes and no: flamel is a GUI front-end and wrapper to flam3-genome and flam3-render; I think that SIGSTOP will work fine but it's not the handiest way to do it
<adrien>
and flamel could probably use a more advanced management of flames (sort flames by hand in particular)