ChanServ changed the topic of #picolisp to: PicoLisp language | Channel Log: https://irclog.whitequark.org/picolisp/ | Check also http://www.picolisp.com for more information
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<razzy> i cannot find example of parael execution :(
<razzy> un picolisp
<razzy> found
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<razzy> how is trail not expensive?
<Regenaxer> Why should it be expensive? It goes up the stack
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<razzy> i propably do not understand it
<Regenaxer> It just collects runtime information which is in the stack anyway
<razzy> i am looking for build up backtrace
<Regenaxer> 'bt'?
<razzy> so i can step foward and backward in program.
<Regenaxer> What do you mean with stepping backward?
<Regenaxer> Debug steps?
<Regenaxer> or function calls?
<razzy> i think it is expensive, so i would not mind to start a function to collect all the variables.
<razzy> i want total rollback
<Regenaxer> ok
<razzy> not for debug, but for reversing one way functions. like (+ 1 2 3) -> 6 to go back change parameters and go foward
<Regenaxer> Good luck!
<razzy> not for decrypting
<razzy> for chess play.
<razzy> for goal finding in chess play
<Regenaxer> nice
<razzy> which would double the search depth
<Regenaxer> How?
<razzy> i loosely explain
<razzy> if you have same computation hardware and you search from start you have for example depth 4.
<razzy> yes?
<razzy> if you have ideal reachable goal in mind and you also run search from goal to start you could have total depth little less than 8
<Regenaxer> I don't understand
<Regenaxer> You mean some backwards search?
<Regenaxer> backtracking
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<Regenaxer> But this is an application-level issue, not backtracking on the VM level
<razzy> do you agree with what i said?
<razzy> loosely?
<Regenaxer> Not really
<Regenaxer> You *can* search backwards
<Regenaxer> Pilog does that
<Regenaxer> But this does not make the search depth half
<Regenaxer> Just do it!
<Regenaxer> I don't need to understand it
<razzy> keyword is ideal reachable goal that is hard to find
<Regenaxer> yes, backtracking
<Regenaxer> Use Pilog or similar
<Regenaxer> ie proving a goal
<Regenaxer> This has nothing at all to do what is in the stack
<Regenaxer> stack is the current state of the call history
<Regenaxer> nothing with a goal
<razzy> i agree
<Regenaxer> OK, so just do it. I have some work to do. I just can answer pil questions
<razzy> so no perfect backtracking function
<razzy> that do rollbacks
<Regenaxer> yes, Pilog
<Regenaxer> yep
<razzy> i do not think pillog can do backward search on normal picolisp functions
<razzy> if you say it can do, i will look into it
<Regenaxer> It can do any backward search. Can of course also operate on functions (= code data)
<razzy> backward search is pain, if you do not keep processing variables
<razzy> from foward execution
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<tankf33der> damn.
<Regenaxer> Hi tankf33der! Is this something similar to the Dining Philosopers" problem?
<Regenaxer> misc/dining.l
<Regenaxer> ?
<tankf33der> eh
<tankf33der> i dont think so
<beneroth> Good morning Regenaxer, tankf33der, razzy
<Regenaxer> Good morning beneroth
<Regenaxer> tankf33der, ok
<Regenaxer> I just saw things like "falls asleep" ;)
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<razzy> beneroth: good morning :]
<tankf33der> also i need to sort this
<tankf33der> example given sorted.
<Regenaxer> Is there a problem with the sorting?
<tankf33der> yea
<Regenaxer> Which?
<tankf33der> maybe i should convert 1518-07-18 00:55 to single number as seconds.
<Regenaxer> What is 1518? A week and a year?
<tankf33der> year
<Regenaxer> ok
<tankf33der> jul 18 1518
<Regenaxer> ($dat "1518-07-18" "-")
<Regenaxer> Really ancient logfiles it seems ;)
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<beneroth> [OT] remote code execution in Kubernetes Management Service: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/12/03/kubernetes_flaw_cve_2018_1002105/
<beneroth> that happens when your stuff is too complex, uses too many turtles. bloat is really bad.
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<razzy> how is picolisp in long time maintenance?
<Regenaxer> Very good
<beneroth> confirm. best thing ever.
<Regenaxer> :)
<razzy> Regenaxer: did you publish your toolchain?
<Regenaxer> Which toolchain?
<beneroth> snapshot is part of the picolisp distro, so I would say - yes?
<Regenaxer> He means the build tools perhaps?
<Regenaxer> Only GNU Asm?
<tankf33der> (sort) function can sort this lines automagically.
<tankf33der> OMG.
<Regenaxer> ha, yes, YYYY-MM-DD sorts well
<Regenaxer> no need to convert
<tankf33der> shocked.
<Regenaxer> Wasted time?
<beneroth> thats why ISO Dates are so nice - they can be textually sorted
<tankf33der> no, its ok.
<beneroth> I often prefix directories with an ISO date for such purposes
<Regenaxer> good idea
<tankf33der> shocked by power of Alexander Burger.
<Regenaxer> hu?
<Regenaxer> iso dates are not my fault ;)
<beneroth> thats normal sorting by number values of chars in a string
<razzy> Regenaxer: i meant day to day maintenance of picolisp toolchain. how to efficiently behave :]
<beneroth> it usually fails then the numbers in the string have different lengths.. e.g. : (sort '("345_foo" "3_blubb" "350_bar" "420_haha")) -> ("345_foo" "350_bar" "3_blubb" "420_haha")
<beneroth> razzy, Regenaxer just writes code using vip and takes from time to time a snapshot (bin/snapshot). no other tools.
<Regenaxer> right
<Regenaxer> I would not call that a toolchain
<beneroth> razzy, Regenaxer does not use such indecent words.. but.. http://programming-motherfucker.com
<beneroth> just do it
<Regenaxer> haha, cool page!
<beneroth> there is no golden path.
<beneroth> (well KISS. but still have to do it.)
<razzy> :D
<razzy> from the picolisp page it seems that lots of output is automated
<razzy> man pages, references
<razzy> or at least should be
<Regenaxer> I think nothing is automated here. Man page (troff) and references (html) are w ritten by hand
<Regenaxer> yepp
<razzy> these are keepers :]
<beneroth> [OT] there seems to be a bug corrupting the ext4 filesystem with newer linux kernels (4.18 + or so). cause not clear yet (afaik): https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201685
<Regenaxer> oha
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