aschmahmann changed the topic of #ipfs to: Heads Up: To talk, you need to register your nick! Announcements: go-ipfs 0.7.0 and js-ipfs 0.52.3 are out! Get them from dist.ipfs.io and npm respectively! | Also: #libp2p #ipfs-cluster #filecoin #ipfs-dev | IPFS: https://github.com/ipfs/ipfs | Logs: https://view.matrix.org/room/!yhqiEdqNjyPbxtUjzm:matrix.org/ | Forums: https://discuss.ipfs.io | Code of Conduct: https://git.io/vVBS0
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<az>
hello
<az>
how does it take for my file to show up on the https link?
<az>
ok, If I create an IPNS from command line how can I prove the ownership of it again?
<az>
is there some password or backup?
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<miguelrochefort[>
What's the catch?
<miguelrochefort[>
Can I just take all of my data and just put it all in IPFS?
<miguelrochefort[>
Surely there are limitations, otherwise we'd all be suing it for everything, no?
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<kavin>
<miguelrochefort[ "What's the catch?"> You need to host your own data or get a pinning service
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<az>
If I create an IPNS from command line how can I prove the ownership of it again?
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<McSinyx[m]>
of the name? it resolves to your public key(s)
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<az>
McSinyx[m], so I've a public key and a private key?
<McSinyx[m]>
your node's private key is generated as you `ipfs init`
<az>
what I want to achive is that I want to generate an IPNS and keep it alive and link it to a pinned file. I don't want to lose control over the IPNS if I delete my software or change device
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I also saw a mention of IPNS acting like a dns service - how can that be used with current methods like traditional dns servers? Is there a proxy, and how anonymous are those connections or would i have to use an overlay network like i2p to cover those requests?
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I know its a lot but both the youtube keynote from ipfs camp 2019 as well as the readme were very broad but not very precise. The bullet list given int hat readme on github.com/ipfs/ipfs only gave me a little, tiny bit of a hint... but nothing more.
<swedneck>
tbh i think what you're looking for is actually syncthing
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
syncthing only goes between devices on the same network and isn't as powerful as I had initially hoped it to be. Already looked at that. It is interesting though. ^^
<swedneck>
uhh
<swedneck>
syncthing works across any networks afaik
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Really? Wasn't clear from reading their Getting Started guide...
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Felt more like a way to synchronize some files between a small amount of devices - like an automated `rsync` , really
<swedneck>
it works fine on my phone that switches from wifi to mobile network
<swedneck>
i'd definitely use syncthing for the personal data, but ipfs could work just fine for the roleplay stuff
<swedneck>
you'd want to use ipfs-cluster though
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
And can you send links to others to download shared content? i.e. you have this video you want to send to your friend, can syncthing do that? And how would I use that in my web app usecase of storing assets? Is there a http gateway i could proxy into?
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Yeah, i will be using a cluster. But I am trying to find a suitable file system-ish thing to use that is tested to distribute files across various servers.
<swedneck>
yeah if you want to share stuff easily then ipfs will work great
<swedneck>
i use it to share screenshots for example
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I suppose the `bafy...` subdomain refers to your own node?
<swedneck>
no, it's the ID of the content i want to share
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
so the CID?
<swedneck>
yes
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I see. And where is the file actually stored? Your own server or some other place?
<swedneck>
in this case the screenshot is in a directory, which is what the ID refers to
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "I see. And where is the file act"> right now it would be permanently hosted on my desktop, and temporarily cached on dweb.link
<swedneck>
i'm not sure if dweb.link will seed it though
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<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<swedneck "right now it would be permanentl"> did you have to open a port on your router to achieve this or is it just a permanently connected client? That would also mean, that should your desktop be offline, you can't share the file too i suppose?
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<swedneck "i'm not sure if dweb.link will s"> I was able to open it just fine. So that sure worked.
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "did you have to open a port on y"> i have port 4001 forwarded but it shouldn't be strictly necessary, just very beneficial
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "I was able to open it just fine."> no, as in seed it to other peers on ipfs
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I see.
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "did you have to open a port on y"> and yes, if my desktop goes offline so does the content unless someone else seeds it
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<swedneck "and yes, if my desktop goes offl"> How can that happen? Do they just target that specific cid and tell their client to seed it? And then a central server knows all the peers that have that cid hosted?
<aschmahmann>
az: you can use the `ipfs key` commands to generate new IPNS public+private key pairs and then export+import them/back them up and restore. Note publishing to the same IPNS key from multiple devices at the same time might have issues with the nodes clobbering each other (e.g. A publishes that the key points at data D1 while B publishes that it points at D2, which one is "right").
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "How can that happen? Do they jus"> you can seed it with e.g. `ipfs pin add CID`
<swedneck>
but it's not like ipfs.io hosts a single server that the network relies on
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
> <@swedneck:feneas.org> you can seed it with e.g. `ipfs pin add CID`
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
> there's *technically* a central peer that keeps track of who has what available, but it's selected by the network and i'm pretty sure there can be multiple such peers.
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I see. Well I did see a mention of a BitTorrent-esque DHT being used - so I assume that ipfs clients communicate with each other in some form.
<az>
aschmahmann, how I can get an fixed IPNS without keeping the software running? any pining service for IPNS?
<swedneck>
actually there are multiple such tracking peers, it's just split into ranges with one peer per range or something
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
So anyone can make a new peer like this to assure that the tracking never stops?
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
But if a file is deleted on one of the hosts - it is gone for everyone that didn't seed it, so nothing is preserved unless at least one other peer pins it?
<McSinyx[m]>
yep
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "But if a file is deleted on one "> it's just like torrent, as long as at least one peer seeds it, it's available on the network and other peers can start seeding it too
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
So if I used ipfs in my web app and someone pinned a specific asset - even if I deleted it off my server, that asset would still be available under the same cid, although its no longer on my server? (i.e. i was following a request to take down a specific artwork for licensing infrindgement)
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I see.
<aschmahmann>
az: I don't know of any pinning services that do IPNS things off hand. If you're ok coming back online once a day or so then you should be able to keep the record in the DHT refreshed. If you're willing to rely exclusively on IPNS over PubSub instead of IPNS over the DHT then you can publish with a long lifetime and that should work too.
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "So if I used ipfs in my web app "> yes
<az>
aschmahmann, thanks I'll check that
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Okay, that's pretty cool. So in theory, I could spawn random servers across places that all pinned a specific set of files (i.e. most requested) and even if my server is down, the content would still be available on the network. Well, I'd have to instruct those other servers to pin those files. And I assume that same as `ipfs pin add`, there is also `ipfs pin remove`?
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
I wonder: Could one use ipfs to back a matrix media store? iirc the synapse hs implementation just dumps the file and generates a link to the file - against the configured base domain by default (https://matrix.ingwie.io in my case)
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
That, indeed, is a mess. :P But very useful.
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<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Okay - well thats nice. But what is DNSlink? Does it just return TXT records?
<swedneck>
the old content would still be pinned
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
where?
<swedneck>
sadly you can't pin IPNS addresses directly yet, it will simply resolve it and pin the current content
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Wait, so the node that created both versions of hello.txt still actually has the old version pinned (and stored)?
<swedneck>
yes
<swedneck>
and anyone who pinned the old content will ofc keep pinning it until they remove the pin
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<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
So to truely get rid of the old version, after running `ipfs add hello.txt` for the second time, i'd have to `ipfs pin rm old_hello.txt_hash` manually to truely get rid of the old one?
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<swedneck>
something like that, i just don't remove old pins because i can't be bothered to care about 500KB of data here and there
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
oh wow, that sentence was so redundant on start and end. xD Man am I a mess today. x.x;
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Yeah makes sense.
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
But if it was like two versions of a 4GB file, it'd probably make sense to remove old hashes - well, pins.
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<swedneck>
keep in mind that any identical data is deduplicated
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Oh? So even if a 4GB file only has a difference of, say, 10MB, it'd only be storing that 4GB + 10MB?
<swedneck>
yes
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Well approximately, since it's per-block iirc
<swedneck>
(basically, there's a bit more to it but eeeeeeeeeeeeh)
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Kinda reminds me of git basically storing a boatload of diffs under the hood.
<ZerXes>
IngwiePhoenix[m]: your 4GB file will be split up in (default) 256kb chunks and any chunk that is identical to a chunk you already have will not use any more diskspace as IPFS only stores every chunk once
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
So there is an ipfs gateway running locally too - so i would be able to use ipfs on an enclosed network too if i *really* wanted to? (which would defeat the purpose of using ipfs int he first place - but, just theoreticaly.)
<swedneck>
there are absoluetly valid use cases for running ipfs on a closed network
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<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<ZerXes "Ingwie Phoenix: your 4GB file wi"> Ah. But if I deliberately deleted the older version, would these two just be merged into the only other remaining version?For instance:
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<swedneck "there are absoluetly valid use c"> Really? But isn't the main idea of ipfs to be decentralized, public and available to everyone?
<swedneck>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "Really? But isn't the main idea "> uhh i'm not sure what you mean?
<swedneck>
running ipfs on a closed network is no different than e.g. an intranet email server
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<swedneck "uhh i'm not sure what you mean?"> From the keynote I listened to, it was all about making data publicy available and alike. Like the independence vote in that town in spain going down using ipfs to store some documents. Kinda felt like ipfs was all about storing everything publicy?
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
<swedneck "running ipfs on a closed network"> Okay, good point
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<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Reading the ipfs-cluster docs is quite interesting. What I want to do is actually already there, right int he docs - allowing other people to rehost a given pinset - and even being able to recover from those in a worst-case scenario. Very, very neat.
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Well i wouldnt redistribute database files in a cluster like this - unless i could encrypt them somehow and only access/read them with the decryption key or something. That way I could even store a database's backend (i.e. postgres' storage) in an ipfs cluster and should i ever accidentially delete it, restore it off other clusters. Can I encrypt sensible files like this and store them in a cluster?
<swedneck>
#orbitdb:matrix.org
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
Neat!
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
had no idea ipfs had pubsub. Good to know
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<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
guess i'll drop ipfs on my system and give it a shot - probably the wsl2 install, so i can test the FUSE layer.
<IngwiePhoenix[m]>
haven't seen any mention of winfsp for ipfs anywhere.
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<swedneck>
<tpdcl[m] "Do you think IPFS will really re"> http is much broader than ipfs, ipfs may replace the use case of just serving simple websites and static content, but not very soon
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<tpdcl[m]>
Oh ok. I saw they had great plans (wanting to surpass HTTP) and a pretty big community and I wanted to see what the consensus was on whether they would live to their promises.
<swedneck>
it's not anything to do with ipfs in specific
<swedneck>
rather that replacing http is a veeeeeeeeery long term thing
<swedneck>
hell not all ISPs even provide ipv6 yet
<tpdcl[m]>
This sounds like a cool project and I don't want to see it end up like BitTorrent (with many sites only metioning it as an alternative way of downloading or not even providing ways of downloading through it for the very large ones)
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<boomerwaffen[m]>
when will ifps be able to host more complex websites?
<tpdcl[m]>
<swedneck "hell not all ISPs even provide i"> Yeah it seems amazing that the Internet is moving so slowly while other areas are progressing to rapidly.
<tpdcl[m]>
> <@swedneck:feneas.org> hell not all ISPs even provide ipv6 yet
<tpdcl[m]>
* Yeah it seems amazing that the Internet is moving so slowly while other areas of tech are progressing to rapidly.
<tpdcl[m]>
* Yeah it seems amazing that the Internet is moving so slowly while other areas of tech are progressing so rapidly.
<swedneck>
<boomerwaffen[m] "when will ifps be able to host m"> when people decide to stop using dynamic websites for everything
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<tpdcl[m]>
<swedneck "when people decide to stop using"> So is it imposible to host dynamic websites for now or are they planning on implementing that?
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<boomerwaffen[m]>
How does privacy work hosting content through ipfs?
<swedneck>
<tpdcl[m] "So is it imposible to host dynam"> i don't see how that would ever work with ipfs, it's rather antithetical to the entire point of ipfs
<swedneck>
what you'd do to make something like e.g. youtube work with ipfs is either just rewrite the website to just be a client that connects to the normal servers, or rewrite the entire stack to be fundamentally decentralized
<tpdcl[m]>
And then how will it create 'the web of tomorrow' if it can't even work with the web of today?
<swedneck>
it works absolutely fine for hosting static content, like images
<swedneck>
also, that's rather like asking nikola tesla how electricity will be the future when it doesn't work with gas
<tpdcl[m]>
Ok.
<tpdcl[m]>
It seems to be promising.
<tpdcl[m]>
I've installed the companion and will install the desktop client when there's a Flatpak for it.
<tpdcl[m]>
Are privacy issues going to be solved(the one I know is IP showing)
<tpdcl[m]>
* Are privacy issues going to be solved(the one I know is IP showing)?
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<swedneck>
i'm pretty sure the consensus on that is that it's not a privacy issue, and not a big issue either
<tpdcl[m]>
Hm
<tpdcl[m]>
Then what is the purpose of Tor?
<swedneck>
bear in mind i'm not a dev or on the go-ipfs team
<tpdcl[m]>
* Then what is the purpose of Tor if not to hide your IP?
<boomerwaffen[m]>
If I wanted to host content that my government found politically unsavoury is it possible to do without exposing myself?
<daviddias[m]>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "guess i'll drop ipfs on my syste"> willscott made https://github.com/willscott/go-nfs so that you don't have to deal with FUSE nuances 🙂
<daviddias[m]>
<IngwiePhoenix[m] "Well i wouldnt redistribute data"> What you want to check are:
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