gl changed the topic of #ocaml to: OCaml 3.07 ! -- Archive of Caml Weekly News: http://pauillac.inria.fr/~aschmitt/cwn , A tutorial: http://merjis.com/richj/computers/ocaml/tutorial/ , A free book: http://cristal.inria.fr/~remy/cours/appsem, Mailing List (best ml ever for any computer language): http://caml.inria.fr/bin/wilma/caml-list | http://icfpcontest.org/ !!
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<maml> hello
<maml> i have spend my night coding a pong game by internet (in o'caml) and i need someone to test it with me ...
<maml> have someone time to lose ?
<Riastradh> Sure.
<Riastradh> ...er, wait, what libraries does it necessitate?
<maml> hum
<maml> unix.cma (you need a POSIX system) and sdl
<Riastradh> I have yet to successfully build an application that uses lablGL. (lablTk seems to work OK, though.)
<maml> i'm a beginner, all commentary on my code is welcome
<maml> ?
<Riastradh> I'm building SDL. (I thought I already had it, but apparently I don't.)
<maml> :)
<maml> i'm testing localy but play in two different windows is very hard :)
<maml> (i have update the last version, to play you'll have to download again netpong.tar.gz)
<maml> i have reupdate, :/ another great bug.
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<Riastradh> Oh, great. OCamlSDL has an integer literal that's out of bounds.
<maml> have you sdlmixer ? :)
<maml> i've just add "bleep" when ball touch pads :)
<maml> exiting.
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<maml> ("" != "") => true ?
<maml> doo
<maml> ?
<maml> # "" = "";;
<maml> - : bool = true
<maml> # "" != "";;
<maml> - : bool = true
<maml> things can be equal and different ?
<maml> where's my bed
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<Smerdyakov> maml, you have made a mistake!
<maml> yep
<maml> it's <>
<Smerdyakov> Right.
<Smerdyakov> != is the opposite of ==.
<maml> it is 4h30 in the morning, here
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<Smerdyakov> Have you guys seen this? http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/craps.php
<Smerdyakov> It's an updated Programming Language Shootout, and both SML/NJ and MLton come out ahead of OCaml for runtime speed!
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<kinners> the ocaml score is brought down a bit by the regular expression benchmark
<Riastradh> The Stalin benchmarks are _still_ almost all missing.
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<may> hola
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<JPL-Justin> hey all :)
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<vincenz> Set regeular expression matchin factor to 0 (just that one) and ocaml is better
<vincenz> Well DUH
<vincenz> There is no regexp entry for ocaml
<vincenz> of course it's last then
<det> those numbers look suspect
<det> no way SML/NJ beats ocaml :)
<vincenz> no those numbers aren ot suspicisiou
<vincenz> if you look in the grand conclusion
<vincenz> ocaml beats sml/nj if you set the regexp weight to 0
<vincenz> and if you look at the regexp, there's no value for mem and cpu for ocaml
<vincenz> so it's placed last
<vincenz> what a crock
<det> that doesnt look suspicious?
<vincenz> plus
<vincenz> look at the random number generator
<vincenz> they should use a for loop
<vincenz> not a recursive loop with n-1
<det> for loop is generally faster in ocaml
* vincenz blinsk
<vincenz> look at the line count for the mlton and ocaml for the one you said
<vincenz> det: well they use a recursive loop
<det> they are the same code mostly
<det> both being SML compilers :)
<vincenz> no
<vincenz> line of codes mlton = 340
<vincenz> line of code ocaml = 29
<det> oh
<vincenz> That's why I blinked
<det> MLton implements a hash table in the code I think
<det> SMLNJ as well
<vincenz> oh
<vincenz> ocaml has it in the libs?
<vincenz> nm, I knew that
<det> smlnj beats mlton with regexp set to 0
<det> this is /not/ right :)
<vincenz> anyways for RNG they should use for loops, and for regexp they don't have times so ocaml scores worst so it brings it's score down
<det> I suspect there is a large bug witht heir timing
<det> look, no programs used any memory
<det> lua used no resources at all
<vincenz> of course
<vincenz> it sums stuff from stdin
<vincenz> you only need one register to hold the sum
<det> but still
<vincenz> though that's a crappy shootout
<vincenz> most of the run time is in reading input
<det> runtime etc..
<det> python forinstance, heap allocates an object for each number
<vincenz> nope
<vincenz> or wait
<vincenz> I'm not sure about that one
<det> they are all messed up
<det> SML/NJ takes many #1s
<det> and the rest it performs shitty on
* vincenz shrugs
<vincenz> Did you compete in ICFP?
<det> no
<det> I had to work
<vincenz> oh
<det> did you?
<vincenz> yup
<det> when will the winner be announced?
<det> how did you do?
<vincenz> we spent too much time on genalgos
<vincenz> instead of just making a compiler for a HLL
<det> ohh
<vincenz> in the end we built an entire frameowrk
<det> gen algos surely would have been the long term solution
<vincenz> but what got submitted is an ant coded by hand by one of the members (he only worked on ants)
<det> I dont think IFCP can take another year of C++ winners :)
<vincenz> why c++?
<det> it won last year
<vincenz> oh!
<vincenz> oh yes you're right
<vincenz> the gui with his genalgo
<vincenz> and his lab of computers
<det> you mean last year?
<vincenz> yup
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<det> I dont think it had any thing to do with gen algos
<vincenz> yes it did
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<Axioplase> Chat Lu!
<kinners> salut Axioplase
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<maml> hello
<maml> i have an abstract type "foo" and a function with side effect get_foo() which return a foo and play a music (st james - amstrong).
<maml> i want to put foo in a ref variable x like this:
<maml> x := get_foo ();
<maml> but i can't call get_foo before call init_sound (); (a function wich turn my jukebox on)
<maml> how can i define 'x' ?
<maml> let x = ???? in begin init_sounf (); x := get_foo (); end
<karryall> let x = ref None
<karryall> then later, after init_sound
<karryall> x := Some (get_foo ())
<maml> ah !
<maml> thanks :)
<Smerdyakov> Why not: init_soundf (); let x = get_foo() in ...
<karryall> he probably wants x to be a toplevel element
<maml> in fact it's:
<maml> no, sorry.
<karryall> :)
<karryall> actually, I see you don't want x to be a toplevel element
<karryall> you could also write it as
<karryall> let x = ref (init_sound () ; get_foo ()) in ...
<Smerdyakov> But then it's silly to make it a ref.
<karryall> that depends on what is in the body of the let .. in
<maml> it's very hard to describe it for me (i do my best to speak english but it's difficult)
<karryall> do it in french then :)
<vincenz> Oui si tu veux, je parles francais
<Submarine> roncq = rocquencourt?
<maml> :)
<maml> roncq is a small town in the north of the france
<maml> there is a "High field" in Roncq.
<Submarine> bon c'est quoi le pb
<maml> hum
<karryall> bon moi je pars en week-end, tcho
<maml> euh, ca va aller, je vous remercie
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<vincenz> Is it possible to have an ocaml interpreter taht does not allow certain modules to be used?
<Submarine> "Is it possible to have an ocaml interpreter taht does not allow certain modules to be used?" ?
<Submarine> Please explain precisely what you wish...
<vincenz> Well I'm thinking of building upon this ircbot I found
<vincenz> and I would like to have the ability to run ocaml code from within irc
<vincenz> much like the bot in #scheme
<vincenz> however for that to happen I need two limitations
<vincenz> a) timeout should occur after too many instructions
<vincenz> b) no system-functions may be called
<Submarine> you mean, it would input arbitrary source code and run it?
<vincenz> yup
<vincenz> ircbot; (fun x -> x+1) 2;;
<Submarine> well, you have to take the ocaml interpreter and restrict the directory where it looks for .cmi files, and prevent the use of #load, #use etc...
<Submarine> Note that this prevents you from distributing binaries of your bot.
<vincenz> Hmm
<vincenz> Either way...I can't just use the interpreter
<vincenz> the bot will be written in ocaml
<Smerdyakov> I predict OCaml is on the way out due to bad licensing and intellectual control limitations!
* vincenz scrathes his head
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<Submarine> You cannot make an interpreter based on OCaml.
<vincenz> damn
<maml> Smerdyakov, i don't understand why
<Smerdyakov> As I understand it, OCaml development is legally in the hands of INRIA.
<Smerdyakov> If they lose funding or interest, OCaml is done.
<Smerdyakov> ... which has already happened with SML/NJ.
<maml> can't they change the licence in such case ?
<Smerdyakov> INRIA probably restricts what they can do.
<Submarine> It's more complex than that.
<Submarine> Ever heard of Moscow ML?
<Smerdyakov> Yes
<Submarine> Well, Leroy and others felt short-changed after the Moscow ML people took Caml Light, changed the input syntax etc... and made a sub-SML interpreter.
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<Smerdyakov> Does your story go on?
<Submarine> Well, Leroy felt pissed off.
<Submarine> They don't want such thing to happen again.
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<wolfman8k> Aren't the OCaml tools Free Software?
<mfurr> wolfman8k: yes. they are just trolling
<wolfman8k> ok thanks
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<Submarine> Well, the compiler is not free software according to some definitions. At least it was not so some while ago.
<Submarine> Now the license has changed, I see.
<mfurr> there was some issues with the bignum library until recently, and that should be resolved/replaced in the next release
<maml> i have just made a pong game in o'caml via tcp, can someone play with me in order to test it ?
* maml has no friend
<Lemmih> Sure
<maml> libsdl-ocaml is required
<Lemmih> ok
<maml> one player is the "server" and the other is the client. the server just run "pong" and the client "pong <addr>"
<maml> lol
<vincenz> sounds like fun
<maml> 8 1 he's pretty good
<maml> there's lag
<maml> who's playing with me ?
<maml> :)
<Lemmih> It's kinda cool.
<maml> lol, it's too slow :)
<maml> do you have sound ?
<Lemmih> I'm uploading about 70k/s... so I'm probably not the best tester (-:
<Lemmih> yeah.
<maml> :)
<maml> there is options :)
<Lemmih> whoa.
<Lemmih> hehheh
<maml> :)
<maml> for option clients and server have to have the sames
<Lemmih> Hmm... Setting pad length to 200 wasn't giving the desired effect.
<Lemmih> oh
<maml> if you are the server it's work
<maml> *it works*, sorry
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<Axioplase> ++
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