<Regenaxer>
Too bad! I now learned that Briar messenger will have no way to export (backup) contacts. This is a killall criterion for me, and I was waiting for it. I give up hope for a truely privacy-protecting messenger
<Regenaxer>
aw-, are you in Japan around end of June? I will be in Sapporo
<beneroth>
Huhu Regenaxer
<beneroth>
Regenaxer, why not? Is it a clan-like "we will never implement this for #reason" situation?
<beneroth>
Regenaxer, I programmed my first ever closure using (job). And I also made use of (curry). good and nice functions, useful!
<Regenaxer>
Hi beneroth!
<Regenaxer>
good :)
<Regenaxer>
Well, seems indeed difficult. They use some session keys with forward security
<Regenaxer>
I'm really disappointed. Was hoping for Briar to become the optimal communication medium
<Regenaxer>
Wife and daughters use(d) it already with me
<beneroth>
How do you come to the conclusion that "Briar messenger will have no way to export (backup) contacts" ?
<beneroth>
The issue you linked is still open, not closed?
<beneroth>
Also there is a workaround described in the thread. Which is considered insecure because it can make it visible that you have Briar in use - but that is probably not an issue for your use cases (unlike e.g. using Briar in jurisdictions which restrict/forbid cryp messengers)
<beneroth>
That workaround seems to work at the moment.
<Regenaxer>
yes, simply copying the home directory
<Regenaxer>
But only to copy the whole DB to some other device, and never use it on the old device again
<beneroth>
that is because of the privacy issue
<beneroth>
I didn't read it as "gives technical issues"
<Regenaxer>
What I want is some export to a local file, so I can backup that. Not moving to another device
<beneroth>
ah I see
<Regenaxer>
I asked in twitter
<beneroth>
you cannot reuse an old backup, because all transfer keys changed by the time you restore and will be invalid
<Regenaxer>
The answer was like it is not intended to implement
<Regenaxer>
only a new feature to establish *new* contacts more easily
<beneroth>
so no way around an additional protocol to re-negotiate new keys.
<beneroth>
lol
<beneroth>
wut?
<Regenaxer>
yes
<Regenaxer>
atm you must meet in person
<Regenaxer>
in the future some other way to establish the contact
<beneroth>
so.. their devs devices have never a failing harddisk?
<Regenaxer>
haha, yes
<Regenaxer>
and never buy a new one
<beneroth>
when the fs is broken, no migration
<beneroth>
well I'm the guy with the 2011 phone still in use, but...
<Regenaxer>
right. then I have 100 contacts and must make all new
<beneroth>
right
<beneroth>
haha
<beneroth>
the devs themselves don't believe you will ever find 100 people using it too :D
<Regenaxer>
yeah, perhaps
<Regenaxer>
I think they see more typically an on-the-fly use
<Regenaxer>
like establish connections in a catastrophe with bluetooth
<beneroth>
we should just pay tankf33der to do a proper practical usable crypto messenger
<Regenaxer>
good idea
<beneroth>
bluetooth is a catastrophe afaik
<Regenaxer>
The other flop was bitmessage
<tankf33der>
no way. :)
<Regenaxer>
hi tankf33der!
<tankf33der>
o/
<beneroth>
\o
<tankf33der>
i use threema
<beneroth>
yeah threema is ok.
<Regenaxer>
well, it needs a central server, right?
<beneroth>
though Swiss privacy laws are also deteriorating
<Regenaxer>
I want a true peer-to-peer
<beneroth>
that requires peers :P
<Regenaxer>
yes, heard that
<beneroth>
but threema is all end-to-end, so they should not have any useful data really
<Regenaxer>
not messages, but contacts
<Regenaxer>
Like WhatsApp
<Regenaxer>
end-to-end hopefully ;)
<beneroth>
whatsapp needs to be leaved asap.
<Regenaxer>
but Facebook gets rich with it
<Regenaxer>
yes
<tankf33der>
no contacts too
<tankf33der>
IIRC
<Regenaxer>
I want *no* other party in between
<beneroth>
well they transfer contacts, and they plan to introduce psycho-exploits (ads) soon. but thats separate from end-to-end, granted.
<beneroth>
T
<Regenaxer>
Bitmessage was good in theory, but does not scale
<beneroth>
So they also have some interest to keep it going and protected in the long run, I believe.
<beneroth>
And Switzerland is not part of 5 eyes, and also not really a loyal US-vassal, at least not as much as .e.g Germany or Sweden. So there is some hope that the stuff remains secure for longer :)
<beneroth>
and most secure identification is also meeting in person with Threema, though you can also get it contact otherwise (contact gets differently flagged for different secured identification)
<Regenaxer>
Who is the "owner" of Threema? They write "privately owned" - well, that's WhatsApp too
<beneroth>
so its basically 3 private people, not additional companies, and its a public company, so hostile takeover is impossible
<beneroth>
its not a public company
<beneroth>
I forgot the not
<beneroth>
and the 3 guys are also the company leadership.
<beneroth>
so basically the same situation as with your or my company
<Regenaxer>
T
<beneroth>
This doesn't rule out that they (or one of them) is malicious or never turns malicious, but I think it's a more trust-able organisation than a company which is on the stock market or one where leadership and owners are different and have different incentives.
<Regenaxer>
Very true
<beneroth>
the current surveillance law in Switzerland as an exemption clause for smaller companies.
<beneroth>
because they got exempted.
<beneroth>
s/because/maybe
<beneroth>
(company needs to apply for it)
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<freemint>
I will spend the next hours with PicoLisp
<freemint>
Regenaxer, would you be interested in having another socratic dialog? If not i find some project to work on.