<kentonv>
note that if it asks you for a credit card, you can enter 4242 4242 4242 4242 (fake test card)
<ocdtrekkie>
I instinctively thought for uninstall 'right click doesn't work, maybe I can drag it somewhere?'
<geofft>
I know at least one person whose preferred pronoun is "it", and does not self-identify as a robot
<geofft>
I appreciate the intent / levity but idk if it's doing what you want it to do?
<dwrensha>
zarvox: yeah, it seems bad if a grain does something like setPath("/../../shared/<link-to-my-evil-grain-that-looks-like-your-grain>")
<dwrensha>
+1 on refining our pronouns thing
<dwrensha>
I know people who would choose "they/them" but would be somewhat unhappy with labeling that as "ambiguous"
<XgF>
The hide sidebar button is not obvious
<kentonv>
dwrensha: would "unspecified" be better for "they"?
<kentonv>
XgF: indeed, that's on the todo list
<XgF>
Actually I'd expect the top left icon to be the home button
<kentonv>
yeah though there isn't really a "home" anymore (it redirects to "open")
<zarvox>
XgF: yeah, I intend to add little triangles to make it slightly more obvious that's the show/hide
<dwrensha>
kentonv: Likely not. It still sounds like your insisting that they instrinsically must have a gender.
<dwrensha>
kentonv: "neutral" might be okay
<kentonv>
dwrensha: can you ask your friend what word they would like?
<zarvox>
Do we need the parentheticals at all?
<kentonv>
I guess not
<dwrensha>
+1 on no parentheticals
<XgF>
I feel like you need a hamburger distinct from the Sandstorm logo :P
<kentonv>
I'm sad about removing "robot". I'm somewhat surprised to hear some people actually want to be called "it", though that's of course their choice.
<geofft>
dropping parentheticals seems fine. (also my reading of "robot" is "this is what you click to create a bot account")
<kentonv>
geofft: that's exactly what I intended
<geofft>
oh.
<geofft>
hrm.
<geofft>
can you split that out UI-wise into a checkbox that disables the pronoun dropdown entirely?
<geofft>
I'm pretty sure "it" as a preferred pronoun is way rarer than many others that aren't already on the list, but _if it's on the list_ it feels like a human pronoun choice.
<kentonv>
we are totally bikeshedding here
<geofft>
yeah sorry :)
<geofft>
what else should I be poking at / giving feedback about? things seem to work.
<geofft>
UI feedback, or just look for brokenness?
<kentonv>
primarily look for brokenness. But UI feedback is nice too.
<geofft>
oh cute, each roundcube grain is its own, new email address?
<aldeka>
I'm surprised that going to the app store means opening a new window/tab.
<aldeka>
Which then is immediately closed once I pick one.
<aldeka>
I guess that whole transition could be less jerky. For instance, if I pick an app whose logo doesn't stand out much, I don't see it when I come back to the apps screen at first.
isd has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<aldeka>
If it were highlighted, then I'd have come context to help me figure out what just happened.
<kentonv>
aldeka: Well, we can't browse the current tab because you might have things open.
<kentonv>
but yes, we need something better when you return to direct you to the new app
<kentonv>
aldeka: try opening some grains, then do it. :)
<geofft>
if I'm running mosh from the Chrome app store, and Chrome proper has a JS text input box open, alt-tab from Mosh renders the input box but not the rest of the browser window
<kentonv>
geofft: ah, not sandstorm-related?
<geofft>
no, other than you're the only people who seem to use JS input boxes :)
<aldeka>
I like the look of the sidebar. It's not immediately obvious what "Open..." means.
<kentonv>
what's a "JS text input box"?
<kentonv>
oh you mean window.prompt()?
<kentonv>
yeah we need to get rid of that
<geofft>
yeah that.
<aldeka>
I would think the "open" grains would be the ones that are listed in the sidebar. If I close one there, though, it still appears under "Open...".
<aldeka>
So it's more like "Instantiated", I guess?
<kentonv>
aldeka: It's meant as a verb, not an adjective... you click there to open a grain.
<aldeka>
Oh. I read it in the same word type as "New..." :P
<kentonv>
I guess it's like the "file" menu usually has "open" and "new"...
* aldeka
nods
<zarvox>
We also considered naming the navbar items "Grains" and "Apps", but the verbs seemed more action-driven
<aldeka>
Usually that menu doesn't have your already-open things adjacent/within it.
<aldeka>
Might help to have a "Current" header or something between the tabs and the list of grains?
<aldeka>
Or some other sort of separation.
<zarvox>
Textual, or do you think a thicker horizontal rule between the items is sufficient?
<aldeka>
Try a rule first, it takes up less space.
<geofft>
hm, the "Autosave in progress, changes may be lost" alert from a backup (IPython Notebook) made me go "what"
<aldeka>
See if anybody else has that issue after. :)
<aldeka>
Hm, how do I rename a grain...
<geofft>
I have no idea whether to click "Stay on this page" or "Leave this page"! also what's an autosave also what changes also why don't you just wait for the autosave to not be in progress
<aldeka>
I first tried clicking on it in the list of open (except that word is taken, hm. open on this machine?) grains, but that didn't do anything. I eventually found the dialog from clicking the title in the top bar.
<kentonv>
geofft: that sounds like something ipython is doing, not something sandstorm is doing.
<geofft>
hrrm, I can't log in to an existing GitHub account associated with geofft@ldpreload.com via an email token for geofft@ldpreload.com, it wants to create a new account
<zarvox>
Hmm. It's tricky to have the navbar be both a click target for switching between grains and also be editable. I guess you could try the show-pencil-on-hover thing there?
<zarvox>
geofft: yeah, we don't have account merging implemented yet
<kentonv>
geofft: yeah we don't have merging of identity sources yet
<aldeka>
I'm not sure what I expected to happen when I clicked the Sandstorm logo, but it changed on hover so I tried it. Definitely didn't expect that to hide the left bar!
<kentonv>
jinx
<aldeka>
It doesn't appear to have any association with the left bar at all. Might help if the logo area were the same width as the left bar?
<aldeka>
Or a little rotating caret.
<zarvox>
Carets are my current work-in-progress!
<aldeka>
:)
<aldeka>
zarvox: Pencils are a useful contextual clue. :)
<geofft>
can I send my grains to other people?
<zarvox>
you can share them! with that share button!
<aldeka>
It'd be cool if all the actions I can do to grains (delete, restart, get debug log, etc) were accessible from the Open... screen.
<geofft>
oh I didn't see the share button because it was colored
<geofft>
or... something.
<aldeka>
Right now the Open... screen doesn't let me do much.
<geofft>
hm, if I create a shareable link and I click something and it goes away, I can't get the link back
<geofft>
I can only delete it and make a new one
<aldeka>
I don't know how I feel about the icon being light grey but the text being white, in the Share button.
<geofft>
wah
<kentonv>
the share button is going to change styles soon-ish, but not before this launches
<geofft>
there's a two-people icon that disappears
<kentonv>
I agree the "open" tab should have more controls
<kentonv>
geofft: yeah we should probably hang the "who has access" window off the share button rather than have a transient icon
<kentonv>
geofft: it's intended that you can only create new links -- the links are not stored on the server, we literally are unable to present it to you again. :)
<kentonv>
geofft: but we are going to add some UI that lets you "get the link again" but actually gives you a new one. No one will notice.
<geofft>
haha
<aldeka>
hah, nice :)
<kentonv>
geofft: we call that UI "the asheesh button"
<geofft>
maybe make it harder for it to disappear, would also solve my problme
<aldeka>
also why does the account dropdown have a big close x, when clicking my name again will also close the dialog?
<kentonv>
aldeka: yeah, we're going to add icons in the empty space eventually...
<zarvox>
aldeka: do you want that dropdown to be totally aligned right, or have the options align with the "Account" text, or both, or?
<kentonv>
aldeka: in fact clicking anywhere outside the window closes it, but not everyone realizes that
<zarvox>
the big close X is present because we're reusing the code from the other popups :P
<aldeka>
heh :)
<aldeka>
zarvox: I would prefer totally aligned right, so that it's actually clearly underneath the thing it's opening from. It can be wider than my name if need be, but it should align on a side.
<geofft>
... I think I got multiple "Notebook has changed since we opened it. Overwrite the changed file?" popups from IPython Notebook
<geofft>
in that I had to click like five times, and the background got progressively less greyed out (it started at almost black)
<kentonv>
geofft: do you have multiple ipython grains open? Or is this all just from one?
<XgF>
Hmm, as a hint of association between the hamburger/whatever for the sidebar, should the button's background colour match the top bar when closed and the sidebar when open?
<aldeka>
The space for icons makes sense. Having an "Account" header is a little weird (though explained by it being a reused component) -- I only expect headers in dropdowns when there's more than one category of stuff in them
<geofft>
I had multiple windows open to the same grain. possibly multiple grains too.
<geofft>
ok I can't get anything to break and also this is such a ridiculously easy way of installing all this software
<geofft>
y'all win
<aldeka>
lol
<geofft>
ghost has no icon I think?
<aldeka>
'; DROP TABLE GRAINS;
<jparyani>
geofft: ya that's a known problem with IPython Notebook. I didn't realize autosave would constantly create the popups, but it's trying to prevent overwriting someone elses changes
<geofft>
oh there it is, it wasn't loading properly.
<aldeka>
(the 'no notifications' message, the search bar is kind of crowded and the magnifying glass isn't vertically centered)
<kentonv>
geofft: :D
<jadewang>
^_^
<aldeka>
My list of grains in "Open..." keeps reordering itself.
<zarvox>
aldeka: what should it say when there are no notifcations? just remove the ellipsis?
<aldeka>
I'm not doing anything to my grains, so this is a little confusing to notice.
<geofft>
er
<aldeka>
zarvox: The text is fine, though the ellipsis seems not needed. It's the left and bottom padding/alignment
<geofft>
Ghost seems to want to link me to this-will-be-replaced-by-sandstorm.com
<aldeka>
"No notifications..... FOR NOW"
<zarvox>
aldeka: oh, that's probably the keepalives marking the sessions as last-used
<geofft>
"Update failed. There was an error saving this post: The server returned an error (Server was not available)."
<geofft>
if I try uploading an image to Ghost it goes "Something went wrong :("
<kentonv>
aldeka: the reordering is because the grains are running and their "last active" keeps updating... we should solve that somehow though I'm not sure how exactly. :)
<geofft>
ok my Ghost is unhappy and idk what I did.
<aldeka>
geofft: :(
<aldeka>
kentonv: :)
<dwrensha>
kentonv: looks like I need to add some new libseccomp symlinks. Working on it...
<aldeka>
I really really want to be able to delete grains from Open.... Right now I have to re-open this silly unused grain to delete it and that's just silly. :)
<jparyani>
geofft: can you pastebin your debug log somewhere?