<asheesh>
Maybe we should make this be a sandstorm.conf setting, so that those who love seeing those reports can see them, and if not, then OK.
<zarvox>
nah, just enable it all the time for dev packages, and not for non-dev packages
<asheesh>
I feel like we should only do that once we are committed to turning the warnings into errors.
<asheesh>
Rather, once we have a timeline for that.
<asheesh>
Otherwise we're going to be annoying people who don't love to be annoyed, in addition to those who do love to be annoyed.
<asheesh>
(annoying them for no particularly solid reason, since who knows when we'll turn enforcement on)
<zarvox>
Not sure I agree with that - the sooner we teach app devs not to do that, the less breakage we/they have to deal with later
<zarvox>
then again, maybe I see the CSP sandbox as closer than you do
<asheesh>
In that case, just commit to a timeframe and you'd satisfy my concern! : P
<asheesh>
I have used so many things that were "deprecated" and never removed.
<zarvox>
The enforcement part is trivial; I've already written the code half a year ago. It's the gently-easing-packages-into-it part that takes all the work.
<asheesh>
I would hate for us to give other people the feeling that the warnings were similar.
<zarvox>
Fair enough.
<asheesh>
I know that it will be "easy", I just don't think other people will believe us. (-:
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<ocdtrekkie>
zarvox: I like the idea of using that on dev packages. Even if we don't have a hard time for disabling outside sources, it should be considered somewhat a no-no to do it now.
<ocdtrekkie>
I try to make a point when reviewing packages on the mailing list of checking for those sorts of things.
<ocdtrekkie>
Because good Sandstorm package files should not break at indeterminate points in the future because some CDN got replaced or went offline.
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<guiniol>
asheesh: did you make any progress on the "getting a shell inside the grain" front? I forgot to subscribe to the ML and can't find an archive ^^
<guiniol>
on the other hand, if you haven't made the announcement yet, I am now subscribed
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<asheesh>
I think that this will get merged in some form very similar to this form, once zarvox reviews it; until then, you can use it so long as you set this VAGRANT_SPK_EXPERIMENTAL=Y env var for vagrant-spk.
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<asheesh>
guiniol: Let me know if that works for you. I'll be AFK for a while, but I'll read scrollback here.
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<guiniol>
asheesh: I'm trying the enter-grain functionnality. It seems to be missing a lot of things for now. I can't do 'ps' for example because /proc is not mounted, which means I have no idea if the process I want to check is running ^^
<guiniol>
btw, if I use postgresql, does that mean the data will be shared between grains?
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<dwrensha>
guiniol: you can do `ps` outside of the grain
<dwrensha>
like, `vagrant-spk vm ssh` then `ps`
<dwrensha>
guiniol: each grain will have its own separate postgres instance
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<guiniol>
dwrensha: that's what I did afterwards ^^ I can't figure out what's wrong because I don't know where to find the logs. is the stdout/stderr of the launcher.sh redirected somewhere?
<guiniol>
and thanks for the info on postgres. This part should work ok then
<guiniol>
asheesh: I have absolutely nothing in the "show debug log" in the UI... I must be doing something wrong
<asheesh>
Interesting.
<asheesh>
Not even this? "** SANDSTORM SUPERVISOR: Grain still in use; staying up for now."
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<asheesh>
I wonder if it would it help if I made a video, guiniol.
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<guiniol>
asheesh: I have this message, yes, but nothing from the application
<guiniol>
tbh, I usually prefer text tutorials
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<asheesh>
guiniol: It's normal for there to be nothing there for some apps, but if you are sure you're writing something to stderr then by jove it should be there.
<guiniol>
I'm not sure of anything
<asheesh>
Hah, OK (_:
<asheesh>
(-:
<guiniol>
but, I have stringer setup in openshift and I can do 'rhc tail' to see the apps logs, so I think that it writes logs to stdout or stderr
<cmr>
kentonv: I saw you had a discussion with Trevor Perrin on the Noise mailing list March 2015. Did you come to any conclusions?
<dwrensha>
guiniol: if you download a backup zip of the grain, the "log" file in the top level directory is your grain log
<dwrensha>
guiniol: also, you can do `vagrant-spk ssh` and then `tail -f /opt/sandstorm/var/sandstorm/grains/YOUR_GRAIN_ID/log`
<guiniol>
dwrensha: I'll try that
<asheesh>
dwrensha: Good idea or bad idea? - 'spk dev' should tail the grain logs of all grains of this app for you
<kentonv>
cmr: I'm still considering using Noise or something closely related to Noise as the basis of Cap'n Proto's encryption transport, whenever I get around to designing that. Zero-round-trip introductions remain a requirement but it seems easy to solve using a pre-shared key from the introducer.
<dwrensha>
asheesh: it does seem like a lot of people expect that behavior
<guiniol>
asheesh: that's what I expected in the first place, so good idea for me
<asheesh>
Heh : )
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<dwrensha>
asheesh: and that would definitely save me a lot of clicking when I'm debugging apps
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<dwrensha>
er, developing apps, in general
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<dwrensha>
asheesh: I don't see any reason not to do it that way, other than implementation effort
<asheesh>
Yeah, I admit I'm a little worried about the implementation effort if I were going to be the one to do it, but that sure would save me some time answering this question from people.
<dwrensha>
if there are multiple grains up, we could prefix each line with the grain ID
<dwrensha>
but even if not, I don't think it would be terribly surprising or confusing to merge the streams
<cmr>
kentonv: Neat, thanks.
<asheesh>
I also wionder if there's a safe way for me to give 'vagrant-spk enter-grain' access to /proc that doesn't result in the grain getting /proc directly. I can dig into that by experimenting with namespaces.
<guiniol>
if you're dev a new app, chances are you're only going to be running that one, no?
<guiniol>
asheesh: for /proc, I realised I could do that through vagrant ssh, so maybe it's not needed
<guiniol>
what is the partitionning tech being used? lxc?
<asheesh>
guiniol: I can add a note about that to the docs for 'vagrant-spk enter-grain', then.
<asheesh>
guiniol: re: what partioning tech: Same Linux features as docker/lxc/etc but we call them ourselves rather than having Docker/lxc call them for us.
<dwrensha>
guiniol: ^ we use the linux containerization syscalls directly
<asheesh>
what dwrensha said : )
<guiniol>
ok
<guiniol>
I think you should be able to use cgroups to only see what is in the grain's group
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<dwrensha>
when I want to see a grain's processes, I do `top` and look at the tree view
<dwrensha>
(shift-v, usually)
<dwrensha>
a grain's processes are all the children of a sandstorm supervisor
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<kentonv>
cmr: question marks need to be escaped in C/C++. (surprise!)
<kentonv>
two question marks in a row have special meaning
<kentonv>
(trigraphs)
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<cmr>
kentonv: Oh, hey, mind if I just contribute that then? :)
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<cmr>
kentonv: Oh, hey, mind if I just contribute that then? :)
<kentonv>
I imagine there will be some grumbling about how it's weird and different but sure. :)
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<chabes>
hi
<chabes>
first off wanted to say.. sandstorm is a really cool project. i'm glad to be learning about it
<kentonv>
hi!
<cmr>
kentonv: is that the lexer used for the website?
<kentonv>
cmr: yes
<kentonv>
chabes: thanks!
<chabes>
i'm currently running in to a couple issues. i'm getting some errors in the admin settings..
<chabes>
one says wildcard_host is misconfigured. i was using the default, which was *.mydomain.sandcats.io in the .conf file. not sure if theres some other settings that need to be changed as well.
<chabes>
another error i got said the server is unable to create a web socket
<chabes>
i looked at the documentation for both errors, tried to make adjustments, but the things i did seemed to break stuff, so i set things back to the original settings
<kentonv>
ughhh my internet is making IRC unusable... connections just stop with no warning
<kentonv>
lol, I can tell by refreshing botbot.me that my messages are still going up, but I'm not receiving anything
<maurer>
kentonv: Maybe mosh to one of your servers?
<maurer>
Alternatively, time to get an irc grain 8U
<kentonv>
chabes: are you able to open any apps on your server?
<kentonv>
oh look, six messages just arrived simultaneously
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<asheesh>
Howdy chabes
<asheesh>
The wildcard_host warning sometimes has false positives. I'm working this week on making it more reliable.
<asheesh>
Basically, go check if you can create a grain of some app, e.g. a new document in etherpad.
<asheesh>
If that works, great; if not, then let's debug your issue.
<asheesh>
Thanks for the kind words! I'm glad to help people learn about it.
<chabes>
so, i just recently got the login setup to work properly for the first time (i'm new at this kind of stuff) and i only have a couple apps installed
<asheesh>
Cool! Do the apps seem to work OK?
<chabes>
i had made an etherdraw grain when i first set it up, but now i cant tell if its not working or just being slow... it just tries to load forever
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<asheesh>
Oh, interesting, so maybe it is having WILDCARD_HOST related problems.
<asheesh>
On the page that shows that error, can you open your browser's Javascript console?