ChanServ changed the topic of ##yamahasynths to: Channel dedicated to questions and discussion of Yamaha FM Synthesizer internals and corresponding REing. Discussion of synthesis methods similar to the Yamaha line of chips, Sound Blasters + clones, PCM chips like RF5C68, and CD theory of operation are also on-topic. Channel logs: https://freenode.irclog.whitequark.org/~h~yamahasynths
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<whitequark> Lord_Nightmare: I have the package in my hands!! :D
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<Lord_Nightmare> YESS!
<Lord_Nightmare> also its 5:30am here and i desparately need sleep, but awesome regardless. see y'all in 8 hours or so.
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<Sarayan> mwahahaha
<Sarayan> White "Yakshaver" Quark.
<Sarayan> so very true
<whitequark> lol
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<cr1901_modern> https://twitter.com/whitequark/status/1146541661981483009 I mean, I'd rather use that than tablge- oh Jesus, I just realized what you're doing ._.
<cr1901_modern> ... eh, still rather play w/ that than tablegen :P
<whitequark> hahahahaha
<andlabs> not sure if clever
<cr1901_modern> Bad idea... random CPU generator based on that diamond inheritance pattern and see how long it takes to get a viable CPU arch
<cr1901_modern> Just choose which classes to inherit from from the OS rng (with rules)
<andlabs> the first CPU designed by machine learning
<andlabs> this is how the robot apocalypse begins
<andlabs> or how MULTIVAC begins, your choice
<cr1901_modern> (Tbh, even if they aren't viable for various reasons- not all of them within individual control- I do like it when ppl design their own CPU archs for fun)
<cr1901_modern> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multivac Oh, here I thought it was a real computer
<cr1901_modern> Bad idea II... create a viable compiler from the first randomly generated CPU arch you get as output from bad idea #1
<cr1901_modern> https://twitter.com/MobyGamer/status/1141519871542513665 Also, because I love all you, and I shouldn't be the only one called out
<kode54> yuck
<cr1901_modern> kode54: Which part :P?
<kode54> the image
<whitequark> cr1901_modern: so here's the thing
<whitequark> the boneless ISA is so dense that almost anything you can get out of it will be just boneless
<whitequark> like, you could get some permutation of ALU opcodes
<whitequark> some really useless instructions, maybe
<cr1901_modern> CPU ISA madlibs
<cr1901_modern> I was indeed thinking useless or overly long/complex instructions. Since boneless is load-store (Is it still?), there are less opportunities for that.
<andlabs> cr1901_modern: specifically the one in The Last Question, which is self-correcting
<cr1901_modern> andlabs: I thought Multivac was the sequel to univac, I mean that's logical right?
<cr1901_modern> Kinda like how Super Mario 65 is the sequel to Super Mario 64
<kode54> don't forget the sequel to Goldeneye 007, Goldeneye 008
<cr1901_modern> Ahhh yes that was a good one
<TD-Linux> for maximum hell you really need either variable length opcodes or instructions large enough to fit different sizes of immediates
<cr1901_modern> The obsesson with fixed length makes me bitter for... well petty reasons.
<whitequark> cr1901_modern: boneless is load-store.
<whitequark> except the register window is in RAM anyway
<cr1901_modern> yea, still load-store for my purposes
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<andlabs> if you want a truly unusual CPU arch though
<cr1901_modern> iapx 432 or rekursive
<cr1901_modern> err rekursiv*
<cr1901_modern> Although the latter most likely does not exist anymore outside of a reference manual
<cr1901_modern> the last known physical implementation is at the bottom of River Thames due to an accident AIUI
<cr1901_modern> Never played with it myself, but AFAIK VAX is kinda weird too- some insns are legally 50 bytes long
<andlabs> nope
<andlabs> this thing
<cr1901_modern> Oh, COSMAC Elf
<cr1901_modern> and apparently it's still made
<andlabs> COSMAC... Elf?
<cr1901_modern> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COSMAC_ELF early computer kit
<andlabs> oh
<cr1901_modern> a popular variant is to put it into an altoids tin
<andlabs> it's still an entirely bizarre CPU design-wise
<andlabs> anyway I am going to head home
<cr1901_modern> be careful
<cr1901_modern> err safe*
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<cr1901_modern> Wow ._.
<ej5> also ^%$#^# 8-bit guy got an amiga genlock
<ej5> which means the prices are gonna spike on ebay for a while, until people figure out it's really boring
<cr1901_modern> I just... at this point try to ignore he and LGR exist, tbh
* cr1901_modern says while still following LGR
<cr1901_modern> The retrocomputing video market is saturated thanks to those two (and maybe Druaga1 to a lesser extent)
<cr1901_modern> I really just want a 68k machine tbh
<cr1901_modern> the cheapest machine that does what I want is probably a Mac Quadra
<cr1901_modern> of some sort
<ej5> yeah my biggest gripe is that some jackass got my adlib clone, fabbed it, but put in their dumbass logo, and sent it to LGR claiming it as their own copy
<ej5> and LGR was like "whoooh dude you totally cloned an adlib, so coooool, lol derp"
<ej5> and then i corrected him in the comments and on twitter. crickets.
<cr1901_modern> of course you end up being the bad guy if you point this out
<cr1901_modern> ej5: Honestly, my thoughts on 8bg and lgr are summed up by this thread: https://twitter.com/gravislizard/status/1114700501394776064
<ej5> i usually say something like "it's not so-and-so's clone, you can get it for free from my github repo"
<ej5> makes me feel bad for gravislizard, they do good work.
<cr1901_modern> Gravis does have a point and it's hard to not be bitter. I explicitly don't do videos b/c there's no point b/c two ppl duopolize the whole subject
<cr1901_modern> And also, some of 8bg's videos on technical topics rub me the wrong way for simplifying (like how 8 bit gfx works).
<ej5> other than bullshitting about topics, they really don't have much to offer. 8bg has his little c64 game which is cute
<cr1901_modern> But _I_ can't point that out b/c It's being PeDaNtIC
<cr1901_modern> and for aAtTeNTion
<cr1901_modern> doesn't 8bg also have a 65xx computer his fans are trying to design
<cr1901_modern> and it's going disastrously?
<cr1901_modern> (like my attempts lmao)
<ej5> yeah, what bothers me is they're basically just consumers who consumed a consumer product back in the day and are remembering (with epic nostalgia) their consumerism from 20 years ago
<ej5> but really they don't have much in terms of technical chops
<cr1901_modern> ej5: Ever see that "but I don't want to cure cancer" spiderman comic book strip?
<ej5> for every one of those guys, there are 10 ppl on twitter with like 23 followers who really, really know what they're doing
* cr1901_modern can make this comparison :D
<ej5> no but you gotta link it
<cr1901_modern> This is me, except "I want to make old computers do modern shit"
<ej5> yeah, i hear that. you might argue that people with technical chops shouldn't be wasting their time on computing dinosaurs
<ej5> and that they should be working on new cool tech that can actually help people, like purifying water or whatever.
<ej5> for me that's $dayjob. the hobby is just for sharpening my claws ;)
<cr1901_modern> I have... thoughts on modern computing, but the zero order tldr is I don't enjoy it and it's something I do b/c society requires it to function.
<whitequark> arguably many people with technical chops would be better off donating their youtube ad money to existing orgs that do water purification
<ej5> ^
<ej5> btw i was gonna call out wq as a person with technical chops but like 23 followers on twitter, but it turns out she has 13K XD
<whitequark> lol
<whitequark> i'm not entirely sure why
<ej5> you do cool interesting shit, that's why