stebalien changed the topic of #ipfs to: Heads Up: To talk, you need to register your nick! Announcements: go-ipfs 0.4.18 and js-ipfs 0.33 are out! Get them from dist.ipfs.io and npm respectively! | Also: #libp2p #ipfs-cluster #filecoin #ipfs-dev | IPFS, the InterPlanetary FileSystem: https://github.com/ipfs/ipfs | Logs: https://view.matrix.org/room/!yhqiEdqNjyPbxtUjzm:matrix.org/ | Forums: https://discuss.ipfs.io | Code of Con
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<aldenp> are there any alternative implementations to go-ipfs? aside from the javascript version and the sketchy C version?
<aldenp> also why are there so many things like chats and streaming software for IPFS; isn't that idiotic? isn't IPFS designed for *persistent* content, not for live data?
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<postables[m]> aldenp: i believe there is a WIP rust implementation. as far as chats that just leverages stuff like libp2p which is the networkign component of IPFS. As far as live streaming, and this moment it's probably impractical, but realistically IPFS can be used as just general data storage, live data is difficult to work with at this time
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<aldenp> well yeah, my understanding was that IPFS wasn't designed for live data at all; my question is why anybody is even trying to make livestreaming services on IPFS, it seems like a bad idea
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<Swedneck> the data sharing aspect would be very nice for livestreams
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<Swedneck> like how peertube makes video sharing not require beefy upload
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<postables[m]> i wouldn't say its a bad idea. At this point in time IPFS isn't very well suited for live data. One of the solutions is to use IPNS but its too slow at the moment. Furthermore, the tech that lies underneath IPFS can be extremely powerful for live-streaming
<aldenp> is it really though?
<aldenp> cuz there's nothing wrong with ipfs only doing one thing and doing it well, instead of throwing in a million extra features just because we can
<aldenp> if IPFS was only capable of distributing static content, that would be great, and a different service could be created for decentralized livestreaming
<aldenp> if the issue is that IPFS wasn't designed for it and it's only now getting lumped in, that seems like a very bad idea
<aldenp> you mentioned libp2p; perhaps someone could go off and create an entirely different service using libp2p; not everything has to be IPFS
<aldenp> idk, I don't know exactly how IPFS works under the hood, but at a glance it seems a little sketchy
<Swedneck> i don't quite think it's right to say it's not designed for it
<Swedneck> after all, once the livestream data is sent, it's static
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<Swedneck> what isn't static is the current head of the content, it's like an IPNS address being updated extremely quickly
<aldenp> the trouble is that livestream data is created on the fly and involves a lot of really small files, which isn't ideal for publishing; it would make more sense for streaming software to stream using an alternate protocol designed purely with speed in mind, and then re-encode the stream into a single video file and publish it to IPFS
<Swedneck> i think that's just a limitation of people trying to use it for livestreaming
<Swedneck> ipfs already splits files into small chunks, i see no reason it would be unable to handle livestream data if formatted correctly
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<postables[m]> that's where IPNS comes in, publish all your data under an IPNS record and you'll be able to rebuild your stream. But IPNS is slow right now so it would probably need to wait a bit before you can reasonably implement streaming via ipfs
<Swedneck> couldn't direct pubsub be used?
<postables[m]> `idk, I don't know exactly how IPFS works under the hood, but at a glance it seems a little sketchy` i don't see how its sketchy 🤷 IPFS is a big and complex beast in some aspects, but its awesome
<postables[m]> swedneck: actually yea it probably could be used 🤔
<aldenp> I mean splitting things up into small pieces is space inefficient because you end up with a lot of duplicate headers & such, so unless IPFS is splitting things up into 10 byte pieces lol...
<TimMc> AIUI, streaming is generally accomplished by streaming a text-based manifest file that points to successive chunks of the stream data. IPFS can no doubt handle the chunks, but you can't content-address the streaming manifest.
<aldenp> streams use more bandwidth and computer power to play back than a properly encoded file
<aldenp> idk, I don't watch a lot of livestreams, but it depends on the usual usage; if users are frequently seeking back in the video, then maybe IPFS makes sense; however, if users are almost entirely just watching it live, it would be more efficient to just directly transport the video as it comes in to viewers, and upload a re-encoded video file to IPFS after the stream for the future people
<TimMc> You could certainly stream a list of IPFS addresses, though, and I bet there's a way to use IPNS differently to say "yes, this is the authoritative stream".
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<postables[m]> `I mean splitting things up into small pieces is space inefficient because you end up with a lot of duplicate headers & such, so unless IPFS is splitting things up into 10 byte pieces lol...` by default its 256KB chunks, i would really recommend that you read about IPFS in depth, it's extremely easy to misjudge technology without understanding the fundamentals of it
<postables[m]> nor can one even reach a valid conclusion about something without understanding it
<postables[m]> *edit:* ~~nor can one even reach a valid conclusion about something without understanding it~~ -> nor can one even reach a valid conclusion about something without understanding it. You can als configure chunking parameters yourself, although it will result in different hashes
<postables[m]> IPFS is extremely flexible, and very modular. So if hte default implementation doesn't work, there's probably a way you can make changes to various pieces of the puzzle to do what you want
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<TimMc> The more relevant question is what chunk size you *want* in the stream.
<TimMc> For streaming video, 256 kB seems fine as a chunk size.
<TimMc> Bad idea: Use dnslink with a short TTL.
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<TimMc> Is there a standard interface that pinning services speak? Or plans for one?
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<postables[m]> what do you mean by that? im not really sure what standard interface they would need to satisfy
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<TimMc> On second thought, I'm not really sure either. :-/
<postables[m]> I mean as long as you just provide access to IPFS through a pinning service it should be fine right? I run a pinning service, and while im not necessarily opposed to the idea of a standard interface, I'm unsure as to the benefits. Although I suppose a set of standard "methods" that can be used would be nice to have for building out applications on other platforms like ethereum which would use IPFS
<postables[m]> although for that you might just be better off having a smart contract with a standard interface (ie, `Pin` `PubSub`) which is listened to by an IPFS pinning service
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<TimMc> That makes sense.
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<stebalien> Dear bikeshed: What would you name a flag that means "please auto-upgrade CIDv0 CIDs to CIDv1 CIDs in output so that they can be properly formatted using multibase". Current contenders are things like `--force-multibase-output`, `--force-multibase-cids`, `--upgrade-cids`, `--upgrade-cids-in-output`, `--force-upgrade-v0-cids-to-v1-in-output`, `--output-cidv1`, `--force-upgrade-cidv0-in-output`, ...
<stebalien> Sticking points: This only applies to output, this only applies to CIDs.
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<postables[m]> has there been any investigation into embedding a tensorflow graph into an IPLD object?
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<ylp> does any one tried to run ipfs on a Exynos5422 cpu ?
<ylp> I guess it should work since it's an ARM but if someone has a first hand experience let me know
<r0kk3rz> ive run it on snapdragon arm processors
<r0kk3rz> worth a shot on exynos
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<lidel> stebalien, I'd go with `--upgrade-cids-in-output` or `--normalize-cids-in-output`
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<aarshkshah1992> Hi guys, I see we have a js API for using IPLD as seen in the examples here
<aarshkshah1992> Is there a Golang equivalent for this API ?
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<Magik6k> aarshkshah1992: there is https://github.com/ipfs/go-ipfs-api/blob/master/dag.go#L19 which sort of works (a new http client is being created in https://github.com/ipfs/go-ipfs-http-client, but it will likely take some time before it's fully usable)
<aarshkshah1992> Magik6k So when I run 'ipfs dag put blah', is that the code getting hit ?
<aarshkshah1992> Also, do the eth/git IPLD go implementations use the same command ?
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<aarshkshah1992> I mean when I run 'ipfs dag put blah' in my shell.
<Magik6k> No, It's the client side. The request goes to https://github.com/ipfs/go-ipfs/blob/master/core/commands/dag/dag.go#L66 on the daemon side
<Magik6k> eth/git/etc use this too
<Magik6k> (this is where git plugin hooks into the system - https://github.com/ipfs/go-ipfs/blob/master/plugin/plugins/git/git.go#L40)
<aarshkshah1992> I see what you mean. So the go-ipfs implementation depends on `go-ipld-git,eth etc etc`.
<aarshkshah1992> If I want to write a piece of code to put some 'Git' blocks into IPFS, can I do that by using `go-ipfs` as a library
<aarshkshah1992> Or do I 'have' to go via the go-ipfs-api that you shared ?
<aarshkshah1992> If you know what I mean
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<Magik6k> You don't have to use go-ipfs-api, there are a few different ways to do this (although, I'd say using go-ipfs-api is the recommended one for now). If you have access to 'raw' git blocks you should use `ipfs block put`
<Magik6k> Using go-ipfs as a library is fairly hard now, so I wouldn't go that route
<Magik6k> To give some example of putting git blocks, have a look at https://github.com/ipfs-shipyard/git-remote-ipld/blob/master/core/push.go#L152 (`api` is instance of go-ipfs-api)
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<aldenp> when I use `ipfs pin add` to pin a directory, does it try to download everything in that dir before the command exits? (pinning a 200GB dir right now and I don't really want to download 200GB on my crappy internet connection atm)
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<pedrohlc> I'm in a network where DHT is blocked (doesn't work at least for torrents), should ipfs work?
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