aschmahmann changed the topic of #ipfs to: Heads Up: To talk, you need to register your nick! Announcements: go-ipfs 0.7.0 and js-ipfs 0.52.3 are out! Get them from dist.ipfs.io and npm respectively! | Also: #libp2p #ipfs-cluster #filecoin #ipfs-dev | IPFS: https://github.com/ipfs/ipfs | Logs: https://view.matrix.org/room/!yhqiEdqNjyPbxtUjzm:matrix.org/ | Forums: https://discuss.ipfs.io | Code of Conduct: https://git.io/vVBS0
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<McSinyx[m]>
we'll be able to keep the server running for around an extra month, so if anyone wants to have a file <16MB pinned, upload it as a project's report/slides, e.g.
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<ErichSpaker[m]>
Anyone have thoughts on whether ipfs or matrix would be more appropriate for building a todo list/notes app?
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<dietrich[m]>
lidel: is subdomain gateway a configuration option? are there docs to set it up or is on by default?
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<Evanito[m]>
Erich Spaker: I can see orbitDB being used for that
<Evanito[m]>
<dietrich[m] "lidel: is subdomain gateway a co"> Should be on by default in recent go-IPFS/IPFS Companion versions. I *think* it's a companion feature
<ErichSpaker[m]>
It seems to me that ipfs isn't well suited to lots of small bits of information, changed frequently
<Discordian[m]>
I believe it's default in companion, yeah.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
But the existence of things like orbitDB means maybe I'm wrong about that.
<Discordian[m]>
* I believe it's default in companion, yeah. Well companion redirects to the subdomain, go-ipfs hosts/handles it.
<swedneck>
<ErichSpaker[m] "Anyone have thoughts on whether "> it's most likely way easier to do so on matrix, however you do have to rely on servers which might be unacceptable depending on the use case
<Discordian[m]>
Yeah I find that question kind of hard to answer, really depends on your goals.
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<ErichSpaker[m]>
There are plans to eliminate need for a true server in matrix.
<swedneck>
with ipfs things will mostly be offline-first, with online capability mostly coming for free
<swedneck>
with matrix it's more online-first, and if you want it to work offline you need to add extra code
<swedneck>
also i should specify that it's more libp2p you'd use, not ipfs
<Discordian[m]>
Efforts are being made on the p2p front in Matrix
<swedneck>
maybe some day this question won't exist since matrix and ipfs will fuse
<Discordian[m]>
There's still a lot of work to do though.
<swedneck>
dreamy sigh
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Interoperability would be nice
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Edit: could be nice
<Discordian[m]>
Believe for p2p to really be usable on Matrix they first need to decouple user accounts from homeservers, which hasn't been done yet.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Yah, they plan to
<ErichSpaker[m]>
But they are focused on spaces right now
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Maybe they should shift some effort though, since matrix.org is seems to be getting bogged down
<Discordian[m]>
Neil is working on all sorts of things, including some p2p work IIRC with Dendrite.
<swedneck>
at least the current p2p stuff is using libp2p to some extent
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Clearly I need to read up on libp2p
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I've just been thinking of it as the ipfs special sauce
<Discordian[m]>
Personally if I were to make such an app, I'd use IPFS/libp2p.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I suppose I could use both actually.
<Discordian[m]>
You can use libp2p more-or-less right through the go-ipfs daemon, looks easy to use/setup.
<swedneck>
basically if you want to do p2p stuff, but not just dealing with files, then you want libp2p
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I think the issue is that my data is a graph, but normally represented as a file
<ErichSpaker[m]>
So the question is at what layer of abstraction to do the syncing
<swedneck>
if you just need to sync a file you may want syncthing
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Of course it could be both.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Syncthing has been recommended to me, but it's not quite right
<Discordian[m]>
It only syncs one-way but if you want to be able to update a file and have it (basically) available anywhere you could use ipfs-sync.
<swedneck>
👍️ just throwing it out there so you don't end up duplicating work if it hadn't been needed
<swedneck>
though it certainly would be nice to have syncthing but using ipfs
<Discordian[m]>
I added it to the v1.0.0 milestone, so now I have to do it lol
<lidel>
<dietrich[m] "lidel: is subdomain gateway a co"> Yes, it is built-in feature of go-ipfs. Enabled by default on `localhost`, but you can add more hostnames if you want to run a public one etc.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Does ipfs have a concept of directories and or sub-files?
<swedneck>
depends how you mean
<Discordian[m]>
Sorta, there's MFS, and you can see what files something links to (like a directory) with `ipfs refs -u <CID>`. There might be easier options, but idk them yet.
<swedneck>
it can represent data as directoriesm but it's just an abstraction ontop of raw blocks
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<Discordian[m]>
<ErichSpaker[m] "Does ipfs have a concept of dire"> If it helps you understand, my website is hosted over IPFS, http://portal.thedisco.zone
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I approve of that hostname
<Discordian[m]>
Haha thank you
<Discordian[m]>
jan Swedneck: curious, would bi-directional sync support be a major feature you think people would want? Maybe I should prioritise that.
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<swedneck>
if it works like syncthing, yes
<Discordian[m]>
Syncthing just like, you point it to a dir on 2 computers, and they end up being the same?
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I think that's the use case most people use for sync
<swedneck>
well it's a lot of things that make it good
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Otherwise I'd just rsync
<swedneck>
most importantly no device is a master, it's fully redundant
<Discordian[m]>
Yeah that's what I was thinking too
<swedneck>
if you have any 2 devices that can reach each other, they can send/recieve files
<swedneck>
UI is also pretty important
<Discordian[m]>
Ah I see their UI, I have an issue opened for one
<Discordian[m]>
Looks like I'm making effectively syncthing for IPFS
<Discordian[m]>
I'll also support encrypting files before they go onto IPFS as an optional feature too.
<swedneck>
really just straight up porting syncthing to ipfs would be good IMO
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I think building things on standard protocols is normally a good idea
<ErichSpaker[m]>
That's why I'd rather build my notes app on straight ipfs or matrix
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Rather than sync thing
<swedneck>
yeah, i really kind of hate the trend of every single damn project making its own protocol
<swedneck>
lbry is a big offender, both torrent and ipfs exist, but noooooo
<Discordian[m]>
<swedneck "really just straight up porting "> Seems like a good idea 🤔, I wonder what kind of work would be involved.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Related, I like graphql for this reason
<ErichSpaker[m]>
It's a self describing api
<Discordian[m]>
I mean in theory you could also just use syncthing along side ipfs-sync I guess, toggling features as wanted/needed.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Which means if you have to make a custom interface, at least it's defined
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Graphql's implementation is a little wonky though
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I dislike that json scheme are not define in json
<ErichSpaker[m]>
* I dislike that requests/json scheme are not define in json
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Like, just, why
<ErichSpaker[m]>
* Like, just, why?
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<ErichSpaker[m]>
Json is the universal format
<swedneck>
i imagine the reason is jumpcuts to the clip of steve ballmer shouting DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS
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<ErichSpaker[m]>
I wish the suckless guys would get involved with all this web3 stuff
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Their pedantic influence would do the protocols good
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Idk Maybe some are it's not like I know them
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<ErichSpaker[m]>
Okay, i've determined that what I actually want to do is make a library that abstracts the graph storage and sync.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
And then you can integrate it with whatever cloud solution you want
<ErichSpaker[m]>
It would do the file to graph, graph to file stuff, and if it is two way then sync should be possible at the graph or file level
<ErichSpaker[m]>
Then I can have one lib that I integrate with qutebrowser, a filesystem daemon, etc.
<ErichSpaker[m]>
I bookmark something, qutebrowser knows where that goes in the graph structure, my lib knows how to convert that to a file, and negotiate with the lib running as a daemon to store the file in a configured place (say ~/bookmakr)
<ErichSpaker[m]>
then I use the lib + a matrix client lib and write something that can sync cross computer
<ErichSpaker[m]>
or write one to use ipfs, or syncthing
<ErichSpaker[m]>
it would be a generalized cloud data interface. That's actually what I want. I've been wonder for weeks whether ipfs or matrix was more general 🤦♂️
<ErichSpaker[m]>
* it would be a generalized cloud data interface. Equally suited to android app, a browser extension, or a vim pluggin. That's actually what I want. I've been wondering for weeks whether ipfs or matrix was more general 🤦♂️
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