adrien changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://caml.inria.fr/ | OCaml 4.00.1 http://bit.ly/UHeZyT | http://www.ocaml.org | Public logs at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/ocaml/
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<flux> what, ocaml trunk has record name disambiguation?
<flux> that's.. almost.. like overloading ;-)
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<darkf> js_of_ocaml doesn't seem to be compiling my modules (I have a few of them) when I use the command on their manual http://ocsigen.org/js_of_ocaml/manual/ - the resulting .js just has some caml_* stdlib functions
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<pippijn> darkf: you have a bytecode program?
<darkf> pippijn: Yes, although now I'm getting a new error - Missing primitives: caml_ml_output_char
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<pippijn> that's ok
<pippijn> darkf: you're using channel I/O
<darkf> pippijn: Yeah I kind of need printf
<pippijn> to stdout?
<pippijn> then you need to implement caml_ml_output_char in javascript
<pippijn> because js has no stdout
<darkf> pippijn: Ah, I see.
<darkf> pippijn: It only seems to be called 3 times even though it outputs ": hi\n" on the console
<darkf> pippijn: Maybe printf is broken?
<darkf> well obviously something else is broken as print_endline doesn't work either - oh well
<darkf> js_of_ocaml might be broken horribly
<darkf> is there a good alternative?
<thomasga> darkf: js_of_ocaml works very well
<thomasga> (for me at least :-) )
<Kakadu> js_of_ocaml should work well
<darkf> well, I'd love it to, but it took me 2 hours just to get this to compile and it doesn't seem to be *correct* (the ocaml interpreter works fine, but it has incorrect results in js)
<Kakadu> darkf: OCaml has hardcoded primitives in itself
<Kakadu> like %apply which applies functions
<Kakadu> or printf primitives which print lines at terminal
<Kakadu> it is obvious that you should not try to print something to terminal if you are in browser
<Kakadu> Do you call printf directly or it is called by Firebug.log (...) ?
<Kakadu> darkf: ^^
<darkf> Kakadu: Directly. But since print_endline doesn't give the correct results either I'm inclined to believe js_of_ocaml isn't compiling something right.
<Kakadu> try to do all logging via https://ocsigen.org/js_of_ocaml/api/Firebug
<Kakadu> I'm almost sure that it will help u
<thomasga> are you flushing your output channel ?
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<philed> xb
<philed> Whoops. Don't mind me.
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<chattered> Wow. Great turn-around getting stuff into OPAM.
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<bobry> is it possible to make opam track project dependencies? similar to the way cabal does it?
<bobry> i. e. read some kind of file with a list of required packages and install-update them
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<troydm> bobry: depends: ["ocamlfind"] for example
<avsm> bobry: we're working on some integration there, but not yet
<avsm> it's a bit tied to the build system to do it right (sub-libraries, tests and so on)
<troydm> ohh i was confused by question
<avsm> right now you can also just create an OPAM file and tell users to "opam install `cat OPAM`" of course
<orbitz> avsm: how easy would it be to make opam mostly a library soi can write tools to parse packages and do transformations on them?
<avsm> it already is
<avsm> the continuous build thing (dubbed "opamalot") does that, but it's not complete yet
<thomasga> (opam install opam-lib)
<orbitz> is it installed as one in opam?
<orbitz> phantastic
<avsm> yeah, opam-lib
<orbitz> tack
<orbitz> opam->nix here i come
<avsm> awesome!
<thomasga> it might be possible that all the library files are not installed properly though
<thomasga> that's sufficient to generate opam.ocamlpro.com
<thomasga> at least
<thomasga> but I think the solver API is not there
<thomasga> I'll check
<thomasga> actually everything is installed
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<orbitz> avsm, thomasga : thanks
<ousado> orbitz: generating nix packages from opam?
<orbitz> ousado: yes
<orbitz> For a large subset it should be trivial, i've done it by hand for all of core
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<ousado> yes, good thing
<ousado> though I'd feel better with nix if it wasn't written in perl+c++
<invariant> Is this the French word for bug? beugue
<invariant> ousado, it's not unreadable C++.
<thomasga> invariant: bogue
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<ousado> yes, it's also not unreadable perl
<ousado> still
<invariant> ousado, there is also the option of using Guile as a surface language.
<orbitz> must be bad C++ if they make you use beohem if you want your data cleane dup
<orbitz> Guix is still in heavy alpha
<invariant> boehm gc, you mean?
<orbitz> yes
<invariant> I also like comla.
<ousado> invariant: comla? in which context?
<invariant> ousado, ask orbitz.
<ousado> brilliant answer
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<orbitz> I odn't know what comla is
<orbitz> i assume it's a gc for C++
<orbitz> But Nix won't free memory unelss you run it in boehm
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<pippijn> Commonwealth Library Association (COMLA)
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<invariant> Are you all just playing dumb?
<invariant> It's not like it isn't entirely obvious from context what I was talking about.
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<orbitz> invariant: I have not heard of comla before
<orbitz> invariant: but good day to you too
<invariant> orbitz, try to rerrange the letters.
<invariant> rearrange*
<orbitz> invariant: k
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<pippijn> Low Water-Mark Mandatory Access Control (LOMAC)
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<tch> hi all :)
<tch> what does this operator: >>=
<tch> ?
<troydm> is it bounded?
<troydm> well it's monad related in haskell
<troydm> i'm not sure if it's the same in Ocaml
<tch> hmm
<troydm> either that or right bitwise shift
<tch> i've got sth like "Eliom_reference.set username (Some name) >>= (fun _ -> Lwt.return ("Hello "^name))
<tch> "
<Kakadu> it's monad
<Kakadu> Lwt monad
<Kakadu> bind AFAIR
<troydm> there is monads in Lwt
<troydm> never knew that
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<troydm> didn't had a chance to try Lwt out
<Kakadu> actually only one monad called lwt
<tch> huh, i don't like monads, i have never understood it
<orbitz> tch: it is actaully quote easyl. (>>=) is 'let'
<orbitz> let foo = bar () with >>= is bar () >>= fun foo -> ...
<orbitz> basically all you need to know
<tch> great, thx!
<Kakadu> orbitz: are you sure that type of foo in 1st expression is the same as in the 2nd?
<orbitz> Kakadu: I'm offering the relatinoship, the types work out to be whatever
<orbitz> the important aprt is, >>= is let
<Kakadu> okay
<adrien> # 1 >>= 2;;
<adrien> - : int = 3
<adrien> looks like addition here
<orbitz> taht doesn't look like lwt from here though
<tch> :)
<adrien> it's the brand new lwt: version 48
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<tch> anyone has ever worked with eliom and ocsigen?
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<smondet> tch: yes, a lot (and there is a #ocsigen channel)
<tch> but it's usually dead
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<tch> i installed Batteries using opam but i can't use "open Date", why?
<tch> i get Error: Unbound module Date
<thelema_> tch: batteries doesn't have a module date
<thelema_> you're looking at documentation for pre-1.0 batteries
<thelema_> which seems to have better google rank than the current docs
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<thelema_> these date functions came from the ocamlnet module; install it (or calendar) for better date functions
<tch> ok, but the same with calendar
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<thelema_> you're using the toplevel?
<thelema_> or compiling?
<tch> i think i use toplevel - i run ocaml from shell
<thelema_> #use "topfind";; #require "calendar";; open Date;;
<thelema_> basically the toplevel needs to be told where calendar was installed, and findlib's topfind code is the easiest way to do this.
<tch> Cannot find file topfind.
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<thelema_> oh yeah, with opam, there's a parameter needed to use its topfind...
<tch> :D
<thelema_> ocaml -I $OCAML_TOPLEVEL_PATH
<thelema_> yes, pretty crazy
<thelema_> you may also want to run ocaml within rlwrap, to get line editing
<tch> is it command?
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<thelema_> rlwrap ocaml -I $OCAML_TOPLEVEL_PATH
<tch> ok, i hadn't it, but i'm installing now
<thelema_> it's possible to make a very nice ocaml programming environment, but it's unnecessarily hard at the moment
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<tch> but i can't open Date still :(
<tch> # #require "calendar";;
<tch> /usr/lib/ocaml/unix.cma: loaded
<tch> /usr/lib/ocaml/str.cma: loaded
<tch> /home/tch/.opam/system/lib/calendar: added to search path
<tch> /home/tch/.opam/system/lib/calendar/calendarLib.cma: loaded
<tch> # open Date;;
<tch> Error: Unbound module Date
<thelema_> maybe Calendar.Date?
<thelema_> I forget whether calendar is packed
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<tch> hmm, i don't know, i tried a lot of possibility, but none works
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<SuperNoeMan> how can I get more expressive errors from ocaml?
<SuperNoeMan> so, when I try to do stuff with it, it usually doesn't give enough information to know just from one look what its talking about...
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<thelema_> SuperNoeMan: you'll understand the errors more after using ocaml more.
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<SuperNoeMan> well, would someone be willing to tell me why I'm getting the current error I am?
<thelema_> SuperNoeMan: paste it if it's small, pastebin if big
<SuperNoeMan> ok
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<thelema_> tch: I think I found it; try "open CalendarLib.Date;;"
<SuperNoeMan> thelema_: pasted...
<thelema_> SuperNoeMan: what's the error?
<SuperNoeMan> line 5
<SuperNoeMan> This expression has type rexp but an expression was expected of type unit
<thelema_> I can paste your first five lines into the toplevel and they work for me.
<SuperNoeMan> oh wait...
<SuperNoeMan> 5 lines from let rec pre r...
<SuperNoeMan> 5 lines down from *
<thelema_> SuperNoeMan: 'if' without 'else' can only return unit
<thelema_> because the implied else is 'else ()'
<SuperNoeMan> oh
<SuperNoeMan> thelema_: thanks a lot
<thelema_> SuperNoeMan: you're welcome
<SuperNoeMan> so, how do I do nothing for else
<thelema_> else Constant "foo"
<thelema_> if you're returning a value, there's no possibility to "do nothing for else"
<tch> oh, it's doesn't work :(
<SuperNoeMan> oh
<SuperNoeMan> yeah that makes sense man
<SuperNoeMan> I was wondering what to do with else
<SuperNoeMan> but in terms of how this will be used
<thelema_> tch: lots of :(
<SuperNoeMan> index will never be greater than length of s
<thelema_> # open CalendarLib;;
<thelema_> # open Date;;
<thelema_> this works for me.
<tch> open Make;;
<thelema_> make?
<tch> oh, not this window, i'm still trying ;)
<thelema_> I just installed calendar from opam, and I can access CalendarLib.Date
<tch> and i can't, so i'm looking for problem in other place
<thelema_> tch: can you pastebin a new toplevel invocation where it doesn't work?
<tch> hmm...$OCAML_TOPLEVEL_PATH
<tch> bash: /home/tch/.opam/system/lib/toplevel
<tch> or what is it toplevel invocation?
<thelema_> that looks right.
<thelema_> I don't understand the question
<tch> how can i get "a new toplevel invocation" to pastebin it?
<thelema_> exit the toplevel and start again
<tch> ah
<thelema_> ok, and now the next few lines showing that "open CalendarLib.Date;;" fails?
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<thelema_> everything I see looks correct.
<tch> i know, and i can do 'open CalendarLib.Date;;' and then 'Date.now ()' or 'CalendarLib.Date.now ()' gives me 'Unbound module' :(
<thelema_> after opening the date module, what about just "now()"?
<tch> Unbound value now
<tch> it's so so weird
<thelema_> hmm, I get the same thing.
<tch> Is another module with Date exist?
<thelema_> there's no Date.now() in calendar
<thelema_> are you still looking at the batteries-beta1 docs?
<thelema_> today();;
<thelema_> date is just a date implementation, it doesn't implement Calendar_sig
<SuperNoeMan> last question:
<SuperNoeMan> I'm converting expressions to strings
<SuperNoeMan> and right now, I have operator precedence being paid attention to
<SuperNoeMan> but I also need to pay attention to associativity
<tch> thelema_: oh
<SuperNoeMan> so that, where the empty string is represented with @
<SuperNoeMan> the sequence of ("", ""), ""
<SuperNoeMan> returns @@@
<SuperNoeMan> because it is left associative, and therefore equivalent
<thelema_> but "", ("", "") should return @(@@)?
<SuperNoeMan> but I want "", ("", "") to return @(@@)
<SuperNoeMan> yes!!
<SuperNoeMan> thelema_: I'm just at a loss as to how to capture this functionality
<SuperNoeMan> in a recursive implementation
<thelema_> start by putting () around everything, and take it away when allowed.
<SuperNoeMan> yeah, but how do I test whether its allowed?
<thelema_> for example, (@@)@ can have () around left branch removed because left associative
<SuperNoeMan> yes
<thizanne> SuperNoeMan: if it does not work, it is not correct
<thelema_> ((@)(@))(@)
<thelema_> singletons get parens removed
<thelema_> and then left branch gets parens removed
<thelema_> try those rules at first
<SuperNoeMan> but I want to keep the logic within the conversion to string function... I don't want to scan my own string that I'm returning after the conversion is complete, that's not very elegant...
<thelema_> if you need to track precedence (which you likely will), you'll just add () when precedence of inside is too low
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<SuperNoeMan> well I have precedence taken care of
<thelema_> I'm not actually suggesting you scan the output string
<SuperNoeMan> for precedence, I pass in a number that represents an operations precedence
<SuperNoeMan> thelema_: ok :)
<thelema_> I'm suggesting that you be able to print with and without ()
<thelema_> for any element
<SuperNoeMan> and compare that number to the currently matched one
<thelema_> and then figure out whether you need ()
<SuperNoeMan> well I don't know how to test for associativity without knowing the context of where I'm parsing...
<SuperNoeMan> or really, I don't know how to test for associativity
<SuperNoeMan> in my algorithm at all
<thelema_> if you really need to do that, you can pattern match more of the tree at once
<SuperNoeMan> ahhh
<SuperNoeMan> so I could have... more than just a single type at a time...
<thelema_> match r with | Seq(Seq(a,b),c) -> ...
<SuperNoeMan> well, then I have to go through every combination
<SuperNoeMan> that's not very ideal...
<thelema_> one solution is to generalize your type: type rex2 = Seq | Either type rexp = Constant of string | Bin of rex2 * rexp * rexp | KleeneStar of rexp;;
<SuperNoeMan> oh cool
<SuperNoeMan> thanks man
<thelema_> for such a small type, this will probably not save you much
<SuperNoeMan> well, how is this scalable...
<SuperNoeMan> if the type was longer than a few individual constructors,this would be giant pain
<SuperNoeMan> and look terrible in source...
<thelema_> but it does allow things like: match r with | Bin(o1,Bin(o2,a,b),c) when o1 = o2 -> ...
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<SuperNoeMan> thelema_: so, using this new construct
<SuperNoeMan> I want to match (rexp, Seq(a, b))
<SuperNoeMan> where rexp is a type I have defined
<SuperNoeMan> but not a constructor
<SuperNoeMan> I want basically any constructor within rexp to fall under this category...
<SuperNoeMan> how can I do this?
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<tch> thelema_: oh
<tch> bad window, again :(
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