flux changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://caml.inria.fr/ | OCaml 4.00.1 http://bit.ly/UHeZyT | http://www.ocaml.org | Public logs at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/ocaml/
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<jtoman> Hello all, I'm developing a bridge between Lua and Ocaml (not because I think it'll be useful but for my own edification).
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<jtoman> It's going more or less well, but when I try to use a value computed in ocaml and passed back to the C code via the Callbacks mechanism I get a segfault. Looking at other addresses I *know* are on the OCaml heap the address I'm getting back is plain wrong. Any thoughts?
<jtoman> Is it impossible to return values from Ocaml back to C via the callbacks mechanism?
<jtoman> Oh, as a final note, I'm not using C as the main program, the program is in OCaml and then calls back out to C which then sometimes calls back into OCaml
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<t4nk701> is it possible to write a polymorphic "print" function that would check the type of the input and then call print_int, print_float, print_char etc. appropriately?
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<ygrek> t4nk701, directly - not possible
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<t4nk701> ok fair enough
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<rgrinberg> companion_cube: how did you host the sequecnce tarball on github?
<rgrinberg> companion_cube: I see an archive diretory in the url file for OPAM but no such directory in the github repo
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<companion_cube> rgrinberg: github creates archives automatically when you push tags
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<rgrinberg> companion_cube: I see, thanks!
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<mcclurmc> i'm getting an exception in the toplevel when using compiler-libs.toplevel in conjunction with the Lexing module
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<mcclurmc> if i load a file which contains just "let lnum_of_pos p = p.Lexing.pos_lnum" into a toplevel with compiler-libs.toplevel installed, i get this exception:
<mcclurmc> # #use "exception.ml";;
<mcclurmc> >> Fatal error: lnum_of_pos unbound at toplevel
<mcclurmc> Fatal error: exception Misc.Fatal_error
<mcclurmc> any ideas? is this a bug
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<yezariaely> can I increase the stack size of the toploop somehow/
<yezariaely> ?
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<adrien_oww> yezariaely: "toploop"?
<adrien_oww> yezariaely: you can increase the stack size of ocamlrun, see "man ocamlrun"
<yezariaely> ocaml
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<adrien_oww> so that will apply to byte-compiled executables and the toplevel (what you called "toploop" I guess)
<yezariaely> found that, but these parameters do not work on ocaml
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<yezariaely> ehm toplevel, sorry.
<adrien_oww> better solution usually is to make your recursive function tail-recursive
<adrien_oww> yezariaely: how did you invoke ocaml?
<yezariaely> simply: ocaml -l1000 and tried ocaml -l 1000 as well.
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<adrien_oww> won't work :-)
<adrien_oww> you need to go through environment variables (or start ocaml with: ocamlrun -your-params /usr/bin/ocaml)
<adrien_oww> OCAMLRUNPARAM="l=1000" ocaml
<yezariaely> ah cool
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<dsheets> what is the simplest way to convince oasis to compile a .d.byte ?
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<tobiasBora> Hello,
<tobiasBora> I'd like to know, what's the difference between != and <> ? Because <> doesn't seems to work on tupplets, but it's the only difference I can see.
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<Drup> tobiasBora: <> is the negation of =, != is the negation of == (the physical equality)
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<Drup> (and <> works fine on tuples)
<tobiasBora> Drup: Thanks. Ah yes I didn't wrote what I'd like : I mean != doesn't work on tuplets. It's the first time I heard about == in Ocaml, what is it exactly ?
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<flux> tobiasbora, it compares if the objects being compared are the same object, not that if their contents is the same
<Drup> = is structural, == is physicial
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<flux> for example let (a, b) = (1.0, 1.0) /* a and b are now equal but they are distinct objects: a == b will return false, but a = b will return true */
<tobiasBora> flux: and a==b for exemple when we do "let a=ref 0 in; let b=a; ?
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<flux> well, if you have let b = a then b == a regardless of if a is a ref or not
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<tobiasBora> I see... Thanks for your help !
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<Kakadu> I have cloned opam-repo-dev and trying to add this remote to opam. But opam wants some file 'urls.txt' which doesn't present in dev-repo
<Kakadu> what I'm doing wrong?
<companion_cube> if you want the repo where packages live, I believe it's opam-repository
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<Kakadu> with fresh js_of_ocaml
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<companion_cube> ↑ this is the one I know, sorry ^^
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<Kakadu> if I do 'touch urls.txt' it gives an error 'Too many downloaded files.'
<Kakadu> And the same if I make opam repository manually
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<Drup> Kakadu: you do know there is a dev repo for eliom (and js_of_ocaml) ?
<Kakadu> Drup: darcs?
<Kakadu> yes, I know
<Drup> no, for opam
<Kakadu> I want it
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<Kakadu> thanks
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<himito> Bonsoir
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<LiesHidden> Anyone here? I'm not understanding why this line of code is causing an infinite loop " | hd::tl when (List.exists (fun x -> x = hd) tl) -> aux (List.filter (fun x -> x <> hd) tl) acc " it's in a match statement, I'm trying to get all instances of the list that have only one instance.
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<flux> well, I would say that that line by itself cannot cause an infinite loop, as in the (assumed) recursion step the size of the set is always smaller
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<flux> in the same way this can never be an infinite loop: let rec loop xs = match xs with hd::tl -> loop tl
<LiesHidden> That's my thought, and the next line is just the hd::tl -> aux tl (acc + 1) (assumed since it doesn't match, it must be unique)
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<LiesHidden> But If i run it without that line, it runs in a second, the instant I put that line in and run it, it goes on and on and on..
<flux> add debug output.
<flux> for example Printf.printf "%d\n%!" (List.length xs) at the beginning of the function is a great start :)
<def-lkb> just to be sure, you don't have any cyclic structure involved (the list itself or the elements compared by polymorphic equality) ?
<LiesHidden> (chuckles) i was thinking that when u suggested debug
<LiesHidden> no, just those lines, plus the [] -> acc match at the beginning, of course
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<flux> if he does, he won't get the first debug message out :)
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<LiesHidden> the list itself forms just fine, and since that statement only calls that list once, I don't see how it could be involved
<flux> and you are certain this is the piece of code where the loop is occurring, not in the code that processes the results?
<def-lkb> the "x = hd" and "x <> hd" may not terminate
<LiesHidden> the first is to check if there are duplicates, the second is to remove those duplicates from the next loop...
<flux> if he never calls recursive step with a list as long or longer than its input, it is impossible to end up in an infinite loop
<flux> because eventually the list will be empty.
<oriba> LiesHidden, " I'm trying to get all instances of the list that have only one instance" you mean a list of lists?
<oriba> List.filter ( fun li -> List.length li = 1 ) list_of_lists
<def-lkb> yes, the structural induction on list will terminate, but until we know more about what is inside the list, we can't be sure that equality tests in guards terminate
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<LiesHidden> no, a list of ints.. but I need instances that only appear once, if they appear more than once, they're not to be included
<LiesHidden> or rather a count, which is why acc + 1
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<flux> lieshidden, have you played with the function in the toplevel? or only embedded inside your application?
<LiesHidden> I'm running through the top level, but the code is in a file. i find it's easier to debug that way lol
<oriba> looks like a job for a map ...
<oriba> Map-module I mean
<oriba> or Set
<flux> Map and a fold is definitely the way to go, but I think this list-based approach should work as well :)
<oriba> if you traverse the list you would need to look up all occurrecnes so far.
<oriba> looks not very efficient to me
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<oriba> or I did not understand the task
<LiesHidden> I'm just starting with OCaml, I haven't had much experience with optimizing yet, oriba lol
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<def-lkb> LiesHidden: maybe you can just put your code on a pastbin?
<oriba> LiesHidden, I did not mean optimizing OCaml-like, but optimizing algorithmic-like
<oriba> But using lists is ok for learning OCaml :-)
<LiesHidden> lol, Lists are a pretty functional approach ;)
<oriba> Map-module also is
<oriba> but that maybe comes later
<oriba> so, go on
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<oriba> but List.length might be your friend
<oriba> or use a seperate function instead of so much nested functions in the match
<LiesHidden> List.length was my first approach, but that requires building a second list, and that takes memory
<oriba> pattern matches can also be dont like this hd::second::tl
<LiesHidden> huh? That's not in my code
<flux> alright
<flux> I think the problem is not that the loop is infinite
<flux> rather than your algorithms is WAY too inefficient :)
<LiesHidden> hmm... the debug is working, but the code is going much slower than it should be, considering
<LiesHidden> Like I said, if i remove that line, it runs in a second, tops
<flux> this might be a good time to learn about the O(x) notation
<flux> lieshidden, but it doesn't work, right?
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<flux> consider how much work needs to be done to process a list of 10 elements
<LiesHidden> It seems to be working, just taking a long time... but I let it run near an hour, and it never completed, with the debug Printf, it's moving though
<flux> and how much to process a list of 20 elements
<LiesHidden> And I'm processing one of 200K elements lol
<flux> (wasn't very insightful of us to not ask about problem size..)
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<def-lkb> (:))
<LiesHidden> OK, so what would be a more efficient approach to getting a count on all instances that only contain ONE instance in the list?
<flux> well, there are two basic approaches
<flux> either you go the list through and maintain another structure with the counts
<flux> like a hash or a map
<flux> another option is to sort the list and eliminate consecutive elements that are equal
<LiesHidden> I did sort it in the return on answer.... and that's what I was trying to do with the match statement that failed so uglily
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<flux> your current algorithm doesn't take advantage of the fact that the list would be sorted
<flux> so for each element, it searches the (remaining) whole list
<flux> you can see how much faster it can be if it only needs to look at the next element, if it's the same or not
<LiesHidden> But there could be 3 or 4 or 5 repeated instances
<LiesHidden> for instance, 120 I happen to know for a fact has 3
<flux> let's say your list of numbers is [0;3;7;9;120;120;120;200;210;210]
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<flux> you can find out your answer pretty fast from that, by looking at the adjacent elements?
<LiesHidden> True, but I'm not sure how to program that
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<LiesHidden> List.nth tl 0 would be the next element in the list on the tail.... match that against hd?
<flux> well, your code would be structured something like this: match xs with a::b::rest when (a = b) -> blahblah
<def-lkb> LiesHidden: mutually recursive functions can help (one keeping unique elements, one dropping consecutive ones)
<def-lkb> let rec keep_uniq = function | a :: b :: tl when a = b -> drop a tl | a :: tl -> a :: keep_uniq tl | [] -> []
<def-lkb> and drop a = function | b :: tl when a = b -> drop a tl | l -> keep_uniq l;;
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<LiesHidden> You guys are awesome, that should help immensely :)
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<LiesHidden> They tried to trick me, lol, the last one is a duplicate, so hd::next::tl didn't catch it, I had to put a clause in the hd::tl to catch it *chuckles* still it runs in about 5 seconds, which is MUCH better, thank you guys :)
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<def-lkb> nice :)
<LiesHidden> Ahh well, much as I'd love to do another problem, I have to get going, have a good one, guys, and thanks again.
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<oriba> it was project Euler, No. 75, aha, we made the good solutions for him ;-)
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<wmeyer> hi
<companion_cube> hello
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<osa1> how is printf implemented in OCaml? it's type depends on first parameter, can we also do that or is it implemented in an ad-hoc way so only printf works that way?
<osa1> I was watching F# type providers presentation here http://2013.flatmap.no/follesoe.html and thought it may be possible to get a OCaml's printf like function in F# with type providers
<osa1> (btw, I never written a single line of F#, this is only a guess)
<companion_cube> osa1: printf literals are special, known by the compiler that type them
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<wmeyer> companion_cube: hello
<wmeyer> :-)
<osa1> companion_cube: where can I learn more about it's implementation? let a = printf;; a "%s";; still works
<companion_cube> osa1: "%s" is not really a string, but a format string, in this case
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<companion_cube> your example works, but not let s = "%" in printf (s ^ "s") "hello"
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<osa1> ok, so does anyone has any ideas if it's possible to implement similar thing in F# type providers?
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<companion_cube> no idea
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<tobiasBora> I've a little question about Algorithm : I've an array and I'd like to put a number in every case wich is inside a ring (I just know the coordonnee of one point inside the ring). What would be the best way to do that ? I thought about a recursive algorithme who would color the cases around him, but I'm not sure it's the best solution.
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<tobiasBora> Does anyone know if it's possible to define a function at the end of a file (because it's would make more sense to read this function at the end, but I must define it at the beginning in order to call it in an other function)
<orbitz> tobiasBora: no
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<tobiasBora> and put a little "prototype" at the beginning to say that the function is at the bottom ,
<orbitz> tobiasBora: one reason to use mli's, you can give functions in the order that makes sense, then define them in any order in the .ml
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<tobiasBora> orbitz: I see... It's interessting in classic programms, but I need to print my program to give it to my teacher, and It need to put it on only one file.
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<zbroyar> tobiasBora: 'to print my programm' - do you mean to print it on paper via the printer?
<tobiasBora> zbroyar: yes
<zbroyar> tobiasBora: then you can put your functions in any order: papers does not compile :-)
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<zbroyar> I mean: write your program, compile, check and debug
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<zbroyar> When it works - change the order as you like and print :-)
<tobiasBora> zbroyar: Indeed ^^ But my moral would forgive me to print a program that we cannot compile !
<orbitz> tobiasBora: I just use clear comments to indicate internal vs api functions
<orbitz> it's not tha tbad
<zbroyar> tobiasBora: your teacher is not going to write your program manually back to digital form, believe me :-)
<tobiasBora> zbroyar: Oh you don't know my teacher ;-)
<tobiasBora> orbitz: I may do that... I'll see if it really no make sense, and if so I'll give back an un-compilable program !
<zbroyar> tobiasBora: anyway, OCaml doesn't have C-style forward declarations.
<tobiasBora> Ok thanks for your help !
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<orbitz> the order thigns get bound in Ocaml matters alot, comparedto soemthing liek C
<tobiasBora> I see. Is it for "technical" raison or not ?
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<ggole> I think the requirement to use 'and' in mutually recursive definitions is a deliberate decision and not a technical limitation.
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<tobiasBora> ggole: what do you mean by 'and' ?
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<ggole> In order to write function and type definitions that depend on each other, they need to be in scope in each others definitions
<ggole> You do that by writing successive definitions with and instead of let
<ggole> let f x = g x and g x = f (x + 1), for a (silly) example
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<Drup> (However, you do need the rec for this)
<ggole> Er, yeah
<ggole> I always forget that :)
<ggole> If I had a buck for every time I had to go back and add a 'rec'...
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<Drup> and the . when dealing with float :p
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<ggole> Yep. And often array.() and string.[], too.
<orbitz> ggole: i think it is as well, and a good one
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<ggole> It beats forward declarations.
<orbitz> You can just rebind stuff so easily in ocaml, forward declarations don't make much sense IMO
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<wmeyer> orbitz: hello
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<rand0000> Hey - does anyone in here have experience with how fas the 'graphics.cma' library is compared to the SDL API? I need to view 25 images/sec with the application I'm planning to write...
<rand0000> * fast *
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<Drup> I think that basically anything is better than graphics.cma if you want something "serious". graphics.cma is a good toy library but that's all
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<rand0000> ahh okay - thanks (:
<Drup> rand0000: But I would not do any guess about how fast SDL is :)
<rand0000> I just find that many of the API's available for func. prog.-langs is out of date with the newest versions of either the prog.-lang or the library implemented...
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<rand0000> specifically looking at SDL api's or maybe open-gl...
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<Drup> there are some up to date cairo or opengl bindings
<Drup> (at least, they are uptodate afaik, I'm not really an expert)
<rand0000> ok - I'll have a look at those
<rand0000> native would just be coolest (:
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<Drup> implementing a native graphic library in ocaml is just insane
<rand0000> well I can imagine... seems like most func. prog.-lang implementations feel that way about native graphics lib's
<Drup> having a functional binding on the other hand is possible and a far better way to go.
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<rand0000> yes - but I'm a bit scared of my program breaking some time in the future if some API stops getting updated.. or should I not be worried?
<rand0000> I could just stick with the old implementation and keep with that..
<Drup> the opengl API for exemple do not evolve very fast
<rand0000> ok
<ousado> and it's not that hard to make a few changes
<Drup> some function in the API have been declared as "deprecated" since 1.0, it's now 3.0 ...
<rand0000> but I know fx that the SDL libs will get updated to a v 2.0 soon, which will bring a lot of change
<rand0000> heh yeah ok
<rand0000> open-gl is just a bit overkill concerning my use-case ; my impression is that SDL is a lot simpler
<rand0000> also because SDL in itself support image-loading of differing formats
<rand0000> I would need another library for that if I chose opengl
<Drup> I'm not sure how the sdl binding is, but cairo can do what you want and the binding is quite nice.
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<rand0000> do you have any idea if cairo is fast?
<rand0000> is it C-code?
<Drup> it depend of what you wan
<rand0000> I'll have a look...
<Drup> want*
<rand0000> 25 frames/sec
<rand0000> images of fullscreen size
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<rand0000> SDL is fast enough - tested in python
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<Drup> that's not really the issue, the problem is the number of objects in your scene.
<rand0000> ok? why not the speed of image-playback?
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<rand0000> I will not have many objects...
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<Drup> It's like if you say "I want to filter a list every X ms" without precising the size of the list :D
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<rand0000> ahh you mean how many images that need to be loaded into memory?
<rand0000> that matters a lot... I need as many as I can get
<Drup> no
<Drup> but 25 f/s is not a lot so I suppose you should be ok.
<rand0000> ok I guess I understand what you mean
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<Drup> anyway, all those APIs are similar, you can switch from one to another without too much trouble if you're application is modular enough.
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<rand0000> You are right (:
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<rand0000> thanks for the help - I'm on the right track
<Drup> no problem
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