<tankf33der>
secure channels made public. so cool.
<Regenaxer>
I see. But what is the advantage over e.g. ssh?
<Regenaxer>
key exchange?
<tankf33der>
you copy 1700LOC to your project and compile.
<tankf33der>
key exchange, embedded devices, full custom.
<tankf33der>
IOT! :)
<beneroth>
Hi all
<Regenaxer>
low power?
<Regenaxer>
Hi beneroth
<mtsd>
Hello beneroth
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<Regenaxer>
tankf33der, your neighbor Estonia uses electronic voting (https://t.co/SOqQ0AHyXE (in german though)). How do you think about that?
<tankf33der>
Regenaxer: they are cool.
<tankf33der>
:)
<Regenaxer>
Can electronic voting ever be controlled? Is it private?
<tankf33der>
EE is far away from LV and LT. Another level.
<Regenaxer>
I think it is not, by principle
<tankf33der>
Regenaxer: i cant answer.
<tankf33der>
Regenaxer: T
<Regenaxer>
I would feel quite uneasy
<beneroth>
I once talked with someone from Estonia about the topic.
<Regenaxer>
The german article (interview) only talks about "security" of e-voting
<beneroth>
Apparently corruption is a widespread problem in Estonia, and at least that person believed that eVoting would make vote meddling less likely than traditional ballots.
<Regenaxer>
ok, I see
<Regenaxer>
good thing is that it seems to be open source
<beneroth>
I think that argument is pretty bad, as one would need to influence a lot less people to manipulate eVoting, and its much less detectable.
<Regenaxer>
but who controls which version of the program runs on the server
<Regenaxer>
T
<beneroth>
there is no way to proof if a given source code belongs to the application running.
<beneroth>
(one thing a picolisp machine might actually solve!)
<Regenaxer>
haha, so easy that even my grandmother would have understood!
<beneroth>
well that person didn't, or didn't want to, so we stopped arguing :)
<Regenaxer>
understand
<beneroth>
it was a female friend of my lisper friends girlfriend
<beneroth>
at CCC congress, where a evoting talk was. we were like "we will not even watch this talk, it's horrible anyway, only gives depression" - she was like "why? how can you say that?" :D
<Regenaxer>
yeah
<Regenaxer>
no way to argue
<beneroth>
concerning security: Estonia is currently in the process of replacing all identity cards (which were used for digital signature etc.) because of crypto flaws: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estonian_identity_card
<beneroth>
ballot counting everyone can understand and easily watch over. not so much with computer implementation.
<beneroth>
razzy, with evoting this would not be the weakest part :)
<razzy>
so the weakest part is uneducated people, imho
<Regenaxer>
razzy, right, manipulating people is another issue. But this happens all the time
<Regenaxer>
Also with educated people
<Regenaxer>
Everybody is easily manipulated
<beneroth>
T
<razzy>
people educated about manipulation are harder to manipulate
<Regenaxer>
People must learn, yes, to use their brains. This is a difficult issue
<Regenaxer>
Most don't or can't
<razzy>
if they do not or can not, their vote rights should be removed
<razzy>
and i agree, democracies are made for inefficiency and stability
<Regenaxer>
It is human, nobody really does use his brain
<beneroth>
razzy, and who decides when vote rights should be removed? nah.
<Regenaxer>
We all *believe* rather than think
<beneroth>
T
<beneroth>
it's simple biology. believing needs less energy than thinking.
<razzy>
beneroth: i agree, there are many problems
<Regenaxer>
What really shocked me was the news recently that people believing in a flat earth are rapidly *increasing*!
<Regenaxer>
Seemingly cause by youtube videos :(
<Regenaxer>
Sorry, afp
<razzy>
afp?
<beneroth>
away from penti. like afk.
<beneroth>
afk
<razzy>
what could be done, is questionaire about world, which would invalidate your vote. example: voteB? yes/no IsEarthFlat? yes/no.
<beneroth>
and who decides what question would be in that questionaire? this can easily be manipulated to take your voting right away, e.g. just asking about some local history you don't know.
<razzy>
beneroth: yes, many problems there
<beneroth>
the fix for this is education and properly functioning journalism, not reducing the people who vote even further in numbers.
<razzy>
agree
<Regenaxer>
ret
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