rob_w has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
rob_w has joined #picolisp
mtsd has quit [*.net *.split]
aw- has quit [*.net *.split]
mtsd has joined #picolisp
aw- has joined #picolisp
<Regenaxer>
Can anybody tell me why I should need fiber to the home?
<Regenaxer>
Today the fourth guy ringed here and tried to sell me one
<Regenaxer>
I have 50 MiB/sec currently, option to upgrade to 100
<Regenaxer>
But I have no application needing more than 10 MiB
<Regenaxer>
These sales guys keep insisting that fiber is "better" and "the future"
<Regenaxer>
But they cannot tell me why
<Regenaxer>
Of cours fiber is a lot better for backbones and infrastructur. But the last few hundred meters to the home?
<beneroth>
for uploads it's good
<beneroth>
or for running your own server
<beneroth>
upload demand skyrocket now with everyone using video conferencing
<Regenaxer>
yes, but who does such uploads at home?
<beneroth>
most cable internet we have in Switzerland are either telephone lines or TV cables. and TV cables are optimized for downloads, but not uploads
<Regenaxer>
A video takes max. 5 MBit / sec
<beneroth>
having your own video server from where you stream to your own devices? but yeah, that are already nerds
<Regenaxer>
yes, when I still operated my server from here, I would use it
<Regenaxer>
They try to sell it to every grandma here
<Regenaxer>
noisy
<beneroth>
I have fiber to the home, from a small-middle sized local company here (local cable network was build by city), works perfect, cheap price
<beneroth>
yeah
<beneroth>
grandmas just need good television connection and they're good, in my experience
<Regenaxer>
yeah
<beneroth>
problem is also: it was different cables in the past, now its all internet
<beneroth>
so if everyone in same few houses uses their stuff to the max at the same time in the evening, congestions can happen
<Regenaxer>
But is there any application in the "future" needing more than 100 MBit/s?
<Regenaxer>
right
<beneroth>
though usually the congestion points are the backbone of the internet company, not really at the house
<Regenaxer>
But here are all single-family houses
<Regenaxer>
T
<Regenaxer>
backbone is good here, all fiber already
<beneroth>
Regenaxer, download videos? netflix? downloading linux ISO files? yes you could wait. but if the server is good you wait 5 seconds instead of an hour
<Regenaxer>
Netflix takes max 5 MBit
<beneroth>
I don't know
<Regenaxer>
Even VR wont take so much in the future
<beneroth>
I use fiber for having my file servers at home and just comfortable fast connections to my rented servers
<beneroth>
but Swiss internet market is not as fucked up as Germanys
<Regenaxer>
ok :)
<beneroth>
I wouldn't save much money by not using fiber, and with this connection I know there is enough overcapacity and that the company actually knows what they're doing (run by hackers), instead of bigcorp which don't have fiber mostly because they invest their money somewhere else than technical infrastructure, including their core switches etc.
<Regenaxer>
T, it is not much more expensive
<Regenaxer>
I just dont want to change now
<beneroth>
might be in Germany that state pays part of the internet companies costs for building fiber in the street, but only when there are enough local citizens who actually buy fiber then
<beneroth>
I guess its more that thing
<beneroth>
money laundering bailout bullshit
<Regenaxer>
haha, yes
<beneroth>
I mean Germany still has huge areas with no useful internet connection at all, maybe 2G mobile but nothing else
<Regenaxer>
That I say them all the time
<Regenaxer>
countrysiye
<Regenaxer>
side
<beneroth>
we don't have fiber everyhwere in Switzerland, and if you live somewhere where there is no fiber in the street, than its unlikely you get some anytime soon
<beneroth>
but most city areas are full on fiber now
<Regenaxer>
sorry, afp
<beneroth>
2G gets shut down here
<beneroth>
np
<Regenaxer>
cu later :)
<beneroth>
so mobile phones working here will not work in Germany and vic versa, unless 4G+ is available ;-)
<beneroth>
you shut down 3G (GSM), we keep it a bit longer (to also shut it down eventually)
aw- has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
aw- has joined #picolisp
<cess11>
i quite enjoy having fiber since about a year back, but my household churns through a lot of traffic due to three persons streaming and downloading video
<Regenaxer>
Hi cess11! So you would say 50 MBit/s would not ae sufficient?
<cess11>
quick uploads is quite nice, i share a lot of documents and videos with a friend, and it's nice for work since i shuffle databases quite a bit
<Regenaxer>
i.e. 10 videos concurrently?
<cess11>
depends on what kind of connection, on 4G/LTE i get irritating buffering or stutters and the latency is pretty bad on ssh when pressuring it to 40 MiB or so, fiber solves this for me
<Regenaxer>
ok
<Regenaxer>
yes
<cess11>
4G and classic ADSL forced me to start using video downloaders since streaming was unrealiable
<cess11>
it's a convenience thing more than crucial but i enjoy having some dumb soap opera or documentary in the background while working, makes it easier to zone in and out smoothly
<Regenaxer>
Probably the problem is in the infrastructure, not so much the last meters to the house
<Regenaxer>
and in the course if installing fiber they upgrade the infrastructure too
<beneroth>
afaik in germany that is mostly the case, yes
<cess11>
with the ADSL we were kind of far out on the telephony line so it maxed out at about 1.2 MiB when there was no competition for bandwidth from those closer to the node in the telephony network
<beneroth>
even more so after the German Telekom Vectoring bullshit now finally fell apart, afaik
<beneroth>
Regenaxer, that is also the sole reason for the slow IPv6 adoption: internet companies & backbone operators would need to replace their core switches (very expensive pieces of hardware)
<beneroth>
afaik
<Regenaxer>
true
<cess11>
with 4G we've had degraded performance around rush hour at four-five in the afternoon due to underwhelming infrastructure and greedy telekom businesses in the swedish cartl
<cess11>
cartel
<cess11>
if you don't have any annoyances, keep what you have now
<beneroth>
T
<Regenaxer>
yeah
<cess11>
the option to move over to fiber isn't likely to go away
<beneroth>
it might increase the value of your property though, in case you sell it and if fiber building stops in your area after a while
<Regenaxer>
I know
<beneroth>
cess11, some places here it stopped, because the investors (be it private corp or cities) found it not as profitable as projected
<Regenaxer>
I hope to be R
<Regenaxer>
I expect to be 5G-only in the future
<Regenaxer>
no more messing with cables ;)
<beneroth>
CH will be there in a few years
<beneroth>
Germany? I doubt it :P
<Regenaxer>
here in Augsburg
<beneroth>
maybe yeah
<beneroth>
free market on cable infrastructure is just dumb
<Regenaxer>
T
<beneroth>
infrastructure should be state-owned, optimized for quality. maybe have then free market on top of it for services
<Regenaxer>
It used to be
<Regenaxer>
but was terribly expensive
<cess11>
i prefer fiber in part because it's more expensive to jam than wireless connections
<Regenaxer>
good old Post telephone
<beneroth>
cess11, good point
<Regenaxer>
indeed
<cess11>
if i ask the guy i'm renting from he'll also call our provider and we have a GiB line within a couple of days, if i want to run a server from home or do serious data shuffling of some kind
<cess11>
not so sure 5G will manage that kind of throughput in practice
<beneroth>
Regenaxer, well our Post is now big in real estate (like our federal train company, which is the biggest real estate company here), and Post service is getting worse every year. Post offices get closed or turned into lottery and mobile bullshit selling zones.
<Regenaxer>
right, for a server things are different
<beneroth>
and now with Pandemic and increase in packages sent they complain about too many packages to handle
<Regenaxer>
I'm talking of the families here
<beneroth>
Regenaxer, families = 4-5+ people constantly watching youtube etc. :P
<Regenaxer>
yes, fo max 25 MBit/s
<beneroth>
your internet volume is just half alone because you use text browser mainly :P
<cess11>
yeah, server is different, currently i'm fine with 100/100
casaca has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
<Regenaxer>
:)
Seteeri has joined #picolisp
orivej has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
rob_w has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Seteeri has quit [Remote host closed the connection]