<MrMobius>
KipIngram, ya good idea targeting arm then
<cbridge-libera>
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<KipIngram>
Well, my first target is x86, but I've deliberately planned for portability to ARM.
<KipIngram>
There's a layer in the softwarre stack that's confined to.
<KipIngram>
You could think of that layer as implementing a vm, and then the rest is written for that vm.
<KipIngram>
I've attempted to have a vm that has efficient implementations on both platforms.
<KipIngram>
I call those bits "portable instructions," and they're implemented as assembly macros. Sometimes a macro is empty on x86, because the efficient x86 implementation doesn't need that one.
<KipIngram>
But that's ok - an empty macro in assembly just... doesn't do anything. Adds no code.
<Zarutian_HTC>
KipIngram: what about the new kid on the block, risc-v?
<KipIngram>
I'm unfamiliar with that. I'll have to take a look.
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<MrMobius>
Zarutian_HTC, also no stock yet :/
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<KipIngram>
Looks ambitious.
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<MrM|Hex>
there was a kickstarter for an rpi type board on kickstarter for $99
<MrMobius>
im getting my irc clients mixed up
<mark4[MFNGA]>
where the pi costs $40?
<mark4[MFNGA]>
is this other board more powerful?
<mark4[MFNGA]>
64 bit with 16g of ram and a couple of sata ports ?
<mark4[MFNGA]>
that would be nice
<MrM|Hex>
1ghz and 1gb ram is what sticks in my mind
<MrMobius>
i dont think risc v is taking over any time soon
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<mark4[MFNGA]>
1gb of ram is pitiful cant even compile half of gentoo with that
<mark4[MFNGA]>
the pi has 4 or 8g
<KipIngram>
Think about what that statement says about our lifetimes.
<KipIngram>
That 1 GB of RAM is "pitiful."
<KipIngram>
My first computer had 16k.
<KipIngram>
It's easy to take that curve for granted, but the last 40 years have been nothing short of amazing.
<Bogen85>
software on most modern systems is extremely bloated... Desktop, Laptops, Tablets, Phones, etc...
<MrMobius>
yes but who cares
<KipIngram>
Well, yes, it is. I want to think we could have done that better if we'd... "somehow been smarter," but maybe it's just a lot harder than one might think. I mean, you're about to get all this new hardware power dropped in your lap, and your job is to figure out how to take advantage of it. Is that really an easy problem?
<KipIngram>
One could argue that it used to be a high specialty to be able to work with computers, and today almost anybody can do the basics.
<KipIngram>
Maybe some of that power was invested in making the technology "more accessible."
<MrMobius>
i think it gets wasted on not paying more for salaries to make projects last longer where better performance wouldnt much matter
<KipIngram>
I'm not really a fan / proponent of swanky GUIs, but I think they do "dumb down" the interface to things quite a bit.
<MrMobius>
which is a legit thing to add bloat for
<mark4[MFNGA]>
KipIngram, come to #freenode-policy and say that lol
<mark4[MFNGA]>
they seemt o be able to argue anything lol
<KipIngram>
I'm not touchin' that one.
<KipIngram>
But arguing seems to be our favorite pasttime in recent years.
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<cmtptr>
what is it like to not argue with a person
<cmtptr>
after working from home for over a year even my cat and i bicker
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<cbridge-libera>
<MrMobius> ping
<cbridge-libera>
<dave0> pong
<cbridge-libera>
<MrMobius> channel monitor plug in is working, woohoo
<crc>
the bridge is still having some stability issues
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<cbridge-libera>
<MrMobius> crc, did you see libera offers some bridge bot?
<crc>
No
<cbridge-libera>
<crc> Any pointers to this? I don't see anything on their website
<mark4[MFNGA]>
so they can track everything we say for nefarious purposes :P~
<mark4[MFNGA]>
no i dont actually believe that lol
<cbridge-libera>
<crc> mark4[MFNGA]: we're publicly logged anyway - no need to mine :)
<mark4[MFNGA]>
which is why i have no problems lol
<mark4[MFNGA]>
this is a public forum and anyone who wants to datamine #forth dont need to SPY on us
<mark4[MFNGA]>
they can do it by datamining the published logs lol
<mark4[MFNGA]>
someone said and what about your PMs here are those public too?
<mark4[MFNGA]>
my answer was yes. my PMs are public and i never say anything in them that is absolutely private
<mark4[MFNGA]>
how do i know you are not logging your chats here and publishing them?
<mark4[MFNGA]>
i have ZERO expectation of privacy in anything i say on this network
<mark4[MFNGA]>
it really is that simple lol
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<cbridge-libera>
<ttmrichter> I make it simpler than that. I have no expectations of privacy ever. Makes life easier. Just assume everybody's out to get you and the 99.44% of the times you're right will not shock you.
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<KipIngram>
I don't share important information with people outside my family, but I do share personal information that I'd PREFER not to have circulated to the world with people I regard as "friends." The meaningfulness of the information would depend on how good the friendship is. Sure - one of them might share that information with someone else, in which case I will reconsider how good a friend that person is.
<KipIngram>
But it'll never be something that really causes me any severe problem.
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<proteusguy>
crc, that's a pretty elegant little bridge.
<crc>
thanks
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<mark4[MFNGA]>
considering it was thrown together in such a short time is pretty amazing actually lol
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<mark4>
we can take the hat off now
<cmtptr>
it is awesome, but to be fair ii is doing all of the irc protocol for him
<cmtptr>
just bring that up to say: it's also a testament of how cool ii is
<crc>
I could write something similar to `ii` pretty quickly, but `ii` does the job well enough to make that a low priority :)
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<KipIngram>
What does ii do exactly - never heard of it.
<crc>
ii connects to an irc server and exposes it via the filesystem
<crc>
it creA
<crc>
creates files for writing to channels, reading from channels, etc
<cbridge-libera>
<nfultz> t right, looking at my calendar now, I'll probably do Fridays June 11 and 25 plus a third day if needed.
<KipIngram>
Ah, I see. It "Linux-izes" irc, via the "everything is a file" concept.
<KipIngram>
Interesting.
<KipIngram>
Linux definitely gets a lot of mileage out of that idea.
<crc>
more of a plan9 thing
<boru>
I was about to say.
<KipIngram>
You mean it's origin?
<boru>
Yeah.
<crc>
yes, plan 9 is much more of everything as files than unix/linux
<KipIngram>
I've heard of plan9, but never really studied it.
<boru>
Well, plan9's concept was moreso regarding the locality of resources, whereas unix was more file-y.
<boru>
Plan9 is pretty neat.
<crc>
I need to get a plan9 system running at some point
<boru>
I'd be interested to hear about how that goes. Unrelated, but I should really just join this channel on one network...
<KipIngram>
I dropped off of the libera side because being in both channels was fouling up my irc client.
<mark4>
crc lol why !
<KipIngram>
I use the highmon plugin to see mentions of my nick.
<KipIngram>
Everything I typed in one channel was coming through the bridge to the other, and highmon didn't realize I typed it, and flagged it as a mention.
<KipIngram>
Well, plan9 is just of major historical interest, for one thing.
<boru>
The plugin I wrote for irssi to do that handles it. I can tell it to ignore mentions by specific users.
<KipIngram>
Oh, nice.
<cmtptr>
i briefly played with a plan9 vm once but didn't like that it pegged my cpu to 100%
<KipIngram>
I would ask you for that, but I don't use irssi.
<KipIngram>
That's a good feature.
<KipIngram>
Mine may have it too; I should check.
<boru>
Yeah, I wrote it out of frustration with some users prefixing every message with my nick.
<KipIngram>
It was just fastest and simplest to part one of the channels.
<cmtptr>
and also everything in plan9 is so foreign it's hard to find your way around, and as you can imagine, finding help on the subject is pretty challening
<KipIngram>
Why were they doing that?
<crc>
mark4: using multiple systems is useful for gathering ideas
<boru>
It can ignore mentions, or highlight the string in the scrollback but not show channel activity etc.
<boru>
I think they were just trying to make it obvious that they were directing their questions/statements at me but also to try to ensure I couldn't ignore their immediate need for my help.
<mark4>
true :)
<mark4>
is plan 9 even still a thing any more tho?
<mark4>
is it still being worked on?
<crc>
there are still some branches of it being developed (9front at least)
<KipIngram>
I never hear much "now" about it - I always run across it in historical contexts, though.
<boru>
ISTR there being a revival somewhere in the last decade or so. I am not sure if it was continued development, or a new project to "modernise" it.
<mark4>
cool
<KipIngram>
It's just associated with that little clique of people who just put their fingerprints on EVERYTHING, it seems.
<KipIngram>
You can't turn over many rocks without running across Ken Thompson, for example.
<KipIngram>
Dude was active all over the map.
<boru>
Well, he worked at Bell Labs.
<KipIngram>
Yeah.
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<KipIngram>
Well, I need to get back busy with Forth progress. The computer port went well, but that doesn't move anything forward. I added a third RAM region that will serve as a pool of disk buffers, so that's "there" now and all zeroed. So, disk words.
<KipIngram>
Buffer management.
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<KipIngram>
I'm still thinking I want to use cuckoo hashing to assign buffers.
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<mark4>
what is cuckoo hashing?
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<KipIngram>
Cuckoos lay their eggs in nests belonging to other birds, and the cuckoo egg hatches first and takes over.
<KipIngram>
The poor "adopted parents" work themselve silly trying to feed the cuckoo chick, which gets big fast.
<KipIngram>
It's one of nature's uglier situations.
<KipIngram>
I can't think of any region not to just use 256-mod as one of the two hashes.
<mark4>
heh
<mark4>
technically not their siblings :)
<KipIngram>
Right.
<KipIngram>
Hence the "..."
<mark4>
:)
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<KipIngram>
Also the origin of cuck / cuckold.
<KipIngram>
The stories I've heard describe the cuckoo chick rapidly growing to be bigger than the parents, and they continue to fetch food and stuff his gullet as hard as they can.
<KipIngram>
Kind of sad.
<KipIngram>
Anyway, it's an evolution of linear probing, where you go to the hash location, and if it's already occupied you just iterate upward until you find a vacancy.
<KipIngram>
But in that case you have to iterate up on reads too.
<KipIngram>
In this case you just rearrange things so that every datum is in one of the first two places you look for it.
<KipIngram>
So you get bounded read time.
<KipIngram>
I'm thinking I'll use an intermediate layer of pointers, so that I won't have to actually copy blocks around when inserting new ones.
<KipIngram>
Just copy a pointer to them to a new home.
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<KipIngram>
Anyway, I think just 256 mod works for the primary buffer choice, and the second one might be as simple as 256 mod 128 xor. I'm just "thinking about" that a little to make sure it doesn't have some obvious problem.
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<cbridge-libera>
<dave0> maw
<KipIngram>
Hey dave0.
<cbridge-libera>
<crc> Hi dave0
<cbridge-libera>
<dave0> maw kipingram, crc
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<cbridge-libera>
<crc> Hi bluekelp
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