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<aeth>
Is it bad for performance to use apply in a situation that pretty much looks like where apply was made for? That is, (apply #'function-taking-in-rest list) vs. (function-taking-in-list list)
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<Zhivago>
Surely that depends on the implementation. I can imagine that apply will have some list processing overhead where the list is dynamic.
<Zhivago>
But you'd be paying for that somewhere along the line, unless you got rid of the dynamic argument lists.
<aeth>
The input is incredibly arbitrary.
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<aeth>
I'm essentially reimplementing a subset of Lisp except prefixing a stream on front writing the infix representation to the stream. e.g. (defun infix+ (stream &rest numbers) ...) where '(+) becomes "0", '(+ 1) becomes "1", '(+ 1 2) becomes "(1 + 2)", etc.
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<aeth>
If macros didn't exist I could probably implement the whole thing (when the input is a list) as (apply (gethash (car list) functions) (cdr list))
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<aeth>
(That wouldn't quite work even without macros because if (:foo 1 2 3) is undefined it would become "foo(1, 2, 3)")
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<asarch>
Stupid questions:
<asarch>
1) If ' is to (QUOTE ...), what is ` to?
<asarch>
3) What is a "lambda list"?
<asarch>
2) What is a "parameter list"? Is it the list of the arguments of a function, macro, etc?
<asarch>
4) If doing this (let ((x 10)) (format t "~a" x)) would be the same as this ((lambda (x) (format t "~a" x)) 10). Then how would I emulate FLET?
<Bike>
` doesn't have one
<Bike>
i don't believe "parameter list" is used in the spec
* asarch
takes notes...
<Bike>
a "lambda list" specifies how a function ormacro or whatever takes arguments
<Bike>
i don't understand the last question
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<Bike>
do you mean that you want to have a function's parameters bind in the function namespace?
<asarch>
What question number?
<Bike>
four
<Bike>
the last one
<Bike>
since you asked four.
<asarch>
Ah, according with PCL, LET is just a macro that expand to the second form
<asarch>
My question was, how is FLET expanded?
<Bike>
it's not
<Bike>
and let is not a macro
<Bike>
i mean, an implementation could make it one, but there's no need to, or to be able to
<Bike>
in most implementations let is specially handled
<asarch>
D'oh! I see the rest of the paragraph: "in some Lisp dialects--though not Common Lisp--"
<Bike>
yeah, in scheme i think it is actually a macro.
<asarch>
"Parameter lists are sometimes also called lambda lists because of the historical relationship between Lisp's notion of functions and the lambda calculus."
<asarch>
So, the parameter list is actually the list of the arguments for a function/macro/etc, right? And, how is a Lambda list?
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<Bike>
i'm telling you i don't think "parameter list" is an official term.
<Bike>
if it's anything it's juts a synonym for "lambda list".
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<mfiano>
a function's parameters are defined by the ordinary lambda list, a type of lambda list
<mfiano>
and yes LET is one of 25 epe ial operators. neither a function nor a macro
<mfiano>
the standard defines 'parameter'
<mfiano>
parameter n. 1. (of a function) a variable in the definition of a function which takes on the value of a corresponding argument (or of a list of corresponding arguments) to that function when it is called, or which in some cases is given a default value because there is no corresponding argument.
<Bike>
parameter certainly means something, yes
<mfiano>
parameter list doesnt really make sense, because there may be more data than parametric data in a lambda list
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<spm_>
Greets. Perhaps silly question, but any clues on how to get rid of case (or uppercase all symbols) when executing CL-DBI queries? DB appears to convert everything to lowercase, so I can't address the plist elements unless I escape the keys (getf row :|field1|), etc. I looked at the test code for cl-dbi, and see they use the pipe-escapes but that seems ugly...
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<asarch>
So the book is wrong?
* asarch
burns his hard copy of the book
<Bike>
it uses a term that's not in the spec
<Bike>
and tells you it means a term that is in the spec
<mfiano>
in other languages a parameter list is a known term. CL is a standard with very specific vocabulary and function parameter location does a bit more than just define a list if parameters
<mfiano>
i suppose the book is being a bit too friendly in cases, but its been a long time since ive read it
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<spm_>
In PCL in that chapter, he's describing how parameters to a function are specified: as a list (of parameters) e.g. a "parameter list". The footnote calls out that these can be referred to as a "lambda-list" for historical reasons, and I believe his doing so is to make the hyperspec docs understandable (as, for instance, the hyperspec for the defun macro shows the argument as lambda-list).
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<asarch>
How does a lambda list look like?
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<mfiano>
That depends on which kind
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<aeth>
defmethod, defmacro, and defun have different lambda lists. I think destructuring-bind's is the same as defmacro
<mfiano>
it is not
<mfiano>
that is ehy it is referred to as a destructuring lambda list
<mfiano>
why*
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<asarch>
What about in a defun, how would it look like?
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<Bike>
(x y z) or (x y &rest r) or (&key (z nil) b &allow-other-keys) or any number of other possibilities.
<aeth>
"A destructuring lambda list can contain all of the lambda list keywords listed for macro lambda lists except for &environment" and that's why I thought that they were the same
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<asarch>
THANK YOU!!!
<asarch>
Thank you very much guys :-)
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<aeth>
because it doesn't put it on one page: 3.4.1 defun/lambda/flet/labels/handler-case/restart-case/define-method-combination, 3.4.2 defgeneric, 3.4.3 defmethod/defgenric, 3.4.4 defmacro/macrolet/define-compiler-macro/define-setf-expander, 3.4.5. destructuring-bind, 3.4.6. defstruct (constructors), 3.4.7 defsetf, 3.4.8. deftype, 3.4.9. define-modify-macro, and 3.4.10. define-method-combination
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<aeth>
Of course, this is just the standard. Libraries can have their own lambda-lists, e.g. specialization-store
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<asarch>
Ok
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<LdBeth>
Good afternoon
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<asarch>
My last stupid question for today: You need to do a small a quick program (maybe to fix a calculation for something), what do you usually use for that? LET, FLET, LET*, lambda, etc?
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<Bike>
those are all different things. i use what i need
<asarch>
Ok
<asarch>
Why LAMBDA and not just Λ or λ?
<Bike>
most keyboards are short on greek.
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<asarch>
I know, but what if the programmer: (funcall (λ (x y) (+x y)) 10 3)?
<Bike>
i can't type a lambda without reconfiguring my system a bit
<Bike>
that's all
<asarch>
Oh :-(
<asarch>
Ok, ok
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<aeth>
It's probably better to turn your lambda into a λ via emacs, locally to your end. It will mess up indentation sometimes, though.
<aeth>
It's pretty rare, though. The only common case with common style where the indentation would be aligned improperly would be (lambda (some-long-variable\n
<aeth>
(But if you're writing a complicated function as a lambda it should probably be named with flet or defun.)
<aeth>
The best thing about it is you can just type "lambda" and emacs will display it, locally to you, as λ
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<LdBeth>
Well I would just give it a name so I can reference to it later
<asarch>
(mapcar #'(lambda (x) (+ x 10))) -> (mapcar #'(λ (x) (+ x 10)))
<LdBeth>
CL21 allows one to write (mapcar ^(+ % 10) ...
<aeth>
That's a terrible name. What if there's a new standard in 2021?
<aeth>
Unlikely, but possible.
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<beach>
Good morning everyone!
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<LdBeth>
Good morning beach
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<shka>
good morning
<beach>
Hello shka.
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<minion>
Remembered. I'll tell asarch when he/she/it next speaks.
<shka>
just use emacs prettify :/
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<flip214>
aeth: CL20.21
<antoszka>
There were quite a few reader macros for shorthand lambda notation.
<antoszka>
Some more some less flexible (with regards to argument passing).
<pjb>
As reader macro, you can use the lambda-calculus syntax. λx,y.(+ x y)
<pjb>
But since you wouldn't want infix notation, it may be too much.
<trittweiler>
I always thought sharp-backquote would be a nice choice of taste, like #`(foo ,2 ,1 ,@&rest) == (lambda (x y &rest rest) (apply 'foo y x rest))
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<pjb>
It's obscure. You have to know it to understand what it does.
<xificurC>
I'm a bit lost with packages. When I add a package do :depends-on in asdf:defsystem, those packages are automatically available when I do in-package? From hands-on experience it seems to be the case.
<shka>
xificurC: you are truely lost
<shka>
packages and systems are two separate terms
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<shka>
package is for reader, systems are something completly different
<xificurC>
shka: I get that they are different, I don't get the interplay :) when I do (require 'foo) and foo is a name of a system that describes a single package with the same name
<shka>
it is not required for a system to provide package with the same name as the system
<shka>
it is just what people do
<xificurC>
did I just require the package or the system?
<shka>
you can't requirte the package
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<LdBeth>
(defun seduce (fn list &rest args)
<LdBeth>
(do ((lst list (cdr lst)))
<LdBeth>
(funcall fn (second lst) (first lst))))
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<shka>
i prefer pjb version
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<shka>
xificurC: packages are only for reading
<shka>
for nothing else
<shka>
so you can't really require it
<xificurC>
clhs of require talks about modules.. great, more terms incoming
<shka>
you can load a package and that would produce new package, but that's just a namespace
<shka>
so interplay is simple: system says how to load code, code can specify packages, and people can name package just like system
<xificurC>
_death: I'll read that, thanks
<shka>
and that's pretty much it
<shka>
makes sense?
<xificurC>
shka: ok, cleared up a bit. Now the question I was aiming at :)
<LdBeth>
package is a data structure contains symbols and their bindings
<shka>
just symbols
<xificurC>
what to do with external, ehm, systems? Those from quicklisp, can I just add them to the :depends-on list and it will magically get downloaded etc when needed?
<shka>
yup
<shka>
quicklisp can do that for you
<shka>
it is basicly a package manager, really
<xificurC>
cool. I could have just tried it out but I was hoping to learn something along the way, and look, I did
<LdBeth>
Well symbols hold their bindings
<shka>
one that is tightly integrated into lisp
<shka>
so in python you would run pip from shell, in cl though, quicklisp hooks into system definition and works automaticly
<shka>
without a need to go to the shell
<shka>
LdBeth: they don't
<shka>
they are associated with bindings in enviorements
<shka>
but that's it
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<xificurC>
cool. Are you using any DAG drawing library? I need to draw something and there's actually a lot of choices in quicklisp. Most bind to graphviz in some way, some have close to 0 docs, and then I found psgraph
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<LdBeth>
shka: so symbols just hold its print name?
<shka>
LdBeth: home package, property list
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<shka>
and boundp works on symbols obviously, but saying that symbol stores it's value may lead to inproper conclusions
<shka>
LdBeth: let me check what i am using actually
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<shka>
xificurC: i am using :cl-dot
<shka>
LdBeth: wrong highlight, sorry
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<trittweiler>
xificurC, a package is essentially a hash-table from string to symbol, which is used by the reader to parse identifiers in source files to a unique object (the symbol). In order to make the `x` in "(let ((x 42)) (+ x x))" always refer to the same object. A system is essentially a Lisp object representing an executable plan to build software (i.e. something like a Makefile)
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<pjb>
shka: you cannot load a package.
<pjb>
shka: don't confuse terms.
<pjb>
in CL, packages are only objects of type PACKAGE.
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<pjb>
They're not a bunch of files that can be loaded.
<pjb>
In CL, LOAD only READs and EVALs files. Not anything else.
<shka>
well, point is that package is the code, not the way to load the code
<pjb>
shka: you can load systems, using asdf:oos or ql:quickload.
<pjb>
package is not the code.
<pjb>
package is a data structure containing symbols.
<shka>
yes, it is a lie
<pjb>
packages let you map symbol names to symbols.
<shka>
but it reflects truth :P
<pjb>
It reflects your ignorance of the CL terminology and data types.
<shka>
point is that xificurC is confused, i don't want to confuse him anymore
<shka>
and what is critical in his case is that packages work with readers
<shka>
not with load, not with defsystem
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<shka>
so yeah, it is a shortcut, but human patience has it's limits
<pjb>
When confusion is here it is critical to start writing a dictionary!
<shka>
trust me, I KNOW what is the package
<shka>
what i also know is that pedantic multipage explanation is not what people want from IRC
<pjb>
Or use the glossary that is already written!
<shka>
that won't help to build mental model in newbie
<pjb>
shka: what's pedantic in writing : "loads a fucking system" instead of "loads a package"?
<pjb>
Talking smurf won't help the newbie to build a mental model either1
<pjb>
!
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<jackdaniel>
confusing terminology between systems/packages inhibits building good mental model – these things are often confused and lead to problems
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<shka1>
hej
<shka1>
czy wie ktoś czy plany techniczne programu Apollo są dostępne publicznie?
<shka1>
eeee sorry
<shka1>
wrong channel
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<loginoob>
what are my options after being intermediate with lisp?
<dlowe>
writing programs and libraries that solve problems for people.
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<random-nick>
how do I check if a stream is closed?
<loginoob>
dlowe: what if i cannot think of anything
<dlowe>
random-nick: open-stream-p
<dlowe>
loginoob: talk to people with problems
<loginoob>
ok
<dlowe>
specifically people who can't write their own programs
<random-nick>
dlowe: thank you, I knew I was missing something obvious
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* jasom
doesn't know whether to envy or pity someone who has no problems to solve. It seems both relaxing and boring at the same time.
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* loginoob
jasom should pity me
<jasom>
loginoob: good to know, I won't complain about my problems as much :)
<jasom>
loginoob: but more seriously pay attention to times when you are mildy annoyed. Fixing something that mildly annoys you several times per day can be very rewarding.
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<flip214>
loginoob: find some library, and check for automated tests and good documentation. (perhaps in QL download order?)
<flip214>
repeat.
* jasom
finds it odd how documentation and tests are usually mentioned together, since the documentation is rarely covered by the tests...
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<flip214>
jasom: if there's bad documentation, the behaviour might be inferred by tests.
<flip214>
(or no documentation)
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<shka1>
documentation is surprisingly strongly linked to tests
<shka1>
on human level
<jasom>
I have seen some tools where the output of the examples is generated by actually running them, which ensures that at least the examples are correct.
<shka1>
documentation-utils-extensions can do that
<jasom>
shka1: because most developers dislike writing both?
<jasom>
shka1: so can org mode IIRC
<shka1>
jasom: mostly because writing good documentation requires writing tests
<shka1>
and writing good tests helps writing good documentation
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<shka1>
for instance, writing exceptional-situation documentation is useless without writing tests for those!
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<andomin>
Hello everyone! I know what i am about to ask is very common question but i am not able to figure it out.
<andomin>
I am not able to find a proper answer to why should I learn CL. I have read paul graham's beating the average and other blogs and answers on SE, all of them are too old and now that we have so many new languages that have implemented features from LISP other than macros.
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<andomin>
Sorry for this stupid question but i really want to know
<flip214>
andomin: simple answer: to learn Common Lisp.
<beach>
I think you should wait until you figure out a good reason.
<jgkamat>
I really enjoy writing CL
<flip214>
andomin: and if you already figured out macros as a difference, ain't that enough motivation to dig deeper?
<andomin>
It is
<andomin>
beach what if i am not able to figure it out myself
<beach>
Then you won't ever learn it.
<dlowe>
that's what we're here for
<shka1>
andomin: for fun?
<shka1>
works for me at least
<dlowe>
I've never regretted learning a new thing.
<andomin>
dlowe so please tell me, my main goal is to be a good programmer.. nothing else
<andomin>
shka1 fun is ok but i have limited time in a day
<shka1>
hm, i see
<shka1>
well, common lisp is excellent language for experimentation
<dlowe>
andomin: okay, what evidence would convince you?
<dlowe>
(actually, I meant we were here for helping you learn it)
<shka1>
so you can use it for building stuff in it that you not exactly figured out
<shka1>
but it takes time as well, obviously
<shka1>
also, IF you have proper libraries in CL, it is surprisingly practical language for various tasks
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<shka1>
easy to code, easy to debug, easy to deploy
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<andomin>
Will i be a better programmer if after learning lisp I learn some other language? Will i be able to implement my understanding from lisp in another language if i learn another language someday
<shka1>
implementation can produce fairly efficient code, which is awesome
<dlowe>
andomin: that depends on you
<Bike>
man. it ain't that hard to learn a programming language at a moderate level. new programmers tend to stress about about which they learn but it's not like it even takes as much time as a natural language.
<dlowe>
andomin: I think you're looking for assurances that don't exist
<dlowe>
for anything
<shka1>
andomin: in my opinion programmers should learn CL (or some other lisp) mostly because it is just different
<shka1>
seriously different
<dlowe>
it's not that different anymore :p
<shka1>
and knowing how things work here open eyes on new ways of programming
<dlowe>
due to new languages importing features
<random-nick>
dlowe: I haven't seen a mainstream language with proper metaprogramming yet
<dlowe>
random-nick: you've gated contenders by saying "proper"
<shka1>
andomin: that's everything i can tell on this topic, hope it helps
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<andomin>
shka1 thank you for the help :)
<dlowe>
andomin: Ask yourself if a good programmer knows lots of things or only a few
<andomin>
Lots of things
<dlowe>
andomin: Ask yourself if a good programmer can deal with lots of kinds of languages or only a few?
<andomin>
I see people learning algorithms and do exercises of implementing them in their chosen language but there are no algorithms book in lisp
<dlowe>
Depends on the algorithms
<dlowe>
Principles of AI Programming is all in common lisp.
<dlowe>
Ask yourself if good programmers only do what is popular
<andomin>
No
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<dlowe>
If you're going to know a lot of things, deal with lots of kinds of languages, and not only do what is popular, then I suggest you get started.
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<andomin>
Ok I'll then. Thank you dlowe for taking time to help me in my stupid question
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<dlowe>
Paradigms of AI Programming is probably a good fit for what you want
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<brit>
Hello there. I'm trying to optimize some code that access structures with arrays of type (simple-array (unsigned-byte 8) *) and getting compilation warnings about the upgraded array element type not being known at compile time. How can I fix that to kill the hairy-data-vector-refs? I'm using SBCL.
<Bike>
not sure with-slots on a struct is a good idea... but whatever.
<brit>
The arefs on lines 319 and 320 have the compiler notes attached. The array its referencing is grabbed through with-slots above but declared on the struct as mentioned.
<Bike>
i'd put declarations in the function body as well.
<brit>
Hmm. Maybe the with-slots is disrupting the type inference?
<Bike>
it might be.
<brit>
Yeah, okay. I should've thought of that. Good idea! :)
<Bike>
if you try macroexpanding it, it will probably result in nt-buffer being replaced with (slot-value ppu 'nt-buffer) or something.
<brit>
Sure, I would just assume that slot-value is _faster_ than going through standard acessors.
<brit>
Yeah, declaring locally fixed it. Hmm. Guess I need to tweak my mental model a bit.
<Bike>
slot-value is probably slower than accessors.
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<Bike>
mainly because any accessor is unique to a slot, while slot-value has tolook up the slot, in general.
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<Bike>
struct accessors can be very fast indeed. maybe just a memory grab.
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<brit>
Okay. Excellent. I've got some things to go patch up. Thank you, Bike!
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<klltkr>
If you don't use linux it's probably not going to be of interest
<jmercouris>
I don't use Linux
<jmercouris>
I use FreeBSD
<klltkr>
FreeBSD is adding Wayland support I think
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<kenster>
Hey, I have a stupid question. In a macro, how do I turn ((something :int) (another :int)) into ('(something :int) '(another :int)) while also spreading those parameters with ,@ ?
<kenster>
I have a macro that calls a macro, and both macros use ,@
<kenster>
I'm trying to pass in ((temporary-location :string) (content-type :string) (tags :pointer) (wantsOwned :int)) into defcfun, but without evaulating "temporary-string" as a function
<kenster>
my brain gets confuzzled by the quoting rules when using ,@ on rest parameters into a macro that uses ,@ on rest parameters into another macro
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<pierpa>
if the backquote notation confuses you then use normal list operations
<kenster>
well, I just need to figure out the write level of quoting. I thought something like `(,@((blah :test))) would work
<pierpa>
but why? unless there's an obfuscated CL context I haven't heard about, there's no prize for the most obscure piece of CL one can come around with.
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<kenster>
I guess you're right pierpa, though I thought my case was at least somewhat common
<pierpa>
hmmm
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<stylewarning>
I'm lacking on a bit of CLOS hygiene. In the construction of an instance of a class, where's the proper place to check that an initarg is supplied, and when can I assume the slot as been bound?
<stylewarning>
All in an :AFTER method of initialize-instance?
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<stylewarning>
Is initialize-instance the right place to set other slots of that instance based on a computation of supplied initargs/bound slots too?
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<stylewarning>
For the first question, PCL suggests using :initform (error ..)
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<stylewarning>
For the second question, PCL reminds us that the primary method of initialize-instance on standard-objects will take care of slots being bound, so I can assume it will be in the :after.
<stylewarning>
For the third question, PCL says the :after method of initialize-instance is the right place.
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<Bike>
the slots are bound in shared-initialize's primary method
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<Bike>
so yes, initialize instance :after
<makomo>
kenster: do you want to do that within defcmethod?
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<makomo>
kenster: from my experience, ',@ is usually not a good idea because you end up with (quote x1 x2 ... xn) which is invalid since QUOTE only takes a single argument
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<kenster>
makomo: I'm trying to pass the types into defcfun while retaining the &body of my macro which gets shoved into a defmethod
<makomo>
if the list happens to have 1 element, i.e. n = 1, then it works
<kenster>
(defcmethod file-upload-info "new" new :pointer nil
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<makomo>
hm well, defcmethod is a macro so you can
<kenster>
that's what I'm very confused about
<makomo>
why are you doing ',@ in defcmethod when calling cffi-defun though?
<kenster>
it keeps giving me that "invalid function" call stuff
<kenster>
well because I need to apply the defcfun arguments as &rest arguments
<Bike>
((blah :test)) is definitely an invalid function call
<kenster>
defcfun takes an arbitrary amount of (t :type) type lists
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<kenster>
so I want the ((blah :test)) to be remain quoted even after both ,@s
<makomo>
kenster: oh i see. well just get rid of the ' then
<kenster>
where?
<makomo>
then ',@(when ...)
<makomo>
the*
<makomo>
why do you have to quote it if cffi-defun is itself a macro
<makomo>
just splice it in using ,@ and leave it be
<makomo>
looking at the expansion after that fix, i get the expected result
<makomo>
in emacs, with the point on the beginning paren of the defcmethod call, C-c C-m to macroexpand
<kenster>
for some reason it doesn't expand for me I have no idea why
<kenster>
but anyway I still get the error
<kenster>
invalid function call
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<kenster>
I think it's because I have the macros defined in a separate file, for some reason it doesn't expand all the way? or I don't know, slime is just confused
<makomo>
kenster: hm i'm not sure, i never had a problem
<pjb>
kenster: `(,@((blah :test))) cannot work in Common Lisp, unless you redefine the reader macro for #\(. ((something)) is never a Common Lisp form, if you assume the standard reader macro for #\(!
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<kenster>
hmmm this is weird, I removed the ` from the when as you said, and I still get the same error
<makomo>
the apostrophe, not the backquote, but i guess that's what you meant
<makomo>
keep analyzing further, what is defcfun ?
<makomo>
kenster: should be good then. what pjb said is what we fixed basically, no need to quote that thing since it's being passed into another macro
<kenster>
there's something wrong with my environment then
<kenster>
I'm using slime-load-system to load it, is that wrong?
<kenster>
I'm livestreaming right now so maybe you can see my setup
<makomo>
kenster: your (defmethod ...) thing looks weird though
<makomo>
nice terminal, loved running emacsclient in it lol
<aeth>
If you're writing advanced macros, use destructuring-bind everywhere where you had to put &rest or something like that. It helps.
<aeth>
There's usually a very simple syntax that you need to enforce.
<pjb>
kenster: macro can use macros in two different ways: a macro can use another macro in its body, so that the other macro is expanded when the first macro is compiled, and the expansion of the other macro is evaluated when the first macro is expanded. Or the firs macro can use the other macro in its expansion, ie. its result, and therefore the other macro will be expanded when the expansion of the first macro is compiled.
<pjb>
In the first case, the arguments to the other macro cannot be the values bound to the parameters of the first macro, since those values are not known yet.
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<pjb>
In the later case, you can of course splice the parameters of the first macro into the calls to the other macro in the expansion.
<kenster>
were you watching for the last few minutes makomo
<makomo>
kenster: it wasn't live on yt i think, i just opened the twitch stream
<kenster>
oh
<makomo>
oh btw, that defmethod looks wrong to me
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<kenster>
pjb: that makes sense
<makomo>
shouldn't the if be run when constructing the list?
<asarch>
How would I turn on the option to show the closing parenthesis in Emacs?
<makomo>
you want that to be within the expansion right?
<makomo>
the let and the apply
<makomo>
right, so that should work then
<makomo>
you should be able to just use quicklisp to load the system, no?
<makomo>
add the directory with the ASDF file to quicklisp's "local projects"
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<makomo>
so then ql:register-local-projects and ql:quickload
<makomo>
oh i see, so you've got it set up, ok
<makomo>
hmm, i'm not completely sure if it recompiles, i guess?
<makomo>
ah i see, so one of the macros itself is wrong
<asarch>
Thank you pjb!
<asarch>
Thank you very much :-)
<makomo>
kenster: can you expand bit by bit until you hit the error
<makomo>
you can expand within the window that shows up
<makomo>
hmm, i'm not sure why it's giving you that error, defcfun should be a macro
<makomo>
it shoudln't be trying to evaluate it
<makomo>
go into the window on the right and try to macroexpand-1 that
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<makomo>
hmm lol, maybe it really isn't a macro within your current image
<makomo>
try reloading the whole lisp maybe?
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<makomo>
and where is defcmethod, in what file? how does your asdf file look again? is it being loaded before this faulty file?
<makomo>
can you open cffi-utils?
<makomo>
LOL
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<makomo>
you aren't importing cffi-utils i think?
<makomo>
well, "using"*
<makomo>
the filebucket package isn't using cffi-utils though, it shouldn't be able to see the macro then, unless you explicitly qualify it with cffi-utils:defcfun
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<makomo>
try USEing cffi-utils within DEFPACKAGE for filebucket maybe
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<makomo>
yeah, i don't get why it's not treating it as a macro
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<makomo>
yeah, i always use quicklisp's quickload
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<makomo>
also, look at Quickproject, you can get it from Quicklisp as wlel
<makomo>
well*
<makomo>
quickproject:make-project to make a project skeleton
<esrarkesh>
is usocket what everyone uses when they do socket programming with cl?
<makomo>
kenster: i don't think so, quicklisp should work fine.
<pjb>
sometimes.
<makomo>
kenster: can you manually try and eval DEFCFUN's macro definition?
<pjb>
(macroexpand-1 '(defcfun …))
<pjb>
(pprint (macroexpand-1 '(defcfun …))) ; when it's long.
<makomo>
kenster: oh wait no, defcmethod i guess
<makomo>
kenster: slime-eval-defun from anywhere within the top-level form
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<makomo>
kenster: , e f in spacemacs
<makomo>
can you try and see if you get autocompletion from within the slime repl if you do "cffi-utils:defme..."?
<makomo>
you typed "cff" instead of "cffi" :D
<makomo>
kenster: yeah, i guess it might be using just a text-based autocompletion. whatever. try running the (defcmethod ...) thing from the repl now
<makomo>
>undefined function DEFCMETHOD
<makomo>
lol, what the
<makomo>
the FILE-UPLOAD-INFO variable is unbound because it's trying to evaluate it, it's the same problem i think
<makomo>
it's treating DEFCMETHOD as a function for some reason
<makomo>
kenster: maybe try moving the macros at the top of filebucket.lisp just to see if it'll work?
<makomo>
oh LOL, did you export it?
<makomo>
you exported the symbols, right? :DDD
<makomo>
in your defpackage, after (:use ...) add (:export #:defcmethod)