lapinou changed the topic of #ocaml to: Discussions about the OCaml programming language | http://caml.inria.fr/ | http://www.ocaml.org | OCaml 4.01.0 announce at http://bit.ly/1851A3R | Public logs at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/ocaml/
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<neutronest> How to solve MachineLearning problem with Ocaml...
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<appleby> hey guys
<appleby> I think I got merlin working
<appleby> but C-c C-t just says buffer has no process
<appleby> hello e o e o ?
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<companion_cube> o/
<Kakadu> TT
<companion_cube> you need sleep!
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<Kakadu> why?
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<wwilly> bonjour
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<flux> react or froc, which one is better? or easier to use? or more suitable for dealing with Gtk?
<companion_cube> I think react is quite popular, but I don't know nothing about it interacting with gtk
<Drup> react
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<Drup> and lablgtk has react stuff I think, adrien did FRP stuff with both
<Drup> but definitly, react is nicer
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<flux> lablgtk has react stuff?
<flux> oh, lablgtk-react exists
<flux> not sure if it really exists, it's not in opam ;)
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<adrien_oww> flux: well, lablgtk-react is a bit special
<adrien_oww> lots of experimentation went into it
<adrien_oww> at some point it was fairly complex code but I ended up realizing it was too complex to use
<adrien_oww> and now it's only a few lines
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<adrien_oww> flux: have a look at slide 26 (iirc) of http://notk.org/~adrien/lablgtk_oups_intro.pdf
<adrien_oww> and first experiment was to put react right into lablgtk, and you'd use something else instead of #connect
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<pippijn> does ocamlbuild parallel build work?
<pippijn> it doesn't seem to work
* companion_cube no surprised
<pippijn> with -j 8: 33.775 total
<adrien_oww> it works
<pippijn> without -j: 34.754 total
<adrien_oww> but ocamlbuild doesn't find many targets to build in parallel
<pippijn> hm
<pippijn> well, I have a bunch of C++ files
<pippijn> that do not depend on each other's product
<adrien_oww> but ocamlbuild doesn't find many targets to build in parallel
<pippijn> and they are not built in parallel
<adrien_oww> ergh
<adrien_oww> wrong term
<adrien_oww> yes because ocamlbuild dynamically discovers the build deps for each file
<adrien_oww> so it will first have to look at a given file to determine when to build it
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<flux> adrien_oww, I think it's enough for me to just make some buttons active/inactive with reactive-callbacks depending on some values in my program
<flux> and maybe even better this way to not use any lablgtk-specific reactiveness, it is easier to possibly switch to lablqt later on!
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<Drup> pippijn: basically : yes ocamlbuild can build in //, but the way it parallelize is crap.
<adrien_oww> flux: the approach I highlight in the pdf doesn't depend on anything in lablgtk
<Drup> because the scheduling is dynamic, and it's very hard to parallelize with dynamic scheduling
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<troydm> what does |> operator do?
<hcarty> flux: I played around with lablgtk + React a bit in a simpler form - https://github.com/hcarty/gtk-light/blob/master/gtk_light.ml#L103
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<hcarty> troydm: It applies the function on the right to the value on the left (ex. x |> f = f x)
<troydm> hcarty: http://cranialburnout.blogspot.ca/2013/09/database-radiation-hazard.html <- that doesn't looks to me that way
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<hcarty> troydm: That's what it's doing. Think of it as | in a shell.
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<troydm> hcarty: is that monadic bind? like in haskell >>=
<troydm> hcarty: no, i think that's probably not it
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<troydm> freling: i don't see any reference to |> in that chapter
<troydm> ohh wait
<troydm> ic
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<justinfront> hi is anyone using ocamljava ?
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<appleby> appleby: hey guys
<appleby> [8:57pm] appleby: I think I got merlin working
<appleby> [8:58pm] appleby: but C-c C-t just says buffer has no process
<appleby> [9:02pm] appleby: hello e o e o ?
<def-lkb> hello
<def-lkb> is ocamlmerlin binary in PATH ?
<appleby> so whats with my merlin do u think
<appleby> how do i tell that
<def-lkb> hmmm
<def-lkb> run M-x shell-command
<def-lkb> which ocamlmerlin
<appleby> says no match
<appleby> M-x which-ocamlmerlin
<def-lkb> Nono, M-x shell-command
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<appleby> says shell command failed
<ggole> Or just M-!
<appleby> (Shell command failed with code 1 and no output)
<appleby> user-error: Minibuffer window is not active
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<def-lkb> Ok, so you don't have ocaml in path.
<def-lkb> You have to run emacs from a context where opam configuration is sourced.
<appleby> ok how do i do this
<appleby> i'm on a mac
<def-lkb> I got that part.
<def-lkb> hmmm, maybe there is an emacs mode for configuring opam
<def-lkb> (any opam guy here :) ?)
<def-lkb> do you know how to launch emacs from a terminal ?
<appleby> no sorry
<def-lkb> np
<appleby> i mean i can do merlin-mode
<appleby> just not C-c C-t
<def-lkb> sure, the process can't be launched because the binary is not in path
<appleby> k
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<def-lkb> PATH is an environment variable that tells where to search for binaries
<def-lkb> when you run a terminal and the opam snippet to setup environment, path is adjusted
<ggole> Could be because the opam setup junk is in .bashrc, which isn't used by your desktop environment
<def-lkb> when you run emacs from the finder, it inherits from the original profile, without your local opam installation
<def-lkb> ggole: yes exactly
<ggole> Easy to check: start an emacs from the shell and see if M-! which ocamlmerlin succeeds.
<def-lkb> ggole: backlog
<ggole> Oh, yeah :)
<def-lkb> :)
<appleby> i'm not sure how to do emacs from shell
<appleby> on my mac
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<def-lkb> what is your version of emacs? bare emacs from osx, or aquamacs ?
<appleby> Shell command:
<appleby> Version 24.3 (9.0)
<ggole> Try just "emacs" first
<appleby> ok
<appleby> that works
<ggole> Now M-! which ocamlmerlin
<ggole> (In *that* emacs.)
<appleby> I cant' do mx
<ggole> ESC x then
<appleby> okay
<appleby> that works
<appleby> I get the path to
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<appleby> a
<appleby> why can't i type
<ggole> OK, then you need to figure out where to put the opam setup code so that your desktop environment will see the results.
<appleby> ok
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<appleby> why the hell does my message not show up in irc
<ggole> I don't know how to do that for Mac. You may have luck with ~/.profile, though.
<appleby> well I don't know, but I just figured that if I edited my ~/.emacs file with the merlin settings, things would work
<appleby> I guess not?
<def-lkb> appleby: you can still run the graphical emacs from the terminal, with e.g. open /Applications/Aquamacs.app
<def-lkb> as long as the emacs process is started from the shell with opam settings, things will work
<appleby> I don't have aquamacs
<def-lkb> well replace the path by your version of emacs :D, maybe Emacs.app
<appleby> okay
<appleby> nice
<appleby> works
<appleby> wow cool
<appleby> it works
<appleby> i can even do C-c C-t
<def-lkb> ok, now there may be some way to apply those settings directly from finder
<def-lkb> or more likely, there is an emacs extension to select opam profile at runtime
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<itadder> hi
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<pippijn> hi
<itadder> hi
<itadder> is this normal desktop http://snag.gy/mHrWU.jpg or messy for a develooer
<pippijn> I don't know what I'm looking at
<itadder> that my desktop
<pippijn> but it looks like you zoomed out of all windows
<itadder> on my 13 inch mac
<itadder> all my virtual desktop
<pippijn> ok
<pippijn> seems fine
<pippijn> I have 12 virtual desktops
<itadder> IT a zoomed view of my vitual deskto
<itadder> oh wow
<itadder> pippijn: do you use kde or gnome or mac
<pippijn> usually 5 are used
<pippijn> sometimes 7
<pippijn> sometimes 8
<pippijn> itadder: xmonad
<Drup> I pop more desktop as I need them
<Drup> so, from 3 to 6/7
<itadder> that a great workflow
<itadder> So no tmux needed
<pippijn> itadder: https://paste.xinu.at/6N9/
<itadder> oh wow I see irssi and vim
<itadder> I need to get back on irssi, and ZNC
<itadder> ubuntu sweet, you like that distro
<pippijn> I don't like it
<pippijn> but it's one of the least crappy ones
<pippijn> or less crappy
<itadder> is that your work pc or you code from home
<pippijn> both
<pippijn> when I'm at home, I have less screen space
<pippijn> usually the irc window is on the left screen
<pippijn> and I'm coding on the right screen
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<pippijn> occasionally some code is open on the left screen, as well
<itadder> do you use emacs or vim
<pippijn> vim
<itadder> nice
<itadder> what your opnion on programing on a mac
<pippijn> my colleague does it, and he seems to do fine
<pippijn> https://paste.xinu.at/fccHo2/ocaml <- is there any way to get this to work?
<itadder> I am new to ocaml, I heard it good lang to learn if your in the hedge fund space
<pippijn> haha
<pippijn> that is if you want to work at jane street
<Drup> hedge fund ?
<pippijn> itadder: it's good to learn for a lot of reasons
<itadder> oh
<itadder> yea I work in NYC
<itadder> but not at jane street
<itadder> what is ocaml good for
<pippijn> writing programs
<itadder> I am omming from a powershell ruby background
<pippijn> especially programs manipulating complex data structures
<itadder> Ahh that make sense
<itadder> simmilar to Rlang
<itadder> maybe not
<Drup> not really similar to rlang, no
<itadder> Yea
<itadder> would I have a hard time learning ocaml form a ruby background
<Drup> proabably, but it would be very worthwhile
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<itadder> I was told a huge demand for ocaml and f#
<itadder> developers
<def-lkb> pippijn: and v () = (default ~v:myvisit ())
<pippijn> def-lkb: ah yes, but I want to use v from myvisit
<pippijn> sorry, I'll amend the testcase
* def-lkb need more context
<pippijn> I'll provide it
* def-lkb needs* (but I'm french, so I guess that's ok)
<adrien> it's not!
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<adrien> you should be ashamed
<def-lkb> not on Friday
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<pippijn> the explicit record definition works
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<pippijn> what my code actually looks like right now is: https://paste.xinu.at/OEWM/ocaml
<pippijn> oh
<pippijn> so the problem is that I need to define defaults for all record members
<pippijn> I would like to do something like { default with map_stmt }
<def-lkb> ok so, the expression is rejected because you are doing computations refering to not yet defined values
<pippijn> what value is that?
<def-lkb> v
<pippijn> right
<def-lkb> when defining v, you pass myvisit to default
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<def-lkb> by myvisit is a function that can refers to v… which is not yet defined
<pippijn> yes
<pippijn> so it's not "statically defined" or something
<def-lkb> the authorised constructions are either value constructors or abstractions
<def-lkb> yes
<pippijn> statically constructive
<def-lkb> or lazy values
<def-lkb> yes
<pippijn> ok, so there is no good way to do this?
<def-lkb> depends on what you exactly want to achieve
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<pippijn> this record is a vtable
<pippijn> I want to provide defaults
<pippijn> those defaults need to access the vtable
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<pippijn> because they need to pass it to the "visit v st e" function
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<def-lkb> ok, you want to pass the final vtable to default, but the vtable itself is defined using default
<def-lkb> you need some way to tie the knot
<pippijn> right
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<def-lkb> why not pass the vtable from default ?
<def-lkb> since the final table is actually built by default
<def-lkb> pippijn: http://pastebin.com/atcxipZY
<pippijn> ah
<pippijn> yes, I wanted to avoid this
<def-lkb> ok
<pippijn> the whole option thing is also quite bad
<pippijn> matching it on every call to the visitor function
<def-lkb> go lazy ? http://pastebin.com/EJ6EwNU8
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<pippijn> hmm
<pippijn> okay
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<def-lkb> not really satisfying, I agree
<appleby> hey def-lkb
<appleby> def-lkb: ok, now there may be some way to apply those settings directly from finder
<appleby> [11:34am] def-lkb: or more likely, there is an emacs extension to select opam profile at runtime
<appleby> any idea how I would go about this
<appleby> ?
<def-lkb> I don't use emacs, I can't really help you.
<appleby> =-\
<def-lkb> At least, you are not alone :)
<appleby> haha
<appleby> hey that worked
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<appleby> nvm
<appleby> not sure if it did
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<appleby> i mean it makes which ocamlmerlin work
<appleby> but not C-c C-t
<def-lkb> yeah, it's faking the shell
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<def-lkb> appleby: this one looks good
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<appleby> which one though =-\
<appleby> the guy says it's not very elegant and he does a lot of shell trickery
<appleby> lol
<def-lkb> the 3 lines starting by "; Set OPAM …"
<def-lkb> put this in your .emacs
<appleby> you mean the 2 lines?
<appleby> doesn't work
<appleby> i got this
<appleby> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading `/Users/zhumatthew/.emacs':
<appleby> Wrong type argument: listp, /bin/bash:
<def-lkb> can you share your .emacs?
<appleby> (load "~/.elisp/tuareg-mode/tuareg-site-file")
<appleby> (add-to-list 'load-path "/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp")
<appleby> (require 'merlin)
<appleby> (add-hook 'tuareg-mode-hook 'merlin-mode)
<appleby> (dolist (var (car (read-from-string (shell-command-to-string "opam config env --sexp"))))
<appleby> (setenv (car var) (cadr var)))
<def-lkb> ok, now run M-x shell-command which opam
<appleby> failed
<def-lkb> good
<appleby> ok haha
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<LinearInterpol> Is there any way to use OCaml on bare metal?
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<companion_cube> LinearInterpol: not afaik (there's a kind of compiler to Pic though)
<companion_cube> but you can try Mirage, which runs ocaml directly on top of Xen
<LinearInterpol> I can't compile to native code?
<companion_cube> sure you can
<LinearInterpol> But I can't just specify "no libraries" can I.
<companion_cube> but it still relies on some external OS to manage memory, etc. (afaik)
<LinearInterpol> Ah, damn.
<companion_cube> well I mean virtual memory, for instance
<companion_cube> but I'm no expert, maybe someone will know better
<LinearInterpol> I'd like to treat it like I do my C toolchain.
<LinearInterpol> Just for fun. :)
<LinearInterpol> I traversed Haskell for a bit and if I can use a similar language for something like embedded development..
<LinearInterpol> Without relying on any sort of external libraries, that is.. It'd be really nice to experience. :)
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<def-lkb> LinearInterpol: that's the purpose of mirage, you don't even rely on a OS, but you still need Xen
<LinearInterpol> I'd rather not have a layer between myself and the metal.
<def-lkb> so it depends on the kind of metal behind bare metal
<LinearInterpol> Yeah..
<LinearInterpol> Oh well, thanks anyway. :)
<def-lkb> what is your target?
<def-lkb> np
<LinearInterpol> eh, any 486-compatible system without a layer between myself and the bare metal.
<LinearInterpol> though thinking about it it wouldn't make much sense. :)
<LinearInterpol> given the language involved.
<def-lkb> that's why xen is a good compromise
<LinearInterpol> It is, but then I'm relying on an underlying layer of abstraction still.
<LinearInterpol> Thanks for your time. :)
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<bitbckt> it's best just to write ucode and skip the decode phase. it's a useless abstraction.
* bitbckt goes back to toggling switches
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<tobiasBora> Hello,
<tobiasBora> I send data over the net (basiquely I serialize/deserialize an array) and I'd like to check the integrity of the package received because I've strange results when I have to many connections, and I wonder if a "mix" cannot be made during the connection.
<tobiasBora> How could I make something like a md5 sum of an array ? (I need something fast enough)
<def-lkb> use cryptokit
<def-lkb> it gives you access to various hashing functions
<tobiasBora> def-lkb: Thank you. I think it's not a default library ?
<def-lkb> not a default one indeed
<tobiasBora> I will have a look thank you.
<def-lkb> by default you have Digest which computes MD5
<def-lkb> but the interface is limited and not very convenient
<tobiasBora> And it's possible to send in entry any package ?
<tobiasBora> *type
<def-lkb> ??
<def-lkb> I guess you have to marshal if you want to hash arbitrary values.
<tobiasBora> I mean, you can make a md5 sum of any object ?
<def-lkb> hashing is done on string
<tobiasBora> Ok
<def-lkb> not on arbitrary structured values (out of context, it doesn't make really sense)
<tobiasBora> Yes indeed
<tobiasBora> I will try it thank you
<def-lkb> np
<tobiasBora> And is there a way to catch any exception with try...with exc ->... And print in ascii the name of the exception ?
<def-lkb> Printexc.to_string
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<tobiasBora> Oh thank you soo much !!!
<tobiasBora> And is there a way to convert a personal type like "type foo = Bar | Foo;;" in a string ?
<def-lkb> no
<def-lkb> not without extensions
<def-lkb> well
<def-lkb> if it's for hashing
<def-lkb> you can get a string of the internal representation: it won't be human readable, but it's ok for hashing
<tobiasBora> Ok. My question was more linked with human readability, I thought that if it was possible with exception it could be possible with personal types.
<tobiasBora> (for debug issues)
<def-lkb> not possible
<tobiasBora> And what kind of extensions are you talking about ?
<def-lkb> camlp4 syntax extensions, like type-conv
<tobiasBora> (Marshal is really practical !)
<def-lkb> those will generate the boilerplate to go from and to strnigs
<def-lkb> strings*
<def-lkb> (yet but unsafe, and there are some cornercases)
<def-lkb> (not everything is "marshallable")
<tobiasBora> Ok thank you. I need to study more about camlp4 this summer !
<def-lkb> have fun :P
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<tobiasBora> Yes, and that's because it's unsafe that I will need to check what I get...
<itadder> is it hard to install ocaml and program on mac
<def-lkb> depends on your actual knowledge
<def-lkb> if you're ok with shell, emacs and/or vim, it will be easy
<itadder> I am okay with VIM and sublime text
<itadder> I can okay with zsh somewhat
<tobiasBora> Thank you def-lkb for your help !
<def-lkb> ok, so you should probably start by installing opam
<tobiasBora> Opam doesn't need ocaml ?
<itadder> do I need a package manager
<itadder> brew instal opam
<def-lkb> tobiasBora: :D, there are some binary distribution that don't need a system ocaml
<itadder> oh it worked
<def-lkb> the ocaml package manager is called opam
<itadder> I did brew install opam
<itadder> what do I tell what version was installed
<itadder> I forget sytnax in zsh
<itadder> which opam
<def-lkb> it is similar to gem / hackage / npm / …
<itadder> sorry for my lack of history on ocaml, who created this
<def-lkb> s/hackage/cabal
<itadder> oh
<def-lkb> you have to install opam separately
<itadder> oh
<itadder> I am under the impressionthat ocaml was created by devlopers at the hedgefund jane street
<def-lkb> ocaml was created by INRIA, a french research institution
<itadder> jane street capital
<itadder> oh
<itadder> so what connection is thier to jane street
<tobiasBora> def-lkb: Ok. Is it the majority of binaries or not ?
<itadder> oh a quantaive trading firm
<itadder> it doing make world and make opt right now
<def-lkb> jane street choose to use ocaml because the language offers one of the best compromise between high performance, high level programming and safety
<def-lkb> (well, i am taking some shortcuts but if you are interested, I guess real world ocaml book offer you a more accurate story)
<itadder> ahh
<itadder> yea I would need a ocaml book
<itadder> to start or a how to
<itadder> for a noob
<def-lkb> real world ocaml, freely available online
<itadder> I feel bad for programing book authors now it so easy to find free ebooks online
<itadder> how they ever make money I am not sure
<def-lkb> well in this case, they decided to publish it for free :)
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<itadder> oh it says Utop and and then merlin
<itadder> def-lkb: what I need java
<itadder> why do I need java runtime
<def-lkb> you don't need java :D
<itadder> oh I just got a popup for java c
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<itadder> to open javac you java version 6 I said no
<def-lkb> It might be completely unrelated… Maybe it's just the daily security update, or you're victim of the exploit of the day if the update came a bit late =)
<itadder> hopefully I did not break anything
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<itadder> I do not even have java on my Mac
<itadder> I refuse to install it
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<def-lkb> there is really no need for java (no jvm here :P)
<itadder> I am sorry if I am asking to much question I am a very hyperactive person :)
<itadder> great I said no
<def-lkb> np, but for my part, I am going to leave soon
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<itadder> okay are you at work
<def-lkb> good luck with the book & your setup :)
<itadder> yea I did $ brew install opam
<itadder> thanks def-lkb
<def-lkb> well, it's 2 am in my timezone, but I am partially at work (db maintenance… night work)
<itadder> I am very adhd person but I wish to learn
<itadder> at wow I am in NYC it 8 pm
<itadder> good ngiht
<def-lkb> thx, have fun