<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg opened issue #206: Allow signal generator IBIS file name / model name to be configured - https://git.io/JJaXo
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg opened issue #207: Allow signal generator sample/symbol rate to be configured - https://git.io/JJaXK
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<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg opened issue #208: When a channel is renamed, filters that use it as an input should also be renamed if they are using default names - https://git.io/JJaDo
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal-apps] azonenberg labeled issue #154: Allow hidden filters to be added to display - https://git.io/JJaD6
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal-apps] azonenberg opened issue #154: Allow hidden filters to be added to display - https://git.io/JJaD6
<Kliment>
azonenberg: embedding and channel cancellation :P
<azonenberg>
Kliment: lol
<Kliment>
Seriously nice though
<Kliment>
I'm learning to VNA for an antenna design
<azonenberg>
Kliment: for reference, this is the sort of thing that scope vendors normally charge four or five digits for
<azonenberg>
lol
<Kliment>
I know :)
<Kliment>
ohnoes, we have to do math! Math costs money!
<Kliment>
I mean, I get their logic - they can't sell base models for a high price because competition, so they try to split out as much as possible into addons
<azonenberg>
Yeah
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<katharina>
o/
<azonenberg>
o/ katharina
<azonenberg>
glad to see you back
<azonenberg>
Hope you're recovering well?
<katharina>
its slow but steady, im now at a point where i can take steps without breaking into a massive sweat
<azonenberg>
Sounds unpleasant but at least heading in the right direction
<katharina>
exactly, but on the other hand you can notice daily improvements
<azonenberg>
Yay
<azonenberg>
as you can see from my tweets we've been busy here :)
<katharina>
yes! also from all the new contributors fixing issues in the protocols etc
<katharina>
awesome how the project has grown
<azonenberg>
Yeah it's definitely building momentum
<azonenberg>
I was chatting with Shahriar the other day about having him do a signalpath video on it at some point once it's a bit more polished
<katharina>
oh wow, i love his channel
<azonenberg>
That should be good advertising, but it's not to that point yet
<azonenberg>
My scope probe will be getting a review there soonish though
<katharina>
thats awesome! ill be definitely watching that video
<azonenberg>
i'm starting the production assembly of the kickstarter probes on monday
<katharina>
does the software still build on windows?
<azonenberg>
all of the boards and components are here and i did one
<azonenberg>
but waiting for my lab tech to be available to help me with the big run
<azonenberg>
No. There's a few regressions in some of the recent code, but it should be trivial to fix
<azonenberg>
i actually have a working copy with some of those fixes
<katharina>
i think that would be a good thing for me to get back into programming if there are fixes left to do
<katharina>
i also have been writing some verilog yesterday and that has been going ok
<azonenberg>
Not sure if you saw my tweet, but I sold my waverunner 8104 back to LeCroy as a trade-in
<azonenberg>
and replaced it with a shiny new (to me) WaveRunner 8404M-MS, which is the same family but quite the upgrade on specs
<katharina>
oh i saw the one where you had glscopeclient running on it
<azonenberg>
10/20 to 20/40 Gsps, and 1 -> 4 GHz
<azonenberg>
and yes
<azonenberg>
i got glscopeclient to build and run on it. Which is quite the milestone :D
<azonenberg>
But i had to comment out a few things and patch a few tidbits
<katharina>
jesus that are some beefy spec upgrades
<azonenberg>
this is what happens when our windows maintainer gets sick :p
<azonenberg>
katharina: yeah but for the kinds of work i do it's totally necessary - in fact, not even enough
<azonenberg>
but closer to what i need than what i had before
<azonenberg>
it's my only scope for the next week or two
<azonenberg>
My other LeCroy, the HDO9204, is the same sample rate but only 2 GHz bandwidth (10 bit resolution though). It's out sick at the moment
<azonenberg>
Channel 4 had a really weird malfunction at high gain settings in 50 ohm mode where it appears to be AC coupling instead of DC
<azonenberg>
I sent it back to the dealer i bought it from, they confirmed it failed their internal cal and that whatever was wrong was beyond their ability to diagnose
<katharina>
i hope ill manage to have some time to get into RF some day, it seems like such an interesting field
<azonenberg>
So it's now back at LeCroy's lab for further debug and repair
<katharina>
im just sitting here with my FPGA solutions at work running at 100 MHz tops lmao
<azonenberg>
Lol. I'm mostly a high speed digital guy, i got dragged kicking and screaming into RF
<azonenberg>
because i got into high speed networking and such, and *sob* my wires aren't wires anymore
<azonenberg>
and my signals don't transition instantly and travel down ideal conductors anymore
<azonenberg>
in zero time
<azonenberg>
So i'm being forced to learn all of the stuff i need to make my stuff faster, and then getting into test equipment is making me learn even more analog and DSP
<azonenberg>
but ultimately the goal is still building fast digital stuff
<katharina>
:)
<azonenberg>
I just need to do analog stuff to debug it :p
<azonenberg>
Anyway, so if you're feeling up to it priority #1 for you is the handful of tweaks to get my recent changes to compile on windows again
<katharina>
sure i think i wanna do that right about now after i devoured this cold pizza from yesterday
<azonenberg>
Longer term a windows CI system that logs to this channel might not be a bad idea, so i can get immediately notified if a commit breaks the build on a platform other than the one i'm developing on
<azonenberg>
I might still expect you to *fix* the problem in that case, but at least we'd know about it right away
<azonenberg>
Your #2 priority is to get the preferences dialog and surrounding stuff to the point it's ready to get merged
<azonenberg>
We have quite a few pending things that will require creation of preferences
<azonenberg>
More so than the startup dialog and other ui-dev work. While very nice, that work isn't blocking anyone else and the preferences dialog is
<azonenberg>
So i want that in master ASAP so we can all start building on it :)
<katharina>
gotcha
<katharina>
ill get the windows build working today, lets see how exhausting that is for me
<azonenberg>
Good luck
<katharina>
i think its a good start to get back into doing actual work
<azonenberg>
Glad to have you back
<noopwafel>
\o/
<azonenberg>
ok so, does anybody have pressing priorities for me to work on tonight?
<azonenberg>
Probably going to be spending most of the weekend getting MAXWELL ready to go, and doing non-test-equipment related work around the house etc. And cable plant work in the lab
<katharina>
azonenberg: could you send me a diff of the windows issues you fixed in your local working copyß
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<azonenberg>
katharina: it was one usleep and some #include paths not resolving right on my msys
<azonenberg>
i think that was it?
<azonenberg>
it should be pretty trivial if you just pull latest and compile
<azonenberg>
iirc my msys wanted ffts/ffts.h not ffts.h
<azonenberg>
but that may have just been me installing it wrong :p
<bvernoux>
azonenberg, very nice your latest video with DeEmbedded
<bvernoux>
and Emulation
<bvernoux>
will be nice to extend glscope to an other tool glvna ;)
<azonenberg>
VNA will come after specan support
<bvernoux>
ha great
<azonenberg>
if ever
<azonenberg>
While i want to add vna support to scopehal it will likely be a separate UI
<azonenberg>
similar to power supplies and DMMs
<bvernoux>
the deEmbedded stuff will be welcome for the XYY view in glvna ;)
<bvernoux>
also a way to compare sxp file
<bvernoux>
like PocketVNA
<azonenberg>
but i guess you could use glscopeclient for that
<azonenberg>
yes there is a lack of good s-parameter viewers out there
<azonenberg>
like i mentioned i mostly use sonnet for that
<bvernoux>
so far there is not any good GUI for VNA SxP files
<bvernoux>
all suxx ;)
<azonenberg>
Re specan support, the big holdup is that i dont own a specan :p
<bvernoux>
yes but sonnet is ugly for sxp files ;)
<azonenberg>
what's ugly about it?
<bvernoux>
the display
<azonenberg>
i like it quite a lot, more than anything else i've used
<bvernoux>
and the GUI is awful to zoom in/out a...
<azonenberg>
i mean i wouldn't buy it for the viewer but if i have it, i'll use it as my general sxp viewer until i find something better
<bvernoux>
test PocketVNA you will understand ;)
<bvernoux>
it is the best so far
<bvernoux>
but it does not support DeEmbedding ...
<bvernoux>
It is why glVNA will be welcome to rule them all
<bvernoux>
adding relatime and offline mode
<bvernoux>
realtime
<bvernoux>
especially if it can support GPIB instrument over USB...
<bvernoux>
or in worst case over Ethernet ;)
<bvernoux>
I will check If I can buy a GPIB Ethernet bridge ;)
<azonenberg>
A SCPIGPIBTransport driver is on the to-do list
<azonenberg>
tverbeure was talking about making one then dropped off the channel
<azonenberg>
if anybody here has a usb gpib dongle and a gpib-capable instrument, feel free to work on it
<bvernoux>
something using libusb done from scratch ?
<bvernoux>
as everything is proprietary ...
<bvernoux>
same issue as using PicoScope over USB 3 ...
<noopwafel>
pico libraries are easy enough ;p
<bvernoux>
all shall be reversed and rewritten with libusb which is a big task
<azonenberg>
is there no standard linux driver stack for gpib?
<azonenberg>
like usb serial
<azonenberg>
i figured it would be a commodity character device interface that we could just use
<bvernoux>
I doubt a linux driver stack for gpib exist but who know
<bvernoux>
in theory it is just a serial port
<noopwafel>
it does, and there is sw too
<bvernoux>
noopwafel, there is no open source lib for Picoscope
<bvernoux>
Picoscope lib are binary blob
<noopwafel>
bvernoux: I mean for gpib
<bvernoux>
ha ok ;)
<noopwafel>
for picoscope, you can just use picoscope libs :)
<bvernoux>
so it is a very good point for gpib as tons of instrument use it
<bvernoux>
even if it seems obsolete I cannot live without that on my old instrument ;)
<bvernoux>
noopwafel, using picoscope libs was a no go for glscope ..
<azonenberg>
bvernoux: why?
<bvernoux>
as it will maybe break the license of glscope
<bvernoux>
to be checked
<azonenberg>
as long as it's not copyleft, it shouldn't be a problem
<azonenberg>
and they're blobs
<bvernoux>
if it does not break the license it break the concept to have something fully open source ;)
<azonenberg>
Yes, that much i agree with
<azonenberg>
but i'd rather have a half-blob solution than none
<bvernoux>
IIRC it is something like copyleft ...
<azonenberg>
i mean i would love to eventually reverse the protocol and write a fully open driver stack
<noopwafel>
so I have a hacky SCPI bridge for now
<azonenberg>
yeah that is a good solution in general to keep it at arms length
<bvernoux>
azonenberg, A must is to use libusb I think for all usb stuff
<bvernoux>
azonenberg, it is portable and work fine on all platform
<noopwafel>
I was going to try adding libusb for the vds1022 yesterday
<noopwafel>
but instead I spent the afternoon trying to work out why my vds1022 no longer works
<bvernoux>
noopwafel, it is more problematic if you hw does not work ...
<bvernoux>
noopwafel, it seems the vds1022 is a sort of Picoscope clone ;p
<noopwafel>
yeah
<bvernoux>
10M record length is short
<bvernoux>
does it support streaming ?
<noopwafel>
the vds1022 itself is a toy: it is 100msps and it has no RAM, so you are limited to block RAM on the FPGA, which is like 5k
<bvernoux>
I love the Picoscope3000 for that over USB3
<bvernoux>
I have bought it for that ;)
<bvernoux>
realtime streaming at up to 250MSPS over USB3
<bvernoux>
using API of course ;)
<noopwafel>
and no, it is no picoscope replacement :p
<bvernoux>
I imagine it is not the same price too
<bvernoux>
Pico3000 is only 1GSPS too
<bvernoux>
and only 8bits ;)
<noopwafel>
but the vds1022 is ~$60 sometimes, and it has hw trigger, so you can leave it permanently attached to long-term setups which is convenient sometimes
<bvernoux>
But good for small signal stuff not exceeding 20MHz
<noopwafel>
the 1gsps ones are way more serious devices, but they cost real money, and I don't think they are worth it
<bvernoux>
what is missing on Pico3000 is 50Ohms input
<bvernoux>
or a way to switch from 50Ohms to 1MOhms like on lot of scope ...
<noopwafel>
but then what would you do with all your pico 50ohm terminators :)
<bvernoux>
yes I use one ;)
<bvernoux>
but I will prefer to have it inside ;)
<noopwafel>
well, if you buy a fancy picoscope with the 50ohm input, I am interested to hear how they are
<bvernoux>
Waiting a good offer for a "cheap" 20GSPS scope ;)
<bvernoux>
something like what azonenberg have ;)
<bvernoux>
it is a must to have warranty for manufacturer with a calibrated scope especially at that price / performance
<bvernoux>
-for+from
<bvernoux>
as Tek6 Series for less than 10KUSD is not for tomorrow ;)
<bvernoux>
especially the Tek6 with 8GHZ BW ;)
<bvernoux>
hehe simulation of Tek6 with 8GHz BW option +add 75KEuros ;)
<bvernoux>
at the end it is >100KEuros ;)
<bvernoux>
RackMount option is >1Keuros ;)
<bvernoux>
Option to have Removable SSD with WIndows License 993Euros !!
<bvernoux>
crazy ...
<bvernoux>
each option are crazy
<azonenberg>
bvernoux: well that is basically targeting the defense world
<azonenberg>
when you want to remove the drive before sending it in for service
<bvernoux>
8B10 protocol decoder => 2720Euros ;)
<azonenberg>
so of course it's expensive, the customer is the military
<azonenberg>
lol
<azonenberg>
and this is why i wrote one :p
<bvernoux>
yes
<bvernoux>
but they should have price for normal lab ;)
<bvernoux>
price for military big industry and for others ;)
<bvernoux>
I plan to do that for my products
<bvernoux>
Price for students/reasearcher/very small company) and price for others
<bvernoux>
woo the only free things is Power Options => Option A1 - Universal EURO (add 0 Euros) ;)
<bvernoux>
Calibration Data report also is 9Euros ;)
<bvernoux>
at the end of the quote they do not want to say price ;)
<bvernoux>
as it exceed 100KEuros ;)
<bvernoux>
I will need to do a Flipper Zero Kickstarter to buy it ;)
<azonenberg>
lol
<azonenberg>
If i ever had $10K to spend on a scope
<bvernoux>
they are near to reach 1MEuros now
<azonenberg>
$100k*
<bvernoux>
totally crazy
<azonenberg>
it better have waaaaaay more than 8 GHz bw
<bvernoux>
and the trends is 16MUSD for Flipper Zero ;)
<azonenberg>
like. at that price i could almost buy a new labmaster
<bvernoux>
azonenberg, yes clearly for 100KUSD it will be more than 25GSPS & 8GHz BW ;)
<bvernoux>
Especially when you know it is just SW
<azonenberg>
bvernoux: The 20 GHz 80 Gsps LabMaster is MSRP $114.3K
<bvernoux>
when you have bought the 25KUSD version 1GHz BW it is the same HW as the 8GHz BW ;)
<azonenberg>
So $100K for just the base scope is a bit nuts
<azonenberg>
and of course, secondhand you can get waaaaay more for your dollar
<bvernoux>
ha yes the LabMaster is clearly more intersting vs Tek6
<bvernoux>
But it does not support mixed domain ;)
<azonenberg>
if i was going to buy a labmaster i'd buy the 36 GHz one on ebay for $52K :p
<azonenberg>
Not a new one for $114K
<azonenberg>
with only 20 GHz bw
<bvernoux>
yes but it is a big risk for 52KUSD
<bvernoux>
if something wrong happen you have loose 52KUSD ...
<azonenberg>
Of course. And I don't have $52K to spend on it either
<bvernoux>
like it was the case for me with my Agilent E44405B ;)
<bvernoux>
but it cost less ;)
<bvernoux>
but I was not far to loose 3KUSD
<bvernoux>
I was lucky it was directly defective
<bvernoux>
and not after 2month of use
<bvernoux>
also I have received some SOuthWest conenctors
<bvernoux>
Brand NEW !!
<bvernoux>
2.92mm
<bvernoux>
the packing is so awfull half are dead ...
<azonenberg>
lol
<bvernoux>
they was unscrewed
<bvernoux>
and center pin is dead
<bvernoux>
!!
<azonenberg>
wow
<bvernoux>
what a shame on this vendor
<azonenberg>
i wonder just how much expensive lab equipment is destroyed in shipping each year by clueless ebay sellers
<bvernoux>
yes clearly just because of very bad packing all in same bag unswrewed
<azonenberg>
(i assume you complained and asked for a refund?)
<noopwafel>
best not to ask these questions
<bvernoux>
when you see the center pin for PCB trace it is so fragile
<bvernoux>
not protected
<bvernoux>
Maybe I can repin them as the connectors are very nice
<bvernoux>
in fact it was item lost ...
<bvernoux>
which I have received 3 month after
<azonenberg>
also ooooh rigol is stepping up their game
<bvernoux>
else I will have paid the guy but all is broken
<bvernoux>
azonenberg, ha ther is some new rigol scope ... ?
<azonenberg>
Not a scope
<bvernoux>
SA ?
<azonenberg>
The DG5352 is 350 MHz, 14 bit, 1 Gsps
<azonenberg>
AWG
<bvernoux>
woo
<bvernoux>
nice
<azonenberg>
With I/Q modulation including QSPK and QAM
<bvernoux>
10KEuros ;)
<azonenberg>
14.1K list price actually
<bvernoux>
yes very nice features
<azonenberg>
I want to build something better :p
<noopwafel>
also slightly more affordable?
<bvernoux>
it is very nice
<bvernoux>
not like the new scope
<bvernoux>
seems very compact too
<azonenberg>
noopwafel: I want to put an AD9154 and an xc7k160t in a 1U system
<azonenberg>
up to 1 Gsps data rates with interpolation to 2.4 Gsps, on four channels at 16 bits
<noopwafel>
right, this would be great
<bvernoux>
the fun stuff look the family ;)
<bvernoux>
DG5071
<bvernoux>
is also 1GSA/S
<bvernoux>
most interesting is 2 chan
<bvernoux>
DG5072
<bvernoux>
which can probably hacked to be a DG5352 ;)
<bvernoux>
with exactly same HW
<azonenberg>
noopwafel: it would basically be maxwell's fpga and ram subsystem, but only gig-e since i'd be using all of the GTX's as JESD204B
<azonenberg>
i think i could hit 500 MHz nyquist bandwidth although i dont know if performance would be great that far
<azonenberg>
also it's very affordable. i wouldnt need rogers since it wouldnt have a lot of long high speed traces to worry about, probably just fr408hr
<bvernoux>
it is challenging to reach 500MHz
<azonenberg>
the pcb wouldnt be nearly as wide as maxwell either
<azonenberg>
so i could probably build it in house
<bvernoux>
yes would be an amazing instrument
<azonenberg>
The AD9154 is only $121 at digikey too
<bvernoux>
a must will be an option to stream data over Ethernet Gb....
<azonenberg>
the fpga will be more than that, probably the same one as maxwell
<azonenberg>
bvernoux: yes but only 1g
<azonenberg>
no 10g
<azonenberg>
because the fpga i'm looking at only has 8 serdes lanes and i need all of them for the DAC
<azonenberg>
anyway i think that will be my next project after maxwell
<azonenberg>
with the scope side of things running in parallel with the non-scope efforts
<bvernoux>
see you
<katharina>
damn it, i have to reinstall windows for some reason, it crashed during update and now its broken, why is that still ä thing
<azonenberg>
lol
<azonenberg>
because windows never had a proper package manager?
<katharina>
yea
<azonenberg>
it doesnt even have kernel versioning for fallbacks etc
<katharina>
when this happens in my linux, i can just chroot into it and fix the packages that failed to install
<azonenberg>
you have one ntoskrnl.exe
<azonenberg>
it either works or doesnt
<katharina>
yea its super annoying
<katharina>
one thing that is super annoying is that on my thinkpad, windows cant use USB3.0 devices during install
<katharina>
i assume its missing the drivers, but i havent seen something like that before
<azonenberg>
you mean not just "dont work at 5 Gbps" but "don't work at all"?
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<azonenberg>
monochroma: hey when you get a chance can you tell me the legal memory depths your DDA has on the upper end?
<azonenberg>
i see 24M on 4ch or 48M points on 2 as the max in the datasheet
<azonenberg>
but normally i would expect there to be a 20M and/or 40M point option
<azonenberg>
is that present or not?
<azonenberg>
basically anything past 10M points i'm curious about
<monochroma>
azonenberg: there are different depth options and i'm not 100% sure what all is available
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<azonenberg>
monochroma: that's why i said "when you get a chance" meaning actually turn it on and poke the settings :p
<azonenberg>
Heads up everyone, two new virtual methods being added to Oscilloscope for configuring channel combining
<azonenberg>
i'll be supplying default implementations in all of the drivers we have so far in master
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±20] https://git.io/JJVRq
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg ad28e35 - Initial channel interleaving support. Only implemented for LeCroy so far. Fixes #23.
<azonenberg>
So according to my scope, the rise time of this pulse generator is 154.39 attoweeks
<azonenberg>
or 1.08 femtodays
<azonenberg>
those are actually units it can be configured to display, lol
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg opened issue #209: Rename TouchstoneParser class to reflect that it's really a generic S-parameter class - https://git.io/JJVEq
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg labeled issue #209: Rename TouchstoneParser class to reflect that it's really a generic S-parameter class - https://git.io/JJVEq
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg labeled issue #203: Rewrite header comments to say "libscopehal" and not "Antikernel" - https://git.io/JJ2fl
<monochroma>
azonenberg: well what i mean is there are different memory options, and i do not know what they all are, iirc i ran into an issue of lack of access to old sales materials/documentation for what the max memory option was
<monochroma>
i will look again though
<monochroma>
i can obviously tell you what's in my scope, but that's not the only memory option for these
<_whitenotifier-b>
[scopehal] azonenberg pushed 2 commits to master [+0/-0/±4] https://git.io/JJVuU