stebalien changed the topic of #ipfs to: Heads Up: To talk, you need to register your nick! Announcements: go-ipfs 0.4.23 and js-ipfs 0.41 are out! Get them from dist.ipfs.io and npm respectively! | Also: #libp2p #ipfs-cluster #filecoin #ipfs-dev | IPFS, the InterPlanetary FileSystem: https://github.com/ipfs/ipfs | Logs: https://view.matrix.org/room/!yhqiEdqNjyPbxtUjzm:matrix.org/ | Forums: https://discuss.ipfs.io | Code of
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<it-xp[m]>
then concept: everywhere presence, sat means, you can be granted or not to start you private processes, store data, read sensors, subscribe events, etc., according to device privacy settings for you
<it-xp[m]>
* then concept: everywhere presence, that means, you can be granted or not to start you private processes, store data, read sensors, subscribe events, etc., according to device privacy settings for you
<it-xp[m]>
but technically you can presence everywhere
<it-xp[m]>
other words, can create you own global Private LAN Layers (broadcast domains) in any network
<it-xp[m]>
every broadcast domain based on Domain Participation Rules (DPR) - smart contract with contribution automations, like atomic swaps, keys verify, ZKP identity approve, payments, addressing, messaging, ..., etc.
<it-xp[m]>
this will rise problem with big encrypted data, which even unsearchable without access
<it-xp[m]>
do you know about problem with big data?
<it-xp[m]>
and yes, go hack me
<it-xp[m]>
if you find )
<it-xp[m]>
and point attention - everywhere presence about interplanetary too, this why my vision fully compatible with vision of IPFS community )
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<it-xp[m]>
hypergraph organized data storage optimize needed space - data, matter for task completion payment, can be stored only at chief, financial officer, executor and several backup stores in private areas. Deal too can be completed only according to contract rules, dependent on each other logically for allow transaction complete only by well known results and keep source state in restricted cases.
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<it-xp[m]>
* hypergraph organized data storage optimize needed space - data, matter for task completion payment, can be stored only at chief, financial officer, executor and several backup stores in private areas. Deal too can be completed only according to contract rules, dependent on each other logically for allow transaction complete only by well known results and keep source state in restricted cases. atomic swap principle.
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<it-xp[m]>
in hyper distributed store, more nodes with data replica speedup new replica sync, so popular data highly accessible (much fast loading, searchable if allowed, etc)
<it-xp[m]>
* in hyper distributed store, more nodes with data replica speedup new replica sync, so popular data highly accessible (much fast loading, searchable best if allowed, etc)
<it-xp[m]>
* in hyper distributed store, count of nodes with data replica grows, speedup new replica sync, so popular data highly accessible (much fast loading, searchable best if allowed, etc)
<it-xp[m]>
and I dont targeted guard from human factor, I want to buils system, in which weak link can be only human factor.
<it-xp[m]>
and in which human very hard to be that weak link )
<it-xp[m]>
* and in which to human very hard to be that weak link )
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<it-xp[m]>
by the way, about global presence, thats why I like providers like https://www.king-servers.com/?ref=4638 - they give /64 IPv6 range for free, instead most, which sell for 1$ per 1 address )
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<it-xp[m]>
but in future we are must be able to become provider itself for each, whit private public IP networks
<it-xp[m]>
* but in future we are must be able to become provider itself for each, whith private public IP networks
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<it-xp[m]>
* but in future we are must be able to become providers itself for each, whith private public IP networks
<it-xp[m]>
* but in future we are must be able to become providers itself for each, with private public IP networks
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<libertine123[m]>
dtynn thanks for the report! Maybe this is related
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<moinmoin>
I have seen a couple of tutorials about how to host websites on IPFS. All of them has been static contents. I guess it is not possible to host dynamic website...as that requires the host node to be able to execute code (which might or might not be available on the node)
<swedneck>
You can use javascript to accomplish mostly the same things as server-side code
<moinmoin>
ok, so the ipfs approach is to throw away the idea of "server-side" code and get by mostly by javascript in the browser?
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<swedneck>
not necessarily, you just need to have some javascript that makes requests to servers
<moinmoin>
but the servers cant be hosted on ipfs
<swedneck>
you just can't generate the html on a server, like with flask or php
<swedneck>
no, ipfs is only static content
<swedneck>
i don't know if anyone has really solved "decentralized servers", and i doubt it's a good concept anyways
<moinmoin>
"no, ipfs is only static content" indeed. exactly what I thought
<moinmoin>
I hear folks talking about application running on the blockchain and smart contracts...I have zero knowledge about blockchain to know if such can help with "decentralized backend servers"
<swedneck>
i think smart contracts sort of do decentralized computing, but it seems rather inefficient
<swedneck>
it's much easier and conventional to just separate the server and client, and host the client on ipfs
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<moinmoin>
correct me if I am wrong, so the way IPFS work is to publish a pointer that contains the recent CID. Just that the pointer is signed by the public key of the node publishing it?
<moinmoin>
but is there the chance that a node can't reach the latest signed/published pointer? and hence end up not getting the latest modification?
<swedneck>
that's IPNS
<moinmoin>
ok,,,thanks...thought I misunderstood the concepts
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<moinmoin>
now trying to understand how nodes know about these "special" pointers...and how to look them up for latest contents...
<moinmoin>
with something like DNS...the "name" stays the same...the IP it points can change...but so far so good not sure where the stuff that stays the same is within IPNS...as far as I understand...signed pointers will also have their CID changed when they are published with latest CID of the mutating content
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<moinmoin>
so lets say a node publishes two websites. The node has just one public key (or can a node use more than one key?). The node uses the same private key of its public key to push out pointers to updated CID of these two websites. How does another node distinguish between these two website?
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<moinmoin>
How also does the name resolution works for ipns. I understand that the hash of the public key becomes the "name" of the node. This name is also a CID. Is there a different resolution mechanism for resolving node than one used to resolve content?
<swedneck>
yes, you can use any amount of keys. the default IPNS key is the same as your public/private key, not sure which
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<swedneck>
IPNS is not bound to your public key, it's just the deafult
<swedneck>
you can make new ipns keys with `ipfs key gen`
<moinmoin>
ok. That clears that up. A node can have multiple private/public keys
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<swedneck>
uh no, a node only has one key, it's just that IPNS is completely separate
<swedneck>
go-ipfs just happens to use your node key as the default IPNS key
<moinmoin>
Ok...I really find the concepts of IPNS really confusing. It does not help that the documentation for it is quite scanty :(
<moinmoin>
What about the resolution of the public key's CID? If I have the CID of a content and I ask the network, I get the content back...if I have the CID of the hash of the public key (ak, I essentially have the name of the node) what does that get me?
<swedneck>
not sure what you mean
<moinmoin>
how is the hash of the public key of a node used within IPNS?
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<swedneck>
afaik it's just used to identify the node. again, the node key and the default IPNS key just happen to be the same, as far as i'm aware
<moinmoin>
so it does not for example come into play in resolving the IP address of a node?
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<swedneck>
not necessarily, you could be lucky and get information about an IPNS key from an already connected peer
<moinmoin>
what if I am unlucky?
<moinmoin>
I am confused about IPNS Key -> Node relationship (the IPNS key is the name of the node alright, but what can be retrieved about the node, given an IPNS key)
<swedneck>
well in the worst case only the origin node has the info, and in that case you'd ask the network until some peer tells you about the origin node or you happen upon the origin node directly
<moinmoin>
exactly...so you ask the network about information regarding an IPNS Key. The question is...this processes I believe is different from asking the network for contents?
<swedneck>
i'm pretty sure there isn't really any relationship
<swedneck>
anyone can publish a new CID to an IPNS address, as long as they have the private key for it
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<moinmoin>
Contents are divided up into blocks...with CIDS, and can be hosted by one or mode nodes on the network. When you ask the network for content using CID, there is a processes involving DHT and Bitswap that finds a node that can serve that contents to you
<moinmoin>
this i believe is a summary of what goes on when you ask the network for contents using a CID to make such a request
<swedneck>
afaik bitswap is solely used for actually trading content data
<moinmoin>
yes.
<moinmoin>
so when you ask the network for content using CID...DHT is used to discover the peers/nodes that has it. Bitswap is used for the actual transfer/trading of content
<moinmoin>
that part is clear
<moinmoin>
what I am now asking...if I ask the network info using the CID derived from the hash of a public key...what goes on then?
<moinmoin>
and what exactly do I get back if I ask such a question?
<moinmoin>
if its normal content, I ask using CID, I get blocks of data/content back
<moinmoin>
if it is CID of a public key, what do I get back? or can I even make a request with CID of a public key
<moinmoin>
This is one aspect I still find confusing. The other aspect is about the pointers. Aka the contents containing CID that is signed by the public key. How does a node knows which updated pointers to ask the network?
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<moinmoin>
www.ipfs.com has a public key. www.ipfs.com signs IPFS-POINTER-A, that contains CID to the most recent content. www.ipfs.com updates contents. Signs IPFS-POINTER-B that now contains the CID of the latest content. Cool.
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<moinmoin>
But as a client, how do I know to find IPFS-POINTER-<?> Also how do I know to find IPFS-POINTER-<?> from say GOOGLE-POINTER-<?>, and BRAVE-POINTER-<?> etc etc that would all be around in the network?
<moinmoin>
Is there a mechanism that allows me to query the network for CIDs signed by a particular Public key? If that is the case, then if I know the public key of www.ipfs.com, then I can query the network for contents signed by www.ipfs.com. I can then decide that the one with the most recent timestamp points to the current data
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<moinmoin>
is that the mechanism used within IPNS? if not, what mechanism answers the question: "But as a client, how do I know to find IPFS-POINTER-<?> Also how do I know to find IPFS-POINTER-<?> from say GOOGLE-POINTER-<?>, and BRAVE-POINTER-<?> etc etc that would all be around in the network?"
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<alexshadow[m]>
Hi everyone!
<alexshadow[m]>
What i mean by working :
<alexshadow[m]>
Me and a friend are trying to make ipfs + Unity3D WORK. (using the dlls generated from ipfs.net.core, ipfs.net.engine, ipfs.peer.talk (by : https://github.com/richardschneider/ - has source + tests + nupackages + a very confusing documentation)
<alexshadow[m]>
- every client should be a node, so that they can I/O IPFS. Pinning content they "bought"(~the ipfs url + some psw to decrypt) through some smart contracts on ETH
<alexshadow[m]>
- our "server" should be a node [being always on, to have a nice pool of peers(~making the ipfs gateway work properly for clients) + redundancy for ALL the stuff added by EACH clients (which might have stuff pinned, but not renewing the content by turning the app on every X-TIME, it could get garbage collected)]
<alexshadow[m]>
So far every change we made just looked like it was randomly working. Either we did restart the node or nuke the folder to regenerate key, it some times worked, some others took ages to show on the gateway, other times it just couldn't work. We started figuring out maybe NAT was doing something that allowed other to write in our blocks repo, but we couldn't provide our blocks around.
<alexshadow[m]>
We tried manually doing what i believe could be a NAT traversal (???) simulating a connection from the peers swarm to our "virtual" swarm, then actually connecting to the remote peer from main swarm : silly stuff started happening, but it kinda worked.
<alexshadow[m]>
It always kind of felt like we were missing something, both because of the instability of the builds, both because of the debugging always giving different results from the same tests .-.
<alexshadow[m]>
Because of the performance spike (and probably security breach) we were encountering, we falled back to using ipfs.client to connect to our server/node(???) (as this engine allowed us to use an ip rather than a passphrase) to write data, and the common engine to read.
<alexshadow[m]>
what would be the steps you take in worst case scenario to do the 2 points above (considering firewall, nat, and all sort of limitation given by isp + satellite - as the app would be cross platform - c#)
<RubenKelevra>
<swedneck "no, ipfs is only static content"> That's not entirely correct, you can establish connections over IPFS, it's just experimental.
<swedneck>
<RubenKelevra "That's not entirely correct, you"> isn't that libp2p?
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<RubenKelevra>
<swedneck "anyone can publish a new CID to "> Yes, but this currently is somewhat limited by the sequence number.. see
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<TraderOne[m]>
is there any pinning service not over charging for duplicate data?
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<TraderOne[m]>
If I pin multiple hashesh with almost everything duplicate I got charged multiple times
<TraderOne[m]>
Also they do not seems to implement timeout - like pin hash for 3 days
<TraderOne[m]>
Temporal has pin expiration in months, not days.
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<RubenKelevra>
@trader_one:matrix.org: the cheapest option is to create a cluster with some vps servers :)
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<TraderOne[m]>
Temporal doesn’t have ability to do manual unpin. Piñata looks best, nice UI but they overcharging for duplicates as everybody.
<TraderOne[m]>
I wait for amazon or other serious provider to go into IPFS busyness.
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<moinmoin>
to get a feel of ipns, I am pushing a directory into ipfs, publish it via ipns and I am checking it on my local node ... it works fine, but it takes quite a long time
<moinmoin>
for example retrieving the index.html file on my own node takes about 30 seconds
<moinmoin>
why would it be that slow?
<moinmoin>
refreshed..now it took 60seconds 🤔
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<RubenKelevra>
moinmoin: have you checked that you can establish the connection in both directions?
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<moinmoin>
connection in both direction? How do you mean?
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<moinmoin>
i got another pc on the same network. That is able to resolve the content faster that the node where the content is on 🤔
<moinmoin>
it took a couple of seconds the first time, now it loads instantly in the other pc. the host still takes between 30 to 60 seconds to load the index page
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<aschmahmann[m]>
moinmoin: IPNS as of go-ipfs 0.4.23 has a number of performance issues. I'd check on the performance in go-ipfs 0.5.0 since there are 1) DHT improvements that really help IPNS. 2) IPNS over PubSub (enabled with the `--enable-namesys-pubsub` flag) is improved to work independently of the DHT.
<aschmahmann[m]>
Note: the changes to IPNS and IPFS DHT resolution will not be as dramatic during the RC phase, but should become more noticable after release)
<aschmahmann[m]>
* moinmoin: IPNS as of go-ipfs 0.4.23 has a number of performance issues. I'd check on the performance in go-ipfs 0.5.0 since there are 1) DHT improvements that really help IPNS. 2) IPNS over PubSub (enabled with the `--enable-namesys-pubsub` flag https://github.com/ipfs/go-ipfs/blob/master/docs/experimental-features.md#ipns-pubsub) is improved to work independently of the DHT.
<aschmahmann[m]>
Note: the changes to IPNS and IPFS DHT resolution will not be as dramatic during the RC phase, but should become more noticable after release
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