<kara-away>
I'm trying to set up ocaml 3.9.3 in order to use HOL Light. My OS is Ubuntu (Hardy). I followed the installation instructions and I thought I'd avoided errors, but I get a "no such file or directory" message when I type ocaml. I first compiled/installed it from the Desktop directory, uninstalled it with sudo apt-get remove, and reinstalled it in a different directory.
<kara-away>
I did get ocaml to run when it was on the Desktop..
<kara-away>
I've read the read-me and installation instructions, but there must be something I'm missing. Any advice?
<mrvn>
just apt-get install ocaml
<kara-away>
that gets me the latest version, which won't work with HOL Light.
<kara-away>
I need a version prior to 3.10
<mrvn>
bummer.
<kara-away>
is there some reason why it would only be happy if I put it on the Desktop
<mrvn>
dig out an older package from an older debian then.
<mfp>
is there a 3.9 section for GODI?
<mfp>
+ still available
<kara-away>
I don't know what GODI is. I'm very new to this.
<mrvn>
or upgrade HOL whatever that is
<kara-away>
the latest version available doesn't work with ocaml 3.10 and beyond.
<mrvn>
kara-away: upgrade it to work with 3.11
<kara-away>
HOL Light is a theorem proving thing. I'm a math PhD student, and I have the opportunity to do some research with a sorta famous guy, but I need to figure this out before I say yes. ;)
<kara-away>
Is there some reason why ocaml will work when I tell it to live on the Desktop, but not if I put it somewhere else?
<mrvn>
no
<mfp>
kara-away: it should be possible to install OCaml 3.09 by following the steps in the page I linked to (with --section 3.09). This allows you to install w/ the prefix of your choice.
<mrvn>
But there is a reason why you might not find it. Check your PATH
<kara-away>
my path should point to the folder, right?
<mrvn>
among others
<mrvn>
and folder might be folder/bin
<mfp>
(OTOH if OCaml alone is enough, you don't want to install it through GODI)
<kara-away>
I'm looking at GODI, but it does seem like overkill. :-/
<mfp>
if you only want OCaml itself, it is, indeed
<kara-away>
I'm a little mystified. I'm going to clean up as best as I can and give it another try.
<kara-away>
thanks for the input.
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<_andre>
does anyone know how to do the equivalent of '#load "unix.cma"' programatically, with the Toploop module?
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<vuln>
Hello there :)
<vuln>
Why 24 mod 25 tells me 24?
<bjorkintosh>
'cause it wanted to see if you were paying attention?
<vuln>
...
<brendan>
what were you expecting?
<vuln>
no idea
<vuln>
but 24 is not in the scope of 'no idea' hehe
<vuln>
:D
<vuln>
In x mod y, when x/y is < 1, mod yells x?
<brendan>
yes
<brendan>
0 remainder x
<vuln>
thank you very much :)
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<kara-away>
I am really perplexed. I downloaded the tar.gz for ocaml 3.8.3, and when I install it, I'm somehow running ocaml 3.10.
<hcarty>
kara-away: Do you still have the Ubuntu package(s) installed?
<kara-away>
no, I did sudo aptitude remove
<mrvn>
on all the ocaml packages?
<kara-away>
I sure thought so.
<mrvn>
which ocaml
<mrvn>
and then dpkg -S ....
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<kara-away>
what the hell. I finally decided it might be easier to see exactly how buggy HOL Light was in the new ocaml
<kara-away>
so I did sudo aptitude ocaml, etc.
<kara-away>
set up hol light
<kara-away>
typed ocaml... and it's version 3.8.2, like I was trying to get before.
<kara-away>
There is something really stupid going on in my brain, because I trust my computer. :(
<_andre>
does anyone have an ocaml.vim file that is compatible with the 3.11 .annot format?
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<kaustuv>
kara-away: belated, but HOL-Light works fine for me on OCaml 3.11.0.
<kara-away>
hm, really?
<kaustuv>
You'll need the experimental version 3.20+ from John's web page, of course
<kara-away>
I finally got another version of ocaml going, but I'm getting an error from HOL Light now. Do you mind if I PM it to you? Maybe you have some idea what's wrong. Mostly, it looks like it hates pa_j.ml and it can't make pa_j.cmo
<kaustuv>
err, make that 2.20+, and sure
<kara-away>
that's still using ocaml 3.8.2
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<kara-away>
I downloaded and installed ocaml-3.11.0, but it still shows the version as 3.10. I've tried sudo apt-get remove, purge, etc., and I can't seem to get to the point where I type ocaml and it tells me I don't have it. help?
<hcarty>
kara-away: "which ocaml"
<hcarty>
That will tell you where it's finding the executable
<kara-away>
thank you.
<kara-away>
...I give up for now. I managed to remove it, confirm that it was gone, and start over from scratch. Now it can't find anything again.
<mrvn>
hash -r
<kara-away>
what does that do?
<mrvn>
search the path again
<kara-away>
it looks like it should have gone in /usr/local/bin, but it's not there.
<kara-away>
no errors with ./configure, no errors with make world.opt, no errors with make install.
<kara-away>
the error I get tells me to do "sudo apt-get install ocaml-interp", but when I do that, I'm informed that I already have the newest version. :)
<kara-away>
maybe it's time to just try again tomorrow.
<thelema_>
maybe you'll think better tomorrow
<kara-away>
maybe. I don't really know what I'm doing and I've been at this for hours, so my brain isn't contributing anything at this point.
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<StoneHand>
Hello, as a somewhat experienced programmer I hate to ask such a newbie question but I can't seem to figure this out in OCaml: I'm creating a class/object with a data member which is basically a screen handle. The thing is I can't initialise this handle until a library (in this case SDL) has been initialised. In the end I'd like to access the screen as a member of the holding class if possible without the handle being returned through an acce
<StoneHand>
ssor method. If anyone has a quick solution or something to read I'd very much appreciate it.
<StoneHand>
I'm guessing since the object itself is its own constructor (correct) I'd just the initialisation out in the open, sort of like what is often done in JavaScript, but I can't seem to figure out how exactly such syntax would go.
<StoneHand>
kaustuv: that's quite clear, so anything before the object declaration acts as an initializer?
<kaustuv>
Sure, you'd initialize the SDL library as needed before creating the object.
<StoneHand>
so I can't initialize the SDL library during the object creation?
<StoneHand>
perhaps I think too much in C/C++
<StoneHand>
err, C++ rather
<kaustuv>
You can certainly do it during creation. For example (pseudocode, I don't actually know how the SDL library works):
<kaustuv>
let make_object sdl_init_args =
<kaustuv>
let sdl =initialize_sdl sdl_init_args in
<kaustuv>
object val handle = sdl method getScreen = handle#screen end
<kaustuv>
oops, the first let should be a class
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<StoneHand>
thank you very much, kaustuv, I'll give that a shot now
<kaustuv>
You can even drop the val handle = sdl bit if you want to keep the handle secret.
<flux>
objects do have initializers also
<flux>
it sort of depends which fits the purpose
<kaustuv>
Yes, anonymous initializers as mentioned in the link above is what you'd need if you want to access the fields and methods of the object during the initialization.
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<Alpounet>
hi there
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<StoneHand>
in an initializer one can't use let, correct?
<StoneHand>
I've got things kind of working now, but I still don't have the screen handle accessable as a member of the class
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<Alpounet>
paste some code :)
<StoneHand>
oops, I think I just figured it out
<StoneHand>
I had attempted to initalize it with "var" and that didn't work, then I realized I had misread the documentation and I tried "val" and it didn't throw any errors at me
<StoneHand>
crap, now how do I access it? class terminal_subsystem =
<StoneHand>
object (self)
<StoneHand>
initializer
<StoneHand>
Sdl.init [`VIDEO; `AUDIO];
<StoneHand>
at_exit Sdl.quit;
<StoneHand>
Sdlttf.init ();
<StoneHand>
at_exit Sdlttf.quit;
<StoneHand>
Sdlmixer.open_audio ();
<StoneHand>
at_exit Sdlmixer.close_audio;
<StoneHand>
val screen = Sdlvideo.set_video_mode 400 400 [`DOUBLEBUF];
<StoneHand>
end;;
<StoneHand>
let dtsys = new terminal_subsystem;;
<StoneHand>
so, dtsys.screen? dtsys#screen?.... taking me a while to pull my head out of the C++/Java world
<StoneHand>
ok, so I have the val screen.... as you can see above, I created an accessor above that: method get_screen = screen
<StoneHand>
it reports screen is unbound
<kaustuv>
StoneHand: method get_screen = #screen
<kaustuv>
but simply dtsys#screen should work
<StoneHand>
aaaaaaah
<StoneHand>
is # only for methods?
<StoneHand>
I get the error This expression has type terminal_subsystem
<StoneHand>
It has no method screen
<kaustuv>
Actually, oops, I think I might have misunderstood your question.
<StoneHand>
Well I didn't show how I was trying to access it either: Sdlvideo.blit_surface ~dst_rect:position_of_image ~src:image ~dst:dtsys#screen ();
<StoneHand>
kaustuv: sorry, still no dice. it complains about how screen is of type sdlvideo, and the reference is 'a. Is there no way to intialize a variable within an initializer and then access it within or outside of the object?
<StoneHand>
I'm terribly confused at this point
<StoneHand>
I guess to rephrase if: I would like to bind something in a particular order within an initializer, then reference/use it outside of the initializer
<StoneHand>
GOT IT
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<StoneHand>
I'd just like to thank everyone here for not yelling at me and helping me out. kaustuv, you were particularly helpful and I really appreciate your patience and time
<StoneHand>
just one last question, for the initialisation order in OCaml, are the directives in the initializer section processed before the initilization of vals within the object?
<flux>
mrvn, garrigues' idea looks like a really nice solution to your problem :)
<flux>
stonehand, no, because the values exist at the initializer already
<flux>
and there is no such thing in ocaml 'exists, but is not initialized'
<StoneHand>
flux: that's precisely what was perplexing me. I have a value that needs to be initialized after a subsystem, but it needs to be a public value within the object and the object is created globally so there is no guaranteed construction order (or is there in OCaml?)
<kig>
i have a new programming credo "if it has array indexing, it has a bug"
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<flux>
stonehand, there is. the order of initialization for modules is the linking order in the command line, and the order of performing initializations in a module is up-down
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<kaustuv>
kig: that's a stupid credo unless you never need to use strings
<kaustuv>
or, I guess, if you are fine with using programs you consider buggy
<StoneHand>
flux: so you mean to say I should create a seperate class for initilization, put both classes in a module such that the order would go the initializer-only class then the actually used class?
<kig>
well. if you segfault, you either have a bug in array indexing (most likely) or a bogus pointer or a bogus function pointer and stack corruption is the most awesome thing ever
<kig>
right after run-on sentences
<kaustuv>
or someone did a kill -SEGV
<StoneHand>
kig: if you have a bug in your array indexing it's your own fault, is it not?
<flux>
stonehand, I'm not sure what your problem actually is.. for a class you can likely set the values before constructing the actual object in whatever order you want..
<StoneHand>
this is what I came up with that for some reason works
<StoneHand>
class terminal_subsystem =
<StoneHand>
object (self)
<StoneHand>
val _screen = Sdlvideo.set_video_mode 400 400 [`DOUBLEBUF];
<StoneHand>
method screen = _screen
<StoneHand>
initializer
<StoneHand>
Sdl.init [`VIDEO; `AUDIO];
<StoneHand>
at_exit Sdl.quit;
<StoneHand>
Sdlttf.init ();
<StoneHand>
at_exit Sdlttf.quit;
<StoneHand>
Sdlmixer.open_audio ();
<StoneHand>
at_exit Sdlmixer.close_audio;
<StoneHand>
end;;
<StoneHand>
let dtsys = new terminal_subsystem;;
<StoneHand>
the thing is, I am defining _screen outside of the initializer
<kig>
StoneHand: everyone makes mistakes, catch them before they get into production
<StoneHand>
kig: I've extensive experience in embedded and ROM programming, and yet to screw up with array indexing
<kig>
you never have segfaults?
<kaustuv>
StoneHand: Sdlvideo.set_video_mode 400 400 wil run before Sdl.init when you say new terminal_subsystem. If that is fine, great!
<flux>
stonehand, well, how about this: class terminal_subsystem = let () = Sdl.init ...; at_exit.. in object (self) method screen = Sdlvideo.set_video_mode 400 400 [..] end;;
<StoneHand>
kaustuv: it shouldn't be
<flux>
uh
<flux>
not method, but val
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<kaustuv>
in flux's version, Sdl.init will be called when the program starts. If that is what you intend, it's the best solution.
<StoneHand>
kig: segfaults don't exist in embedded systems, instead you get "Oh shit my cars breaks don't work!"
<flux>
that can be postboned by adding () to the argument list of terminal_subsystem
<StoneHand>
Sdl.init shoudl be called before screen = Sdlvideo......
<StoneHand>
for some reason it works as it is now, but I'm not quite satisfied as this may not be the case with other things
<flux>
in any case, what you might want to try is: let screen = lazy ( .. init_code_here.. .. return opened display..) and then refer to Lazy.force screen
<flux>
stonehand, you can easily find out the evaluation order by putting print_endline "debug output"
<StoneHand>
you can do that within an object out in the open!?
<StoneHand>
if so that's amazing and bizzare
<flux>
such as val _screen = (print_endline "here"; Sdlvideo.blahblah)
<StoneHand>
aaaah
<StoneHand>
wow
<StoneHand>
hey, that's awesome
<flux>
it's not that bizarre, Sdlvideo.set_mode is already something similar
<kaustuv>
StoneHand: You don't really need objects for what you're doing.
<StoneHand>
I don't need them yet
<kig>
StoneHand: the only method of discovering bugs is explosions on the highway?
<StoneHand>
kig: it's the most real way of finding bugs possible
<flux>
stonehand, but it might be better style to create a function that does that
<flux>
then just it would be: val _screen = mk_display ()
<StoneHand>
flux: you have just opened my eyes
<StoneHand>
that is very very cool
<StoneHand>
kig: I'm half joking around, but indexing should always be checked rigorously
<StoneHand>
there are tools that can help you check that too
<StoneHand>
and low level control systems for cars have very strict coding standards
<StoneHand>
I don't think I've ever heard of any sort of dynamic indexing in such code, so it should be a non issue
<kaustuv>
I compile with -unsafe and I vote.
<StoneHand>
and generally there is a micro-pulse each of the break system controllers (I have never heard of a car with less than two modules per brake) so if one controller fails you SHOULD fail safe or the analog responses system will fail safe for you
<kaustuv>
I think kig means that explosions happen on the highway because of terrorists running buggy GPS systems
<StoneHand>
also, in embedded systems we often have no malloc system, or malloc is unsafe or slow, so we use manual block allocation where we keep track of memory blocks in a big pre-allocated area (usually just a huge generic array) and access them with typecast pointers
<StoneHand>
kaustuv: so buggy GPS systems make terrorists explode?
<StoneHand>
kaustuv: then I guess we can be thankful for crummy korean copycat technology that breaks or bugs out within minutes of using it
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<raven79>
bye
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<kig>
StoneHand: so the compiler checks that the indices don't go out-of-bounds?
<kig>
the basic idea i was after is that if there's a piece of code that can be gotten wrong, someone probably will at some point get it wrong
<kig>
(the someone being me)
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<StoneHand>
kig: we learn through our failures, and a good developer spends enormous ammounts of time debugging. Though I'm just glad you aren't developing automotive breaking systems... are you?
<kig>
so having the compiler enforce indexing bounds either through using higher-order functions or iterators, or black magick, will reduce the amount of simple-to-make stupidly high-impact failures getting into your code
<kig>
i.e. array indexing is buggy
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<StoneHand>
I get what you were saying, I was just razzing you
<StoneHand>
I've made my fair share of mistakes, and if you followed the conversation about the problem I was having you'll realize I should not be trusted anywhere near OCaml as of yet
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<StoneHand>
thanks again everyone, I'm off
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<Smerdyakov>
I'd agree that there are people who think that, I mean.
<Alpounet>
Oh, yep.
<mrvn>
You can always find someone who things anything
<mrvn>
thinks even
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<Alpounet>
mrvn, yep, but this one is amazing...
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<Alpounet>
good night all
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<iago>
hello, someone can say me if there is some function in ocaml to copy a file? (without use Sys.command or Unix.system) I'm looking for it in the documentation without success
<Camarade_Tux_>
you could look at ocaml-fileutils which has a "cp" function
<Camarade_Tux_>
(I have to admit I'm not sure how it works)
<Camarade_Tux_>
iago, ^^
<iago>
thanks Camarade_Tux_
<prigaux>
dd/set osd_DISPLAY localhost:10.0
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<_andre>
anyone using Camlp4MacroParser.cmo?
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<karasuman>
this is a really stupid question. I installed ocaml and finally got it and HOL Light running. Do I need to keep folder of files I installed with?
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* Camarade_Tux_
doesn't get the question
<karasuman>
yeah, I know. It's that bad. :)
<mrvn>
no
<karasuman>
thanks, mrvn. I didn't think so, but every once in a while there's a program that lives entirely in whatever directory you leave the files... like songbird.
<karasuman>
I hate it.
<mrvn>
I like when you can do either.
<karasuman>
I still haven't figured out what was broken when I was trying to do this yesterday, but I hunted down all the ocaml files, deleted them with gksudo nautilus, and reinstalled, and... perfection.
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<karasuman>
does anyone have a favorite checkpoint program they'd like to recommend?
<karasuman>
I use ubuntu.
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<palomer>
hrmph
<palomer>
I remember someone here suggesting I ssh -X to my home computer to get my development done
<palomer>
who was it again...
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<mrvn>
me
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<palomer>
does it work well?
<palomer>
do you use emacs?
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<flux>
indeed, the point brought by Alp Mestan on the mailing list: a book on ocaml that would also touch some libraries such as extlib and batteries would be interesting
<flux>
but unfortunately I don't think there is a person who has both invested time on researching the topic and has time for writing a book exists..
<flux>
s/ exists//
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* Yoric[DT]
has started a few chapters on OCaml which do mention a few aspects of Batteries.
<Yoric[DT]>
(in French, for the moment)
<bjorkintosh>
Yoric[DT], are you writing a book?
<Yoric[DT]>
A wikibook.
<bjorkintosh>
about ocaml?
<Yoric[DT]>
yep
<bjorkintosh>
i thought there were many in existence already!
<bjorkintosh>
especially en francais
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<Yoric[DT]>
Well, yes.
<Yoric[DT]>
This one is expected to cover a number of subjects which I've never seen in other books.